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Post-match Thread: Swindon v Charlton | Sat 19 Dec 2020
Comments
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Baffles me again why we all have to be firmly in one camp or the other, with pathetic insults traded when they're unable to agreeMuttleyCAFC said:
The truth clearly hurts.Desperate_Pete said:MuttleyCAFC said:
I would say those that qualify for the title, without naming names, are those that ignore what is clearly there for all to see. It isn't even debatable for me, it is there on record. The only way you can miss it is if your view is of Bowyer's butt cheeks!Desperate_Pete said:MuttleyCAFC said:I have been critical but have not called for Bowyer to be sacked. I have merely consistently stated he should not have a free pass. If we see the same tactics and outcome in one more game in the next few games, I will have tipped over the edge.
What the delusional arse lickers have to accept when they blame the quality of the squad for today is two things. Firstly the lack of quality Swindon possessed. They were basically shit. Secondly, the tactics of replacing midfielders for defenders brings pressure on you no matter how shit your opponents are. They will try to score and push forward if they are a goal behind and you need to use this against poor, poor teams like Swindon.
Bowyer in his pre-match interview seemed to focus praise on the first half performance against Wimbledon which tells me that he doesn't understand what shit is. We were excellent in the second half but his focus was when we struggled. You have to question what he is on. Seriously!For curiosity sake who are the "delusional arse lickers" that you have in mind if you don't mind saying?
While I see a lot of arse licking on this forum if I commented on it I would say who they are. Try to be tolerant - not easy sometimes....I have no knowledge of Bowyer's butt cheeks but your somewhat strident and over confident answer shows that you have the view of an arse hole.Peace and love everybody!
People need to grow the hell up!! - Dont like someone's views, pissing well ignore them if you cant be civilised
- Leave | Remain
- Hard Left | Hard Right
- For Bowyer | Against Bowyer
Too many idiots view too much as Black and White these days10 -
But my reference is retaliation for being attacked for even suggesting what I see as Bowyer's weakness. People who want to give it have to take it back.2
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Thats fine, but how about we all leave the childish insults alone... Everyone has grey views, not everything is Black and White!!MuttleyCAFC said:But my reference is retaliation for being attacked for even suggesting what I see as Bowyer's weakness. People who want to give it have to take it back.3 -
This is what we were missing yesterday:
"Carlislegoalkeeper Paul Farman pulled off a super stop to tip on-loan Charlton midfielder George Lapslie's effort over the bar".
Super, Super George, Super George Lapslie!
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Fuck off Sorry just read FAs post.8
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We were missing players not scoring?Oggy Red said:This is what we were missing yesterday:
"Carlislegoalkeeper Paul Farman pulled off a super stop to tip on-loan Charlton midfielder George Lapslie's effort over the bar".
Super, Super George, Super George Lapslie!
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We have an uncanny knack of making poor teams look good. We lost to MK Dons who played us off the park, they were clearly a massively underrated side who were ready to start their own promotion push and fly up the table. Since beating us and looking like the best team in league one, their promotion push is....
Lost to Accrington
Drew with Burton
Drew with Peterborough
Lost to Plymouth
2 points from 12......
I said a couple weeks back. We have in my opinion best squad (exception of a main striker) in this poor league. However, we do not have the best team.I questioned then, whether that was because we do not have the best Manager.LB needs to step and create that best team, and become best manager, or we are going to be playing MK Dons again next season.7 -
Maybe by allowing people to make what they feel are valid criticisms of the manager in the first place.ForeverAddickted said:
Thats fine, but how about we all leave the childish insults alone... Everyone has grey views, not everything is Black and White!!MuttleyCAFC said:But my reference is retaliation for being attacked for even suggesting what I see as Bowyer's weakness. People who want to give it have to take it back.1 -
But then its only fair to allow people to defend him if they feel you're wrong?MuttleyCAFC said:
Maybe by allowing people to make what they feel are valid criticisms of the manager in the first place.ForeverAddickted said:
Thats fine, but how about we all leave the childish insults alone... Everyone has grey views, not everything is Black and White!!MuttleyCAFC said:But my reference is retaliation for being attacked for even suggesting what I see as Bowyer's weakness. People who want to give it have to take it back.
