You cannot blame Southgate for this result or any of the performances, its ridiculous to schedule these games the way they have. No wonder clubs get pissy about players going on international duty.
We have a world cup coming up in the middle of the season because FIFA are run by corrupt maggots and toads and now the nations league which started as an honourable distraction from pointless friendlies scheduling games bang on top of each other with no time to rest, recover, train and prepare in between. In June! Fucking let them have a proper break, all this has done is let a ton of people throw mud at the most successful manager we have had in most of our lifetimes and propose we replace him rather than acknowledge the fixtures have been atrociously planned.
Errr yes.. you can do exactly that.
If this was a normal world cup year, THIS is the fucking garbage we would be served up right now. How much recovery would they have had? stop making excuses
the world cup has been played for decades after the normal season in june/july
Not necessarily the same is it though. After a long hard season the motivation to play a few glorified friendlies isn't the same as a World Cup.
For squad players who apparently "want" to go to the world Cup? 2 more games left btw till.the squad is selected.
You cannot blame Southgate for this result or any of the performances, its ridiculous to schedule these games the way they have. No wonder clubs get pissy about players going on international duty.
We have a world cup coming up in the middle of the season because FIFA are run by corrupt maggots and toads and now the nations league which started as an honourable distraction from pointless friendlies scheduling games bang on top of each other with no time to rest, recover, train and prepare in between. In June! Fucking let them have a proper break, all this has done is let a ton of people throw mud at the most successful manager we have had in most of our lifetimes and propose we replace him rather than acknowledge the fixtures have been atrociously planned.
Yes you can blame woke Southgate. How can you fire up your team for kick off, when you make them kneel first? It's a submissive gesture. Never mind the fact he obviously knows F all about what's really behind BLM.
This is one of the most ridiculous posts i've ever read on this forum, and that's saying a lot.
You do realise we did the same during the Euro's yes?
You cannot blame Southgate for this result or any of the performances, its ridiculous to schedule these games the way they have. No wonder clubs get pissy about players going on international duty.
We have a world cup coming up in the middle of the season because FIFA are run by corrupt maggots and toads and now the nations league which started as an honourable distraction from pointless friendlies scheduling games bang on top of each other with no time to rest, recover, train and prepare in between. In June! Fucking let them have a proper break, all this has done is let a ton of people throw mud at the most successful manager we have had in most of our lifetimes and propose we replace him rather than acknowledge the fixtures have been atrociously planned.
Yes you can blame woke Southgate. How can you fire up your team for kick off, when you make them kneel first? It's a submissive gesture. Never mind the fact he obviously knows F all about what's really behind BLM.
You cannot blame Southgate for this result or any of the performances, its ridiculous to schedule these games the way they have. No wonder clubs get pissy about players going on international duty.
We have a world cup coming up in the middle of the season because FIFA are run by corrupt maggots and toads and now the nations league which started as an honourable distraction from pointless friendlies scheduling games bang on top of each other with no time to rest, recover, train and prepare in between. In June! Fucking let them have a proper break, all this has done is let a ton of people throw mud at the most successful manager we have had in most of our lifetimes and propose we replace him rather than acknowledge the fixtures have been atrociously planned.
Yes you can blame woke Southgate. How can you fire up your team for kick off, when you make them kneel first? It's a submissive gesture. Never mind the fact he obviously knows F all about what's really behind BLM.
Got it. Stop kneeling before games and we’d have won the Euros.
Stones’s second booking was a joke and the Magyar should be ashamed of himself for that playacting. That doesn’t excuse the team’s appalling performance.
You cannot blame Southgate for this result or any of the performances, its ridiculous to schedule these games the way they have. No wonder clubs get pissy about players going on international duty.
