I am going to say it!! Yes I am, Nathan Jones......................

[Deleted User]

PeaksAndValleys said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

Lets be real, our early form flattered us. Even when we won 3 on the bounce were we actually playing well? For me bar the West Ham match not really. And for all the Jones disciples saying we are only 3 points off 8th or that we would of loved to be in this position last year, here is a fact - we havent won a league game since August.

As said I hope I am wrong and if we stick with Jones (a manager I have backed previously when our so called fans wanted him out for getting rid of a few players) ill be proven wrong, I just doubt I will be.

I literally listed six reasons in a post just above yours. They were helpfully numbered, to avoid just such a misunderstanding.

As I said, feel free to disagree with any of them, would be interested to hear it. But this post is just bollocks

This is incorrect for a number of reasons and I am currently on my lunch break so I will be kind enough to destroy all your arguments. You are welcome.

"We've been here before and Jones always turns it around" isn't actually an argument, it's just blind faith. At some point every manager runs out of turnarounds. If we're constantly ending up in these awful runs where half the fanbase wants him gone, maybe that's not evidence of his ability to fix problems, maybe it's evidence he's creating them in the first place. You don't get endless credit for putting out fires if you're the one holding the matches.

The budget excuse is getting a bit tired as well. We're told the squad isn't good enough, but Jones has had a massive say in recruitment, hasn't he? If the squad is genuinely this poor then who exactly is responsible for building it? Also, football history is full of managers getting more out of limited squads. You can't spend years taking credit for overperforming and then immediately hide behind the budget whenever the team falls apart.

The "who would you replace him with?" line is always one of the weakest arguments in football. Fans aren't paid to identify managerial targets. That's the club's job. If your defence of a manager boils down to "I can't think of anyone else" then you're basically admitting the performances aren't good enough and just hoping something turns up.

As for the league position, that's looking in the rear-view mirror. The concern is where we're heading, not where we've been. Teams don't suddenly wake up one morning in trouble. They slide into it because people keep pointing at the table and ignoring what's happening on the pitch. If the football is poor and the results are getting worse, eventually the table catches up with you.

Then there's all this stuff about philosophy being embedded through the club. Why is that automatically a good thing? A philosophy isn't some sacred object that has to be protected at all costs. It's only worth keeping if it's producing results. If it's not working, then being deeply embedded just means you've spread the problem throughout the club rather than solving it.

And finally, the five-year contract. That's the most bizarre defence of all. The fact it's expensive to sack him doesn't make him the right manager. That's just sunk-cost thinking. If a decision isn't working, throwing more time at it because you've already invested money is exactly how clubs make bad situations worse.

The reality is that most of these arguments aren't reasons to keep Jones. They're reasons why it would be awkward, expensive or inconvenient to get rid of him. They're arguments for sticking, not arguments that he's actually doing a good job.

Finally, If Nathan Jones was unemployed tomorrow and somebody suggested appointing him based purely on the football, performances and trajectory we're seeing right now, how many Charlton fans would be genuinely excited by it? I think we all know the answer.

It was cute you thought you made a point by calling my post bollocks though.

Chris_from_Sidcup

Re: the 5 year contract and us not being able to afford to get rid of him, i'm pretty sure that won't be true.

It's not as if we'd have to pay up that contract in full. Most contracts these days will have a severance clause in it so it might only cost 6 months money to get rid. At the most i think it'd be a years money, which is for him is what? Half a million?

I don't think there's a single owner in this league who wouldn't fire a manager for that pay off when faced with the risk of dropping into league one and losing 10-12m in tv money.

Chizz

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

Sacked by Forest, 17 games into the 2023-2024 season and by Leicester, 12 league games into the following season.  If we're looking to replicate the Dowie/Reid vibe, he's showing the right numbers. 

Is a manager who has been sacked by Forest, Leicester and Brondby a clear and obvious upgrade on Nathan Jones?  In my view, absolutely not.  But, even if he were, would that delta be sufficient to overcome the obvious and debilitating destabilisation that yet another change of manager would create?  

FirenzeAddick

My view has always been to stick with Jones even in the difficult spells, but this is the first time I can see the merit in a change. Barring the opening 3 wins, our form over the last year has been woeful with performances to match - we made staying up so much harder than it needed to be.

The recruitment, tactical set up, personnel decisions have been left wanting for some time now with no evidence he knows how to change things. He has been a great appointment and improved the club considerably, but like all good things they come to an end, and I think we are getting very close to that.

As a fan I want to look forward to watching us play, but I don't. I want to get out of my seat and see some good football being played, he and this coaching group aren't equipped to do that. 

DennisBooth

fenaddick said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

The idea we could afford Edwards or Cooper is a fantasy

How is it a fantasy? Do you know how much we are paying Jones? No you don’t. Do you know how much Cooper or Edwards would accept. No you don’t. I would suggest that your post is a fantasy. Jones is taking us back to League one.

wmcf123

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

You can only play football if you’ve got good players .  

NabySarr

DennisBooth said:

fenaddick said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

The idea we could afford Edwards or Cooper is a fantasy

How is it a fantasy? Do you know how much we are paying Jones? No you don’t. Do you know how much Cooper or Edwards would accept. No you don’t. I would suggest that your post is a fantasy. Jones is taking us back to League one.

It’s not just being able to afford the wages, they’d actually need to want to join us too. Given our current squad, ambition and budget, they wouldn’t come 

AberystwythAddick

NabySarr said:

DennisBooth said:

fenaddick said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

The idea we could afford Edwards or Cooper is a fantasy

How is it a fantasy? Do you know how much we are paying Jones? No you don’t. Do you know how much Cooper or Edwards would accept. No you don’t. I would suggest that your post is a fantasy. Jones is taking us back to League one.

It’s not just being able to afford the wages, they’d actually need to want to join us too. Given our current squad, ambition and budget, they wouldn’t come 

Good mates with them are you. 

