Planned concessions for drivers include: – Half-price tolling for low-income households (those on certain benefits) in Greenwich, Lewisham, Bexley,Southwark, Tower Hamlets, Newham, Barking & Dagenham, Bromley, Hackney, Havering, Redbridge Waltham Forest and the City. This will last for at least three years following the Silvertown Tunnel’s opening and will be reviewed after that. – Small businesses, sole traders and charities who sign up to Autopay will get a £1 discount on off-peak charges (bringing the cost down to 50p). – Taxis, blue badge holders and wheelchair-accessible minicabs will also be exempt. “Zero-mission capable” private hire vehicles would also be exempt. – NHS staff and patients will be able to get refunds. https://greenwichwire.co.uk/2024/07/10/blackwall-and-silvertown-tunnel-tolls-revealed/5
An utter f***ing joke - the Silvertown tunnel is a ridiculous idea thought up by a bunch of clowns. Local residents get tolls and more pollution.
Tunnel had to happen imo. its the funding from central govt that pushed them into this position. This is why we are so behind on infrastructure. Getting anything funded let alone built is impossible.
As I say this as someone who until fairly recently lived on the peninsular and was affected by the works.
It's a ludicrous idea. Will lead to more traffic in a polluted area.
We don't need another tunnel in this area- nobody can justify it. Khan made no attempt to do so and local opposition has simply been ignored.
We don't? Blackwall is running well over capacity every day. Dartford crossing is the busiest stretch of road in the country also well over capacity. We need one there and one at gravesend imo in order to have any chance of future proofing.
We don't need two river crossings in the same area - even more pollution.
It's a f***ing disgrace and crap for the local area. A mental idea but par for the course.
TFL are utterly clueless - not sure how this will meet their pollution goals.
I lived on the peninsula until fairly recently and was affected by the works. I still think it was much needed as did most of my neighbours that I spoke to about it. When the Blackwall Tunnel had a problem the entire area would come to a standstill. We wouldn't be able to get out the carpark for our building. People would be mounting the pavement to try and cut queues even as the primary school was letting kids out. Everyone wanted another tunnel to prevent this from happening.
As for pollution, cars moving freely produce much less than cars not moving. You could taste and smell the difference in the air quality when the tunnel was screwed even 8 floors up.
In an ideal world yes there would be a bigger gap between the 2 and spread them out but there were various physical and geographical reasons that meant it was just too expensive to dig on other sites.
Apparently electric cars going to pay ulez after 2025. I think rickshaws will be ok though
Not the ULEZ just the central congestion zone.
Electric cars were except from the congestion charge for a couple of years as an incentive to get people to change.
These road improvements will lead to more people driving so won't improve the traffic. In LA they have 10 lane freeways at a standstill, although in fairness their public transport isn't great, unlike London's.
Electric car owners currently pay £10 per year to avoid paying the Central London daily congestion charge. This is what is being withdrawn at the end of next year.
If it has to be paid then we have to swallow it, but I believe private vehicles registered at addresses in Southwark, Lewisham, Greenwich and Bexley, and Tower Hamlets and Newham (have I left out an obvious Borough?) should somehow be exempt. What worries me is the technology you have to negotiate in order to pay. I would much prefer paying cash at a tollbooth.
If it has to be paid then we have to swallow it, but I believe private vehicles registered at addresses in Southwark, Lewisham, Greenwich and Bexley, and Tower Hamlets and Newham (have I left out an obvious Borough?) should somehow be exempt. What worries me is the technology you have to negotiate in order to pay. I would much prefer paying cash at a tollbooth.
I doubt it would be feasible to charge at toll booths. The traffic over the Dartford bridge flows more freely without the toll booths I am not sure that can be said for the tunnels. I for one would not want to sit in a toll booth breathing all the traffic fumes all day. SK just wants to put up more cameras so that will be ready for road pricing.
For the Dartford crossing I think I have had about £20 sitting there for several years. I do remember a couple of years ago having to telephone them in order to keep myself and car number sort of valid. From memory you have to put your car number somewhere, register at another bloody site, have a username and an address and a poxy password with lower case, upper case, capital letters, punctuation, a number and an unusual symbol. Maybe even a security question.
Then you have to remember such stuff across a number of years. I dread to think how I will cope if I ever change my 8 year old Ford Fiesta. Now I am likely to use the Blackwall crossing(s) more than Dartford, and some tech wonk will have devised a registration system so convoluted and difficult I feel sure it is set up to catch people out. When it comes to online technology for me you never ‘just’ have to do something simple, and absolutely nothing is obvious or common sense.
