Probably a lot more than the other 3 have done about it. They are illegal, economic migrants who should have claimed asylum in the first safe country they entered. This is under EU law which is never applied in full because the other countries don't want them. So we end up with them on our doorstep and the people of Calais have to live with the consquences of failed EU policies.
Probably a lot more than the other 3 have done about it. They are illegal, economic migrants who should have claimed asylum in the first safe country they entered. This is under EU law which is never applied in full because the other countries don't want them. So we end up with them on our doorstep and the people of Calais have to live with the consquences of failed EU policies.
OK let's accept that what you say is true (I don't accept it, but never mind). If we leave the EU tomorrow they will still gather at Calais and try to get across. So what will you have achieved?
Why would anyone want to go back to where the trouble started? 5 more years of overspending on welfare again, building up more debt
So which economic indicators has the coalition delivered on its promises on then? Deficit reduction? Growth? Reducing the national debt? Maintaining our AAA credit rating? Increasing exports? Has it significantly reformed the banking sector 7 years after the crash?
I think SHG raises a great point in that those living and working in the South East/London are far from in the ideal position to judge what those of us in the poorer parts of the country are seeing in terms of any supposed recovery. When I walk down my local high street I still see more businesses going than starting up for instance and few people I know feel anything like better off or more economically secure now relative to 2010.
I think the economic recovery can be viewed in a slightly less blinkered way than a stroll down Highcliffe shopping arcade and a chat with a couple of random mates. I'm sure you read your local papers.
The press headlines suggest your anecdotal bias to be a bit wide of the mark for the bigger picture
''Bournemouth beats London as UK's fastest-growing digital economy'' Feb 2015 Britain’s digital economy is booming outside London, with 74pc of digital firms now based beyond the capital, and Bournemouth, Liverpool and Brighton emerging as the industry’s runaway success stories.
Or this from the Echo
Bournemouth one of handful of "cities" driving economy, says report 19th January 2015
BOURNEMOUTH is one of a handful of cities driving economic growth in the UK, according to new research.
Bournemouth is fifth in the table with a 10% growth in jobs between 2004 and 2015. It is also tenth in the table for number of businesses, with 345.5 businesses for every 10,000 people. The proportion of people claiming Job Seekers Allowance is one of the lowest too, at 1.3% - the ninth lowest, according to the study.
My local paper had this article last week
Jaguar Land Rover to invest £450m in Castle Bromwich factory 24 March 2015 Huge investment to turn site into world centre for building aluminium cars
The investment in Castle Bromwich is part of a major push on the Big Cat marque with JLR also putting £400 million into a research and development centre in Coventry.
The new site is set to be built next to the firm’s global headquarters at Whitley, creating another 7,000 to 11,000 jobs indirectly through the supply chain.
Away from manufacturing HSBC moves its UK bank headquarters to Birmingham 24 March 2015 In Birmingham's biggest inward investment deal for a generation, Britain's biggest bank is relocating its UK operation to Arena Central. It comes as a result of new laws over ring-fencing investment arms from the Vickers report into banking.
Bournemouth !!! I'm sure your figures are correct but it's likely to be an anomaly rather than an indicator. Do you have to hand the figures for Skegness or Llandudno ? In any case Bournemouth is a cliche for rich retired so hardly a deprived area in the first place.
As for Birmingham. It's the countries second biggest city. If there was no glimmer of recovery there then we really would be in trouble.
I reiterate my earlier point. I think outside the City, Big business, and the South East in general most people are not feeling what David Cameron is saying. There undoubtedly is a recovery of sorts but it's impacting on very few ordinary workers.
Using the phrase "ordinary workers" is just so patronising. No one is ordinary. And I take it the record numbers of people in employment will not have noticed according to you?
Oh get over yourself. You know exactly what I mean and I wasn't trying to be patronising. To make things clear for you. By "ordinary worker" I mean the man or woman that has a job that isn't secure or particularly well paid and is doing the best they can for themselves and their families. Are they seeing the benefits of this recovery. Fuel bills, food bills, all hugely more expensive in the last five years. Pay frozen or barely increased. Many of the jobs created are zero hour and minimum wage. I don't see much much light at the end of the tunnel and in my humble opinion I think a good many people are like me.
Food price inflation reached a record high in August 2008 13%. - remember who was in power then? It was -3.3% in February this year. Meantime, many businesses made the heroic decision to keep as many workers on as possible (it's one of the reasons productivity is so poor) rather than pay less workers more money - that's the sort of equality a socialist should rejoice in - spreading the pain. Also you are conveniently forgetting that personal allowance increases have taken over 3mn people out of paying income tax altogether and from this weekend further changes will mean that the typical income tax payer is now paying over £700 less tax than they did in 2010. 26mn people are now paying less income tax than they did under the calamitous last regime. Sure that's partially offset by other tax charges but it's still good news and hopefully people will notice.
I'm £1600 a year worse off in during the last five years.
Food has never been more expensive. Gas and electricity prices are still too high and is a scandal. Those two things alone dwarf the income tax changes. Add to that the salary freeze I've been subjected to for the coalition years and the until very recently the theiving price of petrol at the pumps and I'm not sure I can quite view in the same light as "call me Dave" the benefits of his economic plan.
And as for the NHS .. my local hospital in Grimsby is staffed I would estimate by 95% at least local, British people .. the doctors of course are mainly foreigners as are a few nurses .. I have worked short term in another four hospitals in 'the north and midlands' in positions where I was very au fait with staff numbers and names. I would estimate that in these four large NHS Trusts, again 95-96% or at least a VERY large majority of the staff are British. The talk of the NHS being dependant on foreigners is not true in my experience, it may be so in London and other big cities, in smaller towns and cities, in my experience, it is not so, except for doctors who tend to be Asian and increasingly Spanish, Portugese or Greek. This shows to me at least that there is a great need for the UK to start schemes whereby young people can be trained as medics, nurses and scientists and then the NHS in the big population centres will not have to rely on importing staff from every corner (if globes have corners) of the world
Anyone confused about unemployment levels in the UK should refer to this excellent Guardian article. http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/feb/18/uk-unemployment-what-the-economists-say A couple of quotes ''Jeremy Cook, chief economist at currency broker World First Wages are growing at their best level in 3½ years and inflation is at the lowest level on record; consumers are in a very good position and so are the prospects for the UK economy. Real wage increases, currently at the best levels in nearly seven years, represent a silver bullet for the wider UK recovery.''
''Ben Brettell, senior economist, Hargreaves Lansdown Unemployment fell once more to a six-year low of 5.7% in the three months to December, ONS figures released today showed. 30.9m people were in work, an increase of 608,000 from a year earlier.''
Probably all the wrong type of jobs for some, though. Or in the wrong place.