Its not arse kissing is it... Its just someone with a different point of view2 -
Not read any of the thread, but basically our best form of defence is attack.We cant defend for the last 20 mins a la curbs. Lets just attack til the end2
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Happy for them to defend him. We won't have the same views. But make no mistake who the first ones to make it personal were.
In managerial terms, Bowyer has been loyal, but he is nowhere near as loyal as the fans. He gets paid good money and a nice car to do a job and should not be above criticism when people think he deserves criticism.5 -
SELR_addicks said:Bogle missing that chance from Maddison was embarrassing. Imagine he's actually being paid to be a striker for a Football League team.
For balance, he scored a goal a few minutes before that. We have had strikers who couldn't get into goal scoring positions.
Bogle has scored two more goals than Josh Parker who played well in the final but was impotent in front of goal.
Is Bogle good enough for a team with aspirations to finish in the top 6 ?
To hustle defenders as a sub for 15 minutes maybe but NO on what I've seen.
Aneke, Washington, Ronnie Schwartz and Boggle as the 4th striker could be ok for League 1 as long as the midfield chip in with goals.
We may only get RS and a young midfielder on loan to replace Levitt.
A challenge for Lee to improve all our players !2 -
i don't think most that are defending LB are arse kissing - that's just silly - but definitely a bit rose tinted as we all liked LB and don't want to accept that just maybe, he isn't quite what we thought he was, given the seemingly idiotic tactics3
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To be honest neither do I. But they have to accept that those of us who are deeply unhappy with him have a right to be so and may even have a point.1
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Camera seems to be slightly higher on these highlights. How the hell did their equaliser go in!Oggy Red said:Watching that 1st Swindon goal again ...... it's going to give Bowyer nightmares.
Christmas came early for Swindon, gift wrapped.
Even though Swindon were keeping possession outside our box, they were going nowhere, until a cute short pass inside took Maartsen out.
He was slow to recover his positioning. Pearce in the box was in position manmarking but his man Swindon (7) peeled off into the space Maartsen should have been covering.
If Pearce had gone with his player, a pathway to goal would have opened up in front of the Swindon (4) in possession - Pearce had to hold his own position and did.
Meanwhile Swindon (7) receives the ball, turns - and a chasing back Maartsen sells himself and goes to ground.
The Swindon (7) takes a moment to steady himself, switches feet and shoots. At this point I'm thinking Amos could have advanced quickly off his line to make himself large or even Pratley might have came across to try and block with his body - but if Maartsen hadn't dived in, they wouldn't have had to.
My comments are meant to be constructive, so not meaning to play the blame game on such a young but talented player - but IMO Maartsen was at fault on 2 occasions leading up to the goal. He'll learn with coaching and experience - but it makes me wince how easily the Charlton defence was opened up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLguoabdYO4&feature=emb_logo&ab_channel=SwindonTown0 -
I agree they don't look like it now, but I bet most League 1 sides would love JFC or Gilbey. My point was that it's not like last season where the opposition were simply better than us. We have enough talent in my opinion to control possession, especially when Shinnie is back. That's the main reason I'm disappointed Bowyer doesn't seem to want to play like that often enough. Admittedly it needs some movement in front too.Braziliance said:
I can't agree with this. The only one of those 3 near the level of the old league 1 team is Maddison but even then it's only because of his vision and passing, as an all rounder he isn't near Aribo, Bielik is Cullen's level. Not a fan of bashing our players but I think JFC is completely overrated, similar to how Kashi and Clarke were and Gilbey looks like a lower level league 1 player which is exactly where we signed him from.cafcfan1990 said:
We've got players of real quality now. Maybe not quite as good as those, but players like Maddison, Gilbey and JFC have the ability to control the game against the likes of Swindon (genuinely no disrespect intended).Braziliance said:
Very much starting to believe Bowyer is a backs against the wall manager and that's as far as it goes. It was probably the quality of Cullen, Aribo, Gallagher, Bielik etc that made it look like we could play ball that's my concern. They're all doing well away from us, not sure on Cullencafcfan1990 said:
I agree with the last statement, I don't think he's going to last the season. I actually think he'd have done well if he got the West Brom job this week, firing them up and getting them playing. But I'm not convinced he has the ability to get a team dominating the game when they are good enough to.Braziliance said:Probably one of the few times other than when we win people are echoing the same comments. Negativity & naivety from Bowyer unfortunately. I am starting to question him when I haven't before. I don't want him gone cause I don't want us to be that club/fanbase, but every player he has sold or lost has played fine without Bowyer, in a lot of cases even better. I feel like we had a lot of ready made players but we just didn't realise it at the time. Once again the main concern is that on a human level he is starting to annoy me, severely an all.