It is surely generational because I have spent most of my miserable existence in a non digital world, and feel that the new world, with it’s smart meters, and Horizon scandals, and the enrichment of Elton Mask is being forced down my throat. Mind you gambling companies love the digital world.
For the Dartford crossing I think I have had about £20 sitting there for several years. I do remember a couple of years ago having to telephone them in order to keep myself and car number sort of valid. From memory you have to put your car number somewhere, register at another bloody site, have a username and an address and a poxy password with lower case, upper case, capital letters, punctuation, a number and an unusual symbol. Maybe even a security question.
Then you have to remember such stuff across a number of years. I dread to think how I will cope if I ever change my 8 year old Ford Fiesta. Now I am likely to use the Blackwall crossing(s) more than Dartford, and some tech wonk will have devised a registration system so convoluted and difficult I feel sure it is set up to catch people out. When it comes to online technology for me you never ‘just’ have to do something simple, and absolutely nothing is obvious or common sense.
It is surely generational because I have spent most of my miserable existence in a non digital world, and feel that the new world, with it’s smart meters, and Horizon scandals, and the enrichment of Elton Mask is being forced down my throat. Mind you gambling companies love the digital world.
I think Technology is moving too fast and it's alright till there's a problem. The mother in law spent over an hour trying to sort her holiday out online. After an hour rang the company up for them to tell her there was a problem with their systems. The old days they would of sent the tickets out by post , job done.
Anybody ever seen that video of an ‘authoritative’ American woman explaining how to make tea by putting a tea bag in cold water and microwaving it? I see that as a kind of equivalent of the tech wonks who design systems and impose stuff on the rest of us. It might work for them, but does it work for, like, proper people?
If it has to be paid then we have to swallow it, but I believe private vehicles registered at addresses in Southwark, Lewisham, Greenwich and Bexley, and Tower Hamlets and Newham (have I left out an obvious Borough?) should somehow be exempt. What worries me is the technology you have to negotiate in order to pay. I would much prefer paying cash at a tollbooth.
why should they be exempt ? Don't remember you saying those boroughs should be exempt from ULEZ
Apparently electric cars going to pay ulez after 2025. I think rickshaws will be ok though
Which makes zero sense as the name is Ultra Low Emissions Zone, and whilst the electric they run isn't emissions free, the cars themselves are
They aren't, though. Microplastics from car tyres pollute our air and our water systems, finding its way to the sea where it is ingested by sea creatures and into our food. Particulate pollution from car tyres can be up to 2000 times worse than from engine exhausts. Heavier vehicles like electric cars are worse for tyre pollution. Air pollution from a typical new car tyre is 73mg/km. Air pollution from car exhausts is regulated to be no more than 4.5mg/km. Six million tonnes of some 250 different chemicals are released globally each year from car tyres, many of which are carcinogenic. It is a huge problem.
as an EV driver, I don't have a problem paying congestion charge, ULEZ i would, the weight/wheels thing is becoming less of an issue, and whilst some might be heavier, an EV is less likely to be chucking out brake related pollution, as you tend to use the brakes less, and use regenerative breaking more
Not read all the posts so apologies if this point has been made. I have no objection with tolls, congestion charge or ULEZ. What I object to is that this is a tax on the east of London. If you live in or west of the centre of town then you can cross the river with impunity and at zero cost. Should you live towards the east there are less available crossings and you need to pay for the privilege. It’s totally wrong.
Planned concessions for drivers include: – Half-price tolling for low-income households (those on certain benefits) in Greenwich, Lewisham, Bexley,Southwark, Tower Hamlets, Newham, Barking & Dagenham, Bromley, Hackney, Havering, Redbridge Waltham Forest and the City. This will last for at least three years following the Silvertown Tunnel’s opening and will be reviewed after that. – Small businesses, sole traders and charities who sign up to Autopay will get a £1 discount on off-peak charges (bringing the cost down to 50p). – Taxis, blue badge holders and wheelchair-accessible minicabs will also be exempt. “Zero-mission capable” private hire vehicles would also be exempt. – NHS staff and patients will be able to get refunds. https://greenwichwire.co.uk/2024/07/10/blackwall-and-silvertown-tunnel-tolls-revealed/
So TFL think that SE London is 'East London'? I'm so pleased that I live in North Devon, no tolls, no mayor, no motorways, no public transport, no tarmac on the roads, just cowpats.