It's an out and out lie for Farage (and those who support him) to claim that nothing can be done about migration from the EU. I've already quoted the Polish Foreign Minister pointing out how easy it is to dissuade the most undesirable types (those that @brogip mentioned, and I have every sympathy with him). Also don't call Poland "a former associate" of the Soviet Union in front of Mr Sikorski. "Occupied territory" would be far more accurate. They are now countries who are pulling themselves up by their bootlaces creating new markets for EU exporters. Unfortunately while I see German companies from Bosch to BMW coining it in the Czech republic, the British seem to mainly export estate agents, although at least M&S have recently started making an effort and its paying off for them -30% growth in food sales. Right now I've got packs of British fruit and veg from named farmers in Kent in my fridge - but I bet they were picked by Romanians because no Brits want to do that kind of work. The fact is that the vast majority of EU citizens who arrive are young well-educated and want to work. They are going to help pay the pensions of the ageing population. That is also a big issue, is it not? I agree that infrastructure and housing supply is a big issue, and some people on CL helped me understand it better. But simplistic populist solutions such as "get out of the EU" are just that, they have unintended consequences and I'm surprised you don't see the dangers of them.
Perhaps you could tell us all what difference it would make to the problems in Calais if we left the EU tomorrow because those desperate people are not EU citizens. Why do you think they are not happy just to stay in France?
One of your more bizarre rants Prague. A touch too much Type 1 anger on show this morning. Happy Easter.
Sorry, let me simplify, and lose the ranting element.
Farage says that there is nothing that can be done to reduce the current high level of EU migration. This is not true. We can easily bring our benefit system into line with those of other EU countries, so that "undesirable" migrants have no more reason to come here than to say Germany.
Farage totally fails to mention that at least half of the current net migration pressure comes from outside the EU. He has no plan to deal with that. Indeed last night he appeared to encourage more, from what he romantically described as the Commonwealth. As we know there are huge assimilation issues (and worse) among communities of ex-Commonwealth countries. This will not be addressed by his main policy, to leave the EU.
That better?
All immigrants, no matter where they're from, will be assessed on the same criteria. No more discrimination towards those not within the EU.
Why should we bring our benefit system into line with other EU countries?
A democratic, sovereign country does things in its own way not the way an unelected foreign official suggests.
Lack of democratic accountability is a major problem with the EU. Your own statement confirms that as you assert ......"We can easily bring our benefit system into line with those of other EU countries, so that "undesirable" migrants have no more reason to come here than to say Germany.".......
Why should we? An elected British Government should be making these decisions.
Probably a lot more than the other 3 have done about it. They are illegal, economic migrants who should have claimed asylum in the first safe country they entered. This is under EU law which is never applied in full because the other countries don't want them. So we end up with them on our doorstep and the people of Calais have to live with the consquences of failed EU policies.
OK let's accept that what you say is true (I don't accept it, but never mind). If we leave the EU tomorrow they will still gather at Calais and try to get across. So what will you have achieved?
Which part of that don't you accept then? It is EU policy that states that they must claim asylum in the first safe country they enter. Italy, Spain, Greece,etc. The problem is created and exacerbated by the EU and the failure of member states to adhere to that policy.
We would be in a much stronger position to deny them entry if we left the EU tomorrow. They would have to stay within the confines of the EU.
They gather at Calais because the UK is in the EU and they are under the illusion that the UK is paved with gold. I think the reality they suffer tells them otherwise. The problem for a lot of them is that they end up stuck here either in detention or being an illegal on the run without papers. Loads of them actually want to go home but they cannot leave the country. This is a problem all over the EU. There are thousands in detention camps across Greece who want to go home but under EU law Greece is not allowed to send them back to their homelands.
Labour has failed! And the chickens are coming home to roost...
Higher up the thread we see a number of comments and graphs on the national debt under Labour and then the coalition. But the massive deficit caused by the 2007-09 crash has not been analysed and isolated as a one off. So Labour are taking the flak for the whole lot because they didn't grasp the nettle around 2012/13 and state clearly and simply:
The banks had to be saved and it cost x of which y should be recoverable. And that the global crash has cost z in lost corporation tax receipts. This is entirely different from the day to day running which Labour looked fairly good at over 13 years when one looks at the growth, the graph and the rise in living standards. This is not to say that Labour in 2003-07 didn't go mad with PFI and certain other decisions. But much of this can be fixed...policies can change.
Because Labour have failed in this presentation, time after time Cameron goes on about the "mess" left behind and how everyone else wants more debt, taxes and waste - neocon gibberish based on a philosophy that all government spending is bad and that somehow the size of government must be reduced. But we don't see that as the headline policy. He has been in government for five years and living standards for the many are frozen or lower than when he started. That is real life failure compared to 1997-2010. Clear as night and day but not made clear by the opposition and it takes Welsh and Scottich nationalists to point out that there is another way!
People attack the competence of Brown and Darling but I saw them leading on the global banking crisis where they helped implement solutions which avoided a repeat of the great depression. I don't see any such leadership in the two main parties today and Cameron in Europe is laughable.
It is populist to blame financial services but they were making a hugely significant contribution to the exchequer through corporation and payroll taxes before the crash. The banking crisis was global and everyone was deregulating so to blame one country / one government doesn't help. If truth be told the Conservatives would have deregulated further. What has the current government done to avoid a repeat?
More importantly what is the future answer to limit the damage of another crash?
I don't know the total paid into Lloyds, RBS and other failed banks but surely with the economy growing and house prices up, all the loans or underlying assets should be in better shape? The US fed have divested of AIG and Lehmans has finally been unwound possibly with a surplus!!! But why is this administration hanging onto RBS and other "nationalised" banks five years after the event? That's five years money tied up and no real tax receipts either!
As for immigration and UKIP...
None of the main numbers and factors in our economy will be materially affected by net immigration of a few hundred thousand. I used to find it ironic that the Tories were restricting one of our leading sectors (universities) with their target driven rhetoric as they pander to the UKIP agenda. But when you juxtapose with the three million plus Syrian refugees in Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon then the whole thing is rediculous, bordering on obscene... Not talking about the conflict itself but the simple fact that globalisation means people will move for economic and other reasons. As many point out immigrants keep this country working and are net contributors to our economy - they come here in the main to create wealth and earn a better living in their chosen area.
And the reason the EU embraced eastern Europe was for stability and to open up new markets. Let us not forget Farage's soundbite in a bye election where he talked of 26 million Romanians and Bulgarians arriving in the UK the following January. On 1 Jan just one Romanian arrived on a flight at Luton looking for work - the rest were returning to jobs and businesses.
And Farage's line on 50% of HIV diagnoses being health tourists should be taken for what it is - a desparate and dirty soundbite to underpin falling ratings. Yes UKIP are down to 14% and it is spread so thinly that their return in MPs will be quite small - partly because of Cameron once again threatening our stability by putting membership of the EU up for a vote... but that's probably another thread.
Pretending we are an economic island simply because we are in the physical sense does not even begin to address the challenges ahead but fair play to Farrage for he is making a healthy living out of it!
Finally the SNP: They promised to uphold the will of the Scottish people. They lost the vote so they change leaders and will be fighting every seat in Scotland on an independence manifesto. Make no mistake they will make every play in Westminster based on their core goal of independence. Milliband will have to be either brave and/or desparate to get into bed with them!
