I dont cry easily these days. I watched the Remembrance Service this morning & fell apart listening to the Welsh Wife & Mother of a fallen Soldier who had planted a flag on the hill where he used to play as a kid. Then a Veteran from WW2 said he still didnt think he'd done enough?! We owe them all so much!
Watched the whole service on TV with a lump in my throat and a tear in my eye.
But did anyone notice that some of The Veteran Serviceman while waiting for the march past to start giving it the "Harry Worth" while others were on their mobiles waving the cameras and generally playing the fool.
As an ex squaddie from the early 70's I am appalled at those banners. I had some great scottish mates serving with me, we were only young lads but each one of us were proud to wear the uniform and were prepared to do our bit should the need arise. We lost a great mate who was shot by a sniper - he only just arrived in NI a few days earlier. He was 18. I cant believe that in trying to protect the country - known as the UK - we have this kind of 'filth'. As a 50 something I've been saddened and shocked a few times, but this takes the biscuit. A sad day indeed.
As an ex squaddie from the early 70's I am appalled at those banners. I had some great scottish mates serving with me, we were only young lads but each one of us were proud to wear the uniform and were prepared to do our bit should the need arise. We lost a great mate who was shot by a sniper - he only just arrived in NI a few days earlier. He was 18. I cant believe that in trying to protect the country - known as the UK - we have this kind of 'filth'. As a 50 something I've been saddened and shocked a few times, but this takes the biscuit. A sad day indeed.
It's very sad, and that they we're able to get away with it is even worse. The only thing I can take comfort in is the irony that the poppy (for me anyway) signifies remembrance of all those who have been lost in conflict over the years to protect, amongst other things, the freedom of speech that allowed those evil men to hold that banner aloft.
Thank you for your story redmidland, it's for hero's like your friend who made the ultimate sacrifice for our nation that mean it's so important that we all wear out poppies.
For anyone who works nearby, the RBL headquarters is in Borough High Street. They sell the full range of poppy merchandise in the reception there, badges, keyrings, everything.
Weren't the deaths of our troops supposed to be to preserve, amongst other things, freedom of speech and thought?
If so, I don't understand why the Celtic thing is a story. It can hardly be surprising that Irish/Scot Catholics have strong feelings about the British armed services.
[cite]Posted By: iainment[/cite]It can hardly be surprising that Irish/Scot Catholics have strong feelings about the British armed services
The Irish can think whatever they like, our poppy appeal has nothing to do with them. However British citizens displaying paraphernalia which criticises a charity which benefits veterans of many different wars, on British soil is a complete disgrace. I don't understand why their religion would be an issue ?
[cite]Posted By: iainment[/cite]It can hardly be surprising that Irish/Scot Catholics have strong feelings about the British armed services
The Irish can think whatever they like, our poppy appeal has nothing to do with them. However British citizens displaying paraphernalia which criticises a charity which benefits veterans of many different wars, on British soil is a complete disgrace. I don't understand why their religion would be an issue ?
Then you need to bone up a bit on your history. Most Celtic fans are of Irish descent and would have their own interpretation and understanding of the merits of giving to armed forces charities here.
At the end of the day dissent is essential to effective democracy and even if the views expressed by Celtic fans are distasteful to you it doesn't mean that they shouldn't be aired.
[cite]Posted By: iainment[/cite]It can hardly be surprising that Irish/Scot Catholics have strong feelings about the British armed services
The Irish can think whatever they like, our poppy appeal has nothing to do with them. However British citizens displaying paraphernalia which criticises a charity which benefits veterans of many different wars, on British soil is a complete disgrace. I don't understand why their religion would be an issue ?
Then you need to bone up a bit on your history. Most Celtic fans are of Irish descent and would have their own interpretation and understanding of the merits of giving to armed forces charities here.
At the end of the day dissent is essential to effective democracy and even if the views expressed by Celtic fans are distasteful to you it doesn't mean that they shouldn't be aired.
Some of the scottish people I served with were Celtic fans, many Celtic fans, I guess, were killed in the 2nd world war and others since including todays altercations!!. The poppy appeal does not discriminate about who they help, and once again I guess families of Celtic fans have benefited from the charity. I supose I'm disappointed that the powers that be up at Parkhead allowed the banners to be shown. As an aside many Irish people also lost their lives in the wars and many are serving in todays trouble spots for the British Army......its all just a shame that people today so easily forget and want to make a political point when their own countrymen have laid down their lives - fighting for their and our democracy - its a strange world.
