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Post-match Thread: Charlton Athletic v Plymouth Argyle | Tuesday 16th August 2022
Comments
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That first half by rak Sak reminded me of when palace twisted rhoys wiggins inside out and ruined him , was it zaha or bolasie or both3
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The promote buttons looks like it’s giving you the middle finger!aliwibble said:For those who say that Golfie is never happy, from the match thread, for posterity:
(I’m still buzzing from the performance to fall asleep annoyingly - going to pay for that when I have to take my 3 year old to soft play early in the morning)3 -
MOM Sakyi but there were quite a few contenders tonight to chose from. Brilliant performance by the whole team with Leaburns goal the icing on the cake.28 -
Big Bob loves it!2
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Loved that. There were positive signs in previous games but that was a big step up in the way it we took our chances. I said before I don't think goals will be as big an issue as some believe and they'll come from across the pitch due to the way we play. Whether that'll be enough if the question but our start really gives us something to build on.
Garner so far appears to be a great coach, we've had managers try to implement possession or attacking styles but he combines the two and the players show real belief and confidence on the pitch. The composure, decision making and movement is there, even from players who many of us had written off. I've never seen us make a 4-3-3 properly work but tonight showed what can be achieved with three wide forwards all scoring. I'm impressed how quickly he's improved us especially without building a completely new squad.
Tonight we saw the benefits of a possession system. Opponents now have to decide whether to press us or not. Last season teams would almost always press us as they knew we'd eventually go long and hand possession back to them. Pressing us was a must last season but it no longer results in us hoofing the ball back to their defenders. If they press high we'll look to use the gaps it creates to play through them. If they sit back we'll patiently wait for those gaps to appear. Plymouth had 10 men for most of the game so their lack of aggressive pressing was understandable. Sheff Wed at their home ground also seemed reluctant to press. You could argue that was due to the weather, either way it's going to be interesting to see how teams attempt to deal with us and in turn how we handle it. Successfully implementing the style can only help us attract good players and set us up to compete in the Championship should we get there.
Another small thing I really like is in the right moment we'll play a few one touch passes to completely open a team up. It's rare but we did it for the goal against Derby and there was at least one move like that tonight.
On individuals Clare continues to show he's a right back but what a strike that was.
Good to see Clayden take his chance. In a possession side he'll see plenty of the ball high up the pitch which will allow him to use his pace and make his currently perceived defensive weaknesses less of an issue.
I've never completely written Morgan off but at one point last season I almost gave up on him and didn't see much of a future here for him. He's showing why Garner has faith in him ahead of JFC and Gilbey, both of which are rated more highly in sections of the fanbase.
Such a promising debut from JRS, I said in his thread he's a left footed Lookman. It was that chance he put over the bar where I could see that, another day he'll fire an unstoppable shot into the top corner. The way he created space for a shot showed his potential as a goalscorer, he just looked so calm and natural at it.
So pleased to see Kirk get his goal, I hope we keep him here.
I was really impressed by Stockley's play outside the box, it's some of the best hold up play I've seen from him.
Great to see Leaburn make an impact, he's another one I saw the potential in during preseason. He's got such potential with height, pace and strength, not to mention decent technical ability and that goal scoring instinct.
Very promising that we did that tonight while resting Sess and CBT. There's more to come from Payne too, I'm sure it won't be long until he makes his first league start.
Looking forward to Saturday. Things off the pitch aren't looking good and perhaps we have another owner cutting costs ahead of a sale, but on the pitch we may just have a manager and squad who can achieve something despite that. If we can bring in a CB and a striker we can really give it a go this season.30 -
How is Dobson getting within a mark of Morgan in the marks thread?
Seen some mark them the same. Dobson wasn't bad BTW.2 -
Wow. A thoroughly entertaining night, I could praise every player but instead would note
Sessegnon is a better player than Clayden, BUT I think Clayden works much better with Kirk because he's a pure left footer who likes to stay wide, and that's not just based on tonight as I thought it in pre-season too. This gave Kirk much more freedom and space to get into the box, where we need our wide attackers to be. Indeed with Clare limping off, unless Egbo is ready I wonder if Garner will use Sessegnon at RB on Saturday, with Clayden staying on the left.
