Away fans housed in West Stand Upper - Testing in 25/26 season

Markg2004

Redrobo said:

tallboy said:

I'm one of those ST holders affected. My seats have a great view and whilst not rammed its still busy'ish on Saturday matchdays. I was set on renewing but this is making me reconsider. I'll renew if I'm able to relocate at the same price to another part of the West Upper (maybe nearer to the NW quadrant).

As goes the Jimmy Seed stand. I would love to see / hear Home fans in there. I really displike the idea of playing matches in a 3-sided ground however infrequently. Maybe the JS stand is a good place to relocate the 16-20 "Youth" section and also to offer slightly cheaper Adult home tickets to grow home attendances. Would really like to see safe standing for home fans installed in that part of the ground (but appreciate that the Clubs non ownership of the ground is a factor discouraging that happening).

Basically, I won't be happy if forced to decamp from my West Upper seat every so often and it will make me reconsider renewing.

 

It is a trial not a decision.
The letter to affected fans includes an invitation and a telephone number for those who wish to discuss how it affects them and it maybe a good idea to give them a call and explain your concerns.

That takes someone to respond though. I replied to that email address given straight away asking what blocks in case I choose to move across in the West Upper and no response. 

Guess you need to be ITK to get a response by sounds of it.

Powell2ThePeople

addick19 said:

pettgra said:

I have been supporting Charlton for over sixty years and I never knew that the JS stand was the home end.
No wonder I kept getting beaten up.

I've been going since 1965 and it's never been the 'home end.'

I agree with you both, never the home end, but I've been going since the late 70s and spent many a game in the JS stand.   When I was younger, on the East Terrace.  Then in my teens moved down to the clock.  

But many games in the JS along the way.   In fact, the last I remember is against Leeds when Gordon Strachan was tearing us apart on the wing.  So that would have been after the return.  

No recollection of the score that day, nor where the Leeds fans were, but can only assume they were in 1 half of JS, whether that be a top/bottom or an east/west split.   

Bizarre to think that a team like Leeds didn't have the whole end though.   

Which brings me on to another thought... Is it a false memory, or did away fans take up a block or 2 on the south side of the east on a few occasions? 

9goalswentpastperry

Powell2ThePeople said:

addick19 said:

pettgra said:

I have been supporting Charlton for over sixty years and I never knew that the JS stand was the home end.
No wonder I kept getting beaten up.

I've been going since 1965 and it's never been the 'home end.'

I agree with you both, never the home end, but I've been going since the late 70s and spent many a game in the JS stand.   When I was younger, on the East Terrace.  Then in my teens moved down to the clock.  

But many games in the JS along the way.   In fact, the last I remember is against Leeds when Gordon Strachan was tearing us apart on the wing.  So that would have been after the return.  

No recollection of the score that day, nor where the Leeds fans were, but can only assume they were in 1 half of JS, whether that be a top/bottom or an east/west split.   

Bizarre to think that a team like Leeds didn't have the whole end though.   

Which brings me on to another thought... Is it a false memory, or did away fans take up a block or 2 on the south side of the east on a few occasions? 

That Leeds game would have been the cup replay in early 1993. They had the front sections of the Jimmy Seed and we had the back. The capacity was only 8,337 so we didn't have to give them the whole stand. In fact the 1,900 they did get was bloody generous. 

It was either Brentford or Orient who had the East blocks in 2006, possibly they both did. Someone will remember definitively. 

iaitch

Airman Brown said:

Fumbluff said:

iaitch said:

Fumbluff said:

addick19 said:

pettgra said:

I have been supporting Charlton for over sixty years and I never knew that the JS stand was the home end.
No wonder I kept getting beaten up.

I've been going since 1965 and it's never been the 'home end.'

Well it’s where my season ticket was for the first season in the Prem. 

Maybe I went every week to support the other teams then 🤷‍♂️

98/99 was first season in the Premier.

Because the Upper West wasn't finished the home fans were accommodated the JS stand for one game only, I was there, (sound like Max Boyce boyo).

Incorrect

Yeah. From recollection the stand was segregated because the opposition were only entitled to 2,000 seats (10% of capacity) in 98/99.

Ok I stand corrected. I was only in there for one game then took my seat in the Upper West which is where I've been ever since although maybe not much longer with these proposals.

fenlandaddick

Instead of pissing about with this b*llox. How about our rich owners pull their fingers out and buy the ground? Then find a way to gift it or at least the pitch to the fans, so the team and ground / pitch cannot be separated.

