Not enough punishment. Anyway I think as I said yesterday he needs to be made an example of to the wider community now this has emerged.
A rich bloke losing a bit of money would probably elicit a shrug.
I dunno, some kind of community service order of 500 hours, where he recycles little green bags by removing the dog poo from them with his bare hands would be a start.
It would certainly be more of a deterrent than observing a rich bloke losing a little bit of his huge fortune. West Ham playing him last night was a low move, so redirecting some of his money to an animal charity feels like an ‘I hope it goes away’ act of convenience.
Not enough punishment. Anyway I think as I said yesterday he needs to be made an example of to the wider community now this has emerged.
A rich bloke losing a bit of money would probably elicit a shrug.
I dunno, some kind of community service order of 500 hours, where he recycles little green bags by removing the dog poo from them with his bare hands would be a start.
It would certainly be more of a deterrent than observing a rich bloke losing a little bit of his huge fortune. West Ham playing him last night was a low move, so redirecting some of his money to an animal charity feels like an ‘I hope it goes away’ act of convenience.
Agree that fining someone will have little effect (though I’m sure the charities would welcome it) It’ll just mean he’ll get £250,000 this month rather than £500,000. A more fitting punishment would be community service at an animal rescue centre or a place where animals are brought in to give therapy to patients/residents. And to piss West Ham off, the community service should be done on Saturday afternoons or whenever their games are scheduled.
The whole of Hartlepool is still associated with animal cruelty around 200 years old. Like it or not this will taint West Ham United for a long time. He shouldn’t have been picked against Watford. That is why it is now the club as much as the individual. As for equivalence and hypocrisy, if I am getting done for speeding at the side of the road, what good would it do to point out a passing speeding vehicle to the officer? They gonna say ‘oh I’ll let you off then’?
Utter shithouse of the highest order, complete coward and a bully. Football will do what it does though, it will forgive, he won't get sacked because a club with a lower sense of morality will sign him up.
Begs the question "What are the rules in this post-Christian 21st Century morality?"
It seems noone really knows.
I like to think noone on these pages would ever do things the likes of Mendy, Zouma, Greenwood et al do/done/did. And seem to laugh at too.
But these things don't START with torturing animals, beating up and sexually assaulting young women.
These are outward behaviours (and probably regular behaviours too) reflecting their inner distorted thoughts that they believe are normal and acceptable.
We kid ourselves if we think by outlawing racist words from the terraces we have defeated hatred. If we prohibit the use of anti-LGBT expressions we have defeated hatred. And if we no longer condone any offensive terms towards women we suddenly create a loving ordered society where men and women can attain their highest most noble selves and we have relegated mysoginy to the history books.
It's utter rubbish. We merely eject those from the ground who openly reveal the contents of their hearts in song. What about the many people who also share their expressions but are "wise enough" to keep quiet? Aka "clever enough to go undetected". What therefore has changed?
We have merely reminded people there are things we are not allowed to say in public anymore. But that doesn't change anyone.
By all means do all these polite expressions and yes, courtesy is a dying art in this age but don't expect it to actually stop the Mendys, Zoumas, Greenwoods from causing absolute misery to others. (And to animals)
This new morality is not morality at all. It is a la carte Morality where we pick this issue and choose that moral issue but it isn't morality..It leaves plenty of room and acceptable room for people to be completely immoral. Evil in fact! And Mendy, Zouma and Greenwood have found that loophole in our fake new morality.
Post-Christian morality? When the Catholic Church has abused more young children than any other organisation on the planet.
Of course things are changing for the better, whilst some may keep their own evil agenda hidden, many others are coming round to a more progressive way of thinking, which can clearly be seen in almost all statistics relating to crime, violent or otherwise.
But that's just it. Your "progressive utopia" is neither bringing evil (greenwood, Mendy, Zouma) out into the light or keeping evil hidden.
While I agree great evils have taken place in Church organisations (the atheist media do all they can to highlight these evils of course too) it is not the teaching of Truth that is the cause but the failure to live by that Truth that is.
In our desperate attempt to bury Christianity for a post Christian society we haven't eradicated the evil of abuse (it's everywhere now!) but we have erased the teaching, the community of prayer and worship and the hope that these essential aspects of faith give to people.
Do me a favour. Christianity and its adherents have been responsible for more atrocities than every other religion combined over the centuries. Media by definition isn't 'atheist' - it's 'agnostic'. Exposure of the thousands of scandals globally affecting millions of people is not some 'atheist agenda', any more than reporting on climate change is a 'green agenda' or on abuse of womens' rights in Islamic states is 'an anti-Muslim agenda'. It's called 'reporting'.