Why would anyone want to go back to where the trouble started? 5 more years of overspending on welfare again, building up more debt
So which economic indicators has the coalition delivered on its promises on then? Deficit reduction? Growth? Reducing the national debt? Maintaining our AAA credit rating? Increasing exports? Has it significantly reformed the banking sector 7 years after the crash?
I think SHG raises a great point in that those living and working in the South East/London are far from in the ideal position to judge what those of us in the poorer parts of the country are seeing in terms of any supposed recovery. When I walk down my local high street I still see more businesses going than starting up for instance and few people I know feel anything like better off or more economically secure now relative to 2010.
I think the economic recovery can be viewed in a slightly less blinkered way than a stroll down Highcliffe shopping arcade and a chat with a couple of random mates. I'm sure you read your local papers.
The press headlines suggest your anecdotal bias to be a bit wide of the mark for the bigger picture
''Bournemouth beats London as UK's fastest-growing digital economy'' Feb 2015 Britain’s digital economy is booming outside London, with 74pc of digital firms now based beyond the capital, and Bournemouth, Liverpool and Brighton emerging as the industry’s runaway success stories.
Or this from the Echo
Bournemouth one of handful of "cities" driving economy, says report 19th January 2015
BOURNEMOUTH is one of a handful of cities driving economic growth in the UK, according to new research.
Bournemouth is fifth in the table with a 10% growth in jobs between 2004 and 2015. It is also tenth in the table for number of businesses, with 345.5 businesses for every 10,000 people. The proportion of people claiming Job Seekers Allowance is one of the lowest too, at 1.3% - the ninth lowest, according to the study.
My local paper had this article last week
Jaguar Land Rover to invest £450m in Castle Bromwich factory 24 March 2015 Huge investment to turn site into world centre for building aluminium cars
The investment in Castle Bromwich is part of a major push on the Big Cat marque with JLR also putting £400 million into a research and development centre in Coventry.
The new site is set to be built next to the firm’s global headquarters at Whitley, creating another 7,000 to 11,000 jobs indirectly through the supply chain.
Away from manufacturing HSBC moves its UK bank headquarters to Birmingham 24 March 2015 In Birmingham's biggest inward investment deal for a generation, Britain's biggest bank is relocating its UK operation to Arena Central. It comes as a result of new laws over ring-fencing investment arms from the Vickers report into banking.
Bournemouth !!! I'm sure your figures are correct but it's likely to be an anomaly rather than an indicator. Do you have to hand the figures for Skegness or Llandudno ? In any case Bournemouth is a cliche for rich retired so hardly a deprived area in the first place.
As for Birmingham. It's the countries second biggest city. If there was no glimmer of recovery there then we really would be in trouble.
I reiterate my earlier point. I think outside the City, Big business, and the South East in general most people are not feeling what David Cameron is saying. There undoubtedly is a recovery of sorts but it's impacting on very few ordinary workers.
Using the phrase "ordinary workers" is just so patronising. No one is ordinary. And I take it the record numbers of people in employment will not have noticed according to you?
Oh get over yourself. You know exactly what I mean and I wasn't trying to be patronising. To make things clear for you. By "ordinary worker" I mean the man or woman that has a job that isn't secure or particularly well paid and is doing the best they can for themselves and their families. Are they seeing the benefits of this recovery. Fuel bills, food bills, all hugely more expensive in the last five years. Pay frozen or barely increased. Many of the jobs created are zero hour and minimum wage. I don't see much much light at the end of the tunnel and in my humble opinion I think a good many people are like me.
Food price inflation reached a record high in August 2008 13%. - remember who was in power then? It was -3.3% in February this year. Meantime, many businesses made the heroic decision to keep as many workers on as possible (it's one of the reasons productivity is so poor) rather than pay less workers more money - that's the sort of equality a socialist should rejoice in - spreading the pain. Also you are conveniently forgetting that personal allowance increases have taken over 3mn people out of paying income tax altogether and from this weekend further changes will mean that the typical income tax payer is now paying over £700 less tax than they did in 2010. 26mn people are now paying less income tax than they did under the calamitous last regime. Sure that's partially offset by other tax charges but it's still good news and hopefully people will notice.
I'm £1600 a year worse off in during the last five years.
Food has never been more expensive. Gas and electricity prices are still too high and is a scandal. Those two things alone dwarf the income tax changes. Add to that the salary freeze I've been subjected to for the coalition years and the until very recently the theiving price of petrol at the pumps and I'm not sure I can quite view in the same light as "call me Dave" the benefits of his economic plan.
And as for the NHS .. my local hospital in Grimsby is staffed I would estimate by 95% at least local, British people .. the doctors of course are mainly foreigners as are a few nurses .. I have worked short term in another four hospitals in 'the north and midlands' in positions where I was very au fait with staff numbers and names. I would estimate that in these four large NHS Trusts, again 95-96% or at least a VERY large majority of the staff are British. The talk of the NHS being dependant on foreigners is not true in my experience, it may be so in London and other big cities, in smaller towns and cities, in my experience, it is not so, except for doctors who tend to be Asian and increasingly Spanish, Portugese or Greek. This shows to me at least that there is a great need for the UK to start schemes whereby young people can be trained as medics, nurses and scientists and then the NHS in the big population centres will not have to rely on importing staff from every corner (if globes have corners) of the world
In your experience maybe. That's not the reality. 11% of all staff and 26% of all doctors.
Although I think the HIV comment was risky in this day and age, I think the point stands. Why are we happy to just pay for anyone's HIV treatment for the rest of their lives if they're not British residents who have paid into the system over an extended period of time?
I think it was SHG or somebody else who pointed out that many european nations cross charge health costs to the country of nationality. The UK doesn't and it should. We should be maxing the system instead of moaning about it. As above, using disease like this is stooping fairly low.
It's an out and out lie for Farage (and those who support him) to claim that nothing can be done about migration from the EU. I've already quoted the Polish Foreign Minister pointing out how easy it is to dissuade the most undesirable types (those that @brogip mentioned, and I have every sympathy with him). Also don't call Poland "a former associate" of the Soviet Union in front of Mr Sikorski. "Occupied territory" would be far more accurate. They are now countries who are pulling themselves up by their bootlaces creating new markets for EU exporters. Unfortunately while I see German companies from Bosch to BMW coining it in the Czech republic, the British seem to mainly export estate agents, although at least M&S have recently started making an effort and its paying off for them -30% growth in food sales. Right now I've got packs of British fruit and veg from named farmers in Kent in my fridge - but I bet they were picked by Romanians because no Brits want to do that kind of work. The fact is that the vast majority of EU citizens who arrive are young well-educated and want to work. They are going to help pay the pensions of the ageing population. That is also a big issue, is it not? I agree that infrastructure and housing supply is a big issue, and some people on CL helped me understand it better. But simplistic populist solutions such as "get out of the EU" are just that, they have unintended consequences and I'm surprised you don't see the dangers of them.