[cite]Posted By: iainment[/cite]It can hardly be surprising that Irish/Scot Catholics have strong feelings about the British armed services
The Irish can think whatever they like, our poppy appeal has nothing to do with them. However British citizens displaying paraphernalia which criticises a charity which benefits veterans of many different wars, on British soil is a complete disgrace. I don't understand why their religion would be an issue ?
Then you need to bone up a bit on your history. Most Celtic fans are of Irish descent and would have their own interpretation and understanding of the merits of giving to armed forces charities here.
At the end of the day dissent is essential to effective democracy and even if the views expressed by Celtic fans are distasteful to you it doesn't mean that they shouldn't be aired.
Some of the scottish people I served with were Celtic fans, many Celtic fans, I guess, were killed in the 2nd world war and others since including todays altercations!!. The poppy appeal does not discriminate about who they help, and once again I guess families of Celtic fans have benefited from the charity. I supose I'm disappointed that the powers that be up at Parkhead allowed the banners to be shown. As an aside many Irish people also lost their lives in the wars and many are serving in todays trouble spots for the British Army......its all just a shame that people today so easily forget and want to make a political point when their own countrymen have laid down their lives - fighting for their and our democracy - its a strange world.
The political point was raised by SE9addick. I just responded.
I agree with you that there are different strands of opinion in Ireland but even though Irish men and women served, and still do, and died in the British army there is a great well of feeling against the British army amongst many Irish people. I know, I live in Kerry and face occasional prejudice directed against Brits here.
iainment - my Scottish history is just fine, thank you !!!
I think both you, and the people who created this banner are missing the point. The Poppy appeal does not support the political decision or motivations that took this country into the various wars which we have waged. Rather it supports the victims and their families. To try and politicise this charity is wrong, and as Redmidland has pointed out, quite hypocritical when you consider that many of the recipients of this appeals generosity will be Irish and/or Catholic.
[cite]Posted By: iainment[/cite]It can hardly be surprising that Irish/Scot Catholics have strong feelings about the British armed services
The Irish can think whatever they like, our poppy appeal has nothing to do with them. However British citizens displaying paraphernalia which criticises a charity which benefits veterans of many different wars, on British soil is a complete disgrace. I don't understand why their religion would be an issue ?
"I don't understand why their religion would be an issue?" Are you for real?
Quite frankly, I would be surprised if we did not see this sort of thing from some Celtic supporters at Parkhead, they are a relatively small minority of the total fan base but this sort of thing has been going on for years.
Its just part of the same old Old Firm hatred that the extremists both sides of the Sectarian divide love to carry on with.
On the Celtic/Republican side you have the left-wing anti-British stuff and on the Rangers/Loyalist side you have the right-wing anti-Irish stuff, its two sides of the same coin.
[cite]Posted By: se9addick[/cite]iainment - my Scottish history is just fine, thank you !!!
I think both you, and the people who created this banner are missing the point. The Poppy appeal does not support the political decision or motivations that took this country into the various wars which we have waged. Rather it supports the victims and their families. To try and politicise this charity is wrong, and as Redmidland has pointed out, quite hypocritical when you consider that many of the recipients of this appeals generosity will be Irish and/or Catholic.
Ignorance is not an excuse.
The point is you chose to publicise their banners - which I had no previous knowledge of. You chose to pull in this issue, you chose to politicise this thread. You were trying to get others, who agree with you, to be outraged about something that in the scheme of things will have little effect on who will and will not wear a poppy.
The fact is that amongst Celtic supporters there are a significant number who hold the views expressed on the banners, because of their families nationality and history and experience of British soldiery. Why are you surprised at this?
It is only in the last couple of years that Ireland has even been willing to officially acknowledge the Irish who fought in WW1, this is still a divisive issue here. As they say the curse of the Irish is that they will not forget their history.
For what it's worth I think it's an absolute scandal that veterans depend on charity - if the government see fit to go to war the least they can do is provide for those maimed by it and support the families economically effected.
[cite]Posted By: Evelyn Beatrice Hall, illustrating Voltaire's beliefs[/cite]I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.
Saw the first collection box on the bar in the pub on Sunday. Personally I go for start of November though and usually end up buying several as the damn things keep falling off. Can't think of a much better cause to spend the money on though.
Comments
Sandra laid our Reef for us....
Good to see so many "kids" there.
Hope CAFC have poppies on their shirts this arvo.