Nice and convenient way for you to blame people for the ills of the world, rather than religion. "It's not the rules that are wrong, it's that people won't use them". How does that square with the numerous inconsistencies, atrocities and downright fucking meanness in the bible then? If this shit wasn't written down in a book somewhere for cretins to follow, they wouldn't have something to point to and say 'a magic man in the sky made me do it' - they'd have to justify their actions themselves. Might make it a bit harder, if they didn't have a 'sacred text' to hide behind, and thus more difficult to justify to the rest of the world...
All 'faith' ever gave to people was a reason to explain why their life was so shitty. It's *literally* why religion was invented - a convenient way to keep the masses compliant, and a set of guidelines to live by when they weren't educated enough to realise that eating raw meat could kill you.
I wasn't going to look at the video but my husband found it and showed it to me. I am horrified by what I saw, not only was the actual act despicable, but to actually have it videoed and for there to be a row of laughing emojis at the bottom of the video is unbelievable.
Zouma should not be playing for West Ham and must be made an example of. West Ham should have done what Man Utd have done with Mason Greenwood and stopped him training and playing. Violence towards animals is just as bad as violence towards people.
No, it is absolutely not.
Yes it bloody well is. You kick my dog, it's just as bad as kicking one of my children, and either way I'll be aiming to make sure you can never have children of your own once I'm done with you.
whilst I fully understand and respect animal owners feeling that way about their pets (and I do believe they're part of the family), i agree with bobmumro, it isn't the same thing.
it would be far worse if he was getting videoed volleying a child across his kitchen
Depends on whether the child has just volleyed a cat across the kitchen.
Utter shithouse of the highest order, complete coward and a bully. Football will do what it does though, it will forgive, he won't get sacked because a club with a lower sense of morality will sign him up.
Begs the question "What are the rules in this post-Christian 21st Century morality?"
It seems noone really knows.
I like to think noone on these pages would ever do things the likes of Mendy, Zouma, Greenwood et al do/done/did. And seem to laugh at too.
But these things don't START with torturing animals, beating up and sexually assaulting young women.
These are outward behaviours (and probably regular behaviours too) reflecting their inner distorted thoughts that they believe are normal and acceptable.
We kid ourselves if we think by outlawing racist words from the terraces we have defeated hatred. If we prohibit the use of anti-LGBT expressions we have defeated hatred. And if we no longer condone any offensive terms towards women we suddenly create a loving ordered society where men and women can attain their highest most noble selves and we have relegated mysoginy to the history books.
It's utter rubbish. We merely eject those from the ground who openly reveal the contents of their hearts in song. What about the many people who also share their expressions but are "wise enough" to keep quiet? Aka "clever enough to go undetected". What therefore has changed?
We have merely reminded people there are things we are not allowed to say in public anymore. But that doesn't change anyone.
By all means do all these polite expressions and yes, courtesy is a dying art in this age but don't expect it to actually stop the Mendys, Zoumas, Greenwoods from causing absolute misery to others. (And to animals)
This new morality is not morality at all. It is a la carte Morality where we pick this issue and choose that moral issue but it isn't morality..It leaves plenty of room and acceptable room for people to be completely immoral. Evil in fact! And Mendy, Zouma and Greenwood have found that loophole in our fake new morality.
Post-Christian morality? When the Catholic Church has abused more young children than any other organisation on the planet.
Of course things are changing for the better, whilst some may keep their own evil agenda hidden, many others are coming round to a more progressive way of thinking, which can clearly be seen in almost all statistics relating to crime, violent or otherwise.
But that's just it. Your "progressive utopia" is neither bringing evil (greenwood, Mendy, Zouma) out into the light or keeping evil hidden.
While I agree great evils have taken place in Church organisations (the atheist media do all they can to highlight these evils of course too) it is not the teaching of Truth that is the cause but the failure to live by that Truth that is.
In our desperate attempt to bury Christianity for a post Christian society we haven't eradicated the evil of abuse (it's everywhere now!) but we have erased the teaching, the community of prayer and worship and the hope that these essential aspects of faith give to people.
Do me a favour. Christianity and its adherents have been responsible for more atrocities than every other religion combined over the centuries. Media by definition isn't 'atheist' - it's 'agnostic'. Exposure of the thousands of scandals globally affecting millions of people is not some 'atheist agenda', any more than reporting on climate change is a 'green agenda' or on abuse of womens' rights in Islamic states is 'an anti-Muslim agenda'. It's called 'reporting'.