ElfsborgAddick

Sword65pf said:

NabySarr said:

AberystwythAddick said:

NabySarr said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

Bowyer is the only realistic option of those 5, and imo not a good option. The other 4 are not going to want to manage a team with our budget and squad, their next jobs will be top end championship which unfortunately we are not 

I’m obviously still very much Jones in, but if we did need a new manager I’d try and persuade Dave Challinor to move down south. 

You’re talking like this is fact when it’s not. Managers make odd moves all the time. NJ coming to us was a weird move for him. 

If the board are ambitious like they were when they signed NJ many of these are plausible. 

If the board were ambitious enough to hire one of these names then we wouldn’t be in the situation we are in because they’d have invested more on players in the summer. 

It is quite clear that they don’t have the budget and ambition to hire one of those names 

I think they have the budget , but not the ambition and want out as soon as possible. But find it odd they have gone in balls deep and decided to pull out.🤷🏻‍♂️

They have found out how costly the Championship is and were misled when in talks to take the club over.

That's my hunch.

FirenzeAddick

Every manager wants to work in England, there are only 43 other jobs at our level and above, with literally thousands of qualified coaches and managers to choose from across the continent. 

The idea that there is no one out there who could do a better job is nonsense. Prime example this season is  Victor Matos - practically ridiculed as an appointment by the NTT20 boys at the time and yet look now.

Sword65pf

ElfsborgAddick said:

Sword65pf said:

NabySarr said:

AberystwythAddick said:

NabySarr said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

Bowyer is the only realistic option of those 5, and imo not a good option. The other 4 are not going to want to manage a team with our budget and squad, their next jobs will be top end championship which unfortunately we are not 

I’m obviously still very much Jones in, but if we did need a new manager I’d try and persuade Dave Challinor to move down south. 

You’re talking like this is fact when it’s not. Managers make odd moves all the time. NJ coming to us was a weird move for him. 

If the board are ambitious like they were when they signed NJ many of these are plausible. 

If the board were ambitious enough to hire one of these names then we wouldn’t be in the situation we are in because they’d have invested more on players in the summer. 

It is quite clear that they don’t have the budget and ambition to hire one of those names 

I think they have the budget , but not the ambition and want out as soon as possible. But find it odd they have gone in balls deep and decided to pull out.🤷🏻‍♂️

They have found out how costly the Championship is and were misled when in talks to take the club over.

That's my hunch.

I don’t think they are that naive🤷🏻‍♂️ but neither of us know either way really.

ElfsborgAddick

Sword65pf said:

ElfsborgAddick said:

Sword65pf said:

NabySarr said:

AberystwythAddick said:

NabySarr said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

Bowyer is the only realistic option of those 5, and imo not a good option. The other 4 are not going to want to manage a team with our budget and squad, their next jobs will be top end championship which unfortunately we are not 

I’m obviously still very much Jones in, but if we did need a new manager I’d try and persuade Dave Challinor to move down south. 

You’re talking like this is fact when it’s not. Managers make odd moves all the time. NJ coming to us was a weird move for him. 

If the board are ambitious like they were when they signed NJ many of these are plausible. 

If the board were ambitious enough to hire one of these names then we wouldn’t be in the situation we are in because they’d have invested more on players in the summer. 

It is quite clear that they don’t have the budget and ambition to hire one of those names 

I think they have the budget , but not the ambition and want out as soon as possible. But find it odd they have gone in balls deep and decided to pull out.🤷🏻‍♂️

They have found out how costly the Championship is and were misled when in talks to take the club over.

That's my hunch.

I don’t think they are that naive🤷🏻‍♂️ but neither of us know either way really.

You are right, it is all about opinions.
I find it strange that there is a seeming reluctance to spend dough when we are only a play-off spot away from the lottery of the play-offs and promotion to the money league.

Sword65pf

ElfsborgAddick said:

Sword65pf said:

ElfsborgAddick said:

Sword65pf said:

NabySarr said:

AberystwythAddick said:

NabySarr said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

Bowyer is the only realistic option of those 5, and imo not a good option. The other 4 are not going to want to manage a team with our budget and squad, their next jobs will be top end championship which unfortunately we are not 

I’m obviously still very much Jones in, but if we did need a new manager I’d try and persuade Dave Challinor to move down south. 

You’re talking like this is fact when it’s not. Managers make odd moves all the time. NJ coming to us was a weird move for him. 

If the board are ambitious like they were when they signed NJ many of these are plausible. 

If the board were ambitious enough to hire one of these names then we wouldn’t be in the situation we are in because they’d have invested more on players in the summer. 

It is quite clear that they don’t have the budget and ambition to hire one of those names 

I think they have the budget , but not the ambition and want out as soon as possible. But find it odd they have gone in balls deep and decided to pull out.🤷🏻‍♂️

They have found out how costly the Championship is and were misled when in talks to take the club over.

That's my hunch.

I don’t think they are that naive🤷🏻‍♂️ but neither of us know either way really.

You are right, it is all about opinions.
I find it strange that there is a seeming reluctance to spend dough when we are only a play-off spot away from the lottery of the play-offs and promotion to the money league.

I agree it is strange and frustrating at the same time, it is reminiscent of the past when someone has pulled the plug, turned off the tap. Thought this lot were in for the long haul. I can’t help but think about Nj peach at the end of last season, it seemed so positive and they were going to go for it a bit. Now feels like the doing things sustainably really means do it on the cheap. 

ElfsborgAddick

Sword65pf said:

ElfsborgAddick said:

Sword65pf said:

ElfsborgAddick said:

Sword65pf said:

NabySarr said:

AberystwythAddick said:

NabySarr said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

Bowyer is the only realistic option of those 5, and imo not a good option. The other 4 are not going to want to manage a team with our budget and squad, their next jobs will be top end championship which unfortunately we are not 

I’m obviously still very much Jones in, but if we did need a new manager I’d try and persuade Dave Challinor to move down south. 

