MATCH THREAD: Southend Utd v Charlton Athletic: FACR1 Saturday 2nd Nov 2024: KO 15:00 [+post p24]

Bedsaddick said:

Billy_Mix said:

regardless of how much was or wasn't spent on moderate players like Coventry and Ahadme far too much money has been wasted on Gillesphey, A Mitchell, Berry, Docherty, A Campbell to name just 5.
Yet again we were defensively hopeless on Saturday.  Repeatedly failing to deal with simple balls into the box and then dithering around the 2nd ball.
If those bumbling halfwits play twice as well as that against Exeter on Saturday we'll get humped 5 or 6 
It's worrying enough that they fail to read the game and are way off the pace but the refusal to take responsibility tells of deeper problems.
Third division defenders shouldn't be burdening themselves with much decision making, their remit is to get to the ball first and to get it as far away from our goal as quickly as possible.  If in doubt kick it out.  If that means sending colleagues or opponents out with the ball, so be it.  We ain't conceding goals if the ball's at the other end of the pitch or better yet sailing out over row z -  at least not for another minute or so.
There's a reason they're defending in division 3.  But our rabble have a double bummer combination of ideas way above their station and a uniform lack of application to their core responsibilities.

Berry and A Campbell confirmed on Saturday that they're not bothered about doing much more than warming the bench until the next transfer window.  They've schmoozed in on NJ's old pals act and contributed little to nothing at all.  Campbell's pony but Berry has given us a glimpse or two of ability, he's plain opted out of actually earning his crust.

The FA Cup adventure for 24/5 will shortly be over.  Walsall away in a cup would always be a strong odds on home win and the saddlers are in decent form.  Our half-cracked manager and his shitty squad haven't a hope 

I didn't go Saturday but Alex Mitchell must have had a stinker for you to put in in that list. He's been excellent all season.

Garrymanilow said:

Chunes said:

Garrymanilow said:

Talal said:

Garrymanilow said:

Ducktapeshoerepairs said:

Garrymanilow said:

Ducktapeshoerepairs said:

The board aren’t investing in the squad. They want us to believe they are, but ‘undisclosed’ fees are very convenient for them. Fans can then speculate on fees and that somehow becomes the truth. Coventry was ‘rumoured’ to cost £1m, turns out he was free. No way did we spend £1million on Ahadme, but that has now become ‘fact’ to some. We sold Alfie May to pay for last summer’s window. No money was invested. Until they do invest, we’ll stand still I’m afraid. 

To be fair the club have repeatedly stated that they didn't spend anything like £1m on Ahadme, but since he's had a slow start fans have latched onto it to be as critical of him as possible. Can't have it both ways, we can't be investing heavily in bad players and also not at all but our fanbase is currently trying to argue both of these things when we don't win games

I didn’t realise the club had stated that. Where did they state it ? 

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5743749/2024/09/07/birmingham-city-transfer-window-spend/

Not sure if that's accessible for everyone, never sure with The Athletic, but the quote is 'Gassan Ahadme's asking price at Ipswich went up to almost £1m but Charlton say they paid considerably less in what was also an undisclosed deal.' It's possible the fee is up to £1m after certain conditions are met, we just don't know the full details, but with what we've seen so far that seems unlikely.

Isn't that just The Athletic saying that Charlton have said something, rather than an actual quote by the club? 

You're not going to get an official quote from the club on an undisclosed fee

Not doubting the validity but think perhaps "repeatedly stated" was not the right choice of words.

I believe this is something the club have said a few times. If people want to quibble over the meaning of the word stated then that's too Charlton fan even for me

Garrymanilow said:

Chunes said:

Garrymanilow said:

Talal said:

Garrymanilow said:

Ducktapeshoerepairs said:

Garrymanilow said:

Ducktapeshoerepairs said:

The board aren’t investing in the squad. They want us to believe they are, but ‘undisclosed’ fees are very convenient for them. Fans can then speculate on fees and that somehow becomes the truth. Coventry was ‘rumoured’ to cost £1m, turns out he was free. No way did we spend £1million on Ahadme, but that has now become ‘fact’ to some. We sold Alfie May to pay for last summer’s window. No money was invested. Until they do invest, we’ll stand still I’m afraid. 

To be fair the club have repeatedly stated that they didn't spend anything like £1m on Ahadme, but since he's had a slow start fans have latched onto it to be as critical of him as possible. Can't have it both ways, we can't be investing heavily in bad players and also not at all but our fanbase is currently trying to argue both of these things when we don't win games

I didn’t realise the club had stated that. Where did they state it ? 