I am fond of Lee cause we have had some results under him and he was one of the few bright lights in the Roland era, but every post match interview his comments are annoying me. I can accept something along the lines of ''I set us up wrong, I am still learning. Before Thomas I was always hand tied and have adopted a siege like mentality because of it, my subs need to be more positive because we are conceding late on a lot, the stats don't lie''. Instead we get x player did this wrong, it's X players fault, bad refs etc. Takes no accountibility for what is his fault.
I'll try and take the positives, if we win our game in hand we are back in the top6 but I'll be honest I feel negative, watched us play scared against MK Dons, Shrewsbury, Burton and now Swindon. 3 of which are in the relegation zone, the other bottom half. I see this ending in tears I can't lie
I don't think we have any players of real quality, I don't look at any of our players and think, 'he gets in most championship sides' whereas I've thought that about a few players from previous seasons2 -
Didnt do much at Hull though did he? People were noting that on here at the time. He is clearly a very talented footballer. There’s a reason why we were able to pick him up without a fee and for a wage capped salary. I’m not sure that I understand what the relevance of the circs of Aribo’s departure is to my point, which is that he is better than anybody in our current midfield.alangee said:Prague, I think Maddison refused to sign a new deal with Peterborough, much the same as Aribo with us last year. I would not have classed Aribo as surplus to requirements. He was only on loan at Hull, and refused to play beyond his contract date1 -
Hopefully LB will see the result of his substitutions as most of us have on here, and learn from them. A pity if he doesn't as he does so much right.0
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I 100% agree that Bowyer needs to start taking responsibility but if Thomas starts telling Lee to start playing more positive football or else, then I believe it would be the beginning of the end of their relationshipmendonca said:
If Bows took some accountability and mentioned he may have gone too defensive, then he's acknowledging such and connecting with the fans pain. He never admits his wrongs, so we are hoping TS smoothly illustrates his blueprint for the club.siblers said:Do people really want the club to go down the route of the owner telling the manager how to play?
And yes I am getting a bit sick of Lee's negative tactics but for Thomas to be telling Lee to be more positive is a road we don't want to go down2 - Sponsored links:
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siblers said:
I 100% agree that Bowyer needs to start taking responsibility but if Thomas starts telling Lee to start playing more positive football or else, then I believe it would be the beginning of the end of their relationshipmendonca said:
If Bows took some accountability and mentioned he may have gone too defensive, then he's acknowledging such and connecting with the fans pain. He never admits his wrongs, so we are hoping TS smoothly illustrates his blueprint for the club.siblers said:Do people really want the club to go down the route of the owner telling the manager how to play?
And yes I am getting a bit sick of Lee's negative tactics but for Thomas to be telling Lee to be more positive is a road we don't want to go down
The owner and manager should have a typical business working relationship and that should involve the manager explaining his decisions to the owner and any differences in opinion should be addressed.
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It's not as bad as some are making out now, it wasn't as good last week as some made out then.
We have still scored more goals and got more points than 2 years ago and I doubt we will loose our top scorer to the premier league this January.
Cullen, Beilk and Aribo weren't Harvey, Kendall and Ball at this stage of the season. Remember we are about 5 weeks behind in terms of games played.
Every successful Charlton team I have seen, be that under Bowyer, Powell, Curbs or even the spell under Luzon, we played the same system and mainly the same players week in, week out. For the last 13 months we have chopped and changed personal and formation from game to game and even in games far far too often. Yes we have had more than our fair share of injuries but even so.
