Saw something I'd never seen from shelvey last night. An air of almost disinterest. He would always be alert, wanting and virtually demanding the ball. But this was nowhere to be seen. I think monk punished him by making him play the full 90 minutes. Body language suggested jonjo just didn't want to be out there. I can see a spell on the bench or a change of scenery coming up. Imo he's always had an edgy side to his game, first seen with us at orient then (to my 25/1 delight but probably harsh decision) for the bin dippers against Man Utd. After monks comments I was surprised he started last night. I couldn't find a shelvey red card market but would've been all over it.
I'd have him back tomorrow. He's only a baby in football terms. Not sure how a boy from a council estate can be a spoilt brat but dear old Curtis loves the moral high horse
Amazing what a couple of years at £10k a week can do to you huh
watched it just because he was playing. In first half he let their mid field run past him half a dozen times. No way Monk missed that happening as L/Pool nearly scored twice. I thought he had to be subbed at half time, but it seemed to me he was moved further up the pitch. Britton seemed to be the guy who was charged with doing the covering work. Maybe it was JJ doing a "feck u boss" u want me to listen to you ill do that 100% , i stay exactly where you told me"----------JJ didnt even break into a trot first half and over the 90 mins never once tracked a runner------he knew what he was doing.
Sad that things aren't going as hoped for him (and equally disappointing that some here seem to derive some pleasure from it).
No doubt in my mind now that the boy's career is at a real crossroads. He had the big move to the big club that didn't work out, he took a step down to try and move forward from playing regular first team football, and that doesn't seem to be working out either.
The liklihood i think is he will be moving on again soon, and this time it will be in the bracket of a lower half prem club closer to home (Palace, QPR etc) / a newly promoted champ club in the summer / or a champ club looking to move forward with a decent budget (Ipswich / Norwich etc).
On the pitch when he was at his best Jonjo played with a very fine between confidence in his ability and arrogance. I suspect he has lost a little of that confidence. He proved with his loan spell at Blackpool that he has the potential to be far too good to be playing in the Championship, but unless he finds get that confidence back and starts making things happen again in the final third, cut out the silly stuff like the needless elbow last night and cheap bookings, fewer and fewer managers will be prepared to take a punt on him.
I wrote the following piece when he left here nearly five years ago. If you skip the club financial concerns stuff, it highlights that at no stage in his career has he really been able to pull together a consistent performance run. Everyone knows the talent is there, really hope it doesn't go to waste.
Saw something I'd never seen from shelvey last night. An air of almost disinterest. He would always be alert, wanting and virtually demanding the ball. But this was nowhere to be seen. I think monk punished him by making him play the full 90 minutes. Body language suggested jonjo just didn't want to be out there. I can see a spell on the bench or a change of scenery coming up. Imo he's always had an edgy side to his game, first seen with us at orient then (to my 25/1 delight but probably harsh decision) for the bin dippers against Man Utd. After monks comments I was surprised he started last night. I couldn't find a shelvey red card market but would've been all over it.
Hard to keep motivated when your team conceded 4, you scored and own goal and you are aware of the possibility you could be banned for an elbow especially after your manager has come out and criticised your discipline recently. I think we sometimes forget that footballers aren't robots and as such will suffer mentally at times.
I was always a bit split about Jonjo. There's obviously a real talent but I could never see how he fitted into the team, he wasn't a striker, he wasn't reliable enough in central mid because he would sometimes play the wrong ball or make an unnecessary foul and when he played on the wing he could cross but couldn't take on players.
I think his best position would probably be free ranging just behind the strikers, which makes him a bit of a luxury player, as someone has to cover for him or you play with a striker less. Whenever he played for us I always felt that we had to compromise the team structure to accommodate him in it, which was why I wasn't overly upset when he left as we got good money and I thought he could develop more in a team that could afford to get a better mix of players around him.
It was said by many at the time including Parky that he was a b it of a luxury player that we couldn't get all the other players to work with Jonjo's game.
We tried to build a team around him and Jonjo still didn't fit.
I hope he can get his head right, as he along with Jenkinson and Poyet are the biggest chances of Charlton Youth playing regularly at a decent level and potentially getting regular England spots in the future.
Saw something I'd never seen from shelvey last night. An air of almost disinterest. He would always be alert, wanting and virtually demanding the ball. But this was nowhere to be seen. I think monk punished him by making him play the full 90 minutes. Body language suggested jonjo just didn't want to be out there. I can see a spell on the bench or a change of scenery coming up. Imo he's always had an edgy side to his game, first seen with us at orient then (to my 25/1 delight but probably harsh decision) for the bin dippers against Man Utd. After monks comments I was surprised he started last night. I couldn't find a shelvey red card market but would've been all over it.
Hard to keep motivated when your team conceded 4, you scored and own goal and you are aware of the possibility you could be banned for an elbow especially after your manager has come out and criticised your discipline recently. I think we sometimes forget that footballers aren't robots and as such will suffer mentally at times.