Perhaps you could tell us all what difference it would make to the problems in Calais if we left the EU tomorrow because those desperate people are not EU citizens. Why do you think they are not happy just to stay in France?
One of your more bizarre rants Prague. A touch too much Type 1 anger on show this morning. Happy Easter.
Sorry, let me simplify, and lose the ranting element.
Farage says that there is nothing that can be done to reduce the current high level of EU migration. This is not true. We can easily bring our benefit system into line with those of other EU countries, so that "undesirable" migrants have no more reason to come here than to say Germany.
Farage totally fails to mention that at least half of the current net migration pressure comes from outside the EU. He has no plan to deal with that. Indeed last night he appeared to encourage more, from what he romantically described as the Commonwealth. As we know there are huge assimilation issues (and worse) among communities of ex-Commonwealth countries. This will not be addressed by his main policy, to leave the EU.
That better?
All immigrants, no matter where they're from, will be assessed on the same criteria. No more discrimination towards those not within the EU.
Why should we bring our benefit system into line with other EU countries.
A democratic, sovereign country does things in its own way not the way an unelected foreign official suggests.
Lack of democratic accountability is a major problem with the EU. Your own statement confirms that as you assert ......"We can easily bring our benefit system into line with those of other EU countries, so that "undesirable" migrants have no more reason to come here than to say Germany.".......
Why should we? An elected British Government should be making these decisions.
That's what Farage is saying in essence.
So Len, you think that anyone who tips up from, say, Pakistan, should be entitled to benefits from day one?
The reason why other EU countries don't have such a generous system is not because "Brussels" told them not to do it. It is because they think its stupid to have such a system.
Anyone see the programme on Brits living on the Costa Del Sol the other night. The Spanish complaints about the bloody foreigners ruining their economy, stealing their jobs, not integrating/learning the language and spounging off their health service were almost a replica of the Ukip dogma. One Brit suggested no Spaniards would work the hours he does in his restaurant for the pittance he gets paid. It all sounded very familiar in a mirror image sort of way.
Why would anyone want to go back to where the trouble started? 5 more years of overspending on welfare again, building up more debt
So which economic indicators has the coalition delivered on its promises on then? Deficit reduction? Growth? Reducing the national debt? Maintaining our AAA credit rating? Increasing exports? Has it significantly reformed the banking sector 7 years after the crash?
I think SHG raises a great point in that those living and working in the South East/London are far from in the ideal position to judge what those of us in the poorer parts of the country are seeing in terms of any supposed recovery. When I walk down my local high street I still see more businesses going than starting up for instance and few people I know feel anything like better off or more economically secure now relative to 2010.
I think the economic recovery can be viewed in a slightly less blinkered way than a stroll down Highcliffe shopping arcade and a chat with a couple of random mates. I'm sure you read your local papers.
The press headlines suggest your anecdotal bias to be a bit wide of the mark for the bigger picture
''Bournemouth beats London as UK's fastest-growing digital economy'' Feb 2015 Britain’s digital economy is booming outside London, with 74pc of digital firms now based beyond the capital, and Bournemouth, Liverpool and Brighton emerging as the industry’s runaway success stories.
Or this from the Echo
Bournemouth one of handful of "cities" driving economy, says report 19th January 2015
BOURNEMOUTH is one of a handful of cities driving economic growth in the UK, according to new research.
Bournemouth is fifth in the table with a 10% growth in jobs between 2004 and 2015. It is also tenth in the table for number of businesses, with 345.5 businesses for every 10,000 people. The proportion of people claiming Job Seekers Allowance is one of the lowest too, at 1.3% - the ninth lowest, according to the study.
My local paper had this article last week
Jaguar Land Rover to invest £450m in Castle Bromwich factory 24 March 2015 Huge investment to turn site into world centre for building aluminium cars
The investment in Castle Bromwich is part of a major push on the Big Cat marque with JLR also putting £400 million into a research and development centre in Coventry.
The new site is set to be built next to the firm’s global headquarters at Whitley, creating another 7,000 to 11,000 jobs indirectly through the supply chain.
Away from manufacturing HSBC moves its UK bank headquarters to Birmingham 24 March 2015 In Birmingham's biggest inward investment deal for a generation, Britain's biggest bank is relocating its UK operation to Arena Central. It comes as a result of new laws over ring-fencing investment arms from the Vickers report into banking.
Bournemouth !!! I'm sure your figures are correct but it's likely to be an anomaly rather than an indicator. Do you have to hand the figures for Skegness or Llandudno ? In any case Bournemouth is a cliche for rich retired so hardly a deprived area in the first place.
As for Birmingham. It's the countries second biggest city. If there was no glimmer of recovery there then we really would be in trouble.
I reiterate my earlier point. I think outside the City, Big business, and the South East in general most people are not feeling what David Cameron is saying. There undoubtedly is a recovery of sorts but it's impacting on very few ordinary workers.
humble opinion I think a good many people are like me.
Food price inflation reached a record high in August 2008 13%. - remember who was in power then? It was -3.3% in February this year. Meantime, many businesses made the heroic decision to keep as many workers on as possible (it's one of the reasons productivity is so poor) rather than pay less workers more money - that's the sort of equality a socialist should rejoice in - spreading the pain. Also you are conveniently forgetting that personal allowance increases have taken over 3mn people out of paying income tax altogether and from this weekend further changes will mean that the typical income tax payer is now paying over £700 less tax than they did in 2010. 26mn people are now paying less income tax than they did under the calamitous last regime. Sure that's partially offset by other tax charges but it's still good news and hopefully people will notice.
I'm £1600 a year worse off in during the last five years.
Food has never been more expensive. Gas and electricity prices are still too high and is a scandal. Those two things alone dwarf the income tax changes. Add to that the salary freeze I've been subjected to for the coalition years and the until very recently the theiving price of petrol at the pumps and I'm not sure I can quite view in the same light as "call me Dave" the benefits of his economic plan.
And as for the NHS .. my local hospital in Grimsby is staffed I would estimate by 95% at least local, British people .. the doctors of course are mainly foreigners as are a few nurses .. I have worked short term in another four hospitals in 'the north and midlands' in positions where I was very au fait with staff numbers and names. I would estimate that in these four large NHS Trusts, again 95-96% or at least a VERY large majority of the staff are British. The talk of the NHS being dependant on foreigners is not true in my experience, it may be so in London and other big cities, in smaller towns and cities, in my experience, it is not so, except for doctors who tend to be Asian and increasingly Spanish, Portugese or Greek. This shows to me at least that there is a great need for the UK to start schemes whereby young people can be trained as medics, nurses and scientists and then the NHS in the big population centres will not have to rely on importing staff from every corner (if globes have corners) of the world
In your experience maybe. That's not the reality. 11% of all staff and 26% of all doctors.
