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How Likely Are You To Take The Covid Vaccine?

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  • Stig
    Stig Posts: 29,026
    edited October 2023
    Garrymanilow said:
    WellingWill said:
    It is quite amazing how so many people blindly believe everything the government tells them.The same people who foolishly believe the Ukranians are the good guys and Russia the baddies.They are blissfully unaware that Ukraine fought on the side of the Nazis in WW2.They also believe that 99.9% of scientists believe in the efficacy of the covid jabs.Actually it's about 50/50. The ones funded by big Pharma and the Gov't as opposed to the ones not funded and therefore able to give an honest opinion. 
    Excellent. Got to be satire at this point. You must absolutely fucking hate people from Germany, Finland, Italy, Japan, Romania, Bulgaria, Thailand and Slovakia as well if that's your basis for judging others. Of course, saying 'Ukraine fought on the side of the Nazis' is inaccurate and reductive beyond belief, but it's no surprise that your grasp on history is about as good as your understanding of science. Distrusting a group of people based on a stereotypical (and incorrect) perception of them as a whole based on historical decisions made by individuals to tar them all with the same brush and mark them as bad? There's a word for something like that..
    Genuinely amazed this thread hasn't been closed yet
    I keep thinking about it. Mainly because it was me that started this thread and I didn't think that three years on I'd be getting notifications every time someone posted some junk conspiracy. Then I have a little crisis of conscience and I think threads shouldn't be closed just because I disagree with what's being said. I can see the day coming though, because it has largely descended into the majority completely dispelling the nonsense of a minority who seemingly never bother to read what's posted because they never respond other than to post more unsubstantiated guff.
  • Rizzo
    Rizzo Posts: 6,435
    Stig said:
    Garrymanilow said:
    WellingWill said:
    It is quite amazing how so many people blindly believe everything the government tells them.The same people who foolishly believe the Ukranians are the good guys and Russia the baddies.They are blissfully unaware that Ukraine fought on the side of the Nazis in WW2.They also believe that 99.9% of scientists believe in the efficacy of the covid jabs.Actually it's about 50/50. The ones funded by big Pharma and the Gov't as opposed to the ones not funded and therefore able to give an honest opinion. 
    Excellent. Got to be satire at this point. You must absolutely fucking hate people from Germany, Finland, Italy, Japan, Romania, Bulgaria, Thailand and Slovakia as well if that's your basis for judging others. Of course, saying 'Ukraine fought on the side of the Nazis' is inaccurate and reductive beyond belief, but it's no surprise that your grasp on history is about as good as your understanding of science. Distrusting a group of people based on a stereotypical (and incorrect) perception of them as a whole based on historical decisions made by individuals to tar them all with the same brush and mark them as bad? There's a word for something like that..
    Genuinely amazed this thread hasn't been closed yet
    I keep thinking about it. Mainly because it was me that started this thread and I didn't think that three years on I'd be getting notifications every time someone posted some junk conspiracy. Then I have a little crisis of conscience and I think threads shouldn't be closed just because I disagree with what's being said. I can see the day coming though, because it has largely descended into the majority completely dispelling the nonsense of a minority who seemingly never bother to read what's posted because they never respond other than to post more unsubstantiated guff.