He looked disinterested well before they reached 4. If you know you're gonna be banned you should give everything in this match seeing as though you'll be missing a few soon.
It's the goading of uncle smudge not the pleasure of a poor game for shelvey
He showed more class than any recent player by signing his contract ensuring that we got dough for him when he had numerous offers that would have meant we got fuck all
Shame the Internet tough guys say things here rather than to uncles face when offered the opportunity too, but then when your a coward it's easier to hide behind a screen
I think it's Uncle's over protective way of launching an attack at people who have criticised JJ in the past.
It's understandable to a degree, but football fans always are Marmite on players. They love or hate, giving praise or spite filled comments.
It is a bit annoying the way they are goading a comment from Uncle when Uncle comes on here still even though he is a West Ham fan, to chat to and update fans of JJ's original parent club.
It's the goading of uncle smudge not the pleasure of a poor game for shelvey
He showed more class than any recent player by signing his contract ensuring that we got dough for him when he had numerous offers that would have meant we got fuck all
Shame the Internet tough guys say things here rather than to uncles face when offered the opportunity too, but then when your a coward it's easier to hide behind a screen
It was only a few weeks back the SKY pundits were saying what a quality player he is/can be.
From where I sit I see a player who has the ability to be the driving force of the team - technically gifted, strong, great eye for a pass, great weight of pass.
The sad thing is that he hasn't established himself in that role and that is a loss for everybody - including England. Maybe, as others have said, he's a bit volatile, bit of a loose cannon but every time I've seen him interviewed he seems a very down to earth, regular guy.
Let's hope he does achieve his clearly considerable potential, especially at International level.
The Shelvey elbow was daft but overall you could hardly blame him for the loss, he started slowly but got more into the game as it went on.
Bottom line was that at 1-0 Liverpool were running out of steam but then the keeper makes a howler and it's 2-0.
The own goal was unlucky, could happen to anyone, and the Lallana goal (for which I presume Shelvey is being criticised) was unstoppable once Coutinho played that superb flick, it basically took the Swansea midfielders out of the game.
It's the goading of uncle smudge not the pleasure of a poor game for shelvey
He showed more class than any recent player by signing his contract ensuring that we got dough for him when he had numerous offers that would have meant we got fuck all
Shame the Internet tough guys say things here rather than to uncles face when offered the opportunity too, but then when your a coward it's easier to hide behind a screen
I think Jonjo Shelvey is a bit dim and won't improve as a footballer to be much better than he currently is. I don't think I'm tough, but then again I don't see any reason why I have to meet up with 'Uncle' to tell him directly.
Uncle is related to JJ (obviously) it isnt unheard of for people to be protective of their kin----opinions on footballers vary but slatting his personality and IQ bring it back into defending a relative and yes possibly confrontation.
I still think his body language in the first half (he always wanted the ball) but never broke into a trot was saying to Monk "look im right where you told me to be doing 100% what you told me to do" even if that let L/Pool walk past him. Im 100% their is an England player in JJ but something isnt right in his head at the moment.
Uncle is related to JJ (obviously) it isnt unheard of for people to be protective of their kin----opinions on footballers vary but slatting his personality and IQ bring it back into defending a relative and yes possibly confrontation.
I don't see why there's a line drawn there. If the criticism is relevant, which it clearly is. There are plenty of opinions on personalities on this site. Take the Pardew threads; are you going to accept it if a relative of Pardew knocks on your door because you called him a prick? Is that not far worse than stating a player is limited by his (lack of) nous?
Shame the Internet tough guys say things here rather than to uncles face when offered the opportunity too, but then when your a coward it's easier to hide behind a screen
What was reams banned for again? This forum has really gone done the toilet in recent years.
Shame the Internet tough guys say things here rather than to uncles face when offered the opportunity too, but then when your a coward it's easier to hide behind a screen
What was reams banned for again? This forum has really gone done the toilet in recent years.
The Forum? Really? There are others around if this one is so toilet... Or are you hoping it'll come 'good' again?
Shame the Internet tough guys say things here rather than to uncles face when offered the opportunity too, but then when your a coward it's easier to hide behind a screen
What was reams banned for again? This forum has really gone done the toilet in recent years.
The Forum? Really? There are others around if this one is so toilet... Or are you hoping it'll come 'good' again?
Saw something I'd never seen from shelvey last night. An air of almost disinterest. He would always be alert, wanting and virtually demanding the ball. But this was nowhere to be seen. I think monk punished him by making him play the full 90 minutes. Body language suggested jonjo just didn't want to be out there. I can see a spell on the bench or a change of scenery coming up. Imo he's always had an edgy side to his game, first seen with us at orient then (to my 25/1 delight but probably harsh decision) for the bin dippers against Man Utd. After monks comments I was surprised he started last night. I couldn't find a shelvey red card market but would've been all over it.