If it has to be paid then we have to swallow it, but I believe private vehicles registered at addresses in Southwark, Lewisham, Greenwich and Bexley, and Tower Hamlets and Newham (have I left out an obvious Borough?) should somehow be exempt. What worries me is the technology you have to negotiate in order to pay. I would much prefer paying cash at a tollbooth.
why should they be exempt ? Don't remember you saying those boroughs should be exempt from ULEZ
Because the Blackwall crossing has always been free, unlike Dartford which charged from the outset. Also west London crosses for free.
I don’t see the relationship with ULEZ, can you explain more?
Not read all the posts so apologies if this point has been made. I have no objection with tolls, congestion charge or ULEZ. What I object to is that this is a tax on the east of London. If you live in or west of the centre of town then you can cross the river with impunity and at zero cost. Should you live towards the east there are less available crossings and you need to pay for the privilege. It’s totally wrong.
Agree totally, all crossing should either be free, or have a toll. I also don't see why Dartford would be cheaper than Blackwall/Silvertown.
Not that I go that often but tend to go north via Blackwall, now I'd probably go via Dartford more as it's little difference in time.
Not read all the posts so apologies if this point has been made. I have no objection with tolls, congestion charge or ULEZ. What I object to is that this is a tax on the east of London. If you live in or west of the centre of town then you can cross the river with impunity and at zero cost. Should you live towards the east there are less available crossings and you need to pay for the privilege. It’s totally wrong.
Even more so it's a tax on people living South of the river.
The more I think about this the more its pissing me off. Methinks my new (Conservative) MP may have to get involved. Pure discrimination.
For the Dartford crossing I think I have had about £20 sitting there for several years. I do remember a couple of years ago having to telephone them in order to keep myself and car number sort of valid. From memory you have to put your car number somewhere, register at another bloody site, have a username and an address and a poxy password with lower case, upper case, capital letters, punctuation, a number and an unusual symbol. Maybe even a security question.
Then you have to remember such stuff across a number of years. I dread to think how I will cope if I ever change my 8 year old Ford Fiesta. Now I am likely to use the Blackwall crossing(s) more than Dartford, and some tech wonk will have devised a registration system so convoluted and difficult I feel sure it is set up to catch people out. When it comes to online technology for me you never ‘just’ have to do something simple, and absolutely nothing is obvious or common sense.
It is surely generational because I have spent most of my miserable existence in a non digital world, and feel that the new world, with it’s smart meters, and Horizon scandals, and the enrichment of Elton Mask is being forced down my throat. Mind you gambling companies love the digital world.
And yet you tell us you have been happy to master use of a VPN to watch our team 😆😉
Seriously you don’t have to remember the password years later rather reset it if you need to.
The risk of a fine is greater than the moderate hassle of setting up an ‘account’ I’d suggest.
For the Dartford crossing I think I have had about £20 sitting there for several years. I do remember a couple of years ago having to telephone them in order to keep myself and car number sort of valid. From memory you have to put your car number somewhere, register at another bloody site, have a username and an address and a poxy password with lower case, upper case, capital letters, punctuation, a number and an unusual symbol. Maybe even a security question.
Then you have to remember such stuff across a number of years. I dread to think how I will cope if I ever change my 8 year old Ford Fiesta. Now I am likely to use the Blackwall crossing(s) more than Dartford, and some tech wonk will have devised a registration system so convoluted and difficult I feel sure it is set up to catch people out. When it comes to online technology for me you never ‘just’ have to do something simple, and absolutely nothing is obvious or common sense.
It is surely generational because I have spent most of my miserable existence in a non digital world, and feel that the new world, with it’s smart meters, and Horizon scandals, and the enrichment of Elton Mask is being forced down my throat. Mind you gambling companies love the digital world.
And yet you tell us you have been happy to master use of a VPN to watch our team 😆😉
Seriously you don’t have to remember the password years later rather reset it if you need to.
The risk of a fine is greater than the moderate hassle of setting up an ‘account’ I’d suggest.
People who live east of the city will have to pay a toll to cross the Thames, its only fair that those living in the west of London should do the same.
This.
I wonder when Sadiq Khan will bring in a toll to cross Hammersmith Bridge, Chelsea Bridge, etc etc
Tomorrow if he could get away with it.
But it will come soon enough.
Only if someone stumps up to fix Hammersmith Bridge first - it's been shut for years!
If it has to be paid then we have to swallow it, but I believe private vehicles registered at addresses in Southwark, Lewisham, Greenwich and Bexley, and Tower Hamlets and Newham (have I left out an obvious Borough?) should somehow be exempt. What worries me is the technology you have to negotiate in order to pay. I would much prefer paying cash at a tollbooth.
why should they be exempt ? Don't remember you saying those boroughs should be exempt from ULEZ
Because the Blackwall crossing has always been free, unlike Dartford which charged from the outset. Also west London crosses for free.