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5743749/2024/09/07/birmingham-city-transfer-window-spend/

Not sure if that's accessible for everyone, never sure with The Athletic, but the quote is 'Gassan Ahadme's asking price at Ipswich went up to almost £1m but Charlton say they paid considerably less in what was also an undisclosed deal.' It's possible the fee is up to £1m after certain conditions are met, we just don't know the full details, but with what we've seen so far that seems unlikely.

Isn't that just The Athletic saying that Charlton have said something, rather than an actual quote by the club? 

You're not going to get an official quote from the club on an undisclosed fee

Not doubting the validity but think perhaps "repeatedly stated" was not the right choice of words.

I believe this is something the club have said a few times. If people want to quibble over the meaning of the word stated then that's too Charlton fan even for me

se9addick said:

Ducktapeshoerepairs said:

The board aren’t investing in the squad. They want us to believe they are, but ‘undisclosed’ fees are very convenient for them. Fans can then speculate on fees and that somehow becomes the truth. Coventry was ‘rumoured’ to cost £1m, turns out he was free. No way did we spend £1million on Ahadme, but that has now become ‘fact’ to some. We sold Alfie May to pay for last summer’s window. No money was invested. Until they do invest, we’ll stand still I’m afraid. 

You realise this is a loss making business, a significant sum is required just to keep the lights on.

carly burn said:

soapboxsam said:

I said Billy Mix wouldn't show, when we were 2 nil up but when Godden tried to break the net instead of just scoring and going 3 -0 and suddenly it 2-1 from a pen, the alarm went in Billy's brain and he knew it wasn't going to be a wasted football day without his normal narrative on the decline of Charlton Athletic.

As it's 23 years to the day when we won at Arsenal 4-2 I do at times feels like joining in with Billy Boy but my experience of coaching and managing a young group means I always have to look for the light.

Somehow the wins against Bolton and Birmingham must be the benchmark not the losses to also ran's.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion including BM but we would've all given up years ago if their wasn't a flicker of hope somewhere 🤞🏻

We knew Nathan Jones was a religious man and a few sandwiches short of a picnic with a phobia about Table tennis at work but somehow we need him to find the  formula; as an Atheist who like ping pong 🏓 and wing play it's difficult for me but it's his gig and I want him to crack it.

 I happen to think he makes a few valid points.
Gillesphey is absolutely woeful as a centre back and should not be playing there. But with Jones out, we have very little choice so that's one cross against the recruitment drive.
But as I've mentioned before, the real crux for me is this midfield.
People are right to point out Berry has been very effective in moments. Important moments no doubt, but that is all they are. Moments.
But for the other 85 minutes he is largely non existent.
And that's fine if you've got strong players around him that can effectively carry him through. But we really haven't.
It's a midfield that has no cohesiveness at the moment. It struggles with self confidence and the ability to out-battle and out-think much of the opposing midfields it's come up against.
The captain has now probably spent more minutes off the pitch than on it!
 He hasn't been injured..That is just mind boggling.
I haven't given up complete hope. They are,or they were good players in previous times. No reason things can't change.Maybe they will just click  But it needs to happen very soon.

Brown59 said:

The problem lies in the people at board level. They could have got more quality players if they had decided to spend a bit more money instead of going for basement bargain buys. The ones jones has brought in are average league one players. He had no choice as those tight arseholes would not give him the money to buy better quality players. Charlie M was the same at Sunderland bringing the club to its knees. Look how they have moved on since getting him out of that club. Until the manager is allowed the funds to buy the quality players he needs it will stay the same. 

I admit jones selections have been worrying but let’s face it the players brought into the club are simply average payers. The better ones are the clubs that the chairman isn’t afraid to spend.  Don’t trust the board one bit they are just out for themselves. But at least we’re in the hat  for the next round.  It’s the league that matters. 

JamesSeed said:

paulsturgess said:

JamesSeed said:

Fortune 82nd Minute said:

Siv_in_Norfolk said:

Scoham said:

NJ post match interview

https://x.com/cafcofficial/status/1852784300787179582?s=46&t=A-w3Eq0EWWpjMxring904Q

I've watched that and then am commenting straight away without reading others' posts....