My 'experience' is my reality. London has a vey high foreign population, therefore one would expect that there would be a large number of foreign NHS workers .. Also, I made the point that there would be variances across the country .. In this area, an NHS job is regarded as a good job, this might not be the case in more 'prosperous' areas where British youngsters have a wider choice of employment or would rather draw benefits, and immigrants are required to fill the gaps.
Also, what did you make of the 'Which' analysis of grocery prices ?
Probably a lot more than the other 3 have done about it. They are illegal, economic migrants who should have claimed asylum in the first safe country they entered. This is under EU law which is never applied in full because the other countries don't want them. So we end up with them on our doorstep and the people of Calais have to live with the consquences of failed EU policies.
OK let's accept that what you say is true (I don't accept it, but never mind). If we leave the EU tomorrow they will still gather at Calais and try to get across. So what will you have achieved?
Which part of that don't you accept then? It is EU policy that states that they must claim asylum in the first safe country they enter. Italy, Spain, Greece,etc. The problem is created and exacerbated by the EU and the failure of member states to adhere to that policy.
We would be in a much stronger position to deny them entry if we left the EU tomorrow. They would have to stay within the confines of the EU.
They gather at Calais because the UK is in the EU and they are under the illusion that the UK is paved with gold. I think the reality they suffer tells them otherwise. The problem for a lot of them is that they end up stuck here either in detention or being an illegal on the run without papers. Loads of them actually want to go home but they cannot leave the country. This is a problem all over the EU. There are thousands in detention camps across Greece who want to go home but under EU law Greece is not allowed to send them back to their homelands.
So explain this stronger position to me, then. They are not EU citizens. They have no more right of entry now than if we left the EU tomorrow. So what would the stronger position be and how would we enforce it in a way we cannot do now?
I agree they think the UK is paved with gold. That can be fixed without leaving the EU too, as i am trying to explain to @LenGlover
It doesn't matter what I think. The issue is that such matters should be determined by an elected British government and if that elected government wishes to give benefits to different immigrants at different times it should be able to.
If the electorate disapproves of such an act it can remove the Government. It cannot remove a Commisson in Brussels.
By 2020, the author of a new book says, Britain will have spent at least £40bn on its Afghan campaign, enough to recruit over 5,000 police officers or nurses and pay for them throughout their careers. It could fund free tuition for all students in British higher education for 10 years. And that's before we count the cost of deaths and injuries to our armed forces.
Iraq by contrast was a bargain. According to the Ministry of Defence, the total cost of UK military operations in Iraq from 2003 to 2009 was £8.4bn
It doesn't matter what I think. The issue is that such matters should be determined by an elected British government and if that elected government wishes to give benefits to different immigrants at different times it should be able to.
If the electorate disapproves of such an act it can remove the Government. It cannot remove a Commisson in Brussels.
We are a honeypot for economic migrants from outside the EU because of our benefit system. It can be fixed tomorrow, while we remain in the EU. That's what Sikorski was politely pointing out. And if we leave the EU tomorrow we will still be a honeypot for Somalis and so on because our system is more generous than that of the French. This issue has eff all to do with the EU or "sovereignty".
It doesn't matter what I think. The issue is that such matters should be determined by an elected British government and if that elected government wishes to give benefits to different immigrants at different times it should be able to.
If the electorate disapproves of such an act it can remove the Government. It cannot remove a Commisson in Brussels.
We are a honeypot for economic migrants from outside the EU because of our benefit system. It can be fixed tomorrow, while we remain in the EU. That's what Sikorski was politely pointing out. And if we leave the EU tomorrow we will still be a honeypot for Somalis and so on because our system is more generous than that of the French. This issue has eff all to do with the EU or "sovereignty".
Anyway after all this, I'm ready for "Wall....
Sikorski said something to the effect of as long as we don't discriminate.
The point, as I have tried to say above, is who is he to tell an elected British government whether or not it can discriminate?
In the EU we cannot outside the EU we can if we want.
Prague, in case you haven't invested in The Enneagram Made Easy, some passages from
Practical Suggestions and Exercises for a One:
1. Self-Nurturing • Spend some time each day doing some recreational activities you enjoy, for instance, gardening, watching movies, playing a sport, walking, being with friends, or puttering in your workshop. • Give yourself special treats regularly (flowers, sports events, bubble baths, dinner at your favorite restaurant). • Accentuate the importance of humor in your life. Memorize jokes, collect cartoons, watch comedy shows. • Become aware of what you want and learn to ask for it (even for whims). • Avoid the word should. Change the should sentence to “I want to…” or “I don’t want to….” For example, “I should visit Mike” becomes “I want to visit Mike” or “I don’t want to visit Mike.” • Take a class in and practice stress reduction, meditation, or yoga. • Pat yourself on the back for allowing yourself to have one helter-skelter drawer, closet, or room. • Take vacations to get away from work and compulsive doing.
2. Recognizing and Working with Anger • Be aware that you may make sarcastic or cynical remarks when you feel hurt and defensive. • Learn to accept anger as a normal and useful human emotion. • Ask yourself if there is something you haven’t been aware of beneath your anger, such as sadness or disappointment. • Try to realize that expressing anger will not make you unlovable. • If expressing your feelings directly does not seem appropriate, exercise, write, or talk with a friend. • You will become more frustrated and angrier if you pressure yourself and others to live up to unrealistic expectations.
Baron, Renee; Wagele, Elizabeth (2009-08-27). The Enneagram Made Easy (Kindle Location 321). HarperCollins. Kindle Edition.
Prague, in case you haven't invested in The Enneagram Made Easy, some passages from
Practical Suggestions and Exercises for a One:
1. Self-Nurturing • Spend some time each day doing some recreational activities you enjoy, for instance, gardening, watching movies, playing a sport, walking, being with friends, or puttering in your workshop. • Give yourself special treats regularly (flowers, sports events, bubble baths, dinner at your favorite restaurant). • Accentuate the importance of humor in your life. Memorize jokes, collect cartoons, watch comedy shows. • Become aware of what you want and learn to ask for it (even for whims). • Avoid the word should. Change the should sentence to “I want to…” or “I don’t want to….” For example, “I should visit Mike” becomes “I want to visit Mike” or “I don’t want to visit Mike.” • Take a class in and practice stress reduction, meditation, or yoga. • Pat yourself on the back for allowing yourself to have one helter-skelter drawer, closet, or room. • Take vacations to get away from work and compulsive doing.
2. Recognizing and Working with Anger • Be aware that you may make sarcastic or cynical remarks when you feel hurt and defensive. • Learn to accept anger as a normal and useful human emotion. • Ask yourself if there is something you haven’t been aware of beneath your anger, such as sadness or disappointment. • Try to realize that expressing anger will not make you unlovable. • If expressing your feelings directly does not seem appropriate, exercise, write, or talk with a friend. • You will become more frustrated and angrier if you pressure yourself and others to live up to unrealistic expectations.
Baron, Renee; Wagele, Elizabeth (2009-08-27). The Enneagram Made Easy (Kindle Location 321). HarperCollins. Kindle Edition.
Go on, try the bubble bath
You think a bubble bath is the right place to listen to the Wall commentary?