If that happend then I would really believe all the dairy stories I have been hearing.

Before they gift the pitch, can they fix it first so it doesn't look sh*te

Then once the club has the assets they can lookmat a plan to modernise and update the valley for 21st century, ready for when we are in Europe.

Stands will be full then, and won't need to shut a bit to save a fiver

iaitch

fenlandaddick said:

Instead of pissing about with this b*llox. How about our rich owners pull their fingers out and buy the ground? Then find a way to gift it or at least the pitch to the fans, so the team and ground / pitch cannot be separated.

If that happend then I would really believe all the dairy stories I have been hearing.

Before they gift the pitch, can they fix it first so it doesn't look sh*te

Then once the club has the assets they can lookmat a plan to modernise and update the valley for 21st century, ready for when we are in Europe.

Stands will be full then, and won't need to shut a bit to save a fiver

You mean there are udder rumours?

se9addick

9goalswentpastperry said:

Powell2ThePeople said:

addick19 said:

pettgra said:

I have been supporting Charlton for over sixty years and I never knew that the JS stand was the home end.
No wonder I kept getting beaten up.

I've been going since 1965 and it's never been the 'home end.'

I agree with you both, never the home end, but I've been going since the late 70s and spent many a game in the JS stand.   When I was younger, on the East Terrace.  Then in my teens moved down to the clock.  

But many games in the JS along the way.   In fact, the last I remember is against Leeds when Gordon Strachan was tearing us apart on the wing.  So that would have been after the return.  

No recollection of the score that day, nor where the Leeds fans were, but can only assume they were in 1 half of JS, whether that be a top/bottom or an east/west split.   

Bizarre to think that a team like Leeds didn't have the whole end though.   

Which brings me on to another thought... Is it a false memory, or did away fans take up a block or 2 on the south side of the east on a few occasions? 

That Leeds game would have been the cup replay in early 1993. They had the front sections of the Jimmy Seed and we had the back. The capacity was only 8,337 so we didn't have to give them the whole stand. In fact the 1,900 they did get was bloody generous. 

It was either Brentford or Orient who had the East blocks in 2006, possibly they both did. Someone will remember definitively. 

That must have been a nightmare to segregate?!

fenlandaddick

iaitch said:

fenlandaddick said:

Instead of pissing about with this b*llox. How about our rich owners pull their fingers out and buy the ground? Then find a way to gift it or at least the pitch to the fans, so the team and ground / pitch cannot be separated.

If that happend then I would really believe all the dairy stories I have been hearing.

Before they gift the pitch, can they fix it first so it doesn't look sh*te

Then once the club has the assets they can lookmat a plan to modernise and update the valley for 21st century, ready for when we are in Europe.

Stands will be full then, and won't need to shut a bit to save a fiver

You mean there are udder rumours?

Either the shoddy autocorrect or my eyes. I swear it gets worse ( both do actually )

bromleyjohn

Mad and bad idea. You will kill the atmosphere. Atmosphere requires as vocal an away following as possible even if from only 50 fans. Football amongst other things is theatre : us and them. The away end is part of the territorial scene. Dont lose this.

se9addick

bromleyjohn said:

Mad and bad idea. You will kill the atmosphere. Atmosphere requires as vocal an away following as possible even if from only 50 fans. Football amongst other things is theatre : us and them. The away end is part of the territorial scene. Dont lose this.

I don’t think it’s a great idea, but I’m not sure this is going to kill the atmosphere. The 50 odd fans from Forest Green in the JPT are hardly going to create a cauldron if they’re housed in the Jimmy Seed. 

seth plum

They will have less presence in the West Upper.
More respectful of the away fans effort to use the Jimmy Seed.

iaitch

se9addick said:

bromleyjohn said:

Mad and bad idea. You will kill the atmosphere. Atmosphere requires as vocal an away following as possible even if from only 50 fans. Football amongst other things is theatre : us and them. The away end is part of the territorial scene. Dont lose this.

I don’t think it’s a great idea, but I’m not sure this is going to kill the atmosphere. The 50 odd fans from Forest Green in the JPT are hardly going to create a cauldron if they’re housed in the Jimmy Seed. 

But we keep hearing that the acoustics in the JS are better than the covered end so 50 sounds like 50,000!!!

se9addick

seth plum said:

They will have less presence in the West Upper.
More respectful of the away fans effort to use the Jimmy Seed.