You’re talking like this is fact when it’s not. Managers make odd moves all the time. NJ coming to us was a weird move for him. 

If the board are ambitious like they were when they signed NJ many of these are plausible. 

If the board were ambitious enough to hire one of these names then we wouldn’t be in the situation we are in because they’d have invested more on players in the summer. 

It is quite clear that they don’t have the budget and ambition to hire one of those names 

I think they have the budget , but not the ambition and want out as soon as possible. But find it odd they have gone in balls deep and decided to pull out.🤷🏻‍♂️

They have found out how costly the Championship is and were misled when in talks to take the club over.

That's my hunch.

I don’t think they are that naive🤷🏻‍♂️ but neither of us know either way really.

You are right, it is all about opinions.
I find it strange that there is a seeming reluctance to spend dough when we are only a play-off spot away from the lottery of the play-offs and promotion to the money league.

I agree it is strange and frustrating at the same time, it is reminiscent of the past when someone has pulled the plug, turned off the tap. Thought this lot were in for the long haul. I can’t help but think about Nj peach at the end of last season, it seemed so positive and they were going to go for it a bit. Now feels like the doing things sustainably really means do it on the cheap. 

Thus my hunch on the costs.

Addick Addict

fenaddick said:

Chris_from_Sidcup said:

J BLOCK said:

Chris_from_Sidcup said:

J BLOCK said:

If Jones leaves, we go down. If he stays, we have a chance of staying up. 

The owners have not invested in this squad to make us any better than scraping survival. I’m not sure how people can expect more than that. 

I know this is just your opinion, but there's no way of knowing it will become fact. I don't buy the 'we can't sack Jones because there's no one to replace him'. 

Who's to say we couldn't get another manager who would play better football and also get some results?

Swansea were 18th in the Championship in November 2025 when Vitor Matos joined as manager. Who had heard of him? I'd guess at hardly anyone. And of the 4 people who actually had heard of him, who thought this is a great appointment, he's going to do well for them and get them challenging near the top?

Blackburn are a car crash of a club, fans hate the owners, crowds are averaging less than 14k, they nearly went down last year and were tipped to go down this year. They got Mowbray back and are doing better than us. 

Of course i hope he turns it around but very honestly i think if things don't pick up by the international break, it will become pretty toxic at the Valley and he will have to go.

Because i've watched these players week in week out. They are a limited football team. We are not going to be able to start magically playing a different brand of football that is more effective than the one we have. 

Maybe Swansea fans also thought they were a limited football team when Matos joined.

They had 4 wins and 16 points from 16 games and had only scored 14 goals.

Swansea fans felt that Sheehan was wasting the players they had. Matos proved it and then Swansea got access to Jamestown Analytics which has helped them shoot up the table

Therein is something that would help us though, unfortunately, Tony Bloom, who owns the company will only allow one club per division to become partners with Jamestown due to wanting to avoid any potential conflict of interest.  Brighton and Swansea have both clearly benefited from that both on the pitch and in terms of recruitment. 

The Brentford owner, Matthew Benham, used to work for Bloom until they had a massive fall out but it's not difficult to recognise the "buy low, sell high" of untapped potential around the world that has been the major factor in both clubs' success. 

stjohnshill

I still back Jones but there are a few alarming trends that I am noticing - 

1) When we have 3 Championship games in a week, our record in that 3rd game is horrendous - P10 W0 D2 L8 scoring 3 conceding 18!!  Unfairly, 8 of those games have been away from home but Jones saying post match I should have freshened things up is true yet he hasn’t seemed to have learnt from the 9 matches before that how important it is for the 3rd game that week 

2) Jones strength of signing defenders with great traits, developing and coaching up, which his record is fantastic, is hurting us with attacking signings at large. 

He clearly signs a lot of attackers on traits because he believes he can develop them the same way. Sadly that has not been the case for most of them. Attacking wise we’ve been poor since he arrive and this season so far it’s much of the same. You can argue we looked better with Chalobah and we did but we all knew we’d get injured. His back up, Timmy. Another NJ signing based on traits who he believes he can develop, has turned out to be a nightmare and not for the first time in his career. 

4 out of the next 6 are at home. Desperately need 7 points from those to stay away from the relegation zone otherwise I think questions will have to be asked. 

MarcusH26

ElfsborgAddick said:

Sword65pf said:

NabySarr said:

AberystwythAddick said:

NabySarr said:

DennisBooth said:

Someone on X has posted five managers we could go for. The first two, I feel, would be out of our price range.

1  Parker 

2. Dyche 

3. Edwards 

4. Cooper 

5. Bowyer 

Cooper seems a good shout. His teams always play football.

Bowyer is the only realistic option of those 5, and imo not a good option. The other 4 are not going to want to manage a team with our budget and squad, their next jobs will be top end championship which unfortunately we are not 

I’m obviously still very much Jones in, but if we did need a new manager I’d try and persuade Dave Challinor to move down south. 

You’re talking like this is fact when it’s not. Managers make odd moves all the time. NJ coming to us was a weird move for him. 

If the board are ambitious like they were when they signed NJ many of these are plausible. 

If the board were ambitious enough to hire one of these names then we wouldn’t be in the situation we are in because they’d have invested more on players in the summer. 

It is quite clear that they don’t have the budget and ambition to hire one of those names 

I think they have the budget , but not the ambition and want out as soon as possible. But find it odd they have gone in balls deep and decided to pull out.🤷🏻‍♂️

They have found out how costly the Championship is and were misled when in talks to take the club over.

That's my hunch.

Think this is a rather good hunch Elfs. They've given it a go at this level for a year and now aren't willing to fund that next step so are looking for a sale. 

