I want better, but a point to counter this stuff about their poor finishing is BWP. He missed shitloads of chances but was a good enough promotion striker with a good side around him. Neither of these lads are ever gonna be Lyle Taylor who was exceptional at this level, but I think they can be as good as bwp.
that said, I’d still vote for a full refresh !
The Taylor comparison in that season was Kermorgant. He was the striker with that bit extra and the one who would often come up trumps at key moments even though he wasn’t the one who scored the most goals. It was partly because we had a player like Yann that meant BWP got so many chances. That’s the point - there’s probably room for one but not both. If we have to go with both next season it’ll be far from the worst pairing in the league but the club do need to be trying to bring in an upgrade if at all possible (obviously it’s easier said than done).
I think BWP at the start of that season was genuinely clinical and that got us going. Then as the season went on, he lost a bit of sharpness but others took up the slack.
Not underrated IMO but only adequate. No doubt if they had been available all season we would have fared better but if we really want to push for promotion and stay in The Championship, we need much better
Stockley now on 153 minutes per goal this season. At a quick look, only seems to be Broadhead at Sunderland (143 mpg) and May at Cheltenham (144 mpg) better in League 1.
Stockley now on 153 minutes per goal this season. At a quick look, only seems to be Broadhead at Sunderland (143 mpg) and May at Cheltenham (144 mpg) better in League 1.
What was he called on here the other day, Donkley?
God forbid we ask our runners to have talent though.
An in form Washington is also fine.
We'll need to spend big and smart to do well next season. If players have gaps in their ability, we need to make sure their teammates are able to supplement them with their better attributes.
Washington always seems to get some knee jerk reactions if he doesn’t score in a game. He’s a League One player for a reason, but on the list of footballing problems we have I wouldn’t consider him one of them.
Washington really wound me up last night . Twice if he’d been alert (and as a shit ex striker with a brain , I always expected the unexpected and the ball to get to me) and gambled or just not switched off he’d have been in on goal or in a real threatening position but he had given up on it and each time the wombles player tripped/fucked up or whatever , he’s not good enough to be a starter for a promotion winning side .
Stockley now on 153 minutes per goal this season. At a quick look, only seems to be Broadhead at Sunderland (143 mpg) and May at Cheltenham (144 mpg) better in League 1.
Don't really understand the stick Stockley seems to get. If you put the ball in the right areas for him, then as he showed last night, there's a good chance he'll get a goal. He has a minutes per goal and % chance conversion rate that is better than almost anyone in this division.
Ok yes he will miss some chances, but that's why he's playing in league one and not at a higher level. But i'm confident pretty much every team in this division would like to have him in their squad.
Stockley now on 153 minutes per goal this season. At a quick look, only seems to be Broadhead at Sunderland (143 mpg) and May at Cheltenham (144 mpg) better in League 1.
Don't really understand the stick Stockley seems to get. If you put the ball in the right areas for him, then as he showed last night, there's a good chance he'll get a goal. He has a minutes per goal and % chance conversion rate that is better than almost anyone in this division.
Ok yes he will miss some chances, but that's why he's playing in league one and not at a higher level. But i'm confident pretty much every team in this division would like to have him in their squad.
In the minds of some Stockley is firmly seen as a lower league donkey who could score 10 or so a season in a good year. As he’s scored 18 so far his critics will claim that cup goals don’t count. Of course if he hadn’t scored in those cup games it would have been used against him to prove his donkeyness.
In reality it’s clear that while he’s no Kermorgant or Taylor outside the box if you give him regular good service he’ll score goals at this level. It’s not a stretch to believe he should score more in a better team, especially with wide players who put in good crosses and have a couple of reliable set piece takers.
Put a lot of the divisions top scorers in this league and they’d probably have scored a similar number to Stockley and Washington this season. If there are any who are Championship quality they’ll likely move to that level in the summer.
Washington always seems to get some knee jerk reactions if he doesn’t score in a game. He’s a League One player for a reason, but on the list of footballing problems we have I wouldn’t consider him one of them.
He might not be the biggest problem, but having one of your front two as unclinical as he is definitely is a problem that needs solving.
11 in 23 league starts for Stockley this season and 4 goals for in his last 6 matches. Equivalent to 22 goals and if he were to play 46 matches in a season. That would be one more than Lyle Taylor got in 2018/19 (excluding cup and playoffs) and the same number as BWP got in 2012/12. He has his limitations and should probably have more goals (all strikers miss chances) but overall his goals scoring stats are pretty respectable for us.
Washington always seems to get some knee jerk reactions if he doesn’t score in a game. He’s a League One player for a reason, but on the list of footballing problems we have I wouldn’t consider him one of them.
He's Simon Church.
When we used to be a better team we'd say we need better players than that to go up. Nowadays I suppose we take whatever we can get.
Washington always seems to get some knee jerk reactions if he doesn’t score in a game. He’s a League One player for a reason, but on the list of footballing problems we have I wouldn’t consider him one of them.