In what way is it “more respectful of the away fans” to stick them in the Jimmy Seed rather than the upper west?

iaitch

se9addick said:

9goalswentpastperry said:

Powell2ThePeople said:

addick19 said:

pettgra said:

I have been supporting Charlton for over sixty years and I never knew that the JS stand was the home end.
No wonder I kept getting beaten up.

I've been going since 1965 and it's never been the 'home end.'

I agree with you both, never the home end, but I've been going since the late 70s and spent many a game in the JS stand.   When I was younger, on the East Terrace.  Then in my teens moved down to the clock.  

But many games in the JS along the way.   In fact, the last I remember is against Leeds when Gordon Strachan was tearing us apart on the wing.  So that would have been after the return.  

No recollection of the score that day, nor where the Leeds fans were, but can only assume they were in 1 half of JS, whether that be a top/bottom or an east/west split.   

Bizarre to think that a team like Leeds didn't have the whole end though.   

Which brings me on to another thought... Is it a false memory, or did away fans take up a block or 2 on the south side of the east on a few occasions? 

That Leeds game would have been the cup replay in early 1993. They had the front sections of the Jimmy Seed and we had the back. The capacity was only 8,337 so we didn't have to give them the whole stand. In fact the 1,900 they did get was bloody generous. 

It was either Brentford or Orient who had the East blocks in 2006, possibly they both did. Someone will remember definitively. 

That must have been a nightmare to segregate?!

From what I remember the away fans in the east had to go through the JS stand to get to their seats. Line of stewards then kept them apart from the home fans. Not sure how the toilet/refreshment facilities were sectioned off. 

iaitch

se9addick said:

seth plum said:

They will have less presence in the West Upper.
More respectful of the away fans effort to use the Jimmy Seed.

In what way is it “more respectful of the away fans” to stick them in the Jimmy Seed rather than the upper west?

Not sure about respectful but surely it's easier to control away fans in a self contained stand with no home fans close. Stick them in the west upper and you'll have to have more stewards to stop fans possibly getting to each other from either side.

MrOneLung

iaitch said:

Fumbluff said:

addick19 said:

pettgra said:

I have been supporting Charlton for over sixty years and I never knew that the JS stand was the home end.
No wonder I kept getting beaten up.

I've been going since 1965 and it's never been the 'home end.'

Well it’s where my season ticket was for the first season in the Prem. 

Maybe I went every week to support the other teams then 🤷‍♂️

98/99 was first season in the Premier.

Because the Upper West wasn't finished the home fans were accommodated the JS stand for one game only, I was there, (sound like Max Boyce boyo).

I had season ticket for several years in the Jimmy Seed. 

You were in there for just the opening home game and took the seats of the season ticket holders there because your seats were not ready. We were ‘compensated’ for missing that game with a free ticket for the league cup. 

Still fuming that we were usurped from our seats for that first home game. 

Blucher

I suspect the club want to vacate season ticket holders from the far section of the West Stand so that ( 1) if we go up, they can accommodate additional away supporters once the Jimmy Seed has sold out or ( 2 ) if we don’t, they can stick small followings of away supporters in there and leave the Jimmy Seed vacant. In the latter scenario, there’ll be some saving on stewarding but not much because stewards will need to be deployed in the West Stand.

The atmosphere will suffer if one stand is totally empty - it’s bad enough for midweek games with the Sky deal and this will only make it worse. It’s not as if there’s a latent and unsatisfied demand for more home capacity - we can’t get close to filling the other three stands. 

Sticking away supporters in a corner of the West Stand will also probably make a trip to The Valley less attractive for them. If that translates into smaller numbers, the perceived cost savings will be quickly eradicated. I think that our ground is one of the most pleasant to visit and we should be encouraging away attendances not trying to marginalise away supporters.

Why can’t the club be honest as the reasoning behind this, rather than coming out with bullshit about about becoming the “UK’s most cohesive, sustainable community-driven club competing at an elite level.” What does that even mean in this context, other than trying to save a few bob ? Someone needs to remind Rodwell or whoever came up with this crap idea that “elite” football clubs do not play in front of empty stands.

Was there any meaningful consultation with the Supporters’ Trust on this issue ? If not, why not?

