how many black ex players have the full qualifications to get the coaching jobs.
Or is it that they don't bother because they feel it's a waste of time.
I heard Dean Saunders say he has spent many years getting his pro coaching badges, and he wondered if the black ex pros have done the same ?
I'm amazed someone like Paul Mortimer, who wants to be a coach is still struggling to get there, as he comes across, as a very articulated guy. He said he can't even get an interview.
Sol Campbell Would last 5 mins as a coach/manager for reasons all ready stated
I was reading an interview with Dean Windass yesterday and he has all of his coaching bases but can't get a job. He said it's very, very difficult trying to find an opening.
seems like ex professionals have come crashing into the real world. It's hard for anyone to get a job now simply on qualifications alone. You need experience in the field in question.
All well and good putting it up for sale for £25 million....whether someone buys it for that or whether it is actually worth that is a separate debate!
how many black ex players have the full qualifications to get the coaching jobs.
Or is it that they don't bother because they feel it's a waste of time.
I heard Dean Saunders say he has spent many years getting his pro coaching badges, and he wondered if the black ex pros have done the same ?
I'm amazed someone like Paul Mortimer, who wants to be a coach is still struggling to get there, as he comes across, as a very articulated guy. He said he can't even get an interview.
Sol Campbell Would last 5 mins as a coach/manager for reasons all ready stated
I was reading an interview with Dean Windass yesterday and he has all of his coaching bases but can't get a job. He said it's very, very difficult trying to find an opening.
TBH, every time I've heard Dean Windass talk I think I'd struggle to find a place for him stacking shelves at Lidl
If Iain Dowie can get a job, then anyone can.
Dowie was a qualified Rocket scientist.
I guess that's why when he was our manager he looked spaced out!
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
More candidates would mean more jobs. The focus should be getting more black players to take their coaching badges and prove themselves at a lower level. There isn't exactly a plethora of unemployed black football coaches/managers.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
How long ago was that though? Football has had a complete overhaul since then, and it does seem to be evolving still. You have to look at the amount of black players that were around 20 years ago to see why there isn't a huge influx of black coaches. Over the next 10 years I fully expect to see this change..............IF they actually want to be coaches or managers! Being in the Media seems a lot easier, and more lucrative.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
How long ago was that though? Football has had a complete overhaul since then, and it does seem to be evolving still. You have to look at the amount of black players that were around 20 years ago to see why there isn't a huge influx of black coaches. Over the next 10 years I fully expect to see this change..............IF they actually want to be coaches or managers! Being in the Media seems a lot easier, and more lucrative.
This is the million dollar question, and almost impossible to quantify. I really don't accept that there is an 'institutional' problem with racism in the English game, although you can never rule out the ignorant minority, but I personally believe there is a perception that it exists that to some degree prevents black people from applying for roles.
I've said before that I believe the measure of 'how many black managers are there' is wrong. Fewer black managers have been sacked, is that a valid statistic? Surely if you want to measure racism preventing black managers getting appointed, you need to look at the employers not the employees; that is, how many clubs have employed a black manager? The figure is around a quarter of the 92, and many many more in the amateur game, and is considerably greater when you throw coaches and DoFs into the mix. 25%, interestingly, almost exactly reflects the number of black players in the professional game.
As with many things, you can measure equality in terms of outcome or in terms of opportunity. The latter is a significant measure, because you'd hope the consideration would be 'best person for the job' regardless of their race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, etc. And a fair proportion of clubs have
In the meantime the likes of Campbell and John Barnes continue to damage the credibility of a really important issue. I wouldn't employ either as the manager of my football club, and it's got absolutely nothing to do with the colour of their skin. I wouldn't employ Iain Dowie for the same reason I wouldn't employ John Barnes.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
How long ago was that though? Football has had a complete overhaul since then, and it does seem to be evolving still. You have to look at the amount of black players that were around 20 years ago to see why there isn't a huge influx of black coaches. Over the next 10 years I fully expect to see this change..............IF they actually want to be coaches or managers! Being in the Media seems a lot easier, and more lucrative.
This is the million dollar question, and almost impossible to quantify. I really don't accept that there is an 'institutional' problem with racism in the English game, although you can never rule out the ignorant minority, but I personally believe there is a perception that it exists that to some degree prevents black people from applying for roles.
I've said before that I believe the measure of 'how many black managers are there' is wrong. Fewer black managers have been sacked, is that a valid statistic? Surely if you want to measure racism preventing black managers getting appointed, you need to look at the employers not the employees; that is, how many clubs have employed a black manager? The figure is around a quarter of the 92, and many many more in the amateur game, and is considerably greater when you throw coaches and DoFs into the mix. 25%, interestingly, almost exactly reflects the number of black players in the professional game.
As with many things, you can measure equality in terms of outcome or in terms of opportunity. The latter is a significant measure, because you'd hope the consideration would be 'best person for the job' regardless of their race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, etc. And a fair proportion of clubs have
In the meantime the likes of Campbell and John Barnes continue to damage the credibility of a really important issue. I wouldn't employ either as the manager of my football club, and it's got absolutely nothing to do with the colour of their skin. I wouldn't employ Iain Dowie for the same reason I wouldn't employ John Barnes.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
How long ago was that though? Football has had a complete overhaul since then, and it does seem to be evolving still. You have to look at the amount of black players that were around 20 years ago to see why there isn't a huge influx of black coaches. Over the next 10 years I fully expect to see this change..............IF they actually want to be coaches or managers! Being in the Media seems a lot easier, and more lucrative.