We have a world cup coming up in the middle of the season because FIFA are run by corrupt maggots and toads and now the nations league which started as an honourable distraction from pointless friendlies scheduling games bang on top of each other with no time to rest, recover, train and prepare in between. In June! Fucking let them have a proper break, all this has done is let a ton of people throw mud at the most successful manager we have had in most of our lifetimes and propose we replace him rather than acknowledge the fixtures have been atrociously planned.
Yes you can blame woke Southgate. How can you fire up your team for kick off, when you make them kneel first? It's a submissive gesture. Never mind the fact he obviously knows F all about what's really behind BLM.
I’m sure you have no agenda here. Argue about his football not his politics.
I genuinely thought this character was having a laugh when I read it.
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
As for the booing of their national anthem. A cautious no from me, do they deserve it, absolutely they do, but why lower to their backward dated level? Be better than them not the same.
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
In three big games in tournaments we have taken the lead and just sat back and allowed the opposition to control the game. Croatia in WC, Holland in nations league and Italy in the final. Was at all of them and it was so obvious what was happening. Everyone of them game in a carbon copy of themselves. Southgate is painfully negative and it will show itself again at the World Cup.
We are getting a back 5 at WC, whilst Grealish, Foden, Saka and Bellingham will be sat on the bench as we play two holding midfielders again.
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
I do agree with your post, you can only beat what is put in front of you, which of course many managers before him failed to do. So it's unfair to tarnish him with the 'easy route'.
But on the flip side of that i can certainly see the 'easy' point that people make.
I also agree that if the WC is a disappointment, which to me is an exit before the quarters, then he'll probably be gone.
You cannot blame Southgate for this result or any of the performances, its ridiculous to schedule these games the way they have. No wonder clubs get pissy about players going on international duty.
We have a world cup coming up in the middle of the season because FIFA are run by corrupt maggots and toads and now the nations league which started as an honourable distraction from pointless friendlies scheduling games bang on top of each other with no time to rest, recover, train and prepare in between. In June! Fucking let them have a proper break, all this has done is let a ton of people throw mud at the most successful manager we have had in most of our lifetimes and propose we replace him rather than acknowledge the fixtures have been atrociously planned.
Southgate isn't completely blameless. Some of it is way OTT but you can't completely absolve him.
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
In three big games in tournaments we have taken the lead and just sat back and allowed the opposition to control the game. Croatia in WC, Holland in nations league and Italy in the final. Was at all of them and it was so obvious what was happening. Everyone of them game in a carbon copy of themselves. Southgate is painfully negative and it will show itself again at the World Cup.
We are getting a back 5 at WC, whilst Grealish, Foden, Saka and Bellingham will be sat on the bench as we play two holding midfielders again.
He’s not perfect or without criticism, but not the time to sack.
You cannot blame Southgate for this result or any of the performances, its ridiculous to schedule these games the way they have. No wonder clubs get pissy about players going on international duty.
We have a world cup coming up in the middle of the season because FIFA are run by corrupt maggots and toads and now the nations league which started as an honourable distraction from pointless friendlies scheduling games bang on top of each other with no time to rest, recover, train and prepare in between. In June! Fucking let them have a proper break, all this has done is let a ton of people throw mud at the most successful manager we have had in most of our lifetimes and propose we replace him rather than acknowledge the fixtures have been atrociously planned.
Southgate isn't completely blameless. Some of it is way OTT but you can't completely absolve him.
I agree. End of season, players not that bothered, some new caps, experimental formations. Ok it didn't work so he takes some blame for that, but you can't sack a guy based off a couple of bad games v Hungary. Draws v Italy and Germany are not bad results.
The time to panic will be if we perform badly and take a heavy beating in either of the 2 September games. As i'd expect those to be a near full strength side playing 352.
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
In three big games in tournaments we have taken the lead and just sat back and allowed the opposition to control the game. Croatia in WC, Holland in nations league and Italy in the final. Was at all of them and it was so obvious what was happening. Everyone of them game in a carbon copy of themselves. Southgate is painfully negative and it will show itself again at the World Cup.