Blucher

An extreme example of a negligible away following - Fleetwood in September 2023. I tend to think that if these diehards have travelled over 200 miles down to London from the north west coast, they should at least be afforded a good view of proceedings.

iaitch

MrOneLung said:

iaitch said:

Fumbluff said:

addick19 said:

pettgra said:

I have been supporting Charlton for over sixty years and I never knew that the JS stand was the home end.
No wonder I kept getting beaten up.

I've been going since 1965 and it's never been the 'home end.'

Well it’s where my season ticket was for the first season in the Prem. 

Maybe I went every week to support the other teams then 🤷‍♂️

98/99 was first season in the Premier.

Because the Upper West wasn't finished the home fans were accommodated the JS stand for one game only, I was there, (sound like Max Boyce boyo).

I had season ticket for several years in the Jimmy Seed. 

You were in there for just the opening home game and took the seats of the season ticket holders there because your seats were not ready. We were ‘compensated’ for missing that game with a free ticket for the league cup. 

Still fuming that we were usurped from our seats for that first home game. 

So if I lose my seat in the upper west you'll be happy, karma and all that?

fenlandaddick

Blucher said:

An extreme example of a negligible away following - Fleetwood in September 2023. I tend to think that if these diehards have travelled over 200 miles down to London from the north west coast, they should at least be afforded a good view of proceedings.

Nail on the head. The idea is tone deaf and pointless.

seth plum

se9addick said:

seth plum said:

They will have less presence in the West Upper.
More respectful of the away fans effort to use the Jimmy Seed.

In what way is it “more respectful of the away fans” to stick them in the Jimmy Seed rather than the upper west?

Because it is closer to the pitch, closer to their players, good for greeting and appreciating their team, somewhere to hang and display their colours, somewhere to play their drum if they have one, and proximity to celebrate close up if their team scores at the Jimmy Seed end.
To me that is showing away fans who come to the Valley respect.

DOUCHER

Blucher said:

I suspect the club want to vacate season ticket holders from the far section of the West Stand so that ( 1) if we go up, they can accommodate additional away supporters once the Jimmy Seed has sold out or ( 2 ) if we don’t, they can stick small followings of away supporters in there and leave the Jimmy Seed vacant. In the latter scenario, there’ll be some saving on stewarding but not much because stewards will need to be deployed in the West Stand.

The atmosphere will suffer if one stand is totally empty - it’s bad enough for midweek games with the Sky deal and this will only make it worse. It’s not as if there’s a latent and unsatisfied demand for more home capacity - we can’t get close to filling the other three stands. 

Sticking away supporters in a corner of the West Stand will also probably make a trip to The Valley less attractive for them. If that translates into smaller numbers, the perceived cost savings will be quickly eradicated. I think that our ground is one of the most pleasant to visit and we should be encouraging away attendances not trying to marginalise away supporters.

Why can’t the club be honest as the reasoning behind this, rather than coming out with bullshit about about becoming the “UK’s most cohesive, sustainable community-driven club competing at an elite level.” What does that even mean in this context, other than trying to save a few bob ? Someone needs to remind Rodwell or whoever came up with this crap idea that “elite” football clubs do not play in front of empty stands.

Was there any meaningful consultation with the Supporters’ Trust on this issue ? If not, why not?

Not turning the electrics on in another stand I guess is the sustainable bit 

sam3110

Close the JS in it's entirety and you need less stewards overall, less electricity, less staffing (no need for the away bar etc to be open)

Will it subdue the atmosphere a bit? I don't think so, usually when there's only a couple of hundred away fans you can't really hear them anyway. As for "respecting" the away fans, many away games we've been to we're tucked away in a corner or on one side of the pitch, it's not always *home end" and "away end" (Orient, Bristol Rovers stick out for instance)

As I said before it's a trial anyway, but I don't think it's anywhere near as bad as many people are making it out to be

ElfsborgAddick

seth plum said:

They will have less presence in the West Upper.
More respectful of the away fans effort to use the Jimmy Seed.

How is it being disrespectful?  Having less presence is good, besides, there would be Charlton fans behind the goal roaring OUR team on.

seth plum

ElfsborgAddick said:

seth plum said:

They will have less presence in the West Upper.
More respectful of the away fans effort to use the Jimmy Seed.

How is it being disrespectful?  Having less presence is good, besides, there would be Charlton fans behind the goal roaring OUR team on.