What really concerns me is on Saturday you had a back 7 including Matthews, Purrington, Gunter, Pratley, Pearce, Watson and Gilbey. These aren't kids. They have played 1000s of games. They aren't offensive players like Maddison, Williams or Morgan who you could maybe excuse an defensive laps. I have said it before but you have to question Pearce's ability to organise a rear guard action.
Regardless of your opinion of Bogle you really do have to ask the question wtf is going on there. If Bowyer thinks he just isn't good enough, or he isn't doing what Bowyer wants, fine don't play him until he is. Unless we are actually patching him up to get 30-60 minutes out of him. Of course there are other options to the status quo.
Look at Bogle's goals on YouTube, yes it's at a lower level, but look at the way he controls the ball, runs with the ball, attacks the ball and strikes the ball. At the moment he looks like he has never played football before, let alone convinced a Premier league manager to pay £1 million for him. That's a mental problem, not a physical or talent one.
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With no game midweek, we will have another long break. Ideally a few injured players will be closer to a return. It would be good to get Smyth, Morgan and Shinnie.
My concern is how bad we have looked in games following a week of training.
Has Bogle done anything that Davison could not have while learning his trade in the first team?2 -
Disappointed but we always cock up against those at the bottom of the table.
There are a lot of games left to play and we are closer to the January window with a fully committed owner and not a super-duper deal phone in sight.0 -
Yep, the old "we've had a full week to gel and get a few back up to speed" Lee Bowyer special.mendonca said:With no game midweek, we will have another long break. Ideally a few injured players will be closer to a return. It would be good to get Smyth, Morgan and Shinnie.
My concern is how bad we have looked in games following a week of training.
Has Bogle done anything that Davison could not have while learning his trade in the first team?
Excuse me for a sceptic of course, but we always look lethargic and off the pace from the get go, and there is always the kicker of more injury woes from training. Couple that with our tendency to play down to another teams level and I cannot help thinking that something is amiss with the current set up. Prove me wrong Bowyer, please, as I have a lot of good will towards you son.4 -
Yes I was watching a video of Bogle banging in the goals for Grimsby this morning and he doesn’t look the same player. Scoring with both feet and headed goals too. Running with the ball into the box, scoring from inside the box and outside. This is how he is described on Wikipedia: “He is known for his diversity in physical style of play, strength and holding the ball to bringing others into play.” That sounds more like Chuks than Bogle.Cafc43v3r said:It's not as bad as some are making out now, it wasn't as good last week as some made out then.
We have still scored more goals and got more points than 2 years ago and I doubt we will loose our top scorer to the premier league this January.
Cullen, Beilk and Aribo weren't Harvey, Kendall and Ball at this stage of the season. Remember we are about 5 weeks behind in terms of games played.
Every successful Charlton team I have seen, be that under Bowyer, Powell, Curbs or even the spell under Luzon, we played the same system and mainly the same players week in, week out. For the last 13 months we have chopped and changed personal and formation from game to game and even in games far far too often. Yes we have had more than our fair share of injuries but even so.
What really concerns me is on Saturday you had a back 7 including Matthews, Purrington, Gunter, Pratley, Pearce, Watson and Gilbey. These aren't kids. They have played 1000s of games. They aren't offensive players like Maddison, Williams or Morgan who you could maybe excuse an defensive laps. I have said it before but you have to question Pearce's ability to organise a rear guard action.
Regardless of your opinion of Bogle you really do have to ask the question wtf is going on there. If Bowyer thinks he just isn't good enough, or he isn't doing what Bowyer wants, fine don't play him until he is. Unless we are actually patching him up to get 30-60 minutes out of him. Of course there are other options to the status quo.
Look at Bogle's goals on YouTube, yes it's at a lower level, but look at the way he controls the ball, runs with the ball, attacks the ball and strikes the ball. At the moment he looks like he has never played football before, let alone convinced a Premier league manager to pay £1 million for him. That's a mental problem, not a physical or talent one.