Stockley's all round game was excellent tonight. Surprisingly the only negative is that he's not burying headers, but that was more than made up for by the pressing to win the ball, and cross which led to the penalty.
I've always been an Albie supporter, and it's great to see him on top of his game. Garner clearly trusts him in the way Bowyer and Jacko didn't, as typified by moving him to RB to allow McGrandles to get some minutes, rather than bringing Sessegnon on. He clearly buys into whatever Garner is telling him, as it was a very unAlbie like performance at RB, happy to keep possession rather than always going for the attacking forward ball.
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Taken from there fans forum.
“we play one of the better teams in this division on their own ground and are shown where we are! Nowhwere.”
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You might want to be careful with that IP address!aliwibble said:For those who say that Golfie is never happy, from the match thread, for posterity:2 -
Cafc43v3r said:
It's all in the head.ValleyGary said:I would love to sit in on a Garner training session because to get league one players playing that type of football is a masterclass.So much confidence, movement, intelligence with the ball was a delight.Sean Clare looked an upper level Champ right back and that would have been laughable last season. No more out your feet and clip it down the line, actual thought behind where the next 2 passes will go let alone what’s in front of him.So many superb individual performances but when it comes together like that it’s tucking awesome.
Plymouth are no mugs and I don’t expect 46 performances like that but we have set a very high bar and I can’t wait to see where we go from here.
Of course you do the repeating drills, probably no different to the ones Bowyer, Adkins, Jackson etc layed out. League 1 coaches don't teach players to pass, cross, shoot etc. If they can't do that they wouldn't be in a league 1 team in the first place.
Also against popular opinion they don't teach players new positions. They give role definitions and tactical instructions that change game to game.
Ben Garner is one of the best coaches in the game. I spoke to someone recently that said the only question mark is man managing under pressure because he hasn't proved that, as a coach he is top notch. They heard that from a premier league player.
I know that was a good win tonight but let's not get ahead of ourselves !
After 1 dribble Rak Sakyi was too good for League 1 said one poster and Palace might recall him and play him in the Premier !
Blimey OTT or what.
It was very pleasing to see the two wider forwards getting in the box when the ball came in from the opposite flank which hardly happened in the first 13 games last season.
It's great to see work on the training ground coming to fruition on match days but we will have a much better idea after 10 games when we will see if the ability to play with tempo can become 2nd nature. Also that Ben Garner is consistent with the way he rotates the squad and uses his subs.
Good start by Ben Garner and Jaden Stockley is heading the ball so cleanly that he does need a shank off his head which will fool the keeper. Jayden was such a handful the way he played as the Central striker tonight and his movement and laying off has improved and the relationship between the players was good from first whistle to last other than the Plymouth Goal but George Dobson is in credit so we forgive him for that missed tackle.
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How good was it to actually enjoy a game all the way through in complete control and not have any nerves that we would mess it up. Massive shout out to Morgan who was brilliant today, have never been a fan of him but if he keeps this up I soon may change my mind. Enjoying the football they are playing and hopefully we will see many more games like tonight16
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To relive the joy - click here: https://www.skysports.com/football/charlton-athletic-vs-plymouth-argyle/report/4689682
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Love this. Seems someone working on this show is a fan. The scarf in the episode was a hint, but this seems to give it away completely. Butcher is an Addick!
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I'm starting to enjoy football again.2
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Cafc43v3r said:
Answering that and @Henry Irving we moved Morgan to right back because they had zero attacking threat on their left. He became like a right sided quarter back. The best passer in the team got the ball without anyone within 10 yards of him, every time. He didn't have to make a single tackle.mendonca said:Moving Morgan to RB was a hedge. Almost expecting him to do the Milner role through tenacity and ball playing skill.