We are getting a back 5 at WC, whilst Grealish, Foden, Saka and Bellingham will be sat on the bench as we play two holding midfielders again.
Not completely true... Against Croatia and Italy we dominated the first halves but couldn't find a second goal - Croatia we had the pass that Kane should have made to Sterling, whilst Italy we didnt create as much but we were in absolute control... Where Southgate has failed is tactically dealing with either team when they made adjustments to correct that ahead of the second half.
Just to add, of course we'll go back to two holding midfielders, last night confirmed why we had to, and its worked the last three Tournaments so not overly complaining.
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
In three big games in tournaments we have taken the lead and just sat back and allowed the opposition to control the game. Croatia in WC, Holland in nations league and Italy in the final. Was at all of them and it was so obvious what was happening. Everyone of them game in a carbon copy of themselves. Southgate is painfully negative and it will show itself again at the World Cup.
We are getting a back 5 at WC, whilst Grealish, Foden, Saka and Bellingham will be sat on the bench as we play two holding midfielders again.
He’s not perfect or without criticism, but not the time to sack.
The time to sack him was straight after the Italy final. Got criticism for saying it then and think history has shown that it was not a mad as people thought back then. I dislike Southgate so much, I agree it is crazy to suggest sacking him 5 months before a tournament starts.
Have to hope we can keep those clean sheets and bore our way to success.
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
In three big games in tournaments we have taken the lead and just sat back and allowed the opposition to control the game. Croatia in WC, Holland in nations league and Italy in the final. Was at all of them and it was so obvious what was happening. Everyone of them game in a carbon copy of themselves. Southgate is painfully negative and it will show itself again at the World Cup.
We are getting a back 5 at WC, whilst Grealish, Foden, Saka and Bellingham will be sat on the bench as we play two holding midfielders again.
He’s not perfect or without criticism, but not the time to sack.
The time to sack him was straight after the Italy final. Got criticism for saying it then and think history has shown that it was not a mad as people thought back then. I dislike Southgate so much, I agree it is crazy to suggest sacking him 5 months before a tournament starts.
Have to hope we can keep those clean sheets and bore our way to success.
When was the last time England truly played exciting Football?
I guess Klopp should have been sacked after the Champions League Final this season
Joachim Low took eight years (one lost Final and three Semi-Finals) before he won anything with Germany - Thank god he's not English... We just dont have any patience and such an entitlement complex.
started off as caretaker manager - got good results - made everyone feel optimistic and like things were going to change - players let him down like they did all the other managers before him. Questionable tactics.
lost four nil.
deja vu?
Could you get any more simplistic with that?
man no win kick ball match. man bad
Maybe you can!! lol!
Another lesson/parallel: 'attractive attacking football' can be thrashed by attractive-ish defensive football even at the level of Nations League A.
I think Southgate has improved England since he started as manager but in recent times it is starting to feel like he is losing his way.
There seems to be a policy of bringing in youngsters that have come through the England youth sett up just because they have. Regardless of if they are proving they are ready for England by regular performance at top level.
Pope sits on the bench whilst another younger keeper leap frogs him in the games. Surely with a world cup so close he should have been playing as he has been the sub keeper to Pickford.
The policy of keeping possession is ok if you are going to be proactive and move forward with some intent and pace to attack. Keeping it for the sake of it is boring and doesn't work, We got away with the same tactic in Hungary but the Hungarians have gained in confidence and took their chances this time.
To not change our tempo and counter their tactics from the start was naive. I can't be bothered to go into individual players that moved at a snails pace at the back in both these games to then check when they reach the half way line and play it back or square time and time again. No wonder we haven't scored in open play for sometime. Midfield players running toward the stagnant back line to receive a short pass and knock it straight back I lost count of the times.
It must be a frustrating nightmare for attacking intent style players by the time they do get a pass they have no space to move in to.