Nice and convenient way for you to blame people for the ills of the world, rather than religion. "It's not the rules that are wrong, it's that people won't use them". How does that square with the numerous inconsistencies, atrocities and downright fucking meanness in the bible then? If this shit wasn't written down in a book somewhere for cretins to follow, they wouldn't have something to point to and say 'a magic man in the sky made me do it' - they'd have to justify their actions themselves. Might make it a bit harder, if they didn't have a 'sacred text' to hide behind, and thus more difficult to justify to the rest of the world...
All 'faith' ever gave to people was a reason to explain why their life was so shitty. It's *literally* why religion was invented - a convenient way to keep the masses compliant, and a set of guidelines to live by when they weren't educated enough to realise that eating raw meat could kill you.
100% this.
Mind you, it's a pretty convincing argument (if one is gullible enough to buy it) that if you do as you're told now and stop whining about your shitty life then I can promise you a joyous afterlife in this magical utopia called heaven. Not sure there would have been too much compliance if the holy men said all you can look forward to is a black void.
Utter shithouse of the highest order, complete coward and a bully. Football will do what it does though, it will forgive, he won't get sacked because a club with a lower sense of morality will sign him up.
Begs the question "What are the rules in this post-Christian 21st Century morality?"
It seems noone really knows.
I like to think noone on these pages would ever do things the likes of Mendy, Zouma, Greenwood et al do/done/did. And seem to laugh at too.
But these things don't START with torturing animals, beating up and sexually assaulting young women.
These are outward behaviours (and probably regular behaviours too) reflecting their inner distorted thoughts that they believe are normal and acceptable.
We kid ourselves if we think by outlawing racist words from the terraces we have defeated hatred. If we prohibit the use of anti-LGBT expressions we have defeated hatred. And if we no longer condone any offensive terms towards women we suddenly create a loving ordered society where men and women can attain their highest most noble selves and we have relegated mysoginy to the history books.
It's utter rubbish. We merely eject those from the ground who openly reveal the contents of their hearts in song. What about the many people who also share their expressions but are "wise enough" to keep quiet? Aka "clever enough to go undetected". What therefore has changed?
We have merely reminded people there are things we are not allowed to say in public anymore. But that doesn't change anyone.
By all means do all these polite expressions and yes, courtesy is a dying art in this age but don't expect it to actually stop the Mendys, Zoumas, Greenwoods from causing absolute misery to others. (And to animals)
This new morality is not morality at all. It is a la carte Morality where we pick this issue and choose that moral issue but it isn't morality..It leaves plenty of room and acceptable room for people to be completely immoral. Evil in fact! And Mendy, Zouma and Greenwood have found that loophole in our fake new morality.
Post-Christian morality? When the Catholic Church has abused more young children than any other organisation on the planet.
Of course things are changing for the better, whilst some may keep their own evil agenda hidden, many others are coming round to a more progressive way of thinking, which can clearly be seen in almost all statistics relating to crime, violent or otherwise.
But that's just it. Your "progressive utopia" is neither bringing evil (greenwood, Mendy, Zouma) out into the light or keeping evil hidden.
While I agree great evils have taken place in Church organisations (the atheist media do all they can to highlight these evils of course too) it is not the teaching of Truth that is the cause but the failure to live by that Truth that is.
In our desperate attempt to bury Christianity for a post Christian society we haven't eradicated the evil of abuse (it's everywhere now!) but we have erased the teaching, the community of prayer and worship and the hope that these essential aspects of faith give to people.
Do me a favour. Christianity and its adherents have been responsible for more atrocities than every other religion combined over the centuries. Media by definition isn't 'atheist' - it's 'agnostic'. Exposure of the thousands of scandals globally affecting millions of people is not some 'atheist agenda', any more than reporting on climate change is a 'green agenda' or on abuse of womens' rights in Islamic states is 'an anti-Muslim agenda'. It's called 'reporting'.
Nice and convenient way for you to blame people for the ills of the world, rather than religion. "It's not the rules that are wrong, it's that people won't use them". How does that square with the numerous inconsistencies, atrocities and downright fucking meanness in the bible then? If this shit wasn't written down in a book somewhere for cretins to follow, they wouldn't have something to point to and say 'a magic man in the sky made me do it' - they'd have to justify their actions themselves. Might make it a bit harder, if they didn't have a 'sacred text' to hide behind, and thus more difficult to justify to the rest of the world...
All 'faith' ever gave to people was a reason to explain why their life was so shitty. It's *literally* why religion was invented - a convenient way to keep the masses compliant, and a set of guidelines to live by when they weren't educated enough to realise that eating raw meat could kill you.
100% this.
Mind you, it's a pretty convincing argument (if one is gullible enough to buy it) that if you do as you're told now and stop whining about your shitty life then I can promise you a joyous afterlife in this magical utopia called heaven. Not sure there would have been too much compliance if the holy men said all you can look forward to is a black void.