I'm going to get on the exercise bike for the first half. heaven knows how I'll manage the second half.
Anyway, neat way for you to side-step addressing those inconvenient truths. Is that a typical Type 5 (or whichever you are) tactic?
It's an out and out lie for Farage (and those who support him) to claim that nothing can be done about migration from the EU. I've already quoted the Polish Foreign Minister pointing out how easy it is to dissuade the most undesirable types (those that @brogip mentioned, and I have every sympathy with him). Also don't call Poland "a former associate" of the Soviet Union in front of Mr Sikorski. "Occupied territory" would be far more accurate. They are now countries who are pulling themselves up by their bootlaces creating new markets for EU exporters. Unfortunately while I see German companies from Bosch to BMW coining it in the Czech republic, the British seem to mainly export estate agents, although at least M&S have recently started making an effort and its paying off for them -30% growth in food sales. Right now I've got packs of British fruit and veg from named farmers in Kent in my fridge - but I bet they were picked by Romanians because no Brits want to do that kind of work. The fact is that the vast majority of EU citizens who arrive are young well-educated and want to work. They are going to help pay the pensions of the ageing population. That is also a big issue, is it not? I agree that infrastructure and housing supply is a big issue, and some people on CL helped me understand it better. But simplistic populist solutions such as "get out of the EU" are just that, they have unintended consequences and I'm surprised you don't see the dangers of them.
Perhaps you could tell us all what difference it would make to the problems in Calais if we left the EU tomorrow because those desperate people are not EU citizens. Why do you think they are not happy just to stay in France?
One of your more bizarre rants Prague. A touch too much Type 1 anger on show this morning. Happy Easter.
It's an out and out lie for Farage (and those who support him) to claim that nothing can be done about migration from the EU. I've already quoted the Polish Foreign Minister pointing out how easy it is to dissuade the most undesirable types (those that @brogip mentioned, and I have every sympathy with him). Also don't call Poland "a former associate" of the Soviet Union in front of Mr Sikorski. "Occupied territory" would be far more accurate. They are now countries who are pulling themselves up by their bootlaces creating new markets for EU exporters. Unfortunately while I see German companies from Bosch to BMW coining it in the Czech republic, the British seem to mainly export estate agents, although at least M&S have recently started making an effort and its paying off for them -30% growth in food sales. Right now I've got packs of British fruit and veg from named farmers in Kent in my fridge - but I bet they were picked by Romanians because no Brits want to do that kind of work. The fact is that the vast majority of EU citizens who arrive are young well-educated and want to work. They are going to help pay the pensions of the ageing population. That is also a big issue, is it not? I agree that infrastructure and housing supply is a big issue, and some people on CL helped me understand it better. But simplistic populist solutions such as "get out of the EU" are just that, they have unintended consequences and I'm surprised you don't see the dangers of them.
Perhaps you could tell us all what difference it would make to the problems in Calais if we left the EU tomorrow because those desperate people are not EU citizens. Why do you think they are not happy just to stay in France?
One of your more bizarre rants Prague. A touch too much Type 1 anger on show this morning. Happy Easter.
Whats Type 1 anger ?
I think that's the one where you have to inject?
True enough. People with blood sugars up and down, can be cranky.
Good god this is a depressing thread..............I must be definitely missing something. I totally agree with most of what Mr Farage says, maybe it is my age? where I have lived? where I work?.........as people have said it is up to each individual, after all that is what my old Grandad is supposed to have fought for (god bless him) and one other thing I am 100% he would be voting for Ukip as well.
Anyway enough of this.............over to the real action today!!
Prague, in case you haven't invested in The Enneagram Made Easy, some passages from
Practical Suggestions and Exercises for a One:
1. Self-Nurturing • Spend some time each day doing some recreational activities you enjoy, for instance, gardening, watching movies, playing a sport, walking, being with friends, or puttering in your workshop. • Give yourself special treats regularly (flowers, sports events, bubble baths, dinner at your favorite restaurant). • Accentuate the importance of humor in your life. Memorize jokes, collect cartoons, watch comedy shows. • Become aware of what you want and learn to ask for it (even for whims). • Avoid the word should. Change the should sentence to “I want to…” or “I don’t want to….” For example, “I should visit Mike” becomes “I want to visit Mike” or “I don’t want to visit Mike.” • Take a class in and practice stress reduction, meditation, or yoga. • Pat yourself on the back for allowing yourself to have one helter-skelter drawer, closet, or room. • Take vacations to get away from work and compulsive doing.
2. Recognizing and Working with Anger • Be aware that you may make sarcastic or cynical remarks when you feel hurt and defensive. • Learn to accept anger as a normal and useful human emotion. • Ask yourself if there is something you haven’t been aware of beneath your anger, such as sadness or disappointment. • Try to realize that expressing anger will not make you unlovable. • If expressing your feelings directly does not seem appropriate, exercise, write, or talk with a friend. • You will become more frustrated and angrier if you pressure yourself and others to live up to unrealistic expectations.
Baron, Renee; Wagele, Elizabeth (2009-08-27). The Enneagram Made Easy (Kindle Location 321). HarperCollins. Kindle Edition.
Go on, try the bubble bath
You think a bubble bath is the right place to listen to the Wall commentary?
I'm going to get on the exercise bike for the first half. heaven knows how I'll manage the second half.
Anyway, neat way for you to side-step addressing those inconvenient truths. Is that a typical Type 5 (or whichever you are) tactic?
ah, "Truths". As Oscar Fingal O'Flahertie Wills Wilde said: "The truth is rarely pure and never simple.”
I met a guy (called Bob Jope) yesterday who told me that he taught Nigel Farage at Dulwich College and that at the time he was an unashamed fascist who was known for teaching the other kids Hitler Youth songs. He told me he had evidence to substantiate his claims as well and had been interviewed by the media about it. I Googled his name and came across this article -http://www.channel4.com/news/nigel-farage-ukip-letter-school-concerns-racism-fascism - amongst many other things.
Now I don't for a minute think that all UKIP supporters are Fascists and most I imagine would be disgusted by the thought of the Hitler Youth songs but this is what you are voting for. If you are comfortable with that then fine, crack on. I most certainly would not be.
There are many eminent politicians who did repugnant things in their youth. Nelson Mandela for example.
Made me laugh last night how Sturgeon and Milliband (?) Said they would build 200,000 houses every year when net immigration last year was 300,000+
Would that be the 300,000 which meant a net rise in immigration despite the "No ifs, no buts,we will reduce immigration into the tens of thousands by 2015" speech given by Cameroon at the last election?
Labour has failed! And the chickens are coming home to roost...
Higher up the thread we see a number of comments and graphs on the national debt under Labour and then the coalition. But the massive deficit caused by the 2007-09 crash has not been analysed and isolated as a one off. So Labour are taking the flak for the whole lot because they didn't grasp the nettle around 2012/13 and state clearly and simply:
The banks had to be saved and it cost x of which y should be recoverable. And that the global crash has cost z in lost corporation tax receipts. This is entirely different from the day to day running which Labour looked fairly good at over 13 years when one looks at the growth, the graph and the rise in living standards. This is not to say that Labour in 2003-07 didn't go mad with PFI and certain other decisions. But much of this can be fixed...policies can change.