He's Simon Church.
When we used to be a better team we'd say we need better players than that to go up. Nowadays I suppose we take whatever we can get.
I don’t think anyone has said we don’t need a better striker. Doesn’t mean Washington isn’t good enough to be one of four or five strikers next season. We’re not going to have four top quality strikers who can all score 20+. Washington is capable of double figures which is fine as a squad player.
Washington always seems to get some knee jerk reactions if he doesn’t score in a game. He’s a League One player for a reason, but on the list of footballing problems we have I wouldn’t consider him one of them.
He's Simon Church.
When we used to be a better team we'd say we need better players than that to go up. Nowadays I suppose we take whatever we can get.
I don’t think anyone has said we don’t need a better striker. Doesn’t mean Washington isn’t good enough to be one of four or five strikers next season. We’re not going to have four top quality strikers who can all score 20+. Washington is capable of double figures which is fine as a squad player.
This opinion is fine.
We had others trying to say that Washington and Stockley were the missing piece back in January and have a PPG of 3 or whatever that argument was.
Just saying that Washington has no business being a starting striker in a team pushing for promotion.
Takes 10 chances to score one and that includes penalties.
I don't have a problem with Jaden's goalscoring record. I like him as a bloke but I just don't like him as a player, I don't think a club like ours should be having a massive lump as our talisman in the modern age. And I do think he's a donkey with his feet.
I questioned at the beginning of the season why he was being signed to play the lone role upfront in a 4-2-3-1 when he had neither the technical ability or the mobility to do it.
I don't enjoy watching him play and he makes us a worse footballing side.
I don't have a problem with Jaden's goalscoring record. I like him as a bloke but I just don't like him as a player, I don't think a club like ours should be having a massive lump as our talisman in the modern age. And I do think he's a donkey with his feet.
I questioned at the beginning of the season why he was being signed to play the lone role upfront in a 4-2-3-1 when he had neither the technical ability or the mobility to do it.
I don't enjoy watching him play and he makes us a worse footballing side.
This is exactly where I am. I also really don't like him as captain. Can't fault his goal scoring for us at this level though.
It means other clubs accept route one football because it's a direct consequence of their means. Limited budget, limited players, limited football. We have more means than most clubs in this league, so we should not have to rely on playing with a big lump striker.
When have we ever? Only Leaburn. Whenever we've been successful in the modern era we've had proper footballers up front. If we want to control games and have them not be a lottery, that's what we need.
Agree with others that you can't fault the scoring record, but on the other hand he doesn't knit play together in the way a target man should ideally do, and can't really be used in a press, which means we find it hard to create moves that make chances for other players. We should lobby to bring NFL rules to the EFL and bring him on for set pieces at either end!
Since seeing my first Charlton game in 1964, I have witnessed four promotions from the third tier of English football. I realise that over the years tactics and formations change but I thought it might be instructive to compare Stockley and Washington with the main striking partnerships in those four promotion years. Number of goals relates to league goals only.
1974/75. Main Partnership. Derek Hales 20 Goals. Arthur Horsfield 10 Goals.
I don’t believe that anyone is going to argue that neither of the current strikers can realistically be considered in the same class as Hales as he was starting to hit his stride. ( I don’t think any his goals were penalties as Curtis was the penalty taker as this time.) Horsfield was getting a bit long in the tooth at this point but remained a clever player.
1980/81. Main Partnership. Derek Hales 17 Goals. Paul Walsh 11 Goals.
It could be argued that Hales was a bit past his best at this time but 17 goals is still impressive. Walsh was much more than just a striker and went on to play for Spurs, Liverpool and England. There was useful back up from Martin Robinson who notched up 10 goals.
It is probably unfair to compare any other of our 3rd Tier teams with this lot. We pretty much ran away with league from day one. Johnnie Jackson weighed in with 12 goals. This was decent Championship outfit masquerading as a 3rd Tier team.
2018/19
Main Partnership. Lyle Taylor 21 Goals. Karlan Grant 14 Goals.
Up through the play-offs. Whatever people think of Taylor now there is no doubt that he was too good for this level. Grant left in the January and would have probably gone on to reach 20 goals for us us well had he stayed. Aribo weighed in with 9 goals as well.
Looking at those partnerships I afraid I wouldn’t swop any of them for Stockley and Washington. In fact it is difficult to think of either of them challenging for a starting place ahead of any of the strikers named above.
Stockley now on 153 minutes per goal this season. At a quick look, only seems to be Broadhead at Sunderland (143 mpg) and May at Cheltenham (144 mpg) better in League 1.
Just noticed that he's now on 190 minutes per goal, which puts him joint 9th with Mo Eisa.
From the person who made this topic a few weeks ago. It was my first time seeing Stockley play in person.
He was pretty shocking yesterday.
He scored a goal so it’s hard to be very critical but it just felt like he existed to get in the way and everything that went up to him broke down.