As I said earlier, if this leads to Charlton fans in the Jimmy Seed all well and good.
Otherwise for me an empty space there is rather depressing.

iaitch

ElfsborgAddick said:

seth plum said:

They will have less presence in the West Upper.
More respectful of the away fans effort to use the Jimmy Seed.

How is it being disrespectful?  Having less presence is good, besides, there would be Charlton fans behind the goal roaring OUR team on.

Are these fans that have moved from the north and east stands so reducing the support in those areas?

valleynick66

DOUCHER said:

Blucher said:

I suspect the club want to vacate season ticket holders from the far section of the West Stand so that ( 1) if we go up, they can accommodate additional away supporters once the Jimmy Seed has sold out or ( 2 ) if we don’t, they can stick small followings of away supporters in there and leave the Jimmy Seed vacant. In the latter scenario, there’ll be some saving on stewarding but not much because stewards will need to be deployed in the West Stand.

The atmosphere will suffer if one stand is totally empty - it’s bad enough for midweek games with the Sky deal and this will only make it worse. It’s not as if there’s a latent and unsatisfied demand for more home capacity - we can’t get close to filling the other three stands. 

Sticking away supporters in a corner of the West Stand will also probably make a trip to The Valley less attractive for them. If that translates into smaller numbers, the perceived cost savings will be quickly eradicated. I think that our ground is one of the most pleasant to visit and we should be encouraging away attendances not trying to marginalise away supporters.

Why can’t the club be honest as the reasoning behind this, rather than coming out with bullshit about about becoming the “UK’s most cohesive, sustainable community-driven club competing at an elite level.” What does that even mean in this context, other than trying to save a few bob ? Someone needs to remind Rodwell or whoever came up with this crap idea that “elite” football clubs do not play in front of empty stands.

Was there any meaningful consultation with the Supporters’ Trust on this issue ? If not, why not?

Not turning the electrics on in another stand I guess is the sustainable bit 

Do the ball boys find a ball in the dark then?

I can’t believe they can save much energy costs 

DOUCHER

valleynick66 said:

DOUCHER said:

Blucher said:

I suspect the club want to vacate season ticket holders from the far section of the West Stand so that ( 1) if we go up, they can accommodate additional away supporters once the Jimmy Seed has sold out or ( 2 ) if we don’t, they can stick small followings of away supporters in there and leave the Jimmy Seed vacant. In the latter scenario, there’ll be some saving on stewarding but not much because stewards will need to be deployed in the West Stand.

The atmosphere will suffer if one stand is totally empty - it’s bad enough for midweek games with the Sky deal and this will only make it worse. It’s not as if there’s a latent and unsatisfied demand for more home capacity - we can’t get close to filling the other three stands. 

Sticking away supporters in a corner of the West Stand will also probably make a trip to The Valley less attractive for them. If that translates into smaller numbers, the perceived cost savings will be quickly eradicated. I think that our ground is one of the most pleasant to visit and we should be encouraging away attendances not trying to marginalise away supporters.

Why can’t the club be honest as the reasoning behind this, rather than coming out with bullshit about about becoming the “UK’s most cohesive, sustainable community-driven club competing at an elite level.” What does that even mean in this context, other than trying to save a few bob ? Someone needs to remind Rodwell or whoever came up with this crap idea that “elite” football clubs do not play in front of empty stands.

Was there any meaningful consultation with the Supporters’ Trust on this issue ? If not, why not?

Not turning the electrics on in another stand I guess is the sustainable bit 

Do the ball boys find a ball in the dark then?

I can’t believe they can save much energy costs 

solar powered torch 

ElfsborgAddick

iaitch said:

ElfsborgAddick said:

seth plum said:

They will have less presence in the West Upper.
More respectful of the away fans effort to use the Jimmy Seed.

How is it being disrespectful?  Having less presence is good, besides, there would be Charlton fans behind the goal roaring OUR team on.

Are these fans that have moved from the north and east stands so reducing the support in those areas?

That is a possibility.

fenlandaddick

If this lot want to tick the Eco box just stick some solar panels on the roof.

Or stop playing shit music on a match day , that should save a few watts.

Change the floodlights to something out the 21st century, instead of the the last century. LED lights, I assume, cost less to run that the old ones currently in use.

Turn all lights off at half time and ask the fans to light the stadium with their phones.

Only serve cold food and warm beer

Turn off the big screen

Don't use growing lights on the pitch.

Only have a 3 day week in the office,  will save on heating and electric

Plenty more 'great' ideas where those came from.and on par with the current one on offer.