Because Labour have failed in this presentation, time after time Cameron goes on about the "mess" left behind and how everyone else wants more debt, taxes and waste - neocon gibberish based on a philosophy that all government spending is bad and that somehow the size of government must be reduced. But we don't see that as the headline policy. He has been in government for five years and living standards for the many are frozen or lower than when he started. That is real life failure compared to 1997-2010. Clear as night and day but not made clear by the opposition and it takes Welsh and Scottich nationalists to point out that there is another way!
People attack the competence of Brown and Darling but I saw them leading on the global banking crisis where they helped implement solutions which avoided a repeat of the great depression. I don't see any such leadership in the two main parties today and Cameron in Europe is laughable.
It is populist to blame financial services but they were making a hugely significant contribution to the exchequer through corporation and payroll taxes before the crash. The banking crisis was global and everyone was deregulating so to blame one country / one government doesn't help. If truth be told the Conservatives would have deregulated further. What has the current government done to avoid a repeat?
More importantly what is the future answer to limit the damage of another crash?
When Gordon Brown made the BOE independent he took away a monitoring function hitherto carried out by the BOE that measured the gap between m0 and m3, this measure not only enabled them to monitor the risk in the economy but also as licensor of the sector, gave them the ability to control that risk by the actual or threat of removing a institutions license and therefore ability to trade.
Gordon's economic miracle was based upon the over expansion of capital, that would never have taken place before his intervention. That was the single most important factor in the risk the banks carried and the eventual crash. "I have done away with boom and bust economics" said Gordon, yeah of course you have!
Labour has failed! And the chickens are coming home to roost...
Higher up the thread we see a number of comments and graphs on the national debt under Labour and then the coalition. But the massive deficit caused by the 2007-09 crash has not been analysed and isolated as a one off. So Labour are taking the flak for the whole lot because they didn't grasp the nettle around 2012/13 and state clearly and simply:
The banks had to be saved and it cost x of which y should be recoverable. And that the global crash has cost z in lost corporation tax receipts. This is entirely different from the day to day running which Labour looked fairly good at over 13 years when one looks at the growth, the graph and the rise in living standards. This is not to say that Labour in 2003-07 didn't go mad with PFI and certain other decisions. But much of this can be fixed...policies can change.
Because Labour have failed in this presentation, time after time Cameron goes on about the "mess" left behind and how everyone else wants more debt, taxes and waste - neocon gibberish based on a philosophy that all government spending is bad and that somehow the size of government must be reduced. But we don't see that as the headline policy. He has been in government for five years and living standards for the many are frozen or lower than when he started. That is real life failure compared to 1997-2010. Clear as night and day but not made clear by the opposition and it takes Welsh and Scottich nationalists to point out that there is another way!
People attack the competence of Brown and Darling but I saw them leading on the global banking crisis where they helped implement solutions which avoided a repeat of the great depression. I don't see any such leadership in the two main parties today and Cameron in Europe is laughable.
It is populist to blame financial services but they were making a hugely significant contribution to the exchequer through corporation and payroll taxes before the crash. The banking crisis was global and everyone was deregulating so to blame one country / one government doesn't help. If truth be told the Conservatives would have deregulated further. What has the current government done to avoid a repeat?
More importantly what is the future answer to limit the damage of another crash?
When Gordon Brown made the BOE independent he took away a monitoring function hitherto carried out by the BOE that measured the gap between m0 and m3, this measure not only enabled them to monitor the risk in the economy but also as licensor of the sector, gave them the ability to control that risk by the actual or threat of removing a institutions license and therefore ability to trade.
Gordon's economic miracle was based upon the over expansion of capital, that would never have taken place before his intervention. That was the single most important factor in the risk the banks carried and the eventual crash. "I have done away with boom and bust economics" said Gordon, yeah of course you have!
Spot on. The FSA, which (at Brown's instigation) took over bank supervision from The Old Lady, was hopelessly out of its depth and a supervisory catastrophe.
I can see a couple of disasters waiting to happen. The housing crisis, with ever increasing prices fuelling a false sense of wealth, and pensioners blowing their pension savings in the short term, leaving them destitute in the medium to longer term.
Comments
http://www.which.co.uk/home-and-garden/leisure/reviews-ns/best-and-worst-supermarkets/supermarket-prices-compared/
And as for the NHS .. my local hospital in Grimsby is staffed I would estimate by 95% at least local, British people .. the doctors of course are mainly foreigners as are a few nurses ..
I have worked short term in another four hospitals in 'the north and midlands' in positions where I was very au fait with staff numbers and names. I would estimate that in these four large NHS Trusts, again 95-96% or at least a VERY large majority of the staff are British.
The talk of the NHS being dependant on foreigners is not true in my experience, it may be so in London and other big cities, in smaller towns and cities, in my experience, it is not so, except for doctors who tend to be Asian and increasingly Spanish, Portugese or Greek.
This shows to me at least that there is a great need for the UK to start schemes whereby young people can be trained as medics, nurses and scientists and then the NHS in the big population centres will not have to rely on importing staff from every corner (if globes have corners) of the world
http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/feb/18/uk-unemployment-what-the-economists-say
A couple of quotes
''Jeremy Cook, chief economist at currency broker World First
Wages are growing at their best level in 3½ years and inflation is at the lowest level on record; consumers are in a very good position and so are the prospects for the UK economy. Real wage increases, currently at the best levels in nearly seven years, represent a silver bullet for the wider UK recovery.''
''Ben Brettell, senior economist, Hargreaves Lansdown
Unemployment fell once more to a six-year low of 5.7% in the three months to December, ONS figures released today showed. 30.9m people were in work, an increase of 608,000 from a year earlier.''
Probably all the wrong type of jobs for some, though. Or in the wrong place.
A democratic, sovereign country does things in its own way not the way an unelected foreign official suggests.
Lack of democratic accountability is a major problem with the EU. Your own statement confirms that as you assert ......"We can easily bring our benefit system into line with those of other EU countries, so that "undesirable" migrants have no more reason to come here than to say Germany.".......
Why should we? An elected British Government should be making these decisions.
That's what Farage is saying in essence.
Which part of that don't you accept then? It is EU policy that states that they must claim asylum in the first safe country they enter. Italy, Spain, Greece,etc. The problem is created and exacerbated by the EU and the failure of member states to adhere to that policy.
We would be in a much stronger position to deny them entry if we left the EU tomorrow. They would have to stay within the confines of the EU.
They gather at Calais because the UK is in the EU and they are under the illusion that the UK is paved with gold. I think the reality they suffer tells them otherwise. The problem for a lot of them is that they end up stuck here either in detention or being an illegal on the run without papers. Loads of them actually want to go home but they cannot leave the country. This is a problem all over the EU. There are thousands in detention camps across Greece who want to go home but under EU law Greece is not allowed to send them back to their homelands.