This is the million dollar question, and almost impossible to quantify. I really don't accept that there is an 'institutional' problem with racism in the English game, although you can never rule out the ignorant minority, but I personally believe there is a perception that it exists that to some degree prevents black people from applying for roles.
I've said before that I believe the measure of 'how many black managers are there' is wrong. Fewer black managers have been sacked, is that a valid statistic? Surely if you want to measure racism preventing black managers getting appointed, you need to look at the employers not the employees; that is, how many clubs have employed a black manager? The figure is around a quarter of the 92, and many many more in the amateur game, and is considerably greater when you throw coaches and DoFs into the mix. 25%, interestingly, almost exactly reflects the number of black players in the professional game.
As with many things, you can measure equality in terms of outcome or in terms of opportunity. The latter is a significant measure, because you'd hope the consideration would be 'best person for the job' regardless of their race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, etc. And a fair proportion of clubs have
In the meantime the likes of Campbell and John Barnes continue to damage the credibility of a really important issue. I wouldn't employ either as the manager of my football club, and it's got absolutely nothing to do with the colour of their skin. I wouldn't employ Iain Dowie for the same reason I wouldn't employ John Barnes.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
Can you back up that statement with any evidence?
The percentage of senior black coaches and managers compared to the percentage of black players. You'd expect them to be broadly similar if there were no blocks to there progress.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
Can you back up that statement with any evidence?
The percentage of senior black coaches and managers compared to the percentage of black players. You'd expect them to be broadly similar if there were no blocks to there progress.
and you genuinly think that racism is the only reason for that?
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
Can you back up that statement with any evidence?
The percentage of senior black coaches and managers compared to the percentage of black players. You'd expect them to be broadly similar if there were no blocks to there progress.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
Can you back up that statement with any evidence?
The percentage of senior black coaches and managers compared to the percentage of black players. You'd expect them to be broadly similar if there were no blocks to there progress.
Even if Campbell is an awful choice to be manager of a club that doesn't detract from there being racism within football that stops him and other black candidates from even being considered for a job. I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
Can you back up that statement with any evidence?
The percentage of senior black coaches and managers compared to the percentage of black players. You'd expect them to be broadly similar if there were no blocks to there progress.
Just because you guys don't like what I say it doesn't mean I am wrong. Look at NFL and the effect rooney's rule had. Similar crap was being spouted before that came in.
Just because you guys don't like what I say it doesn't mean I am wrong. Look at NFL and the effect rooney's rule had. Similar crap was being spouted before that came in.
Completely different situation. for a start, the percentage of black NFL players is a lot higher and has been for years. The Rooney Rule was introduced because a lot of those players wanted to stay in the game and their wasn't anywhere near a fair representation of black coaches amongst the 32 teams.
What you are basically saying is that black coaches cant get work because of racist owners/boardrooms. Ok. Who are these qualified black coaches? Where are they being turned down? How many black coaches actually posses a UEFA A or B license?
Its easy to just lay blame and shout racist, when the real problem is why black players aren't staying in the game to take on their badges. If they are now, then expect to see more black managers in the future. If that doesnt happen, then think of introducing the Rooney rule, like in the NFL.
Comments
http://www.itv.com/news/london/2014-10-15/sol-campbells-25-million-chelsea-home-goes-up-for-sale/
Prob a bit like every contract he got.
Hmmm, Pot calling the Kettle
oh
I guess that's why when he was our manager he looked spaced out!
being discussed already there
I can remember when the received wisdom was that black players could only play in attacking positions as they had no tactical awareness. Football is slow to change and there is still a racism in the boardrooms that stops black candidates being considered. The only question really is how long before that goes and an even playing field is created.
I've said before that I believe the measure of 'how many black managers are there' is wrong. Fewer black managers have been sacked, is that a valid statistic? Surely if you want to measure racism preventing black managers getting appointed, you need to look at the employers not the employees; that is, how many clubs have employed a black manager? The figure is around a quarter of the 92, and many many more in the amateur game, and is considerably greater when you throw coaches and DoFs into the mix. 25%, interestingly, almost exactly reflects the number of black players in the professional game.
As with many things, you can measure equality in terms of outcome or in terms of opportunity. The latter is a significant measure, because you'd hope the consideration would be 'best person for the job' regardless of their race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, etc. And a fair proportion of clubs have
In the meantime the likes of Campbell and John Barnes continue to damage the credibility of a really important issue. I wouldn't employ either as the manager of my football club, and it's got absolutely nothing to do with the colour of their skin. I wouldn't employ Iain Dowie for the same reason I wouldn't employ John Barnes.
You'd expect them to be broadly similar if there were no blocks to there progress.
Read what @Its_Hamer_Time posted in response you.
Unless you can provide me with a list of fully qualified black coaches that have been turned down for roles, then you're just making stuff up.
Look at NFL and the effect rooney's rule had. Similar crap was being spouted before that came in.
What you are basically saying is that black coaches cant get work because of racist owners/boardrooms. Ok. Who are these qualified black coaches? Where are they being turned down? How many black coaches actually posses a UEFA A or B license?
Its easy to just lay blame and shout racist, when the real problem is why black players aren't staying in the game to take on their badges. If they are now, then expect to see more black managers in the future. If that doesnt happen, then think of introducing the Rooney rule, like in the NFL.