Meant McGrandles and Payne could get mins, while Clare taken off as a precaution (I hope).
Genius.
It was one of those night for Morgan that he went from being Glen Hoddle in midfield to Trent Alexander-Arnold in the Right attacking wing back and he could've gone in goal and made some saves as he had the Midas touch tonight4 -
It’s a fantastic win - but the news of Aneke’s injury is very concerning.
Its a bloody long season and we can’t just have Stockley as our only fit striker.
We need at least one more striker to come in.8 -
Forcing the new Palace kid to do the tunnel jump after his first game. Brilliant.Callumcafc said:
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Awesome. Helps that I love the show too and am aware of the Charlton background references in season 3. Assumed it was an incidental set designer but maybe it goes higher in the production chain..Clem_Snide said:Love this. Seems someone working on this show is a fan. The scarf in the episode was a hint, but this seems to give it away completely. Butcher is an Addick!2 -
Dreamland!Sort of wished the ref hadn’t sent that fella off for handball. Think we’d have one comfortably anyway, but it all felt a bit skewed after that.Morgan has really surprised me this season. Thought he’d be loaned out or sold, but he’s like a whole new player, in the mold of a Cullen maybe.The back four were all superb tonight. Love Clare. Clayden is improving rapidly, and easily good enough as backup to Sess, I think.
Lavelle & O’Connell were so composed on the ball, but still think a left footed CB would help a depth.Kirk’s best game so far I think. He fits the 433, and he’s finally showing some of the form that made us buy him. We’re now spoiled for choice in the wing department.He’s Rak-Sakyi might is going to be causing havoc all season by the looks of it. He’ll get stronger too.As for Garner. Well, for once I can actually see a proper style of play, and a plan that gets stuck to. Under previous recent managers it all seemed a bit of a mess. Have a feeling a top six is on the cards.
PS First game with both of my boys since the play off final. 👍7 -
Karl Urban was in some of my film classes at university as was Jemaine Clement. Taika Waititi was on the scene too (although i think he dropped out - loser) Bret McKenzie was about as well. Something was in the water. Thank god i stuck to me booze.Manic_mania said:
Awesome. Helps that I love the show too and am aware of the Charlton background references in season 3. Assumed it was an incidental set designer but maybe it goes higher in the production chain..Clem_Snide said:Love this. Seems someone working on this show is a fan. The scarf in the episode was a hint, but this seems to give it away completely. Butcher is an Addick!6 - Sponsored links:
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Absolutely brilliant..Garnerball, high tempo, energy, goals from everywhere. Sorry to see JJ's team let in five on the night we score five. As early as it is (and we are still only mid August!) I think the difficult TS managerial decision is looking more and more inspired with every passing week.
Albie Morgan will be player of the season for this division. Absolutely delighted with this brilliant new addicks team. COYR!!!0 -
From an Argyle forum
Subject: Re: Charlton Athletic 19:45 Plymouth Argyle 
Yesterday at 9:57 pmGraiser wrote:GreenSnake wrote:I might be over-reacting, but under Schumacher there have been some really shambolic performances (Cambridge, Wycombe and tonight away. MK Dons home are examples)
There have been really good ones as well, if we are going to be this depressingly inconsistent - Can we start asking questions about him?
Bit early for that, first goal is piss poor defending, 2nd goal poor clearance from Cooper, the penalty and sending off isn’t Schumacher’s fault it’s the players, bad night, put it to bed and move on
Very fair assessment of tonight, in all fairness Charlton were excellent and any team in this league would have struggled against them.
Very right in saying bad night and move on. Has to be forgotten and we're now on to Forest Green.
