I am going to say it!! Yes I am, Nathan Jones......................
Comments
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MillwallFan said:
I always say it, start to judge a team after 10 or so games, not the first 3 or 4.oohaahmortimer said:And we probably were last year, unfortunately the season doesn’t end after 8 games and we all know that come the final game we won’t be above them
10 games is a good yardstick.
Both Charlton and Millwall have been thrashed with CAFC at Stoke and Spanner FC at Saints. Also Wrexham had a win at the Den and we were awful at Cardiff and were lucky to only concede 3.
Yet I look at the Championship table and Charlton are 8th and Millwall are 11th after eight games. Both South London sides have been good, bad and ugly during the condensed 8 match spell.
I would take being 1 place behind Millwall at the end of the season as it means we at worse in mid table.
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I trust him to take us forward. You have to have trust with a manager like Jones as he is a bit unconventional. He has three weeks to solve some problems and I suspect he will.3
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What Jones gives us is players that are willing to run through walls for him, and that helps make up for our lack of quality compared to others in the division.
Worryingly, we have had back to back away performances where effort and desire can be called into question.
He needs to make sure we get back to what Jones sides are known for, or we will be bang on trouble by Christmas.2 -
I judged Millwall before a ball was kicked. Still, you won't care 😉.MillwallFan said:
I always say it, start to judge a team after 10 or so games, not the first 3 or 4.oohaahmortimer said:And we probably were last year, unfortunately the season doesn’t end after 8 games and we all know that come the final game we won’t be above them2 -
The five without a win is obviously not great. It’s compounded by our October fixtures (below). Now knowing us we will get a result in one or two of these games, but on the face of it, it could be a fairly sparse month.If we say pick up 4 points from the available 15 in October, how would people be feeling.
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I hope we get something from the first three games as the last two I think will be fruitless.AberystwythAddick said:The five without a win is obviously not great. It’s compounded by our October fixtures (below). Now knowing us we will get a result in one or two of these games, but on the face of it, it could be a fairly sparse month.If we say pick up 4 points from the available 15 in October, how would people be feeling.1 -
So in September and October, we have/had 10 games but only 2 Saturday 3pm kickoffs?AberystwythAddick said:The five without a win is obviously not great. It’s compounded by our October fixtures (below). Now knowing us we will get a result in one or two of these games, but on the face of it, it could be a fairly sparse month.If we say pick up 4 points from the available 15 in October, how would people be feeling.
Seems a bit off.1 -
It'll almost certainly be the same for everybody else.lordromford said:
So in September and October, we have/had 10 games but only 2 Saturday 3pm kickoffs?AberystwythAddick said:The five without a win is obviously not great. It’s compounded by our October fixtures (below). Now knowing us we will get a result in one or two of these games, but on the face of it, it could be a fairly sparse month.If we say pick up 4 points from the available 15 in October, how would people be feeling.
Seems a bit off.1 -
4 from 15 from those fixtures would worry me. Need to take at least 6 from the first 3 because I can't see us getting anything from Norwich or BoroAberystwythAddick said:The five without a win is obviously not great. It’s compounded by our October fixtures (below). Now knowing us we will get a result in one or two of these games, but on the face of it, it could be a fairly sparse month.If we say pick up 4 points from the available 15 in October, how would people be feeling.0 -
That's my concern. They gave up yesterday 3-1 down deffo.Croydon said:What Jones gives us is players that are willing to run through walls for him, and that helps make up for our lack of quality compared to others in the division.
Worryingly, we have had back to back away performances where effort and desire can be called into question.
He needs to make sure we get back to what Jones sides are known for, or we will be bang on trouble by Christmas.1 -
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Oh, I don’t doubt that Elfs. I just hadn’t realised how often we’d been moved from the traditional time.ElfsborgAddick said:
It'll almost certainly be the same for everybody else.lordromford said:
So in September and October, we have/had 10 games but only 2 Saturday 3pm kickoffs?AberystwythAddick said:The five without a win is obviously not great. It’s compounded by our October fixtures (below). Now knowing us we will get a result in one or two of these games, but on the face of it, it could be a fairly sparse month.If we say pick up 4 points from the available 15 in October, how would people be feeling.
Seems a bit off.
Fans of Prem clubs have been complaining about it for a while, but it hadn’t registered with me how affected we are now.2 -
Alii just walked away leaving a player unmarked near the post.Braziliance said:
That's my concern. They gave up yesterday 3-1 down deffo.Croydon said:What Jones gives us is players that are willing to run through walls for him, and that helps make up for our lack of quality compared to others in the division.
Worryingly, we have had back to back away performances where effort and desire can be called into question.
He needs to make sure we get back to what Jones sides are known for, or we will be bang on trouble by Christmas.
Ouma also looked less than committed, as did Grant.
