To be fair, the NHS saved his life, multiple times, I can see why he's so passionate about it and fair enough he's voting for the candidate in his constituency he believes is best placed to protect it (the headline is rather misleading, it doesn't mention Ed Miliband once as a quote from him). I'm sure that the hundreds of people killed by the incompetence and malpractice that happened as a result of Labour's management of the NHS would probably vote against Labour, but sadly for those people the dead can't vote.
One sided comments like this really undermine the one or two good points you occasionally make.
I'm far from being the only one who feels this way
It might be interesting if someone actually cared to counter anything I or or any of the other dozens of people posting stuff that's critical of Labour/Miliband post instead of just whinging and hurling personal abuse. I do find it hilarious though that some people on here get so upset whenever their favourite political party is criticised, yet they'll happily make up anything about the Tories/LibDems/UKIP and post it like it's a fact.
I've just watched last night's Panorama - Who will win the election ?
American statistician Nate Silver, who apparently called the last USA election correct re every single US State & apparently, always gets these things correct. His prediction -
Conservative 283 Labour 270 SNP 48 Lib Dem 24 DUP 8 UKIP 1 Others 16
His conclusion. To close too call what will happen.
Personally, if I understand it correctly and the present govt, get first dibs. Then the Tories, basically, have to try and get most of the others on their side (obviously SNP will side with Labour).
I can't see that happening & think it's more likely Lib Dems will side with Labour & Labour will form a minority govt.
I thought the Lib Dems said they'd only enter a coalition with the party who held the most seats (hence them not joining Labour in 2010) ?
Interesting from the American analyst but I'd imagine that where there are only two real options as per American Presidential elections it's slightly easier to predict than when you have a dozen or so options which must increase the variables hugely.
No Clegg said that. There is no way Labour would deal with Clegg - It will be Cable or Alexander leading them. What is difficult to predict is the SNP. They can put a spanner in Labour's works but in doing so would help the tories which won't be popular in Scotland. I think Labour and Lib Dems would form a minority government on the numbers above and rely on SNP voting on a vote by vote basis, but not siding with the Conservatives.
Out of the non genuine benefits claimants in this country ie those that are either lazy, on the fiddle, unemployable, on smack, or all of the above, how much as a percentage would vote labour if they bothered to vote?
100%?
Maybe 95%
Doesn't that tell it all?
I'd vote for a NLA/Fiish/DamoNorthStand coalition tomorrow...
That's not a coalition. That's a cabal of Tories
I'm a Tory? I should be told, I've forgot to vote for them my whole life!
It might be interesting if someone actually cared to counter anything I or or any of the other dozens of people posting stuff that's critical of Labour/Miliband post instead of just whinging and hurling personal abuse. I do find it hilarious though that some people on here get so upset whenever their favourite political party is criticised, yet they'll happily make up anything about the Tories/LibDems/UKIP and post it like it's a fact.
I find it hilarious that you think we are still interested in your opinion after weeks of digging out the Labour party to satisfy your own agenda........
Out of the non genuine benefits claimants in this country ie those that are either lazy, on the fiddle, unemployable, on smack, or all of the above, how much as a percentage would vote labour if they bothered to vote?
100%?
Maybe 95%
Doesn't that tell it all?
I'd vote for a NLA/Fiish/DamoNorthStand coalition tomorrow...
That's not a coalition. That's a cabal of Tories
I'm a Tory? I should be told, I've forgot to vote for them my whole life!
Tories not right wing enough for you?
I despise Labour so I must be right-wing? OK then. Has nothing to do that their party is made up almost entirely of discredited charlatans who would be in over their head running a tuck shop, let alone a country. It's amazing the selective reading people have on here that they seem to miss all the posts I made actually stating my political position (Centrist, sympathetic towards LibDems more than anything) or when I criticised the Tories (welfare, environment, housing).
The fact is, the people say 'this is ruining the good points you've made', they're actually saying 'you posted something previously I agreed with, but I disagree with this because it means criticising Labour, so you must be wrong'.
If you go through the posts on here, most of the factual stuff has come from Labour supporters - the arguments on the right are more heresay and telegraph quotes. Difficult to counter Fiiish as all he gives is his opinion. Most of us think it is wrong, but he is entitled to his opinion. The things you can counter are incorrect facts.
Some on here have their only issue seemingly as lazy work shy scroungers. I do not agree that Labour supports or encourages these, but the money the country spends on them compared to other things means that other policies should be looked at too. If you make a decision on just that one thing – the tip of the iceberg, it cannot be an informed decision and it is based on your prejudice rather than grasp of the numbers etc... For instance benefit overpayments due to fraud represent .7% of the welfare budget, where as overpayments due to errors represent 1.3%. You don't get people angry about errors in the same way as fraud.