PeaksAndValleys

Radostanradical said:

PeaksAndValleys said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

Lets be real, our early form flattered us. Even when we won 3 on the bounce were we actually playing well? For me bar the West Ham match not really. And for all the Jones disciples saying we are only 3 points off 8th or that we would of loved to be in this position last year, here is a fact - we havent won a league game since August.

As said I hope I am wrong and if we stick with Jones (a manager I have backed previously when our so called fans wanted him out for getting rid of a few players) ill be proven wrong, I just doubt I will be.

I literally listed six reasons in a post just above yours. They were helpfully numbered, to avoid just such a misunderstanding.

As I said, feel free to disagree with any of them, would be interested to hear it. But this post is just bollocks

This is incorrect for a number of reasons and I am currently on my lunch break so I will be kind enough to destroy all your arguments. You are welcome.

"We've been here before and Jones always turns it around" isn't actually an argument, it's just blind faith. At some point every manager runs out of turnarounds. If we're constantly ending up in these awful runs where half the fanbase wants him gone, maybe that's not evidence of his ability to fix problems, maybe it's evidence he's creating them in the first place. You don't get endless credit for putting out fires if you're the one holding the matches.

The budget excuse is getting a bit tired as well. We're told the squad isn't good enough, but Jones has had a massive say in recruitment, hasn't he? If the squad is genuinely this poor then who exactly is responsible for building it? Also, football history is full of managers getting more out of limited squads. You can't spend years taking credit for overperforming and then immediately hide behind the budget whenever the team falls apart.

The "who would you replace him with?" line is always one of the weakest arguments in football. Fans aren't paid to identify managerial targets. That's the club's job. If your defence of a manager boils down to "I can't think of anyone else" then you're basically admitting the performances aren't good enough and just hoping something turns up.

As for the league position, that's looking in the rear-view mirror. The concern is where we're heading, not where we've been. Teams don't suddenly wake up one morning in trouble. They slide into it because people keep pointing at the table and ignoring what's happening on the pitch. If the football is poor and the results are getting worse, eventually the table catches up with you.

Then there's all this stuff about philosophy being embedded through the club. Why is that automatically a good thing? A philosophy isn't some sacred object that has to be protected at all costs. It's only worth keeping if it's producing results. If it's not working, then being deeply embedded just means you've spread the problem throughout the club rather than solving it.

And finally, the five-year contract. That's the most bizarre defence of all. The fact it's expensive to sack him doesn't make him the right manager. That's just sunk-cost thinking. If a decision isn't working, throwing more time at it because you've already invested money is exactly how clubs make bad situations worse.

The reality is that most of these arguments aren't reasons to keep Jones. They're reasons why it would be awkward, expensive or inconvenient to get rid of him. They're arguments for sticking, not arguments that he's actually doing a good job.

Finally, If Nathan Jones was unemployed tomorrow and somebody suggested appointing him based purely on the football, performances and trajectory we're seeing right now, how many Charlton fans would be genuinely excited by it? I think we all know the answer.

It was cute you thought you made a point by calling my post bollocks though.

Not on my lunch break but luckily I'm treated like a big boy so I can manage my own time and respond to this immediately.

I'll start with the worst part (takes some doing) which is in bold. You start out saying they aren't reasons to keep Jones, then say they are reasons why getting rid would be bad - those are two sides of the same coin, if it's bad to get rid then that's a reason not to (also known as keeping him).

Then you say they are reasons for keeping not for him doing a good job - that's about the only correct thing in your post, unfortunately it's not an argument against me since that's exactly what I said the reasons were. Feel free to take a look. While you're scrolling back maybe look at your own post which referred to 'the only possible argument for keeping Jones' (not, the only argument for him doing a brilliant job currently).

Onto the also incorrect but slightly less offensively incoherent counterarguments. Blind faith - no, people calling for Jones' head have been shown to be wrong on multiple occasions. That's a very good reason to think they might be wrong now. Blind faith is sacking with no alternative plan and hoping things magically get better.

Ups and downs are part of football, if the average outcome season end is positive (which it is - safety, promotion, safety) then long term it's a good appointment. Sacking on every down is how you spend years languishing in league one. 

If you're tired of people pointing out that the budget almost guarantees poor performances and a low league position then take a nap. But it will still be true when you wake up. 

League position, as above it's about how you average out. He didn't deserve an offer to manage Barcelona off the back of winning the first three games and he doesn't deserve the sack off the back of the current run. As I said the form is concerning and that needs to be kept under review. Both position and form are rear view and used as an indicator of the future - you're just being selective in which one you want to cite. 

Think I've already dealt with your two final non points. I didn't say they made him a good manager, I said they were downsides to sacking him and therefore arguments for keeping him.

It was cute that you thought you could destroy my arguments. Glad I could clear things up for you. You're welcome. Hope you had time for a sandwich in between typing out that bollocks. 

FirenzeAddick

Addick Addict said:

fenaddick said:

Chris_from_Sidcup said:

J BLOCK said:

Chris_from_Sidcup said:

J BLOCK said:

If Jones leaves, we go down. If he stays, we have a chance of staying up. 

The owners have not invested in this squad to make us any better than scraping survival. I’m not sure how people can expect more than that. 

I know this is just your opinion, but there's no way of knowing it will become fact. I don't buy the 'we can't sack Jones because there's no one to replace him'. 

Who's to say we couldn't get another manager who would play better football and also get some results?

Swansea were 18th in the Championship in November 2025 when Vitor Matos joined as manager. Who had heard of him? I'd guess at hardly anyone. And of the 4 people who actually had heard of him, who thought this is a great appointment, he's going to do well for them and get them challenging near the top?

Blackburn are a car crash of a club, fans hate the owners, crowds are averaging less than 14k, they nearly went down last year and were tipped to go down this year. They got Mowbray back and are doing better than us. 