    On the plus side, some of these conspiracy theories are really incredibly amusing to read. 
  • ShootersHillGuru
    ShootersHillGuru Posts: 50,619
    WellingWill said:
    It is quite amazing how so many people blindly believe everything the government tells them.The same people who foolishly believe the Ukranians are the good guys and Russia the baddies.They are blissfully unaware that Ukraine fought on the side of the Nazis in WW2.They also believe that 99.9% of scientists believe in the efficacy of the covid jabs.Actually it's about 50/50. The ones funded by big Pharma and the Gov't as opposed to the ones not funded and therefore able to give an honest opinion. 
    Yep. Ukrainians fought with the Nazis and so did the Italians. I’d argue that the Germans and Italians are now two of our closest friends and allies and post the end of the Cold War so are Ukraine. What’s your point ? Do you still distrust the French because of Napoleon. What about the Spanish Armada, snakey bastards. As for scientific scepticism of vaccines being 50/50 - prove that to me. Do you class medical doctors as scientists ? I do and I’m estimating that 99.9% support the vaccine programme. 
  • Garrymanilow
    Garrymanilow Posts: 13,171
    Rizzo said:
    Stig said:
    Garrymanilow said:
    WellingWill said:
    It is quite amazing how so many people blindly believe everything the government tells them.The same people who foolishly believe the Ukranians are the good guys and Russia the baddies.They are blissfully unaware that Ukraine fought on the side of the Nazis in WW2.They also believe that 99.9% of scientists believe in the efficacy of the covid jabs.Actually it's about 50/50. The ones funded by big Pharma and the Gov't as opposed to the ones not funded and therefore able to give an honest opinion. 
    Excellent. Got to be satire at this point. You must absolutely fucking hate people from Germany, Finland, Italy, Japan, Romania, Bulgaria, Thailand and Slovakia as well if that's your basis for judging others. Of course, saying 'Ukraine fought on the side of the Nazis' is inaccurate and reductive beyond belief, but it's no surprise that your grasp on history is about as good as your understanding of science. Distrusting a group of people based on a stereotypical (and incorrect) perception of them as a whole based on historical decisions made by individuals to tar them all with the same brush and mark them as bad? There's a word for something like that..
    Genuinely amazed this thread hasn't been closed yet
    I keep thinking about it. Mainly because it was me that started this thread and I didn't think that three years on I'd be getting notifications every time someone posted some junk conspiracy. Then I have a little crisis of conscience and I think threads shouldn't be closed just because I disagree with what's being said. I can see the day coming though, because it has largely descended into the majority completely dispelling the nonsense of a minority who seemingly never bother to read what's posted because they never respond other than to post more unsubstantiated guff.
    On the plus side, some of these conspiracy theories are really incredibly amusing to read. 
    They are but also they sort of aren't. They start off funny like Peanuts posting about mad bollocks and then before long they descend into the last poster claiming that people from Ukraine are evil because some of their grandparents were fascists. It always escalates and you realise that these people often aren't just dafties who read something silly online, many of them actually have deeply unpleasant views and they're filled with hate. It's really depressing.
  • ME14addick
    ME14addick Posts: 9,762
    Rather than shut down an important thread, wouldn't it be better to stop the posters who post fake news, or at least give them a warning.
  • killerandflash
    killerandflash Posts: 69,849
    Leaving aside the nonsense, just tested positive again...

