[cite]Posted By: dabos[/cite]Great post Chunes. Somes it up perfectly. Fitness wise he is poor, but for a lower Championship/upper League 1 side he is a decent player.
Exactly that, I think some of our fans see him as a top half Championship player, so the way he's been playing is seen him as under performing. Probably down to him coming through when we were in the Prem and looking ok back then. No doubt he could/should have been more consistent, but as said the same could even be said of players like Bailey.
Leeds fans will see him for what he is, a free transfer to give them another option in a team that have just been promoted back to the Championship. He won't have the expectations some had for him here, where he was expected to destroy this league.
In my time Morts, Robson, Thomas and Sam have all suffered similar treatment. All very talented, but all at times inconsistent and accused of being lazy. It's always seemed to be in the Charlton mindset that effort is more important than anything else and unless you're charging around like a headless chicken, all other contributions are deemed to be irrelevant by some of our fans.
I hope Waggy does well for us, but my gut feeling is that we'll be crying out to have Lloyd back once we've seen a couple of months of Waggy toiling away to no great effect.
Difference between Wagstaff and Sam is not just effort but also his goals. While Sam creates chances, Wagstaff scores more than he sets up and that stands out.
I agree, was just trying to say some don't see it like that. Wagstaff isn't the better player at the moment, but because he scores and runs around a lot some prefer him.
Totally agree with what Chunes said, only thing I think Sam did lack though was consistency in his shooting (especially when compared with Wagstaff) he got often in good positions to score but rarely looked like he felt he would score and usually didn't.
Also, because we relied on him so much as a team for creativity not only did fans expect him to move mountains but there was a period when players would kick it 30 yard + at him in expectency of him doing something they couldn't. Whilst his touch was incredible and he could deal with these balls coming at him, many teams realised our one-dimensionality and double-marked him, lessening his effect on games. I also think his 'laziness' was much overstated due to his languid style of movement.
He will be greatly missed by us, will be a hit at yours esp on a free.
As usual most Charlton fans slated him either for not producing enough or not challenging enough, what basis they have to compare against is beyond me, with've not had an effective winger (RHS) since Robbo, and he werent great just a bloody good grafter, maybe its still miss guided dispapontment from Rommaldahl or something, or maybe the fact he was a late developer and should have performed like last season earlier in his carer but what ever it is hopefully now he's gone it doesnt pass on to th next winger, becasue although I think waggy can step up over the next few years he's no where near as good/consistant as Sam, and not sure he ever will be as technically good or be able to cross the ball lke sam - although I do think he'll score and create (directly) more chances than sam did, although sams crosses were pin point just our strikers could never take advantage of them.
The truth of the matter, sadly, is that the Charlton crowd loves a scapegoat and Sam was it for a good number of people last season along with Mooney.
We will undoubtedly miss him as at league 1 and Championship level he has the class and ability to unlock defences even if he doesn't do it often enough for some people.
Waggy, for all his virtues and he does have some, is simply not in the same class.
Most fans don't have a clue let's face it. Sam is, was and will no doubt always be a good crosser. One of his early matches against Tottingham, in our last days of prem, he just couldn't stop crossing. And pretty much all of them were good crosses but our attack was too static and often he could have gotten them off quicker. Maybe that day he crossed as he had no option and the Spurs full backs were narrow.
Thing is that is the only day when he played a percentage game. Virtually every other match I've seen him he'll not hit a cross early or when he makes the space. He only hits crosses when it's instinctive with the ball zipped out to him, or he takes the ball at speed to go outside. Maybe Leeds as a punchy, physical team that have great ball players on the counter he get's those positions where he doesn't have to think just hit.
He is a great assist player. He covers his full back superbly, something he was atrocious at until 2008-2009. It'd be interesting to see his prozone stats as last season he developed an alarming nack to be totally nackered after 60 mins. There can be many frustrations with regards to Sam, but unlike many of our players of the last few seasons he is definitely champ quality.
I know as an ex Charlton academy player, I should be wishing Lloyd well but could not help but raise a smile when he gave away the penalty and then was taken off after 65 odd minutes looking shattered.
Comments
Leeds fans will see him for what he is, a free transfer to give them another option in a team that have just been promoted back to the Championship. He won't have the expectations some had for him here, where he was expected to destroy this league.
In my time Morts, Robson, Thomas and Sam have all suffered similar treatment. All very talented, but all at times inconsistent and accused of being lazy. It's always seemed to be in the Charlton mindset that effort is more important than anything else and unless you're charging around like a headless chicken, all other contributions are deemed to be irrelevant by some of our fans.
I hope Waggy does well for us, but my gut feeling is that we'll be crying out to have Lloyd back once we've seen a couple of months of Waggy toiling away to no great effect.
As usual most Charlton fans slated him either for not producing enough or not challenging enough, what basis they have to compare against is beyond me, with've not had an effective winger (RHS) since Robbo, and he werent great just a bloody good grafter, maybe its still miss guided dispapontment from Rommaldahl or something, or maybe the fact he was a late developer and should have performed like last season earlier in his carer but what ever it is hopefully now he's gone it doesnt pass on to th next winger, becasue although I think waggy can step up over the next few years he's no where near as good/consistant as Sam, and not sure he ever will be as technically good or be able to cross the ball lke sam - although I do think he'll score and create (directly) more chances than sam did, although sams crosses were pin point just our strikers could never take advantage of them.
The truth of the matter, sadly, is that the Charlton crowd loves a scapegoat and Sam was it for a good number of people last season along with Mooney.
We will undoubtedly miss him as at league 1 and Championship level he has the class and ability to unlock defences even if he doesn't do it often enough for some people.
Waggy, for all his virtues and he does have some, is simply not in the same class.
Thing is that is the only day when he played a percentage game. Virtually every other match I've seen him he'll not hit a cross early or when he makes the space. He only hits crosses when it's instinctive with the ball zipped out to him, or he takes the ball at speed to go outside. Maybe Leeds as a punchy, physical team that have great ball players on the counter he get's those positions where he doesn't have to think just hit.
He is a great assist player. He covers his full back superbly, something he was atrocious at until 2008-2009. It'd be interesting to see his prozone stats as last season he developed an alarming nack to be totally nackered after 60 mins. There can be many frustrations with regards to Sam, but unlike many of our players of the last few seasons he is definitely champ quality.
Yes, yes, we all know the Charlton Life Motto... but what's your opinion on Lloyd Sam Off_It?
Let's face it, most fans couldn't construct a thought better than a mentalist pub logician.
Did we ever play him on the left?
He's a Charlton youth product so there'll always be an interest. Hence why there's threads on Parker, Mcdonald etc..
Hey, ISaw, be nice about Lloydie. He was one of ours and very unlucky with the penalty.
Otherwise I'll set Sam Lloyd on you.
Be afraid, be very afraid!
Sorry mate, wish them lot all the worst in the championship, agent sam started well though i suppose ;-)
Can't say Leeds are my 2nd favourite team either - much nearer to my 92nd favourite team, in fact.
Agent Sam. I like that! haha
Don't think so.