Of course i hope he turns it around but very honestly i think if things don't pick up by the international break, it will become pretty toxic at the Valley and he will have to go.

Because i've watched these players week in week out. They are a limited football team. We are not going to be able to start magically playing a different brand of football that is more effective than the one we have. 

Maybe Swansea fans also thought they were a limited football team when Matos joined.

They had 4 wins and 16 points from 16 games and had only scored 14 goals.

Swansea fans felt that Sheehan was wasting the players they had. Matos proved it and then Swansea got access to Jamestown Analytics which has helped them shoot up the table

Therein is something that would help us though, unfortunately, Tony Bloom, who owns the company will only allow one club per division to become partners with Jamestown due to wanting to avoid any potential conflict of interest.  Brighton and Swansea have both clearly benefited from that both on the pitch and in terms of recruitment. 

The Brentford owner, Matthew Benham, used to work for Bloom until they had a massive fall out but it's not difficult to recognise the "buy low, sell high" of untapped potential around the world that has been the major factor in both clubs' success. 

They brought Damien Duff in as an Assistant Head Coach this season too, and wouldn't be surprised to see him take over in the long term. He is the kind of appointment we could look at, alongside the likes of Robbie Keane.

Neither having had that breakout opportunity in England.

Spanish

I’m not in the ‘Jones Out’ camp yet but I have to admit I find his rhetoric pre and post match frustrating. He comes across very stubborn and clearly has his favourites. All last season, he was talking about evolving our style of play and that that would be suited to Rankin Costello, who has barely featured. Similarly and as mentioned before, he talks up Knibbs in training yet doesn’t get a starting place.

 

On paper, we have a fair squad, that should it be regularly available then he would expect us to be able to more than compete. Unfortunately signing injury prone players like Burke & Chalobah and having misfortune with the likes of Godden and Kellman, makes his team selection difficult. But that’s my concern with NJ is. We play a game, don’t play well, tells us all ‘we didn’t do the basics right’ or ‘didn’t do what we trained all week on’ and then he selects pretty much the same team and same style.

 

To go to Watford and play 7 defence minded players is at the very least, short sighted if not damn right stupid. I think we all know the clubs capabilities and limits and I for one would have applauded his selection if he’d tried to win it from the outset. But instead he played such a negative side and we got what we deserved. And on top of that, he never owned it and blamed the players.

EugenesAxe

PeaksAndValleys said:

Radostanradical said:

PeaksAndValleys said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

Lets be real, our early form flattered us. Even when we won 3 on the bounce were we actually playing well? For me bar the West Ham match not really. And for all the Jones disciples saying we are only 3 points off 8th or that we would of loved to be in this position last year, here is a fact - we havent won a league game since August.

As said I hope I am wrong and if we stick with Jones (a manager I have backed previously when our so called fans wanted him out for getting rid of a few players) ill be proven wrong, I just doubt I will be.

I literally listed six reasons in a post just above yours. They were helpfully numbered, to avoid just such a misunderstanding.

As I said, feel free to disagree with any of them, would be interested to hear it. But this post is just bollocks

This is incorrect for a number of reasons and I am currently on my lunch break so I will be kind enough to destroy all your arguments. You are welcome.

"We've been here before and Jones always turns it around" isn't actually an argument, it's just blind faith. At some point every manager runs out of turnarounds. If we're constantly ending up in these awful runs where half the fanbase wants him gone, maybe that's not evidence of his ability to fix problems, maybe it's evidence he's creating them in the first place. You don't get endless credit for putting out fires if you're the one holding the matches.

The budget excuse is getting a bit tired as well. We're told the squad isn't good enough, but Jones has had a massive say in recruitment, hasn't he? If the squad is genuinely this poor then who exactly is responsible for building it? Also, football history is full of managers getting more out of limited squads. You can't spend years taking credit for overperforming and then immediately hide behind the budget whenever the team falls apart.

The "who would you replace him with?" line is always one of the weakest arguments in football. Fans aren't paid to identify managerial targets. That's the club's job. If your defence of a manager boils down to "I can't think of anyone else" then you're basically admitting the performances aren't good enough and just hoping something turns up.

As for the league position, that's looking in the rear-view mirror. The concern is where we're heading, not where we've been. Teams don't suddenly wake up one morning in trouble. They slide into it because people keep pointing at the table and ignoring what's happening on the pitch. If the football is poor and the results are getting worse, eventually the table catches up with you.

Then there's all this stuff about philosophy being embedded through the club. Why is that automatically a good thing? A philosophy isn't some sacred object that has to be protected at all costs. It's only worth keeping if it's producing results. If it's not working, then being deeply embedded just means you've spread the problem throughout the club rather than solving it.

And finally, the five-year contract. That's the most bizarre defence of all. The fact it's expensive to sack him doesn't make him the right manager. That's just sunk-cost thinking. If a decision isn't working, throwing more time at it because you've already invested money is exactly how clubs make bad situations worse.

The reality is that most of these arguments aren't reasons to keep Jones. They're reasons why it would be awkward, expensive or inconvenient to get rid of him. They're arguments for sticking, not arguments that he's actually doing a good job.

Finally, If Nathan Jones was unemployed tomorrow and somebody suggested appointing him based purely on the football, performances and trajectory we're seeing right now, how many Charlton fans would be genuinely excited by it? I think we all know the answer.

It was cute you thought you made a point by calling my post bollocks though.

Not on my lunch break but luckily I'm treated like a big boy so I can manage my own time and respond to this immediately.

I'll start with the worst part (takes some doing) which is in bold. You start out saying they aren't reasons to keep Jones, then say they are reasons why getting rid would be bad - those are two sides of the same coin, if it's bad to get rid then that's a reason not to (also known as keeping him).