It might be interesting if someone actually cared to counter anything I or or any of the other dozens of people posting stuff that's critical of Labour/Miliband post instead of just whinging and hurling personal abuse. I do find it hilarious though that some people on here get so upset whenever their favourite political party is criticised, yet they'll happily make up anything about the Tories/LibDems/UKIP and post it like it's a fact.
I find it hilarious that you think we are still interested in your opinion after weeks of digging out the Labour party to satisfy your own agenda........
As someone who reads this thread with absolutely no political allegiance, theres been plenty of 'labour supporters' (ffs that saying creeps me out, how can someone 'support' a political party) that are just as guilty.
It might be interesting if someone actually cared to counter anything I or or any of the other dozens of people posting stuff that's critical of Labour/Miliband post instead of just whinging and hurling personal abuse. I do find it hilarious though that some people on here get so upset whenever their favourite political party is criticised, yet they'll happily make up anything about the Tories/LibDems/UKIP and post it like it's a fact.
I find it hilarious that you think we are still interested in your opinion after weeks of digging out the Labour party to satisfy your own agenda........
Hurling personal abuse at people is a funny way of showing a lack of interest. You could just ignore the post if it disinterests you so much. At least my 'agenda' doesn't revolve solely around trying to shut down/silence opinions that you don't agree with.
It might be interesting if someone actually cared to counter anything I or or any of the other dozens of people posting stuff that's critical of Labour/Miliband post instead of just whinging and hurling personal abuse. I do find it hilarious though that some people on here get so upset whenever their favourite political party is criticised, yet they'll happily make up anything about the Tories/LibDems/UKIP and post it like it's a fact.
People often do and whenever they do you throw a hissy fit accusing them of being 'un informed', claiming that you have a degree in Statistics and don't have the time to educate people on here.
I went through one of your linked articles in detail a while back and showed how it was made up of 90% typical anti Miliband Daily Telegraph spin. So hardly a fact based article supporting your view as you claimed.
On your latest link about the woman who blamed Labour for the treatment her mother received in the NHS, do you not believe that for every woman/family that feels this way there is another woman/family that has had exactly the same experience in the NHS but blames the Tories?
Lets be honest .....running anything , a family , a business , a country is fraught with pressures and dangers. Us humans are an imperfect tribe and we get it wrong as well as right. I think it fair to say that broadly speaking the world is getting better. I know that some will decry this but I believe it is true to say that we are living in one of the least violent and dangerous period of world history.
Both main political parties have mixed success at running as government. All governments make mistakes , all governments waste money , all government do some good stuff. It is in my view not very illuminating to engage in a polemic argument which suggests that one or other of the main parties is absolutely appalling or outstanding. It is however the downside of an adversarial political system. The very design of the House of Commons demonstrates this. I suspect that both of the main parties are relatively similar in terms of their managership of the governmental system. I think who can manage government well, is an important question. But not as important as the question of the values and philosophies of the parties.
On that front I could never vote Conservative. There very name suggests their desire to preserve the status quo particularly on issues of social justice. They are a party , in my view that institutionalises advantage, whilst pretending they want you and I to really succeed. Trickle down economics has abysmally failed and issues of social justice are largely changed by radical dissent and uprising ( see women's votes, ending of slaverery, race issues in the USA, unfair work practices etc
The wealth of the richest grows ever higher. This is at the expense of the hard working poor. In this country and overseas. Capitalism is dead Feudalsim lives.
IF NOTHING CHANGES IN ANOTHER 30 YEARS, THE TOP 1 PERCENT WILL SHARE 36-37 PERCENT OF INCOME, AND THE BOTTOM 50 PERCENT WILL SHARE 6 [PERCENT]. THAT’S NOT A CAPITALIST ECONOMY ANYMORE, THAT’S A FEUDALIST ECONOMY. THIS IS JUST MATH. IT’S VERY SIMPLE MATH. - Billionaire Nick Hanauer
If you believe that the Tories want to really give up their privilege I think you are naive. If you think they are gifted and blessed with super human gifts that enable them to govern in a far more superior way than the Labour Party I think you have been sold a lie ! ( I am not a member of any political party )
On your latest link about the woman who blamed Labour for the treatment her mother received in the NHS, do you not believe that for every woman/family that feels this way there is another woman/family that has had exactly the same experience in the NHS but blames the Tories?
The first part of your post is pretty much complete rubbish so I'm going to ignore it and address this tidbit.
She states in the interview that she called up a Labour MP who put the phone down on her and that she found it disgusting Labour were claiming to be the party of the NHS given their head in the sand attitude to any wrongdoing or malpractice occurring on the watch. Again, I'm not in the business of defending the Tories, just posting some balance that not everyone agrees that Labour are the best custodians of the NHS. Even Labour voters in Wales agree with this woman.
It might be interesting if someone actually cared to counter anything I or or any of the other dozens of people posting stuff that's critical of Labour/Miliband post instead of just whinging and hurling personal abuse. I do find it hilarious though that some people on here get so upset whenever their favourite political party is criticised, yet they'll happily make up anything about the Tories/LibDems/UKIP and post it like it's a fact.