Hard to keep motivated when your team conceded 4, you scored and own goal and you are aware of the possibility you could be banned for an elbow especially after your manager has come out and criticised your discipline recently. I think we sometimes forget that footballers aren't robots and as such will suffer mentally at times.
He looked disinterested well before they reached 4. If you know you're gonna be banned you should give everything in this match seeing as though you'll be missing a few soon.
True but it's all very well saying that but another with what the mind will actually allow you to do.
JJ just has to grow up. Seen it time and time again with young players and they end up going one of two ways. I'm sure he's the type of lad who will heed the wise words of those close to him and get his career back on track.
However he will need to learn to curb his tendency to lash out and to do more when his side hasn't got the ball.
I wonder if some of this is down the outside life. Consider - grew up in Romford, at the age when many are settling into a first job he is moving 200 miles away to one of the most famous football clubs on the planet. For whatever reason that doesn't work and so he moves again to Wales. And gets married to a minor celebrity and, this March, had a baby (thanks Wikipedia for all this by the way, have not been stalking). So at 22 he is a dad living in a foreign country (sort of) and having his work criticised by his boss in national media.
I know they earn fortunes but one has to hope the pastoral care is up to the job.
Comments
That would be a way of getting back at Monk.
If he's looking to get a move then how impressed would other clubs be?
He would always be alert, wanting and virtually demanding the ball. But this was nowhere to be seen.
I think monk punished him by making him play the full 90 minutes. Body language suggested jonjo just didn't want to be out there. I can see a spell on the bench or a change of scenery coming up.
Imo he's always had an edgy side to his game, first seen with us at orient then (to my 25/1 delight but probably harsh decision) for the bin dippers against Man Utd. After monks comments I was surprised he started last night. I couldn't find a shelvey red card market but would've been all over it.
Hope he isnt Palarse bound
No doubt in my mind now that the boy's career is at a real crossroads. He had the big move to the big club that didn't work out, he took a step down to try and move forward from playing regular first team football, and that doesn't seem to be working out either.
The liklihood i think is he will be moving on again soon, and this time it will be in the bracket of a lower half prem club closer to home (Palace, QPR etc) / a newly promoted champ club in the summer / or a champ club looking to move forward with a decent budget (Ipswich / Norwich etc).
On the pitch when he was at his best Jonjo played with a very fine between confidence in his ability and arrogance. I suspect he has lost a little of that confidence. He proved with his loan spell at Blackpool that he has the potential to be far too good to be playing in the Championship, but unless he finds get that confidence back and starts making things happen again in the final third, cut out the silly stuff like the needless elbow last night and cheap bookings, fewer and fewer managers will be prepared to take a punt on him.
I wrote the following piece when he left here nearly five years ago. If you skip the club financial concerns stuff, it highlights that at no stage in his career has he really been able to pull together a consistent performance run. Everyone knows the talent is there, really hope it doesn't go to waste.
http://forum.charltonlife.com/discussion/34102/new-article-the-curious-case-of-jonjo-shelvey/p1
We tried to build a team around him and Jonjo still didn't fit.
I hope he can get his head right, as he along with Jenkinson and Poyet are the biggest chances of Charlton Youth playing regularly at a decent level and potentially getting regular England spots in the future.
He showed more class than any recent player by signing his contract ensuring that we got dough for him when he had numerous offers that would have meant we got fuck all
Shame the Internet tough guys say things here rather than to uncles face when offered the opportunity too, but then when your a coward it's easier to hide behind a screen
It's understandable to a degree, but football fans always are Marmite on players. They love or hate, giving praise or spite filled comments.
It is a bit annoying the way they are goading a comment from Uncle when Uncle comes on here still even though he is a West Ham fan, to chat to and update fans of JJ's original parent club.
From where I sit I see a player who has the ability to be the driving force of the team - technically gifted, strong, great eye for a pass, great weight of pass.
The sad thing is that he hasn't established himself in that role and that is a loss for everybody - including England. Maybe, as others have said, he's a bit volatile, bit of a loose cannon but every time I've seen him interviewed he seems a very down to earth, regular guy.
Let's hope he does achieve his clearly considerable potential, especially at International level.
Bottom line was that at 1-0 Liverpool were running out of steam but then the keeper makes a howler and it's 2-0.
The own goal was unlucky, could happen to anyone, and the Lallana goal (for which I presume Shelvey is being criticised) was unstoppable once Coutinho played that superb flick, it basically took the Swansea midfielders out of the game.
Could be that uncle has a blinkered view and thinks that Jonjo is marvellous whatever he does, sure we have all met people like that.
I still think his body language in the first half (he always wanted the ball) but never broke into a trot was saying to Monk "look im right where you told me to be doing 100% what you told me to do" even if that let L/Pool walk past him. Im 100% their is an England player in JJ but something isnt right in his head at the moment.
However he will need to learn to curb his tendency to lash out and to do more when his side hasn't got the ball.
I know they earn fortunes but one has to hope the pastoral care is up to the job.