We need all 11 to be at it to compete and we only had 8.
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I think all we can do is see where we are come the end of October. After that questions can be asked.The window is over and NJ now has the team that for better or worse will be with us until Jan.
It’s in his court now to get a tune out of them and keep our heads above water.He did it last season so hopefully he can do it again.1 -
Norwich aren’t pulling up any trees, no reason why we can’t beat them.MarcusH26 said:
4 from 15 from those fixtures would worry me. Need to take at least 6 from the first 3 because I can't see us getting anything from Norwich or BoroAberystwythAddick said:The five without a win is obviously not great. It’s compounded by our October fixtures (below). Now knowing us we will get a result in one or two of these games, but on the face of it, it could be a fairly sparse month.If we say pick up 4 points from the available 15 in October, how would people be feeling.5 -
Burnley are terrible at the moment. Norwich have a terrible goalkeeper and just conceded 4 at home to Bolton. Watford have also had a poor recent run. It’s not an easy 5 games for sure but I think we will pick up more than 4 points.We are still unbeaten at home, and other than the QPR game we’ve played well in each home game. Just need to sort ourselves out away from home and tbh Burnley and Watford are good fixtures at the moment for us to do that3
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Really hope Jones now see's we need creativity as well as being sound in defense - we can be good all we want at defending but it's unrealistic to expect them to defend for their lives continously without any outlet.
I hope he fights to sign 2/3 in Jan but as always with Charlton that makes to much sense and we will probably sign 3 more CDMs.0 -
We won’t be signing anyone until we can offload players.WillmoreTheRed said:Really hope Jones now see's we need creativity as well as being sound in defense - we can be good all we want at defending but it's unrealistic to expect them to defend for their lives continously without any outlet.
I hope he fights to sign 2/3 in Jan but as always with Charlton that makes to much sense and we will probably sign 3 more CDMs.You’d probably be looking at Knibbs, Apter and maybe Carey?1 -
Almost seems ridiculous to suggest we need to sign more players already, but it really doesn’t appear that we signed the type of players we most needed, the majority of our latest window are a mixture of cheaper options and panic buys/ loans.WillmoreTheRed said:Really hope Jones now see's we need creativity as well as being sound in defense - we can be good all we want at defending but it's unrealistic to expect them to defend for their lives continously without any outlet.
I hope he fights to sign 2/3 in Jan but as always with Charlton that makes to much sense and we will probably sign 3 more CDMs.0 -
The three true manager outcomes:
1. Leave, for family/health/retirement reasons. Usually the most glorious outcome
2. Snapped up by a club with more ambitions/money etc
3. Sacked
The arc of Jones at Charlton is long, but I know which one of these I predict. Obviously he'll fight it like hell, but the sad truth is that footballers are never quite what he wants. They're fallible, they make mistakes, they can't keep going forever. And for Jones, this is a problem, because his methods do not allow for this. He is the Captain Ahab of the EFL1 -
Might as well shift Knibbs and Apter as he has seemingly made his mind up on them, not sure about Carey he hasn't quite faced the full Jones shut out yet.AberystwythAddick said:
We won’t be signing anyone until we can offload players.WillmoreTheRed said:Really hope Jones now see's we need creativity as well as being sound in defense - we can be good all we want at defending but it's unrealistic to expect them to defend for their lives continously without any outlet.
I hope he fights to sign 2/3 in Jan but as always with Charlton that makes to much sense and we will probably sign 3 more CDMs.You’d probably be looking at Knibbs, Apter and maybe Carey?1 -
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I’m still not for getting rid of NJ, but if it were to happen, could another manager get anymore out of our current group of players, with the clear gaps we have in the squad?Leuth said:The three true manager outcomes:
1. Leave, for family/health/retirement reasons. Usually the most glorious outcome
2. Snapped up by a club with more ambitions/money etc
3. Sacked
The arc of Jones at Charlton is long, but I know which one of these I predict. Obviously he'll fight it like hell, but the sad truth is that footballers are never quite what he wants. They're fallible, they make mistakes, they can't keep going forever. And for Jones, this is a problem, because his methods do not allow for this. He is the Captain Ahab of the EFL0 -
The only thing another manager could do with this squad is make it even more turgid and defensive to grind out results.Sword65pf said:
I’m still not for getting rid of NJ, but if it were to happen, could another manager get anymore out of our current group of players, with the clear gaps we have in the squad?Leuth said:The three true manager outcomes:
1. Leave, for family/health/retirement reasons. Usually the most glorious outcome
2. Snapped up by a club with more ambitions/money etc
3. Sacked
The arc of Jones at Charlton is long, but I know which one of these I predict. Obviously he'll fight it like hell, but the sad truth is that footballers are never quite what he wants. They're fallible, they make mistakes, they can't keep going forever. And for Jones, this is a problem, because his methods do not allow for this. He is the Captain Ahab of the EFL
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I'm not saying to even think about sacking him now, it'd doom us. But I'm taking a long view0
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I agree, they couldn’t make us anymore dynamic, it’s mad to say a lot of us would put Cardiff up as a side we might aspire to be in respect to playing style, we are so far off it.Chunes said:
The only thing another manager could do with this squad is make it even more turgid and defensive to grind out results.Sword65pf said:
I’m still not for getting rid of NJ, but if it were to happen, could another manager get anymore out of our current group of players, with the clear gaps we have in the squad?Leuth said:The three true manager outcomes:
1. Leave, for family/health/retirement reasons. Usually the most glorious outcome
2. Snapped up by a club with more ambitions/money etc
3. Sacked
The arc of Jones at Charlton is long, but I know which one of these I predict. Obviously he'll fight it like hell, but the sad truth is that footballers are never quite what he wants. They're fallible, they make mistakes, they can't keep going forever. And for Jones, this is a problem, because his methods do not allow for this. He is the Captain Ahab of the EFL0 -
He's the best we'd get for now - would be a different story if he had the players and still wasn't getting the results or style of play right but I think most of us can see he is just constantly reshuffling a bad hand.4
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It really makes no sense talking about new players unless it's with a new manager who has some positive play about him . Jones and Fleming were defenders and boy does it show.