Then you say they are reasons for keeping not for him doing a good job - that's about the only correct thing in your post, unfortunately it's not an argument against me since that's exactly what I said the reasons were. Feel free to take a look. While you're scrolling back maybe look at your own post which referred to 'the only possible argument for keeping Jones' (not, the only argument for him doing a brilliant job currently).

Onto the also incorrect but slightly less offensively incoherent counterarguments. Blind faith - no, people calling for Jones' head have been shown to be wrong on multiple occasions. That's a very good reason to think they might be wrong now. Blind faith is sacking with no alternative plan and hoping things magically get better.

Ups and downs are part of football, if the average outcome season end is positive (which it is - safety, promotion, safety) then long term it's a good appointment. Sacking on every down is how you spend years languishing in league one. 

If you're tired of people pointing out that the budget almost guarantees poor performances and a low league position then take a nap. But it will still be true when you wake up. 

League position, as above it's about how you average out. He didn't deserve an offer to manage Barcelona off the back of winning the first three games and he doesn't deserve the sack off the back of the current run. As I said the form is concerning and that needs to be kept under review. Both position and form are rear view and used as an indicator of the future - you're just being selective in which one you want to cite. 

Think I've already dealt with your two final non points. I didn't say they made him a good manager, I said they were downsides to sacking him and therefore arguments for keeping him.

It was cute that you thought you could destroy my arguments. Glad I could clear things up for you. You're welcome. Hope you had time for a sandwich in between typing out that bollocks. 

Needless to say you had the last laugh...

It's nice to see Radostan writing in proper sentences though, and has dropped the "I'm too intelligent to use grammar" thing.

Stu_of_Kunming

Radostanradical said:

Chizz said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

There should be no doubt whatsoever that replacing Jones now would rapidly accelerate this march. 

This is incorrect. There is evidence backing my assertion, yours is purely opinion. We may get relegated if we change manager, equally we could stay up.

What evidence is that? When were we even last in a relegation spot? 

[Deleted User]

PeaksAndValleys said:

Radostanradical said:

PeaksAndValleys said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

Lets be real, our early form flattered us. Even when we won 3 on the bounce were we actually playing well? For me bar the West Ham match not really. And for all the Jones disciples saying we are only 3 points off 8th or that we would of loved to be in this position last year, here is a fact - we havent won a league game since August.

As said I hope I am wrong and if we stick with Jones (a manager I have backed previously when our so called fans wanted him out for getting rid of a few players) ill be proven wrong, I just doubt I will be.

I literally listed six reasons in a post just above yours. They were helpfully numbered, to avoid just such a misunderstanding.

As I said, feel free to disagree with any of them, would be interested to hear it. But this post is just bollocks

This is incorrect for a number of reasons and I am currently on my lunch break so I will be kind enough to destroy all your arguments. You are welcome.

"We've been here before and Jones always turns it around" isn't actually an argument, it's just blind faith. At some point every manager runs out of turnarounds. If we're constantly ending up in these awful runs where half the fanbase wants him gone, maybe that's not evidence of his ability to fix problems, maybe it's evidence he's creating them in the first place. You don't get endless credit for putting out fires if you're the one holding the matches.

The budget excuse is getting a bit tired as well. We're told the squad isn't good enough, but Jones has had a massive say in recruitment, hasn't he? If the squad is genuinely this poor then who exactly is responsible for building it? Also, football history is full of managers getting more out of limited squads. You can't spend years taking credit for overperforming and then immediately hide behind the budget whenever the team falls apart.

The "who would you replace him with?" line is always one of the weakest arguments in football. Fans aren't paid to identify managerial targets. That's the club's job. If your defence of a manager boils down to "I can't think of anyone else" then you're basically admitting the performances aren't good enough and just hoping something turns up.

As for the league position, that's looking in the rear-view mirror. The concern is where we're heading, not where we've been. Teams don't suddenly wake up one morning in trouble. They slide into it because people keep pointing at the table and ignoring what's happening on the pitch. If the football is poor and the results are getting worse, eventually the table catches up with you.

Then there's all this stuff about philosophy being embedded through the club. Why is that automatically a good thing? A philosophy isn't some sacred object that has to be protected at all costs. It's only worth keeping if it's producing results. If it's not working, then being deeply embedded just means you've spread the problem throughout the club rather than solving it.

And finally, the five-year contract. That's the most bizarre defence of all. The fact it's expensive to sack him doesn't make him the right manager. That's just sunk-cost thinking. If a decision isn't working, throwing more time at it because you've already invested money is exactly how clubs make bad situations worse.

The reality is that most of these arguments aren't reasons to keep Jones. They're reasons why it would be awkward, expensive or inconvenient to get rid of him. They're arguments for sticking, not arguments that he's actually doing a good job.

Finally, If Nathan Jones was unemployed tomorrow and somebody suggested appointing him based purely on the football, performances and trajectory we're seeing right now, how many Charlton fans would be genuinely excited by it? I think we all know the answer.

It was cute you thought you made a point by calling my post bollocks though.

Not on my lunch break but luckily I'm treated like a big boy so I can manage my own time and respond to this immediately.

I'll start with the worst part (takes some doing) which is in bold. You start out saying they aren't reasons to keep Jones, then say they are reasons why getting rid would be bad - those are two sides of the same coin, if it's bad to get rid then that's a reason not to (also known as keeping him).

Then you say they are reasons for keeping not for him doing a good job - that's about the only correct thing in your post, unfortunately it's not an argument against me since that's exactly what I said the reasons were. Feel free to take a look. While you're scrolling back maybe look at your own post which referred to 'the only possible argument for keeping Jones' (not, the only argument for him doing a brilliant job currently).

Onto the also incorrect but slightly less offensively incoherent counterarguments. Blind faith - no, people calling for Jones' head have been shown to be wrong on multiple occasions. That's a very good reason to think they might be wrong now. Blind faith is sacking with no alternative plan and hoping things magically get better.