As the great Patti Smith sang
Jesus died for somebody's sins but not mine Meltin' in a pot of thieves Wild card up my sleeve Thick heart of stone My sins my own They belong to me, me
I wasn't going to look at the video but my husband found it and showed it to me. I am horrified by what I saw, not only was the actual act despicable, but to actually have it videoed and for there to be a row of laughing emojis at the bottom of the video is unbelievable.
Zouma should not be playing for West Ham and must be made an example of. West Ham should have done what Man Utd have done with Mason Greenwood and stopped him training and playing. Violence towards animals is just as bad as violence towards people.
No, it is absolutely not.
I understand why you might state that violence towards animals is not as bad as violence towards people. There are many who might say it’s not the same thing, which is understandable given desired diet, but if Zouma went off on one at home and was filmed kicking his wife, children, dog and cat all in one session surely the viciousness of intent and action would be the same thing? You don’t agree with my perspective sure, but there are many people who would say the violence is the same, maybe even worse if it is towards an animal like it would be if it was violence towards a child. I would suggest that treating an animal the way Zouma has done is indicative of a susceptibility towards domestic violence too. I wonder how many degrees of separation there are between a man like Kurt Zouma and Mason Greenwood.
Correct - we don't agree.
That in no way diminishes my revulsion at what Zouma did, but I place human life above all other life forms - and diet has fuck all to do with it.
I am not suggesting you’re not as appalled as everybody else about what Zouma did. My post was about how different people might view the sanctity of life.
Sanctity of life. ~ Now you're talking. Was thinking this needed a mention in this thread. I wondered, as people winced at the poor cat's treatment (which, goes without saying ~ is appalling) if they would find it as appalling if it were an unborn child being hacked to pieces by an abortionist?
We can be commended as a society for not contributing our taxes in the funding of the kicking of cats. But we show our true barbarism in how we treat the most vulnerable human beings..
Always baffles me this one. A society that thinks nothing of slaughtering the most vulnerable human beings but asks for the head of a bloke who kicks a cat?!
A whiff of hypocrisy wending its way through this thread perhaps...
Comments
Anyway I think as I said yesterday he needs to be made an example of to the wider community now this has emerged.
West Ham playing him last night was a low move, so redirecting some of his money to an animal charity feels like an ‘I hope it goes away’ act of convenience.
A more fitting punishment would be community service at an animal rescue centre or a place where animals are brought in to give therapy to patients/residents.
And to piss West Ham off, the community service should be done on Saturday afternoons or whenever their games are scheduled.
One less minor pathway at least.
Like it or not this will taint West Ham United for a long time.
He shouldn’t have been picked against Watford.
That is why it is now the club as much as the individual.
As for equivalence and hypocrisy, if I am getting done for speeding at the side of the road, what good would it do to point out a passing speeding vehicle to the officer? They gonna say ‘oh I’ll let you off then’?
Nice and convenient way for you to blame people for the ills of the world, rather than religion. "It's not the rules that are wrong, it's that people won't use them". How does that square with the numerous inconsistencies, atrocities and downright fucking meanness in the bible then? If this shit wasn't written down in a book somewhere for cretins to follow, they wouldn't have something to point to and say 'a magic man in the sky made me do it' - they'd have to justify their actions themselves. Might make it a bit harder, if they didn't have a 'sacred text' to hide behind, and thus more difficult to justify to the rest of the world...
All 'faith' ever gave to people was a reason to explain why their life was so shitty. It's *literally* why religion was invented - a convenient way to keep the masses compliant, and a set of guidelines to live by when they weren't educated enough to realise that eating raw meat could kill you.
Kurt Zouma could face four years in prison in France for kicking his cat
A leading French animal rights group has filed a legal complaint in Paris as the RSPCA investigates in the UK
https://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/sheffield-wednesday-cat-wigan-hillsborough-26185039
Thank God
Jesus died for somebody's sins but not mine
Meltin' in a pot of thieves
Wild card up my sleeve
Thick heart of stone
My sins my own
They belong to me, me
I wondered, as people winced at the poor cat's treatment (which, goes without saying ~ is appalling) if they would find it as appalling if it were an unborn child being hacked to pieces by an abortionist?
We can be commended as a society for not contributing our taxes in the funding of the kicking of cats. But we show our true barbarism in how we treat the most vulnerable human beings..
Always baffles me this one. A society that thinks nothing of slaughtering the most vulnerable human beings but asks for the head of a bloke who kicks a cat?!
A whiff of hypocrisy wending its way through this thread perhaps...