    Just been on holiday on a group tour of Saudi Arabia, so either caught it from one of the other people, or on Sunday on the flight home from Jeddah. No vaccine since last autumn as I am bit longer eligible, but definitely would have had it if offered.
  • Solidgone
    Solidgone Posts: 10,208
    I had Covid and flu jabs last Friday 27/10 and other than a sore arm I have been perfectly well.

    My final rabies jab tomorrow. 
  • shine166
    shine166 Posts: 13,918
    ME14addick said:
    Rather than shut down an important thread, wouldn't it be better to stop the posters who post fake news, or at least give them a warning.
    Is that not a echo chamber ? 
  • Garrymanilow
    Garrymanilow Posts: 13,171
    shine166 said:
    ME14addick said:
    Rather than shut down an important thread, wouldn't it be better to stop the posters who post fake news, or at least give them a warning.
    Is that not a echo chamber ? 
    No, people can still disagree on the need to take the vaccine, it should just be based on actual facts not completely made up lies. It's like going on the post match thread; posters can disagree for a week abut whether or not Lloyd Jones is good enough for a promotion team but it falls apart fairly quickly if there's a bunch of idiots screaming that he's actually a government plant put in place by ministers sympathetic to Crystal Palace and we're all idiots for believing the players we signed this season are anything other than loads of ants glued together by big FIFA.
  • JamesSeed
    JamesSeed Posts: 17,380
    ME14addick said:
    Rather than shut down an important thread, wouldn't it be better to stop the posters who post fake news, or at least give them a warning.
    I'd delete all of the crank anti vax posts from the likes of Peanuts, Welling & Queensland etc. I wouldn't want the misinformation spreading on my watch, because just one person choosing not to take the vaccine because of some guff they've read on here is one too many.
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  • JamesSeed
    JamesSeed Posts: 17,380
    Garrymanilow said:
    shine166 said:
    ME14addick said:
    Rather than shut down an important thread, wouldn't it be better to stop the posters who post fake news, or at least give them a warning.
    Is that not a echo chamber ? 
    No, people can still disagree on the need to take the vaccine, it should just be based on actual facts not completely made up lies. It's like going on the post match thread; posters can disagree for a week abut whether or not Lloyd Jones is good enough for a promotion team but it falls apart fairly quickly if there's a bunch of idiots screaming that he's actually a government plant put in place by ministers sympathetic to Crystal Palace and we're all idiots for believing the players we signed this season are anything other than loads of ants glued together by big FIFA.
    Crazy, but less dangerous than anti-vax conspiracy posts.
  • Greenhithe
    Greenhithe Posts: 780
    I’ve got COVID for the 4th time. Bloody love it I do. Just part of life now surely. I’ve had worse flu. 
  • PeanutsMolloy
    PeanutsMolloy Posts: 6,711
    edited October 2023

    Garrymanilow said:
    shine166 said:
    ME14addick said:
    Rather than shut down an important thread, wouldn't it be better to stop the posters who post fake news, or at least give them a warning.
    Is that not a echo chamber ? 
    No, people can still disagree on the need to take the vaccine, it should just be based on actual facts not completely made up lies. It's like going on the post match thread; posters can disagree for a week abut whether or not Lloyd Jones is good enough for a promotion team but it falls apart fairly quickly if there's a bunch of idiots screaming that he's actually a government plant put in place by ministers sympathetic to Crystal Palace and we're all idiots for believing the players we signed this season are anything other than loads of ants glued together by big FIFA.

    Thank you for determining what is and is not acceptable to debate about the mRNA vaccines.
    So, it is acceptable to disagree about the need to take the vaccine but not to query its safety or efficacy or to quote findings from independent scientists (originally pro-vaccine) that the manufacturing process for the mRNA vaccine rolled out to the masses was materially different to the process used for the trialled version.
    Or to quote the opinion of a leading British oncologist, who happens to have long experience of vaccine development, and who has material concerns about the that he has observed in his patients formerly in remission, who have suffered the return of aggressive and untreatable cancers after receiving repeated boosters.
    Anyone raising these matters here is a "nutter" or "conspiracy theorist" and must be muted "because just one person choosing not to take the vaccine because of some guff they've read on here is one too many".
    Because you (and others) know the absolute, unimpeachable truth. 
    Well, apologies for doubting your infinite wisdom and that pharmaceutical companies are to be implicitly trusted to put patients' health before their own profit, but here is my latest offering, from the International Journal of Vaccine Theory, Practice, and Research
    And rather than dismissing it as "guff", try reading it without your head stuck up your arse.

    https://ijvtpr.com/index.php/IJVTPR/article/view/86

    In summary

    The analysis reported here is unique in that it is the first study of the original data from the Pfizer/BioNTech BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine clinical trial (CA4591001) to be carried out by a group unaffiliated with the trial sponsor. Our study is a forensic analysis of the 38 trial subjects who died between July 27, 2020, the start of Phase 2/3 of the clinical trial, and March 13, 2021, the data end date of their 6-Month Interim Report. Phase 2/3 of the trial involved 44,060 subjects who were equally distributed into two groups and received Dose 1 of either the BNT162b2 mRNA vaccinated or the Placebo control (0.9% normal saline). At Week 20, when the BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine received Emergency Use Authorization from the U.S. FDA, subjects in the placebo arm were given the option to be BNT162b2 vaccinated. All but a few accepted. Surprisingly, a comparison of the number of subject deaths per week during the 33 Weeks of this study found no significant difference between the number of deaths in the vaccinated versus placebo arms for the first 20 weeks of the trial, the placebo-controlled portion of the trial.  After Week 20, as subjects in the Placebo were unblinded and vaccinated, deaths among this still unvaccinated cohort of this group slowed and eventually plateaued. Deaths in the BNT162b2 vaccinated subjects continued at the same rate. Our analysis revealed inconsistencies between the subject data listed in the 6-Month Interim Report and publications authored by Pfizer/BioNTech trial site administrators. Most importantly, we found evidence of an over 3.7-fold increase in number of deaths due to cardiovascular events in BNT162b2 vaccinated subjects compared to Placebo controls. This significant adverse event signal was not reported by Pfizer/BioNTech. Potential sources of these data inconsistencies are identified.