... listening to NJ, I  am heartened by the fact that - as in previous weeks - he really goes in strong on the fact that the team aren't performing to the standards he expects 

I've read a fair few people on here saying that we arent good enough and that he is the wrong manager for us and/or he isn't doing a good job. Hopefully, those people see value in the fact that he isn't trying to make excuses or sugar coat. He knows it isn't good enough. Given time and support, I think he'll get us to the levels we aspire to. 

Instead of continually talking about how the standards aren't up to what he expects why doesn't he do something about it?

I think the reason for his angst is that he signed players like Docherty, Berry and even Godden* probably quite rightly expecting them to be a good fit - I don’t think there were many complaints from us when he signed them - but they haven’t lived up to his, or our, expectations. I think he feels let down. 

(*Godden is at least getting on the scoresheet.)

This is his fault… he either chose these players badly or is coaching them badly!! There is no other way to look at it so he can moan all he likes…

remember that brag after the Bolton game “there are some people in the club who don’t think he can play as an 8”… he evidently went hard in to get docherty, for example, who has been poor and not up to what Jones thought ! 

Sometimes we have to stop making excuses for players Paul. We can’t just keep blaming ‘bad coaching’ for everything. Sometimes players need to pull their fingers out.

Looking back with hindsight, our recruitment has been poor, with a few exceptions, but those three players mentioned above have played at a decent level or a higher level, and need to be busting a gut. So disappointing. 

carly burn said:

Covered End said:

Chunes said:

carly burn said:

soapboxsam said:

I said Billy Mix wouldn't show, when we were 2 nil up but when Godden tried to break the net instead of just scoring and going 3 -0 and suddenly it 2-1 from a pen, the alarm went in Billy's brain and he knew it wasn't going to be a wasted football day without his normal narrative on the decline of Charlton Athletic.

As it's 23 years to the day when we won at Arsenal 4-2 I do at times feels like joining in with Billy Boy but my experience of coaching and managing a young group means I always have to look for the light.

Somehow the wins against Bolton and Birmingham must be the benchmark not the losses to also ran's.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion including BM but we would've all given up years ago if their wasn't a flicker of hope somewhere 🤞🏻

We knew Nathan Jones was a religious man and a few sandwiches short of a picnic with a phobia about Table tennis at work but somehow we need him to find the  formula; as an Atheist who like ping pong 🏓 and wing play it's difficult for me but it's his gig and I want him to crack it.

 I happen to think he makes a few valid points.
Gillesphey is absolutely woeful as a centre back and should not be playing there. But with Jones out, we have very little choice so that's one cross against the recruitment drive.
But as I've mentioned before, the real crux for me is this midfield.
People are right to point out Berry has been very effective in moments. Important moments no doubt, but that is all they are. Moments.
But for the other 85 minutes he is largely non existent.
And that's fine if you've got strong players around him that can effectively carry him through. But we really haven't.
It's a midfield that has no cohesiveness at the moment. It struggles with self confidence and the ability to out-battle and out-think much of the opposing midfields it's come up against.
The captain has now probably spent more minutes off the pitch than on it!
 He hasn't been injured..That is just mind boggling.
I haven't given up complete hope. They are,or they were good players in previous times. No reason things can't change.Maybe they will just click  But it needs to happen very soon.

I agree – there's zero balance in the midfield. They're all basically the same player; not one of them can drive forwards with the ball or hold possession in tight spaces. Taylor has probably looked the most lively, and that's the one midfielder Jones was trying to get rid of!

Agreed, yet Nathan Jones did this deliberately.

 I think it's safe to say Jones is not the most experienced in player identification and recruitment. And why should he be? Very few managers are these days.
They normally leave all that to the sporting director and their department.
But our sporting director or whatever Andy Scott calls himself these days showed himself to be pretty inept at it so we gave full autonomy to Jones .. and ended up with much of his old has beens because he has a lack of knowledge and experience in the wider market imo.

Dazzler21 said:

Six-a-bag-of-nuts said:

Ducktapeshoerepairs said:

The board aren’t investing in the squad. They want us to believe they are, but ‘undisclosed’ fees are very convenient for them. Fans can then speculate on fees and that somehow becomes the truth. Coventry was ‘rumoured’ to cost £1m, turns out he was free. No way did we spend £1million on Ahadme, but that has now become ‘fact’ to some. We sold Alfie May to pay for last summer’s window. No money was invested. Until they do invest, we’ll stand still I’m afraid. 

Fine, but how do we know your "truth" is the real truth. Can you verify?

 There is and can only ever be ONE truth. The Truth. 

Anything else, is opinion, rumour or guesswork.