Higher up the thread we see a number of comments and graphs on the national debt under Labour and then the coalition. But the massive deficit caused by the 2007-09 crash has not been analysed and isolated as a one off. So Labour are taking the flak for the whole lot because they didn't grasp the nettle around 2012/13 and state clearly and simply:
The banks had to be saved and it cost x of which y should be recoverable. And that the global crash has cost z in lost corporation tax receipts. This is entirely different from the day to day running which Labour looked fairly good at over 13 years when one looks at the growth, the graph and the rise in living standards. This is not to say that Labour in 2003-07 didn't go mad with PFI and certain other decisions. But much of this can be fixed...policies can change.
Because Labour have failed in this presentation, time after time Cameron goes on about the "mess" left behind and how everyone else wants more debt, taxes and waste - neocon gibberish based on a philosophy that all government spending is bad and that somehow the size of government must be reduced. But we don't see that as the headline policy. He has been in government for five years and living standards for the many are frozen or lower than when he started. That is real life failure compared to 1997-2010. Clear as night and day but not made clear by the opposition and it takes Welsh and Scottich nationalists to point out that there is another way!
People attack the competence of Brown and Darling but I saw them leading on the global banking crisis where they helped implement solutions which avoided a repeat of the great depression. I don't see any such leadership in the two main parties today and Cameron in Europe is laughable.
It is populist to blame financial services but they were making a hugely significant contribution to the exchequer through corporation and payroll taxes before the crash. The banking crisis was global and everyone was deregulating so to blame one country / one government doesn't help. If truth be told the Conservatives would have deregulated further. What has the current government done to avoid a repeat?
More importantly what is the future answer to limit the damage of another crash?
I don't know the total paid into Lloyds, RBS and other failed banks but surely with the economy growing and house prices up, all the loans or underlying assets should be in better shape? The US fed have divested of AIG and Lehmans has finally been unwound possibly with a surplus!!! But why is this administration hanging onto RBS and other "nationalised" banks five years after the event? That's five years money tied up and no real tax receipts either!
As for immigration and UKIP...
None of the main numbers and factors in our economy will be materially affected by net immigration of a few hundred thousand. I used to find it ironic that the Tories were restricting one of our leading sectors (universities) with their target driven rhetoric as they pander to the UKIP agenda. But when you juxtapose with the three million plus Syrian refugees in Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon then the whole thing is rediculous, bordering on obscene... Not talking about the conflict itself but the simple fact that globalisation means people will move for economic and other reasons. As many point out immigrants keep this country working and are net contributors to our economy - they come here in the main to create wealth and earn a better living in their chosen area.
And the reason the EU embraced eastern Europe was for stability and to open up new markets. Let us not forget Farage's soundbite in a bye election where he talked of 26 million Romanians and Bulgarians arriving in the UK the following January. On 1 Jan just one Romanian arrived on a flight at Luton looking for work - the rest were returning to jobs and businesses.
And Farage's line on 50% of HIV diagnoses being health tourists should be taken for what it is - a desparate and dirty soundbite to underpin falling ratings. Yes UKIP are down to 14% and it is spread so thinly that their return in MPs will be quite small - partly because of Cameron once again threatening our stability by putting membership of the EU up for a vote... but that's probably another thread.
Pretending we are an economic island simply because we are in the physical sense does not even begin to address the challenges ahead but fair play to Farrage for he is making a healthy living out of it!
Finally the SNP: They promised to uphold the will of the Scottish people. They lost the vote so they change leaders and will be fighting every seat in Scotland on an independence manifesto. Make no mistake they will make every play in Westminster based on their core goal of independence. Milliband will have to be either brave and/or desparate to get into bed with them!
The reason why other EU countries don't have such a generous system is not because "Brussels" told them not to do it. It is because they think its stupid to have such a system.
One Brit suggested no Spaniards would work the hours he does in his restaurant for the pittance he gets paid. It all sounded very familiar in a mirror image sort of way.
I agree they think the UK is paved with gold. That can be fixed without leaving the EU too, as i am trying to explain to @LenGlover
If the electorate disapproves of such an act it can remove the Government. It cannot remove a Commisson in Brussels.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/30/afghanistan-war-cost-britain-37bn-book
By 2020, the author of a new book says, Britain will have spent at least £40bn on its Afghan campaign, enough to recruit over 5,000 police officers or nurses and pay for them throughout their careers. It could fund free tuition for all students in British higher education for 10 years.
And that's before we count the cost of deaths and injuries to our armed forces.
Iraq by contrast was a bargain.
According to the Ministry of Defence, the total cost of UK military operations in Iraq from 2003 to 2009 was £8.4bn
Anyway after all this, I'm ready for "Wall....
The point, as I have tried to say above, is who is he to tell an elected British government whether or not it can discriminate?
In the EU we cannot outside the EU we can if we want.
Practical Suggestions and Exercises for a One:
1. Self-Nurturing
• Spend some time each day doing some recreational activities you enjoy, for instance, gardening, watching movies, playing a sport, walking, being with friends, or puttering in your workshop.
• Give yourself special treats regularly (flowers, sports events, bubble baths, dinner at your favorite restaurant).
• Accentuate the importance of humor in your life. Memorize jokes, collect cartoons, watch comedy shows.
• Become aware of what you want and learn to ask for it (even for whims).
• Avoid the word should. Change the should sentence to “I want to…” or “I don’t want to….” For example, “I should visit Mike” becomes “I want to visit Mike” or “I don’t want to visit Mike.”
• Take a class in and practice stress reduction, meditation, or yoga.
• Pat yourself on the back for allowing yourself to have one helter-skelter drawer, closet, or room.
• Take vacations to get away from work and compulsive doing.
2. Recognizing and Working with Anger
• Be aware that you may make sarcastic or cynical remarks when you feel hurt and defensive.
• Learn to accept anger as a normal and useful human emotion.
• Ask yourself if there is something you haven’t been aware of beneath your anger, such as sadness or disappointment.
• Try to realize that expressing anger will not make you unlovable.
• If expressing your feelings directly does not seem appropriate, exercise, write, or talk with a friend.
• You will become more frustrated and angrier if you pressure yourself and others to live up to unrealistic expectations.
Baron, Renee; Wagele, Elizabeth (2009-08-27). The Enneagram Made Easy (Kindle Location 321). HarperCollins. Kindle Edition.
Go on, try the bubble bath
I'm going to get on the exercise bike for the first half. heaven knows how I'll manage the second half.
Anyway, neat way for you to side-step addressing those inconvenient truths. Is that a typical Type 5 (or whichever you are) tactic?
Anyway enough of this.............over to the real action today!!
COYR...................
Gordon's economic miracle was based upon the over expansion of capital, that would never have taken place before his intervention. That was the single most important factor in the risk the banks carried and the eventual crash. "I have done away with boom and bust economics" said Gordon, yeah of course you have!