For me the team picks itself now - and we HAVE to play the first team for the last two nations league games to build momentum now rather than stick a load of fringe players in:
Pickford
James Walker Stones Maguire Chilwell (or Shaw … only decision for me)
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
In three big games in tournaments we have taken the lead and just sat back and allowed the opposition to control the game. Croatia in WC, Holland in nations league and Italy in the final. Was at all of them and it was so obvious what was happening. Everyone of them game in a carbon copy of themselves. Southgate is painfully negative and it will show itself again at the World Cup.
We are getting a back 5 at WC, whilst Grealish, Foden, Saka and Bellingham will be sat on the bench as we play two holding midfielders again.
He’s not perfect or without criticism, but not the time to sack.
The time to sack him was straight after the Italy final. Got criticism for saying it then and think history has shown that it was not a mad as people thought back then. I dislike Southgate so much, I agree it is crazy to suggest sacking him 5 months before a tournament starts.
Have to hope we can keep those clean sheets and bore our way to success.
On what grounds would you have sacked a guy after reaching our first major final for 55 years?
I think Southgate has improved England since he started as manager but in recent times it is starting to feel like he is losing his way.
There seems to be a policy of bringing in youngsters that have come through the England youth sett up just because they have. Regardless of if they are proving they are ready for England by regular performance at top level.
Pope sits on the bench whilst another younger keeper leap frogs him in the games. Surely with a world cup so close he should have been playing as he has been the sub keeper to Pickford.
The policy of keeping possession is ok if you are going to be proactive and move forward with some intent and pace to attack. Keeping it for the sake of it is boring and doesn't work, We got away with the same tactic in Hungary but the Hungarians have gained in confidence and took their chances this time.
To not change our tempo and counter their tactics from the start was naive. I can't be bothered to go into individual players that moved at a snails pace at the back in both these games to then check when they reach the half way line and play it back or square time and time again. No wonder we haven't scored in open play for sometime. Midfield players running toward the stagnant back line to receive a short pass and knock it straight back I lost count of the times.
It must be a frustrating nightmare for attacking intent style players by the time they do get a pass they have no space to move in to.
Southgate has seen Pope play for England before, Ramsdale is fairly new so surely in games which are effectively as meaningless as we will play, are the time to try him out?
Also i think people are slightly biased about Pope because he played for us. Ramsdale is the Arsenal number 1, whereas Pope is supposedly only wanted by just one PL club (newly promoted Forest) despite being available for about 15m. Surely that tells us something.
Southgate’s record in major tournaments and qualifiers:
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
And don’t gimme no “easy route to final” line, there’s no such thing, the best teams make it to the latter stages, whether they’re a nation with a tradition of winning or not is irrelevant. You can’t fluke your way to finals etc.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
In three big games in tournaments we have taken the lead and just sat back and allowed the opposition to control the game. Croatia in WC, Holland in nations league and Italy in the final. Was at all of them and it was so obvious what was happening. Everyone of them game in a carbon copy of themselves. Southgate is painfully negative and it will show itself again at the World Cup.
We are getting a back 5 at WC, whilst Grealish, Foden, Saka and Bellingham will be sat on the bench as we play two holding midfielders again.
He’s not perfect or without criticism, but not the time to sack.
The time to sack him was straight after the Italy final. Got criticism for saying it then and think history has shown that it was not a mad as people thought back then. I dislike Southgate so much, I agree it is crazy to suggest sacking him 5 months before a tournament starts.
Have to hope we can keep those clean sheets and bore our way to success.
Why though, he did really well, first final in 55 years, lost on penalties. History hasn’t happened since, we’ve not played in a tournament since. If we go out underwhelmed this year ill agree but until then his last major tournament was very good.
Southgate deserves Qatar because of the previous two tournaments.
He's a conservative manager and that is always how he will set up. That isn't necessarily a bad thing, it just means that bad results will look worse because of the lack of attacking intent.
He's a good tournament manager that I don't think is quite capable of making the jump to a trophy winner.