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The grapes are very sour down in the west country. While a couple of their posters have praised us & said we were excellent I've also read that we were bang average, we're just a mid table team, we're going nowhere, we have a hoodoo over them, they were getting on top until the penalty & sending off & we only scored because they kept giving the ball away. Seriously it's like reading a sheff wednesday forum. Of course all the above may be true but when you've been hammered 5-1 probably best to say nothing Pilgrims.Badger said: Subject: Re: Charlton Athletic 19:45 Plymouth Argyle Yesterday at 9:57 pmGraiser wrote:GreenSnake wrote:I might be over-reacting, but under Schumacher there have been some really shambolic performances (Cambridge, Wycombe and tonight away. MK Dons home are examples)
There have been really good ones as well, if we are going to be this depressingly inconsistent - Can we start asking questions about him?
Bit early for that, first goal is piss poor defending, 2nd goal poor clearance from Cooper, the penalty and sending off isn’t Schumacher’s fault it’s the players, bad night, put it to bed and move on
Very fair assessment of tonight, in all fairness Charlton were excellent and any team in this league would have struggled against them.
Very right in saying bad night and move on. Has to be forgotten and we're now on to Forest Green. 4 -
Many thanks for a good read, on a game where it all 'clicked' .I didnt see it, so i cant give much comment.But i note that Stockley had a good game, which is good. He doesn't seem to be an out and out goal poacher .Check Leaburn's goal, after he has distributed the ball he instictively moves to the center, into the danger zone. And the Palace boy, although not a striker, per se, after seeing some Palace footage, his instictive movements are very similar.and often scores Stockly doesn't do that-- Stockly, is what my old dad, used to call, Charlton legend ,Stuart Leary, a deep lying CF. I thought, yeah dad, he doesn't score any goals, But take S L out of the equasion, and the forward line fell flat .Yes we still need a striker. Simply for extra depth .No other particular reason
I am fairly sure ( no time or know how ,how to verify) it was Argyle who i saw back in the 60s. 6--6 draw .Paul Mariner was around then ,But we only got a point .Not the emphatic 3 like last night (it would have been 2 points then)
A final point ,and it will put a dampener on the, surely better times ahead,and last night emphatic win, that i feel is not just a 'flash in the pan'. Enjoy it while it lasts, coz knowing Charlton, the better players, will just keep the cash tills ringing. Until this culture changes, we will always be lower than Palarse and Mill wall ---C O Y A0 -
Sorry, I meant a league game. And in normal time, not a play off match.se9addick said:
Last week?golfaddick said:A few observations before posting more later.....
First time Golfie Jnr has seen us score 5 in the flesh.
Must be a first win at home, with a crowd, under floodlights for years.
5 different goalscorers
Adkins wanted 23 clean sheets.....and it got him the sack. Top 6 and only 1 clean sheet so far. Shows that scoring goals is more important.
Clare's thunderbolt is up there with Page's for goal of the season against Plymouth.1 -
Starting 11 had only 3 players - Rak-Sakyi, Wollacott and O' Connell, that weren't here last season...39
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Aaron Henry's shot a week ago put some strain on the netting.Cafc43v3r said:First next buster since Page v Plymouth.
Best performance since Plymouth at home last season? Still the last time we won a game were neither Stockley nor Aneke played IIRC
First 5 or more since Plymouth away?
Can we play you every week?1 -
Rak-Sakyi is a red, he hates Palace.
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Plymouth last year 👍golfaddick said:
Sorry, I meant a league game. And in normal time, not a play off match.se9addick said:
Last week?golfaddick said:A few observations before posting more later.....
First time Golfie Jnr has seen us score 5 in the flesh.
Must be a first win at home, with a crowd, under floodlights for years.
5 different goalscorers
Adkins wanted 23 clean sheets.....and it got him the sack. Top 6 and only 1 clean sheet so far. Shows that scoring goals is more important.
Clare's thunderbolt is up there with Page's for goal of the season against Plymouth.0 -
balham red said:Starting 11 had only 3 players - Rak-Sakyi, Wollacott and O' Connell, that weren't here last season...
Interesting point but football is now a 16 player game and the 11 players on the field in the last 25 minutes is as important as the starting 11; as Proven by a very successful England team recently.
Absolutely no headache for Ben Garner on starting 11.
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From an Argyle forum