But did anyone notice that some of The Veteran Serviceman while waiting for the march past to start giving it the "Harry Worth" while others were on their mobiles waving the cameras and generally playing the fool.
As an ex squaddie from the early 70's I am appalled at those banners. I had some great scottish mates serving with me, we were only young lads but each one of us were proud to wear the uniform and were prepared to do our bit should the need arise. We lost a great mate who was shot by a sniper - he only just arrived in NI a few days earlier. He was 18. I cant believe that in trying to protect the country - known as the UK - we have this kind of 'filth'. As a 50 something I've been saddened and shocked a few times, but this takes the biscuit. A sad day indeed.
It's very sad, and that they we're able to get away with it is even worse. The only thing I can take comfort in is the irony that the poppy (for me anyway) signifies remembrance of all those who have been lost in conflict over the years to protect, amongst other things, the freedom of speech that allowed those evil men to hold that banner aloft.
Thank you for your story redmidland, it's for hero's like your friend who made the ultimate sacrifice for our nation that mean it's so important that we all wear out poppies.
They don't deserve to wear the poppy on their vile hoops.
If so, I don't understand why the Celtic thing is a story. It can hardly be surprising that Irish/Scot Catholics have strong feelings about the British armed services.
The Irish can think whatever they like, our poppy appeal has nothing to do with them. However British citizens displaying paraphernalia which criticises a charity which benefits veterans of many different wars, on British soil is a complete disgrace. I don't understand why their religion would be an issue ?
Then you need to bone up a bit on your history. Most Celtic fans are of Irish descent and would have their own interpretation and understanding of the merits of giving to armed forces charities here.
At the end of the day dissent is essential to effective democracy and even if the views expressed by Celtic fans are distasteful to you it doesn't mean that they shouldn't be aired.
Some of the scottish people I served with were Celtic fans, many Celtic fans, I guess, were killed in the 2nd world war and others since including todays altercations!!. The poppy appeal does not discriminate about who they help, and once again I guess families of Celtic fans have benefited from the charity. I supose I'm disappointed that the powers that be up at Parkhead allowed the banners to be shown. As an aside many Irish people also lost their lives in the wars and many are serving in todays trouble spots for the British Army......its all just a shame that people today so easily forget and want to make a political point when their own countrymen have laid down their lives - fighting for their and our democracy - its a strange world.
The political point was raised by SE9addick. I just responded.
I agree with you that there are different strands of opinion in Ireland but even though Irish men and women served, and still do, and died in the British army there is a great well of feeling against the British army amongst many Irish people. I know, I live in Kerry and face occasional prejudice directed against Brits here.
I think both you, and the people who created this banner are missing the point. The Poppy appeal does not support the political decision or motivations that took this country into the various wars which we have waged. Rather it supports the victims and their families. To try and politicise this charity is wrong, and as Redmidland has pointed out, quite hypocritical when you consider that many of the recipients of this appeals generosity will be Irish and/or Catholic.
Ignorance is not an excuse.
"I don't understand why their religion would be an issue?" Are you for real?
Quite frankly, I would be surprised if we did not see this sort of thing from some Celtic supporters at Parkhead, they are a relatively small minority of the total fan base but this sort of thing has been going on for years.
Its just part of the same old Old Firm hatred that the extremists both sides of the Sectarian divide love to carry on with.
On the Celtic/Republican side you have the left-wing anti-British stuff and on the Rangers/Loyalist side you have the right-wing anti-Irish stuff, its two sides of the same coin.
sorry bloody awful spelling mistake that was... last night still ruining my brain!
hear hear!
The point is you chose to publicise their banners - which I had no previous knowledge of. You chose to pull in this issue, you chose to politicise this thread. You were trying to get others, who agree with you, to be outraged about something that in the scheme of things will have little effect on who will and will not wear a poppy.
The fact is that amongst Celtic supporters there are a significant number who hold the views expressed on the banners, because of their families nationality and history and experience of British soldiery. Why are you surprised at this?
It is only in the last couple of years that Ireland has even been willing to officially acknowledge the Irish who fought in WW1, this is still a divisive issue here. As they say the curse of the Irish is that they will not forget their history.
For what it's worth I think it's an absolute scandal that veterans depend on charity - if the government see fit to go to war the least they can do is provide for those maimed by it and support the families economically effected.
Anyway, Celtic plan on banning the protestors and apologise for any offence caused so this storm in a teacup is presumably over. Everyone can take back their comments about what the powers that be at Parkhead did and didn't do.
Back to discussing the poppy campaign.