I don’t see the relationship with ULEZ, can you explain more?
Driving in those boroughs was free from the outset, now you have to pay Ulez
Yet you want the boroughs surrounding the tunnel to not pay any charge, because it was free from the outset
why should the boroughs be exempt of one charge but you are not advocating being exempt of the other charge
Planned concessions for drivers include: – Half-price tolling for low-income households (those on certain benefits) in Greenwich, Lewisham, Bexley,Southwark, Tower Hamlets, Newham, Barking & Dagenham, Bromley, Hackney, Havering, Redbridge Waltham Forest and the City. This will last for at least three years following the Silvertown Tunnel’s opening and will be reviewed after that. – Small businesses, sole traders and charities who sign up to Autopay will get a £1 discount on off-peak charges (bringing the cost down to 50p). – Taxis, blue badge holders and wheelchair-accessible minicabs will also be exempt. “Zero-mission capable” private hire vehicles would also be exempt. – NHS staff and patients will be able to get refunds. https://greenwichwire.co.uk/2024/07/10/blackwall-and-silvertown-tunnel-tolls-revealed/5
An utter f***ing joke - the Silvertown tunnel is a ridiculous idea thought up by a bunch of clowns. Local residents get tolls and more pollution.
Tunnel had to happen imo. its the funding from central govt that pushed them into this position. This is why we are so behind on infrastructure. Getting anything funded let alone built is impossible.
As I say this as someone who until fairly recently lived on the peninsular and was affected by the works.
It's a ludicrous idea. Will lead to more traffic in a polluted area.
We don't need another tunnel in this area- nobody can justify it. Khan made no attempt to do so and local opposition has simply been ignored.
We don't? Blackwall is running well over capacity every day. Dartford crossing is the busiest stretch of road in the country also well over capacity. We need one there and one at gravesend imo in order to have any chance of future proofing.
We don't need two river crossings in the same area - even more pollution.
It's a f***ing disgrace and crap for the local area. A mental idea but par for the course.
TFL are utterly clueless - not sure how this will meet their pollution goals.
I lived on the peninsula until fairly recently and was affected by the works. I still think it was much needed as did most of my neighbours that I spoke to about it. When the Blackwall Tunnel had a problem the entire area would come to a standstill. We wouldn't be able to get out the carpark for our building. People would be mounting the pavement to try and cut queues even as the primary school was letting kids out. Everyone wanted another tunnel to prevent this from happening.
As for pollution, cars moving freely produce much less than cars not moving. You could taste and smell the difference in the air quality when the tunnel was screwed even 8 floors up.
In an ideal world yes there would be a bigger gap between the 2 and spread them out but there were various physical and geographical reasons that meant it was just too expensive to dig on other sites.
I live on the peninsula and hardly know of any support for the scheme. Not sure who exactly you spoke to?
It will increase traffic and add to the pollution in the area. TFL have just gone ahead with the scheme regardless.
It's cost a huge amount and added a toll to add insult to injury.
We will now have more HGVs in the area and publicity has been kept to a minimum because TFL know it's a shit scheme.
If it has to be paid then we have to swallow it, but I believe private vehicles registered at addresses in Southwark, Lewisham, Greenwich and Bexley, and Tower Hamlets and Newham (have I left out an obvious Borough?) should somehow be exempt. What worries me is the technology you have to negotiate in order to pay. I would much prefer paying cash at a tollbooth.
why should they be exempt ? Don't remember you saying those boroughs should be exempt from ULEZ
Because the Blackwall crossing has always been free, unlike Dartford which charged from the outset. Also west London crosses for free.
I don’t see the relationship with ULEZ, can you explain more?
Driving in those boroughs was free from the outset, now you have to pay Ulez
Yet you want the boroughs surrounding the tunnel to not pay any charge, because it was free from the outset
why should the boroughs be exempt of one charge but you are not advocating being exempt of the other charge
One is about road use that has always been free. The other is about Air Pollution, and the ULEZ has been inside the South Circular for years, before being expanded. The Blackwall crossing has been there inside the S Circ, and free to use. Now it is the case the ULEZ scheme has been accepted London wide for years. Any charge on the Blackwall crossing is a new thing, about a different issue. I have a feeling that people in Dartford get some kind of exemption on the Dartford crossing, or used to, and if they haven't got it now I believe they should have, being local and all that. So I believe the local Boroughs should have some kind of exemption too, because of what I believe was precedent at Dartford, and because other Thameside boroughs in London cross the river in a number of places (not Hammersmith Bridge) for free. The notion being that people living near the north or south of the river are more likely than most to criss cross more frequently. I accept there may be a counter argument, but that is my reasoning.