  • Isawsummersplay
    Isawsummersplay Posts: 1,428
    Recently turned 70. I had my pneumonia jab in September, and then the Covid and flu jabs at the same time at the beginning of October. No side effects. Have been taking Statins for over 20 years as my cholesterol reading without is double the safe levels. Again, never had a single side effect. 
    Don’t have any problems with those who are against vaccinations per se. Good luck to them. The only time I have lost my temper in the last few years is when an anti - vac group were demonstrating in Maidstone and one of them asked me if I had had the covid jab. I said yes, and this chap who was half my age tried to lecture me. 
    Put it this way, I think he regretted it quite quickly. 
  • Gillis
    Gillis Posts: 998
    PeanutsMolloy said:

    Garrymanilow said:
    shine166 said:
    ME14addick said:
    Rather than shut down an important thread, wouldn't it be better to stop the posters who post fake news, or at least give them a warning.
    Is that not a echo chamber ? 
    No, people can still disagree on the need to take the vaccine, it should just be based on actual facts not completely made up lies. It's like going on the post match thread; posters can disagree for a week abut whether or not Lloyd Jones is good enough for a promotion team but it falls apart fairly quickly if there's a bunch of idiots screaming that he's actually a government plant put in place by ministers sympathetic to Crystal Palace and we're all idiots for believing the players we signed this season are anything other than loads of ants glued together by big FIFA.

    Thank you for determining what is and is not acceptable to debate about the mRNA vaccines.
    So, it is acceptable to disagree about the need to take the vaccine but not to query its safety or efficacy or to quote findings from independent scientists (originally pro-vaccine) that the manufacturing process for the mRNA vaccine rolled out to the masses was materially different to the process used for the trialled version.
    Or to quote the opinion of a leading British oncologist, who happens to have long experience of vaccine development, and who has material concerns about the that he has observed in his patients formerly in remission, who have suffered the return of aggressive and untreatable cancers after receiving repeated boosters.
    Anyone raising these matters here is a "nutter" or "conspiracy theorist" and must be muted "because just one person choosing not to take the vaccine because of some guff they've read on here is one too many".
    Because you (and others) know the absolute, unimpeachable truth. 
    Well, apologies for doubting your infinite wisdom and that pharmaceutical companies are to be implicitly trusted to put patients' health before their own profit, but here is my latest offering, from the International Journal of Vaccine Theory, Practice, and Research
    And rather than dismissing it as "guff", try reading it without your head stuck up your arse.

    https://ijvtpr.com/index.php/IJVTPR/article/view/86

    In summary

    The analysis reported here is unique in that it is the first study of the original data from the Pfizer/BioNTech BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine clinical trial (CA4591001) to be carried out by a group unaffiliated with the trial sponsor. Our study is a forensic analysis of the 38 trial subjects who died between July 27, 2020, the start of Phase 2/3 of the clinical trial, and March 13, 2021, the data end date of their 6-Month Interim Report. Phase 2/3 of the trial involved 44,060 subjects who were equally distributed into two groups and received Dose 1 of either the BNT162b2 mRNA vaccinated or the Placebo control (0.9% normal saline). At Week 20, when the BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine received Emergency Use Authorization from the U.S. FDA, subjects in the placebo arm were given the option to be BNT162b2 vaccinated. All but a few accepted. Surprisingly, a comparison of the number of subject deaths per week during the 33 Weeks of this study found no significant difference between the number of deaths in the vaccinated versus placebo arms for the first 20 weeks of the trial, the placebo-controlled portion of the trial.  After Week 20, as subjects in the Placebo were unblinded and vaccinated, deaths among this still unvaccinated cohort of this group slowed and eventually plateaued. Deaths in the BNT162b2 vaccinated subjects continued at the same rate. Our analysis revealed inconsistencies between the subject data listed in the 6-Month Interim Report and publications authored by Pfizer/BioNTech trial site administrators. Most importantly, we found evidence of an over 3.7-fold increase in number of deaths due to cardiovascular events in BNT162b2 vaccinated subjects compared to Placebo controls. This significant adverse event signal was not reported by Pfizer/BioNTech. Potential sources of these data inconsistencies are identified.