Ups and downs are part of football, if the average outcome season end is positive (which it is - safety, promotion, safety) then long term it's a good appointment. Sacking on every down is how you spend years languishing in league one. 

If you're tired of people pointing out that the budget almost guarantees poor performances and a low league position then take a nap. But it will still be true when you wake up. 

League position, as above it's about how you average out. He didn't deserve an offer to manage Barcelona off the back of winning the first three games and he doesn't deserve the sack off the back of the current run. As I said the form is concerning and that needs to be kept under review. Both position and form are rear view and used as an indicator of the future - you're just being selective in which one you want to cite. 

Think I've already dealt with your two final non points. I didn't say they made him a good manager, I said they were downsides to sacking him and therefore arguments for keeping him.

It was cute that you thought you could destroy my arguments. Glad I could clear things up for you. You're welcome. Hope you had time for a sandwich in between typing out that bollocks. 

Wow you ignored all my points and didnt address a single one. Maybe you should try agAIn. PS the "-" a give away.

Needless to say I have had the last laugh.

[Deleted User]

Stu_of_Kunming said:

Radostanradical said:

Chizz said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

There should be no doubt whatsoever that replacing Jones now would rapidly accelerate this march. 

This is incorrect. There is evidence backing my assertion, yours is purely opinion. We may get relegated if we change manager, equally we could stay up.

What evidence is that? When were we even last in a relegation spot? 

The championship form table would show a aggressive drop in our position.

elbiglad

I am still very much Jones in. That’s mostly because I believe in him to turn it around (as he has done before), partly by his ability to thrive in situations like ours in this league, and slightly because I don’t like the sound of most of the viable replacement options. The players definitely deserve some of the blame. Far too many passive and weak performances lately.

But this has to be our rock bottom (for the first half of the season at least; I am fully expecting another barren run later in the year). At the moment we do not play in the style Jones wants us to and he makes no secret of that by telling us after every match that the players are not trained to play this way. So something’s gotta give, somewhere. The players do not look confident, we are not the aggressive horrible to play team we once were. The performances have actually been worse than the results. 

The team has no identity. That is clear by the constant formation changes. But beyond that there’s no philosophy behind the way we play, and it’s primarily an issue going forward. Things that aren’t currently working:
1. The formation(s). 4-2-3-1 doesn’t work properly because we didn’t sign a good right winger,  we are missing someone like Chalobah or an in form no 10 to help create, and we look open at the back. The shift to five at the back has not brought huge improvements in defensive solidity and nullified our already quite limited attacking ability.

2. Goals. We are struggling to create chances let alone score. Our two most likely players (TC and Grant) play in the same position and, as we currently set up, neither of them are even playing in that position. I’d rather we revert to 4-2-3-1, and accept that either TC or Grant have to play out of position or not start. 

3. Maximising the ability we do have. TC started the season on fire and then we changed the formation to reduce his number of touches in 1v1 areas out wide. He looked knackered on Saturday. Leaburn has a unique profile and set of skills that we don’t seem to utilise. We have two hard working industrious midfielders and yet get overrun through the middle constantly. What’s going on?
4. Defensive transition and counter attacks. Wide open from so many attacking free kicks on Saturday and caught on the counter continuously. Same against Burnley. We were built on doing the basics right but look so open at the moment. 

5. Passive 1v1 defending. We are giving wide players too much space and time to attack our full backs. Either the defenders aren’t confident in their ability or they feel like they’re on an island without adequate support from the player inside of them. 

6. Pressing. If we do press high up then, typically, we don’t do it very well. 

Some promising signs:
1. Players are returning from fitness. Koumetio improves our ability to build up, as does a fully fit Ramsay. Chalobah will be a huge upgrade on Skipp, for however long he can stay fit. A signing like Solly March would also benefit us.
2. Attacking set pieces look very dangerous again.

I’m sure there are more reasons for optimism, but I am currently struggling to think of them. Jones deserves our backing and patience. He can definitely turn this around. But the team is lacking confidence and aggression. If we can go back to the basics of Jones’ philosophy - defend the centre of the pitch and the box, press with aggression and intent, fast paced but also direct attacking play - then we will go back to being a team that is competitive in games and hard to beat. I think that’s all most reasonable fans want - sorry to those who are expecting free flowing all out attack football. It’s very frustrating that when things go bad for this team they seem to go really bad. But we have been here before. Hopefully Jones is referencing ‘Watford away’ as a turning point in a press conference later this year… and the next year, and the next year.  

Orpingtony

If you look at the owners' record on recruiting managers, all the previous ones were worse than NJ. 

[Deleted User]

EugenesAxe said:

PeaksAndValleys said:

Radostanradical said:

PeaksAndValleys said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

Lets be real, our early form flattered us. Even when we won 3 on the bounce were we actually playing well? For me bar the West Ham match not really. And for all the Jones disciples saying we are only 3 points off 8th or that we would of loved to be in this position last year, here is a fact - we havent won a league game since August.

As said I hope I am wrong and if we stick with Jones (a manager I have backed previously when our so called fans wanted him out for getting rid of a few players) ill be proven wrong, I just doubt I will be.

I literally listed six reasons in a post just above yours. They were helpfully numbered, to avoid just such a misunderstanding.

As I said, feel free to disagree with any of them, would be interested to hear it. But this post is just bollocks

This is incorrect for a number of reasons and I am currently on my lunch break so I will be kind enough to destroy all your arguments. You are welcome.

"We've been here before and Jones always turns it around" isn't actually an argument, it's just blind faith. At some point every manager runs out of turnarounds. If we're constantly ending up in these awful runs where half the fanbase wants him gone, maybe that's not evidence of his ability to fix problems, maybe it's evidence he's creating them in the first place. You don't get endless credit for putting out fires if you're the one holding the matches.