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Bogle started off okay, but now looks very cumbersome and one directional. We've had this before with the Tresor's / Leon Clarke etc and am starting to see it again.0
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Charltonisation.EveshamAddick said:
Yes I was watching a video of Bogle banging in the goals for Grimsby this morning and he doesn’t look the same player. Scoring with both feet and headed goals too. Running with the ball into the box, scoring from inside the box and outside. This is how he is described on Wikipedia: “He is known for his diversity in physical style of play, strength and holding the ball to bringing others into play.” That sounds more like Chuks than Bogle.Cafc43v3r said:It's not as bad as some are making out now, it wasn't as good last week as some made out then.
We have still scored more goals and got more points than 2 years ago and I doubt we will loose our top scorer to the premier league this January.
Cullen, Beilk and Aribo weren't Harvey, Kendall and Ball at this stage of the season. Remember we are about 5 weeks behind in terms of games played.
Every successful Charlton team I have seen, be that under Bowyer, Powell, Curbs or even the spell under Luzon, we played the same system and mainly the same players week in, week out. For the last 13 months we have chopped and changed personal and formation from game to game and even in games far far too often. Yes we have had more than our fair share of injuries but even so.
What really concerns me is on Saturday you had a back 7 including Matthews, Purrington, Gunter, Pratley, Pearce, Watson and Gilbey. These aren't kids. They have played 1000s of games. They aren't offensive players like Maddison, Williams or Morgan who you could maybe excuse an defensive laps. I have said it before but you have to question Pearce's ability to organise a rear guard action.
Regardless of your opinion of Bogle you really do have to ask the question wtf is going on there. If Bowyer thinks he just isn't good enough, or he isn't doing what Bowyer wants, fine don't play him until he is. Unless we are actually patching him up to get 30-60 minutes out of him. Of course there are other options to the status quo.
Look at Bogle's goals on YouTube, yes it's at a lower level, but look at the way he controls the ball, runs with the ball, attacks the ball and strikes the ball. At the moment he looks like he has never played football before, let alone convinced a Premier league manager to pay £1 million for him. That's a mental problem, not a physical or talent one.2 -
Bonne missed worse chances last year, and he's supposed to be a "proven championship" striker.
At least nobody could accuse Bogle of not trying his hardest. If anything he's trying too hard.
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4 years ago thoughEveshamAddick said:
Yes I was watching a video of Bogle banging in the goals for Grimsby this morning and he doesn’t look the same player. Scoring with both feet and headed goals too. Running with the ball into the box, scoring from inside the box and outside. This is how he is described on Wikipedia: “He is known for his diversity in physical style of play, strength and holding the ball to bringing others into play.” That sounds more like Chuks than Bogle.Cafc43v3r said:It's not as bad as some are making out now, it wasn't as good last week as some made out then.
We have still scored more goals and got more points than 2 years ago and I doubt we will loose our top scorer to the premier league this January.
Cullen, Beilk and Aribo weren't Harvey, Kendall and Ball at this stage of the season. Remember we are about 5 weeks behind in terms of games played.
Every successful Charlton team I have seen, be that under Bowyer, Powell, Curbs or even the spell under Luzon, we played the same system and mainly the same players week in, week out. For the last 13 months we have chopped and changed personal and formation from game to game and even in games far far too often. Yes we have had more than our fair share of injuries but even so.
What really concerns me is on Saturday you had a back 7 including Matthews, Purrington, Gunter, Pratley, Pearce, Watson and Gilbey. These aren't kids. They have played 1000s of games. They aren't offensive players like Maddison, Williams or Morgan who you could maybe excuse an defensive laps. I have said it before but you have to question Pearce's ability to organise a rear guard action.
Regardless of your opinion of Bogle you really do have to ask the question wtf is going on there. If Bowyer thinks he just isn't good enough, or he isn't doing what Bowyer wants, fine don't play him until he is. Unless we are actually patching him up to get 30-60 minutes out of him. Of course there are other options to the status quo.
Look at Bogle's goals on YouTube, yes it's at a lower level, but look at the way he controls the ball, runs with the ball, attacks the ball and strikes the ball. At the moment he looks like he has never played football before, let alone convinced a Premier league manager to pay £1 million for him. That's a mental problem, not a physical or talent one.
Nicky Ajose will also look great if you just see the highlights of that golden season at Swindon1
big boss isn't happy.