    The International Journal of Vaccine Theory, Practice, and Research isn't a credible scientific journal. It is, unsurprisingly, an anti-vaccine mouthpiece. Two members of its editorial board are also members of Children's Health Defense, which is an American anti-vaccine activist group.
    I haven't read the article you've cited, partly because of the difficulty I've been having extracting my head from my arse, but mainly because if it were credible it would have been submitted to a reputable scientific journal. This is just more anti-vaccine disinformation.
  • kigelia
    kigelia Posts: 2,582
    edited October 2023
    I had a quick read, but it will take me a while to read it more thoroughly. I did note that the journal started in mid 2020 and much is a bit of a red flag, as is the inclusion of the daily clout in the author list - a site that mediabiasfactcheck describes as right wing based conspiracy and pseudoscience focused. No whilst I haven’t read the paper in enough detail I suspect the likelihood of bias is quite high. 

    I will read it it more detail this evening though. 
  • ShootersHillGuru
    ShootersHillGuru Posts: 50,619
    I’m sure this won’t have the slightest impact on peanuts but…….

    https://www.metabunk.org/threads/need-help-further-debunking-ijvtpr-international-journal-of-vaccine-theory-practice-and-research-paper-titled-worse-than-the-disease.12201/
  • Friend Or Defoe
    Friend Or Defoe Posts: 18,090
    Is the drug used during phase 2/3 of the clinical trials the same that gets distributed?
  • JamesSeed
    JamesSeed Posts: 17,380
    @kigelia 👏👏
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  • Super_Eddie_Youds
    Super_Eddie_Youds Posts: 1,977
    JamesSeed said:
    @kigelia 👏👏
    Seconded. 

    The issue is that there’ll be no engagement with the important, considered and objective views that have been shared by @kigelia
  • Rizzo
    Rizzo Posts: 6,435
    Super_Eddie_Youds said:
    JamesSeed said:
    @kigelia 👏👏
    Seconded. 

    The issue is that there’ll be no engagement with the important, considered and objective views that have been shared by @kigelia
    It's a pattern we saw many times in the HoC threads, on various subjects. Conspiracy nutters post some crap they found online (#doingtheirresearch ), thinking it's a jolly impressive 'mic drop' moment but within minutes it's thoroughly debunked. Rather than think about why this keeps happening, they just move onto the next online crank, rinse and repeat. 
  • Friend Or Defoe
    Friend Or Defoe Posts: 18,090
    Rizzo said:
    Super_Eddie_Youds said:
    JamesSeed said:
    @kigelia 👏👏
    Seconded. 

    The issue is that there’ll be no engagement with the important, considered and objective views that have been shared by @kigelia
    It's a pattern we saw many times in the HoC threads, on various subjects. Conspiracy nutters post some crap they found online (#doingtheirresearch ), thinking it's a jolly impressive 'mic drop' moment but within minutes it's thoroughly debunked. Rather than think about why this keeps happening, they just move onto the next online crank, rinse and repeat. 
    On this very thread a poster moved on to Ukraine. 🤷🏻‍♂️
  • kigelia
    kigelia Posts: 2,582
    Friend Or Defoe said:
    Is the drug used during phase 2/3 of the clinical trials the same that gets distributed?
    I believe so. From what I read phase 1 was working out the dose required phase 2/3 was looking at effectiveness. 
  • ShootersHillGuru
    ShootersHillGuru Posts: 50,619
    Friend Or Defoe said:
    Rizzo said:
    Super_Eddie_Youds said:
    JamesSeed said:
    @kigelia 👏👏
    Seconded. 