The budget excuse is getting a bit tired as well. We're told the squad isn't good enough, but Jones has had a massive say in recruitment, hasn't he? If the squad is genuinely this poor then who exactly is responsible for building it? Also, football history is full of managers getting more out of limited squads. You can't spend years taking credit for overperforming and then immediately hide behind the budget whenever the team falls apart.

The "who would you replace him with?" line is always one of the weakest arguments in football. Fans aren't paid to identify managerial targets. That's the club's job. If your defence of a manager boils down to "I can't think of anyone else" then you're basically admitting the performances aren't good enough and just hoping something turns up.

As for the league position, that's looking in the rear-view mirror. The concern is where we're heading, not where we've been. Teams don't suddenly wake up one morning in trouble. They slide into it because people keep pointing at the table and ignoring what's happening on the pitch. If the football is poor and the results are getting worse, eventually the table catches up with you.

Then there's all this stuff about philosophy being embedded through the club. Why is that automatically a good thing? A philosophy isn't some sacred object that has to be protected at all costs. It's only worth keeping if it's producing results. If it's not working, then being deeply embedded just means you've spread the problem throughout the club rather than solving it.

And finally, the five-year contract. That's the most bizarre defence of all. The fact it's expensive to sack him doesn't make him the right manager. That's just sunk-cost thinking. If a decision isn't working, throwing more time at it because you've already invested money is exactly how clubs make bad situations worse.

The reality is that most of these arguments aren't reasons to keep Jones. They're reasons why it would be awkward, expensive or inconvenient to get rid of him. They're arguments for sticking, not arguments that he's actually doing a good job.

Finally, If Nathan Jones was unemployed tomorrow and somebody suggested appointing him based purely on the football, performances and trajectory we're seeing right now, how many Charlton fans would be genuinely excited by it? I think we all know the answer.

It was cute you thought you made a point by calling my post bollocks though.

Not on my lunch break but luckily I'm treated like a big boy so I can manage my own time and respond to this immediately.

I'll start with the worst part (takes some doing) which is in bold. You start out saying they aren't reasons to keep Jones, then say they are reasons why getting rid would be bad - those are two sides of the same coin, if it's bad to get rid then that's a reason not to (also known as keeping him).

Then you say they are reasons for keeping not for him doing a good job - that's about the only correct thing in your post, unfortunately it's not an argument against me since that's exactly what I said the reasons were. Feel free to take a look. While you're scrolling back maybe look at your own post which referred to 'the only possible argument for keeping Jones' (not, the only argument for him doing a brilliant job currently).

Onto the also incorrect but slightly less offensively incoherent counterarguments. Blind faith - no, people calling for Jones' head have been shown to be wrong on multiple occasions. That's a very good reason to think they might be wrong now. Blind faith is sacking with no alternative plan and hoping things magically get better.

Ups and downs are part of football, if the average outcome season end is positive (which it is - safety, promotion, safety) then long term it's a good appointment. Sacking on every down is how you spend years languishing in league one. 

If you're tired of people pointing out that the budget almost guarantees poor performances and a low league position then take a nap. But it will still be true when you wake up. 

League position, as above it's about how you average out. He didn't deserve an offer to manage Barcelona off the back of winning the first three games and he doesn't deserve the sack off the back of the current run. As I said the form is concerning and that needs to be kept under review. Both position and form are rear view and used as an indicator of the future - you're just being selective in which one you want to cite. 

Think I've already dealt with your two final non points. I didn't say they made him a good manager, I said they were downsides to sacking him and therefore arguments for keeping him.

It was cute that you thought you could destroy my arguments. Glad I could clear things up for you. You're welcome. Hope you had time for a sandwich in between typing out that bollocks. 

Needless to say you had the last laugh...

It's nice to see Radostan writing in proper sentences though, and has dropped the "I'm too intelligent to use grammar" thing.

As always I have heard my people and give plentiful and wisely. I am but a man of the people, as long as those people are at least university educated and middle class. I'll tolerate the rest.

Stu_of_Kunming

Radostanradical said:

Stu_of_Kunming said:

Radostanradical said:

Chizz said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

There should be no doubt whatsoever that replacing Jones now would rapidly accelerate this march. 

This is incorrect. There is evidence backing my assertion, yours is purely opinion. We may get relegated if we change manager, equally we could stay up.

What evidence is that? When were we even last in a relegation spot? 

The championship form table would show an aggressive drop in our position.

Just as it did last season, it’s not evidence that we’ll go down. 

Addick Addict

Radostanradical said:

Stu_of_Kunming said:

Radostanradical said:

Chizz said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

There should be no doubt whatsoever that replacing Jones now would rapidly accelerate this march. 

This is incorrect. There is evidence backing my assertion, yours is purely opinion. We may get relegated if we change manager, equally we could stay up.

What evidence is that? When were we even last in a relegation spot? 

The championship form table would show a aggressive drop in our position.

"an aggressive". Needless to say, I won that argument. 

[Deleted User]

Addick Addict said:

Radostanradical said:

Stu_of_Kunming said:

Radostanradical said:

Chizz said:

Radostanradical said:

The only possible argument for keeping Jones in charge is the absence of a capable replacement, which should really tell you everything you need to about our prospects and some of our, so called, fans ambtions. There are mangers out there and yes it would be a gamble but I am afraid sticking with Jones is just a slow death march to League 1.

There should be no doubt whatsoever that replacing Jones now would rapidly accelerate this march. 

This is incorrect. There is evidence backing my assertion, yours is purely opinion. We may get relegated if we change manager, equally we could stay up.

What evidence is that? When were we even last in a relegation spot? 

The championship form table would show a aggressive drop in our position.

"an aggressive". Needless to say, I won that argument. 

I thought you were done with commenting on my posts. Dont worry mate off licence will open up soon.