Maybe give your mate at city hall that you voted in a call and tell him you think it's wrong he is charging the good people of lewisham to drive their Ford fiesta through the tunnels but everyone else should be charged.
Maybe give your mate at city hall that you voted in a call and tell him you think it's wrong he is charging the good people of lewisham to drive their Ford fiesta through the tunnels but everyone else should be charged.
Maybe. However didn't the information already published talk about consultation, and the possibility of some kind of leeway in nearby Boroughs? I don't think the final proposal has been settled yet, I wait to see what it says about Lewisham Ford Fiestas.
Maybe give your mate at city hall that you voted in a call and tell him you think it's wrong he is charging the good people of lewisham to drive their Ford fiesta through the tunnels but everyone else should be charged.
Maybe. However didn't the information already published talk about consultation, and the possibility of some kind of leeway in nearby Boroughs? I don't think the final proposal has been settled yet, I wait to see what it says about Lewisham Ford Fiestas.
The consultation is not going to respond to feedback - see ULEZ consultation for precedent🙂
I believe it’s a legal / procedural step to go through only in all practical terms.
Always thought it’s totally unfair that citizens of East London will have to pay to cross the river……this includes the Dartford Tunnel of course, whereas citizens from Central & West London get charged nothing….f’ing outrageous. 😡
Comments
As for pollution, cars moving freely produce much less than cars not moving. You could taste and smell the difference in the air quality when the tunnel was screwed even 8 floors up.
In an ideal world yes there would be a bigger gap between the 2 and spread them out but there were various physical and geographical reasons that meant it was just too expensive to dig on other sites.
What worries me is the technology you have to negotiate in order to pay. I would much prefer paying cash at a tollbooth.
From memory you have to put your car number somewhere, register at another bloody site, have a username and an address and a poxy password with lower case, upper case, capital letters, punctuation, a number and an unusual symbol. Maybe even a security question.
I dread to think how I will cope if I ever change my 8 year old Ford Fiesta.
Now I am likely to use the Blackwall crossing(s) more than Dartford, and some tech wonk will have devised a registration system so convoluted and difficult I feel sure it is set up to catch people out.
When it comes to online technology for me you never ‘just’ have to do something simple, and absolutely nothing is obvious or common sense.
Mind you gambling companies love the digital world.
The mother in law spent over an hour trying to sort her holiday out online.
After an hour rang the company up for them to tell her there was a problem with their systems.
The old days they would of sent the tickets out by post , job done.
I see that as a kind of equivalent of the tech wonks who design systems and impose stuff on the rest of us.
It might work for them, but does it work for, like, proper people?
Don't remember you saying those boroughs should be exempt from ULEZ
Also west London crosses for free.
I don’t see the relationship with ULEZ, can you explain more?
Not that I go that often but tend to go north via Blackwall, now I'd probably go via Dartford more as it's little difference in time.
The more I think about this the more its pissing me off. Methinks my new (Conservative) MP may have to get involved. Pure discrimination.
Seriously you don’t have to remember the password years later rather reset it if you need to.
;-)
Yet you want the boroughs surrounding the tunnel to not pay any charge, because it was free from the outset
why should the boroughs be exempt of one charge but you are not advocating being exempt of the other charge
It will increase traffic and add to the pollution in the area. TFL have just gone ahead with the scheme regardless.
It's cost a huge amount and added a toll to add insult to injury.
We will now have more HGVs in the area and publicity has been kept to a minimum because TFL know it's a shit scheme.
The other is about Air Pollution, and the ULEZ has been inside the South Circular for years, before being expanded. The Blackwall crossing has been there inside the S Circ, and free to use. Now it is the case the ULEZ scheme has been accepted London wide for years.
Any charge on the Blackwall crossing is a new thing, about a different issue.
I have a feeling that people in Dartford get some kind of exemption on the Dartford crossing, or used to, and if they haven't got it now I believe they should have, being local and all that.
So I believe the local Boroughs should have some kind of exemption too, because of what I believe was precedent at Dartford, and because other Thameside boroughs in London cross the river in a number of places (not Hammersmith Bridge) for free. The notion being that people living near the north or south of the river are more likely than most to criss cross more frequently.
I accept there may be a counter argument, but that is my reasoning.
However didn't the information already published talk about consultation, and the possibility of some kind of leeway in nearby Boroughs?
I don't think the final proposal has been settled yet, I wait to see what it says about Lewisham Ford Fiestas.
I believe it’s a legal / procedural step to go through only in all practical terms.