    The issue is that there’ll be no engagement with the important, considered and objective views that have been shared by @kigelia
    It's a pattern we saw many times in the HoC threads, on various subjects. Conspiracy nutters post some crap they found online (#doingtheirresearch ), thinking it's a jolly impressive 'mic drop' moment but within minutes it's thoroughly debunked. Rather than think about why this keeps happening, they just move onto the next online crank, rinse and repeat. 
    On this very thread a poster moved on to Ukraine. 🤷🏻‍♂️
    It’s classic we’re all being lied to by government about everything conspiracy stuff. What is never taken into consideration is that if we are being lied to about eg vaccines, and the war in Ukraine, then we’re looking at a conspiracy that takes in every government in the world, even the rogue ones and every doctor and scientist. For god sake, even Iran had a vaccine programme. 
  • Friend Or Defoe
    Friend Or Defoe Posts: 18,090
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Friend Or Defoe said:
    Rizzo said:
    Super_Eddie_Youds said:
    JamesSeed said:
    @kigelia 👏👏
    Seconded. 

    The issue is that there’ll be no engagement with the important, considered and objective views that have been shared by @kigelia
    It's a pattern we saw many times in the HoC threads, on various subjects. Conspiracy nutters post some crap they found online (#doingtheirresearch ), thinking it's a jolly impressive 'mic drop' moment but within minutes it's thoroughly debunked. Rather than think about why this keeps happening, they just move onto the next online crank, rinse and repeat. 
    On this very thread a poster moved on to Ukraine. 🤷🏻‍♂️
    It’s classic we’re all being lied to by government about everything conspiracy stuff. What is never taken into consideration is that if we are being lied to about eg vaccines, and the war in Ukraine, then we’re looking at a conspiracy that takes in every government in the world, even the rogue ones and every doctor and scientist. For god sake, even Iran had a vaccine programme. 
    There's usually a kernel of truth then a load of nonsense gets added and you end up with 1+1=7. A lot of anti vax stuff comes from Thalidomide side effects in the 1950s. The 5G weirdness has been going on in some form for decades. Some people in the Victorian age believed radio waves were used by the government to control people.
  • Garrymanilow
    Garrymanilow Posts: 13,171
    PeanutsMolloy said:

    Garrymanilow said:
    shine166 said:
    ME14addick said:
    Rather than shut down an important thread, wouldn't it be better to stop the posters who post fake news, or at least give them a warning.
    Is that not a echo chamber ? 
    No, people can still disagree on the need to take the vaccine, it should just be based on actual facts not completely made up lies. It's like going on the post match thread; posters can disagree for a week abut whether or not Lloyd Jones is good enough for a promotion team but it falls apart fairly quickly if there's a bunch of idiots screaming that he's actually a government plant put in place by ministers sympathetic to Crystal Palace and we're all idiots for believing the players we signed this season are anything other than loads of ants glued together by big FIFA.

    Thank you for determining what is and is not acceptable to debate about the mRNA vaccines.
    So, it is acceptable to disagree about the need to take the vaccine but not to query its safety or efficacy or to quote findings from independent scientists (originally pro-vaccine) that the manufacturing process for the mRNA vaccine rolled out to the masses was materially different to the process used for the trialled version.
    Or to quote the opinion of a leading British oncologist, who happens to have long experience of vaccine development, and who has material concerns about the that he has observed in his patients formerly in remission, who have suffered the return of aggressive and untreatable cancers after receiving repeated boosters.
    Anyone raising these matters here is a "nutter" or "conspiracy theorist" and must be muted "because just one person choosing not to take the vaccine because of some guff they've read on here is one too many".
    Because you (and others) know the absolute, unimpeachable truth. 
    Well, apologies for doubting your infinite wisdom and that pharmaceutical companies are to be implicitly trusted to put patients' health before their own profit, but here is my latest offering, from the International Journal of Vaccine Theory, Practice, and Research
    And rather than dismissing it as "guff", try reading it without your head stuck up your arse.