I wasn’t at the game y’day, but my old man made a good point. He’s all arms and legs. There’s definitely a threat with his aerial prowess and physicality, but he said he was (and he does), charge around like a bit of madman at times. He said he compared him to Stockton. He said Stockton was very measured and composed, using optimum levels of energy, whereas Stockley is very erratic.
To the point about 22 goals based on projected goals and games for a full season. Who knows? Impossible to say. He’s definitely chipped in this season with poor players around him, so that’s a plus, but there’s a something about him, Aneke and Washington that doesn’t fill me with confidence
I could not agree more? Stockley had a poor game and is not in the same league as Yann or even Stockton. But he does score goals. I would be interested to know the stats yesterday on crosses into the box, there seemed to be quite a lot, 2 of which we scored from. But is it the accuracy of the cross or the striker trying to get on the end of it? Not sure?
Comments
Washington runs.
One of them is a decent player, the other runs.
God forbid we ask our runners to have talent though.
We'll need to spend big and smart to do well next season. If players have gaps in their ability, we need to make sure their teammates are able to supplement them with their better attributes.
Twice if he’d been alert (and as a shit ex striker with a brain , I always expected the unexpected and the ball to get to me) and gambled or just not switched off he’d have been in on goal or in a real threatening position but he had given up on it and each time the wombles player tripped/fucked up or whatever , he’s not good enough to be a starter for a promotion winning side .
Ok yes he will miss some chances, but that's why he's playing in league one and not at a higher level. But i'm confident pretty much every team in this division would like to have him in their squad.
In reality it’s clear that while he’s no Kermorgant or Taylor outside the box if you give him regular good service he’ll score goals at this level. It’s not a stretch to believe he should score more in a better team, especially with wide players who put in good crosses and have a couple of reliable set piece takers.
Put a lot of the divisions top scorers in this league and they’d probably have scored a similar number to Stockley and Washington this season. If there are any who are Championship quality they’ll likely move to that level in the summer.
When we used to be a better team we'd say we need better players than that to go up. Nowadays I suppose we take whatever we can get.
next season. We’re not going to have four top quality strikers who can all score 20+. Washington is capable of double figures which is fine as a squad player.
We had others trying to say that Washington and Stockley were the missing piece back in January and have a PPG of 3 or whatever that argument was.
Just saying that Washington has no business being a starting striker in a team pushing for promotion.
Takes 10 chances to score one and that includes penalties.
I questioned at the beginning of the season why he was being signed to play the lone role upfront in a 4-2-3-1 when he had neither the technical ability or the mobility to do it.
I don't enjoy watching him play and he makes us a worse footballing side.
What does that even mean? We're an upper league one side that sometimes visits the championship, only to return back to league one shortly after.
Stockley is a symptom of this, as are many of our players.
Some supporters weirdly seem to see us as a massive club when in reality we're half the club we were in the Premier League (where we were a minnow).
When have we ever? Only Leaburn. Whenever we've been successful in the modern era we've had proper footballers up front. If we want to control games and have them not be a lottery, that's what we need.
To renew Jackson must be telling him he is a starter, so another alarm bell already ringing for me.
1974/75.
Main Partnership. Derek Hales 20 Goals. Arthur Horsfield 10 Goals.
I don’t believe that anyone is going to argue that neither of the current strikers can realistically be considered in the same class as Hales as he was starting to hit his stride. ( I don’t think any his goals were penalties as Curtis was the penalty taker as this time.) Horsfield was getting a bit long in the tooth at this point but remained a clever player.
1980/81.
Main Partnership. Derek Hales 17 Goals. Paul Walsh 11 Goals.
It could be argued that Hales was a bit past his best at this time but 17 goals is still impressive. Walsh was much more than just a striker and went on to play for Spurs, Liverpool and England. There was useful back up from Martin Robinson who notched up 10 goals.
2011/12
Main Partnership.
Bradley Wright-Phillips 22 Goals. Yann Kermorgant. 12 Goals.
It is probably unfair to compare any other of our 3rd Tier teams with this lot. We pretty much ran away with league from day one. Johnnie Jackson weighed in with 12 goals. This was decent Championship outfit masquerading as a 3rd Tier team.
2018/19
Main Partnership. Lyle Taylor 21 Goals. Karlan Grant 14 Goals.
Up through the play-offs. Whatever people think of Taylor now there is no doubt that he was too good for this level. Grant left in the January and would have probably gone on to reach 20 goals for us us well had he stayed. Aribo weighed in with 9 goals as well.
Looking at those partnerships I afraid I wouldn’t swop any of them for Stockley and Washington. In fact it is difficult to think of either of them challenging for a starting place ahead of any of the strikers named above.
To the point about 22 goals based on projected goals and games for a full season. Who knows? Impossible to say. He’s definitely chipped in this season with poor players around him, so that’s a plus, but there’s a something about him, Aneke and Washington that doesn’t fill me with confidence