We've got the squad capable of doing it but I feel like the Euros was the tournament we should have won, now we're past the peak under Southgate. He just hasn't really shown that he's learning from his setbacks.
The major problem is between the 45th-75th minute, other managers will make adjustments and Southgate can't recognise and adapt a game-plan during the game to match it. We lost to Croatia, Italy and Holland all for this reason.
Only watched the highlights to be honest. Thought England looked like a team ready for their holidays yet again and were pretty disorganised throughout. Hungary looked useful and were ruthless when presented with chances. Did I imagine it, or was Maguire roundly booed when he came on? Not sure where the animosity towards him comes from? The Stones sending off was hilarious! I assume they had VAR so why wasn't that overturned? Madness.
Only watched the highlights to be honest. Thought England looked like a team ready for their holidays yet again and were pretty disorganised throughout. Hungary looked useful and were ruthless when presented with chances. Did I imagine it, or was Maguire roundly booed when he came on? Not sure where the animosity towards him comes from? The Stones sending off was hilarious! I assume they had VAR so why wasn't that overturned? Madness.
Got a feeling that Maguire wasnt booed per se... It was more because Southgate was sending on a defensive player, for an attacking one - Why another attacking player would have made any difference at that stage, I'm not sure.
VAR couldnt overturn the Stones sending off, because he was only given a yellow card, just happened to be his second.
Only watched the highlights to be honest. Thought England looked like a team ready for their holidays yet again and were pretty disorganised throughout. Hungary looked useful and were ruthless when presented with chances. Did I imagine it, or was Maguire roundly booed when he came on? Not sure where the animosity towards him comes from? The Stones sending off was hilarious! I assume they had VAR so why wasn't that overturned? Madness.
Got a feeling that Maguire wasnt booed per se... It was more because Southgate was sending on a defensive player, for an attacking one - Why another attacking player would have made any difference at that stage, I'm not sure.
VAR couldnt overturn the Stones sending off, because he was only given a yellow card, just happened to be his second.
Ah right, that makes more sense re Maguire I guess.
Didn't realise that re VAR. I assumed any 'clear and obvious error' could be reviewed? The look on Stones' face was a classic. The fella just ran past him and hit the deck ffs! God knows what the ref was thinking.
I get why people struggle with bad England results because they're not fun to watch but I don't think these matches are anything to base a decision as massive as sacking the manager on. Southgate has proven that he is better than any manager we have had for the past 32 years in terms of World Cup progression and no manager has ever taken England further in the Euros. Euro 2020 was our first appearance at a major tournament final since 1966. You may not like his style or the football we play but he's very aware of what it takes to progress in tournaments. The reality is that misery makes a successful tournament team. For all the attacking players we have, it's solidity that sees teams progress.
The last set of World Cups have been won by fairly miserable teams. France in 2018 won under Didier Deschamps, the French equivalent of Southgate who plays with caution and relies on moments of brilliance from individuals rather than an overall aggressive playing style despite their wealth of talent. Before that Germany just about made it through, drawing their second group game against Ghana (who finished bottom of their group), scraped past Algeria after extra time, beat France 1-0, shellacked Brazil in a hilariously anomalous game and then squeaked out the dullest of 1-0 injury time wins over Argentina in the final. Before that Spain won, coming out of their group with a defeat against Switzerland, a 2-0 win over Honduras and a fairly fortunate 2-1 win over Chile.They then beat Portugal, Paraguay and Germany 1-0, before beating Holland 1-0 in the final after extra time. This was a team so good that Ramos played right back because Pique and Puyol were in the middle, Iniesta played on the left so that Xabi Alonso, Busquets and Xavi could all fit in and there wasn't space for all of Fernando Torres, David Villa and Cesc Fabregas together. Pedro and Mata were exclusively used from the bench. They had one of the best international teams ever and still chose to control possession, stay tight and generally didn't score until 60-80-odd minutes in. I probably don't need to lay out just how much fun Italy weren't to watch in 2006 but they drew with the USA, beat Australia 1-0 and won the tournament on pens. They also spent the last 10 mins of extra time in the final against 10 men because Zidane lost his mind, and they acted like nothing had changed because they'd rather chance the pens than lose their structure. Brazil were fun in 2002 with their team of all-time greats, but there's a reason they've been unable to win the tournament since, and it's mostly David Luiz related. 98 is going so far back it was almost a different game, but France still needed extra time, pens and allegedly a rigged draw to get to the end.