    https://ijvtpr.com/index.php/IJVTPR/article/view/86

    In summary

    The analysis reported here is unique in that it is the first study of the original data from the Pfizer/BioNTech BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine clinical trial (CA4591001) to be carried out by a group unaffiliated with the trial sponsor. Our study is a forensic analysis of the 38 trial subjects who died between July 27, 2020, the start of Phase 2/3 of the clinical trial, and March 13, 2021, the data end date of their 6-Month Interim Report. Phase 2/3 of the trial involved 44,060 subjects who were equally distributed into two groups and received Dose 1 of either the BNT162b2 mRNA vaccinated or the Placebo control (0.9% normal saline). At Week 20, when the BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine received Emergency Use Authorization from the U.S. FDA, subjects in the placebo arm were given the option to be BNT162b2 vaccinated. All but a few accepted. Surprisingly, a comparison of the number of subject deaths per week during the 33 Weeks of this study found no significant difference between the number of deaths in the vaccinated versus placebo arms for the first 20 weeks of the trial, the placebo-controlled portion of the trial.  After Week 20, as subjects in the Placebo were unblinded and vaccinated, deaths among this still unvaccinated cohort of this group slowed and eventually plateaued. Deaths in the BNT162b2 vaccinated subjects continued at the same rate. Our analysis revealed inconsistencies between the subject data listed in the 6-Month Interim Report and publications authored by Pfizer/BioNTech trial site administrators. Most importantly, we found evidence of an over 3.7-fold increase in number of deaths due to cardiovascular events in BNT162b2 vaccinated subjects compared to Placebo controls. This significant adverse event signal was not reported by Pfizer/BioNTech. Potential sources of these data inconsistencies are identified.

    Excellent, so we've established that you can engage with people after you post what you do. With that in mind, would you like to engage with the fact every single thing you've posted has been debunked on here often minutes after you posted it, including kigelia's excellent takedown of the unscientific trash you've linked above, or are you just going to ignore that in favour of being dangerously wrong and never engaging when facts overcome your YouTube videos? I promise I'll remove my head from my arse long enough to hear you.
  • WellingWill
    WellingWill Posts: 26
    I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.
  • DaveMehmet
    DaveMehmet Posts: 21,601
    Friend Or Defoe said:
    Rizzo said:
    Super_Eddie_Youds said:
    JamesSeed said:
    @kigelia 👏👏
    Seconded. 

    The issue is that there’ll be no engagement with the important, considered and objective views that have been shared by @kigelia
    It's a pattern we saw many times in the HoC threads, on various subjects. Conspiracy nutters post some crap they found online (#doingtheirresearch ), thinking it's a jolly impressive 'mic drop' moment but within minutes it's thoroughly debunked. Rather than think about why this keeps happening, they just move onto the next online crank, rinse and repeat. 
    On this very thread a poster moved on to Ukraine. 🤷🏻‍♂️
    That wasn't very wise considering there's a war going on over there.
  • Rizzo
    Rizzo Posts: 6,435
    DaveMehmet said:
    Friend Or Defoe said:
    Rizzo said:
    Super_Eddie_Youds said:
    JamesSeed said:
    @kigelia 👏👏
    Seconded. 

    The issue is that there’ll be no engagement with the important, considered and objective views that have been shared by @kigelia
    It's a pattern we saw many times in the HoC threads, on various subjects. Conspiracy nutters post some crap they found online (#doingtheirresearch ), thinking it's a jolly impressive 'mic drop' moment but within minutes it's thoroughly debunked. Rather than think about why this keeps happening, they just move onto the next online crank, rinse and repeat. 
    On this very thread a poster moved on to Ukraine. 🤷🏻‍♂️
    That wasn't very wise considering there's a war going on over there.
    LIES!! It's a 'special military operation'. 
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