Anyone with any attacking ability soon has all their confidence sucked out of them because they are either played out of position or more likely are benched . I'm convinced someone else could get Knibbs , Carey and Apter to do what they were brought in for but Jones has given up on them , especially Knibbs and Apter.
As i said before . If he was given a war chest for players he'd just sign defenders or defensive midfielders.5 -
I do think it would be an effective use of funds to hire a coach who is good at coaching attacking patterns of play. We have quite a small coaching staff really and it shows8
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I said this in the summer. I’m assuming Hylton is responsible for this along with set pieces. Jones strikes me as someone who will only bring in someone he knows and trustsfenaddick said:I do think it would be an effective use of funds to hire a coach who is good at coaching attacking patterns of play. We have quite a small coaching staff really and it shows
I also doubt we focused much on it over the summer. Changing from 3-5-2 to 4-2-3-1 was a big risk and I’m pretty certain we would have spent most of the time drilling the defensive side of it because that is always going to be more important for us in the championship on our budget. Hopefully now we can put some more work into in possession over the break and the rest of the season1 -
I know it’s been a while now but he has none of his coaching team with him. Hart obviously retired and Cohen (now Lincoln co boss) was an assistant elsewhere.NabySarr said:
I said this in the summer. I’m assuming Hylton is responsible for this along with set pieces. Jones strikes me as someone who will only bring in someone he knows and trustsfenaddick said:I do think it would be an effective use of funds to hire a coach who is good at coaching attacking patterns of play. We have quite a small coaching staff really and it shows
I also doubt we focused much on it over the summer. Changing from 3-5-2 to 4-2-3-1 was a big risk and I’m pretty certain we would have spent most of the time drilling the defensive side of it because that is always going to be more important for us in the championship on our budget. Hopefully now we can put some more work into in possession over the break and the rest of the seasonObviously you see it a lot with coaches where they are found out a bit when they don’t have their old staff (take gerrard with Mick Beale).
I wonder how much influence coaches like Hart, Cohen and Hartford had on attacking styles of play?0 -
He also had Sheehan with him at Luton for a bit (who is currently unemployed I think).AberystwythAddick said:
I know it’s been a while now but he has none of his coaching team with him. Hart obviously retired and Cohen (now Lincoln co boss) was an assistant elsewhere.NabySarr said:
I said this in the summer. I’m assuming Hylton is responsible for this along with set pieces. Jones strikes me as someone who will only bring in someone he knows and trustsfenaddick said:I do think it would be an effective use of funds to hire a coach who is good at coaching attacking patterns of play. We have quite a small coaching staff really and it shows
I also doubt we focused much on it over the summer. Changing from 3-5-2 to 4-2-3-1 was a big risk and I’m pretty certain we would have spent most of the time drilling the defensive side of it because that is always going to be more important for us in the championship on our budget. Hopefully now we can put some more work into in possession over the break and the rest of the seasonObviously you see it a lot with coaches where they are found out a bit when they don’t have their old staff (take gerrard with Mick Beale).
I wonder how much influence coaches like Hart, Cohen and Hartford had on attacking styles of play?I think with Jones we’ve seen him across multiple teams and coaching staffs and he’s got good results so I don’t think he’s reliant on coaches to do well like some managers definitely are.He got us playing decent enough football in league 1, I don’t think the problem is him or the coaches, it’s just that we don’t have good enough players to do it and until that changes no manager or coaches combination is going to be able to do any better2