The European Championships aren't much different. We were some poorly taken penalties away from glory against a team just as well-organised and cautious as us last time, and I think if you took the Championship winning teams of Portugal and Greece and showed their tournament runs to the ECHR they'd have banned football by the end of the group stages. Tournaments are exciting but they're also generally won by the teams who make the fewest mistakes and grind their opponents into powder via the medium of suffocating, careful football. I think I'd rather have a team that are designed over many years to play in a way that results in progression in tournaments even if it's not as attacking as it could be because playing expansively and beating Lithuania 4-0 in the qualifiers doesn't mean much if you're then knocked out by Iceland in the actual tournament. I eel for Southgate, I can see him walking regardless of how Qatar goes because despite the massive, massive improvement he's brought to England's fortunes he still gets so much grief. People like to claim he's blessed with the young squad at his disposal as if the so-called Golden Generation weren't stinking out tournaments as recently as 2010.
Only watched the highlights to be honest. Thought England looked like a team ready for their holidays yet again and were pretty disorganised throughout. Hungary looked useful and were ruthless when presented with chances. Did I imagine it, or was Maguire roundly booed when he came on? Not sure where the animosity towards him comes from? The Stones sending off was hilarious! I assume they had VAR so why wasn't that overturned? Madness.
Got a feeling that Maguire wasnt booed per se... It was more because Southgate was sending on a defensive player, for an attacking one - Why another attacking player would have made any difference at that stage, I'm not sure.
VAR couldnt overturn the Stones sending off, because he was only given a yellow card, just happened to be his second.
Ah right, that makes more sense re Maguire I guess.
Didn't realise that re VAR. I assumed any 'clear and obvious error' could be reviewed? The look on Stones' face was a classic. The fella just ran past him and hit the deck ffs! God knows what the ref was thinking.
I thought the same RE: the booking - I mean in the World Cup Play-Off, a New Zealand player had his booking upgraded to a straight red, so at the time presumed the same could happen the other way.
I think Southgate has improved England since he started as manager but in recent times it is starting to feel like he is losing his way.
There seems to be a policy of bringing in youngsters that have come through the England youth sett up just because they have. Regardless of if they are proving they are ready for England by regular performance at top level.
Pope sits on the bench whilst another younger keeper leap frogs him in the games. Surely with a world cup so close he should have been playing as he has been the sub keeper to Pickford.
The policy of keeping possession is ok if you are going to be proactive and move forward with some intent and pace to attack. Keeping it for the sake of it is boring and doesn't work, We got away with the same tactic in Hungary but the Hungarians have gained in confidence and took their chances this time.
To not change our tempo and counter their tactics from the start was naive. I can't be bothered to go into individual players that moved at a snails pace at the back in both these games to then check when they reach the half way line and play it back or square time and time again. No wonder we haven't scored in open play for sometime. Midfield players running toward the stagnant back line to receive a short pass and knock it straight back I lost count of the times.
It must be a frustrating nightmare for attacking intent style players by the time they do get a pass they have no space to move in to.
Southgate has seen Pope play for England before, Ramsdale is fairly new so surely in games which are effectively as meaningless as we will play, are the time to try him out?
Also i think people are slightly biased about Pope because he played for us. Ramsdale is the Arsenal number 1, whereas Pope is supposedly only wanted by just one PL club (newly promoted Forest) despite being available for about 15m. Surely that tells us something.
If there was more than just 2 games before the World Cup I would agree with you about Ramsdale being given a try but there are not.
Southgate has had Pope on the bench when Pickford played and also when Ramsdale played so he is obviously rated 2nd goalie behind Pickford. For the record I am not biased toward Pope, I always want the best player for the position. Ramsdale is a good prospect but I don't think he is ready yet for England and this World Cup.
If we don't get positive results in the next 2 games before the tournament we will go in to it with the press & fans on the teams back and no confidence.
Comments
You do realise we did the same during the Euro's yes?
P41 W30 D7 L4
I’m as embarrassed as anyone regarding last night, and twice as bored considering this break we’ve just witnessed. But Southgate is excellent in tournaments, I’ll repeat, Southgate is excellent in tournaments.
I’d give him Qatar, then I’d imagine the FA will get rid if it’s underwhelming.
But on the flip side of that i can certainly see the 'easy' point that people make.
I also agree that if the WC is a disappointment, which to me is an exit before the quarters, then he'll probably be gone.
Southgate isn't completely blameless. Some of it is way OTT but you can't completely absolve him.
The time to panic will be if we perform badly and take a heavy beating in either of the 2 September games. As i'd expect those to be a near full strength side playing 352.
Just to add, of course we'll go back to two holding midfielders, last night confirmed why we had to, and its worked the last three Tournaments so not overly complaining.
I guess Klopp should have been sacked after the Champions League Final this season
Joachim Low took eight years (one lost Final and three Semi-Finals) before he won anything with Germany - Thank god he's not English... We just dont have any patience and such an entitlement complex.
There seems to be a policy of bringing in youngsters that have come through the England youth sett up just because they have. Regardless of if they are proving they are ready for England by regular performance at top level.
Pope sits on the bench whilst another younger keeper leap frogs him in the games. Surely with a world cup so close he should have been playing as he has been the sub keeper to Pickford.
The policy of keeping possession is ok if you are going to be proactive and move forward with some intent and pace to attack. Keeping it for the sake of it is boring and doesn't work, We got away with the same tactic in Hungary but the Hungarians have gained in confidence and took their chances this time.
To not change our tempo and counter their tactics from the start was naive. I can't be bothered to go into individual players that moved at a snails pace at the back in both these games to then check when they reach the half way line and play it back or square time and time again. No wonder we haven't scored in open play for sometime. Midfield players running toward the stagnant back line to receive a short pass and knock it straight back I lost count of the times.
It must be a frustrating nightmare for attacking intent style players by the time they do get a pass they have no space to move in to.
Pickford
Walker
Stones
Maguire
Chilwell (or Shaw … only decision for me)
Bellingham
Foden
Kane
Sterling
Grealish seems better off the bench.
Also i think people are slightly biased about Pope because he played for us. Ramsdale is the Arsenal number 1, whereas Pope is supposedly only wanted by just one PL club (newly promoted Forest) despite being available for about 15m. Surely that tells us something.
He's a conservative manager and that is always how he will set up. That isn't necessarily a bad thing, it just means that bad results will look worse because of the lack of attacking intent.
He's a good tournament manager that I don't think is quite capable of making the jump to a trophy winner.
We've got the squad capable of doing it but I feel like the Euros was the tournament we should have won, now we're past the peak under Southgate. He just hasn't really shown that he's learning from his setbacks.
The major problem is between the 45th-75th minute, other managers will make adjustments and Southgate can't recognise and adapt a game-plan during the game to match it. We lost to Croatia, Italy and Holland all for this reason.
VAR couldnt overturn the Stones sending off, because he was only given a yellow card, just happened to be his second.
Didn't realise that re VAR. I assumed any 'clear and obvious error' could be reviewed? The look on Stones' face was a classic. The fella just ran past him and hit the deck ffs! God knows what the ref was thinking.