I find it hilarious that you think we are still interested in your opinion after weeks of digging out the Labour party to satisfy your own agenda........
Hurling personal abuse at people is a funny way of showing a lack of interest. You could just ignore the post if it disinterests you so much. At least my 'agenda' doesn't revolve solely around trying to shut down/silence opinions that you don't agree with.
The truth is a bollock ache sometime eh Fiiish. But I don't see it as hurling abuse and if anyone is looking to have a career in politics they will need a thicker skin than that. FWIW some of the things you say make sense, and are agreeable to me, however they are completely outweighed by the constant, constant snipes at Labour, as I have said I have not decided where my X will go yet.
There's also shy Tory syndrome - a proven phenomenon that anywhere up to 3% of respondents to a poll say they're undecided but intend to and will vote Tory on the day.
You do realise that, by definition, that "phenomenon" cannot be "proven", right?
Actually it can be proven in a statistically meaningful way but since you most likely have not even a basic grasp of statistic mathematics I won't waste time explaining it to you. Since I actually have a degree-level understanding of statistic analysis and calculation, I know it isn't impossible to prove this.
This is not pompous, patronising and condescending?
Conservative or Labour - result is the same. Complaints left, right and centre. At the re-election unless the economy dives again, they will keep their seat and Complaints left, right and centre. Eventually another re-election will occur and there will be complaints Llft, right and centre.
You know I'm right when I say no matter who is voted in, tons of people will whinge and whine about it as promises are ignored and targets missed.
noun, plural phenomena [fi-nom-uh-nuh] (Show IPA), or especially for 3, phenomenons.
1.
a fact, occurrence, or circumstance observed or observable: to study the phenomena of nature.
2.
something that is impressive or extraordinary.
3.
a remarkable or exceptional person; prodigy; wonder.
4.
Philosophy. a.an appearance or immediate object of awareness in experience. b. Kantianism. a thing as it appears to and is constructed by the mind, as distinguished from a noumenon, or thing-in-itself.
There's also shy Tory syndrome - a proven phenomenon that anywhere up to 3% of respondents to a poll say they're undecided but intend to and will vote Tory on the day.
You do realise that, by definition, that "phenomenon" cannot be "proven", right?
Actually it can be proven in a statistically meaningful way but since you most likely have not even a basic grasp of statistic mathematics I won't waste time explaining it to you. Since I actually have a degree-level understanding of statistic analysis and calculation, I know it isn't impossible to prove this.
If I could be bothered, I would ask you to explain how it already *had* been proven, as per your initial comment ("a proven phenomenon").
And if you had, I would have politely explained it to you. But you didn't. In fact, you were going to ask but you then decided to override your common sense and post a snarky comment based on your personal feelings towards me.
You continuously expose yourself as a rude, petulant, ignorant troll who contributes little to the thread in the form of polite debate and instead you attack the character of those whose political beliefs differ from yours. It says volumes that the same people who liked your post are the same people who are also prone to posting petulant, fact-free rants when their prejudices are questioned.
I also see little point ever presenting you with citations whenever you demand them, since the last time I fulfilled your request, you threw a tantrum that the citations weren't valid. The thing is that is all you do, whenever someone posts something that doesn't fit your warped view of the world, you cry 'that's untrue' or 'you can't back that up'. You even slandered a fellow poster of being a rape apologist then weaseled your way out of giving him a proper apology. My recommendation to everyone on this thread is if Chizz decides to question the truth of anything you post, ignore him, since he will clearly never accept what you say as the truth even when presented with comprehensive proof.
How can you use the example of one person - the point made is that you can always find individual people who have reason to be unhappy. This is my problem - people make a sweeping statement, you ask for evidence and it is - I haven't got time to look into it but it is. There has been a real weakness in the evidence from the right on this thread. It is just Miliband is a back stabber.
The wealth of the richest grows ever higher. This is at the expense of the hard working poor.
Same old Labour bollox. Why are the poor so hard working in comparison to everyone else?!
Don't assume everyone with wealth was born with a silver spoon in their mouth.
And even if they were, that silver spoon was bought and placed by someone that was very successful and worked hard.
Lots of people work hard from all walks of life. The issue I have with a lot of lefties is this major chip on the shoulder with anyone who has bought success to themselves. It's life - everyone will know someone that has been more financially successful than them. Friend of mine has just bought a house for £2.5m in Virginia Water. My first thought is 'bloody well done pal' not 'oooo I hope Labour get in so he gets hammered with some bolloxy mansion tax'.
GDP figures of only 0.3% growth in Q1 will be a massive blow to the Tories. Positioning yourself as the party to boost the economy doesn't work when the numbers shoot you in the foot a week before the vote.
GDP figures of only 0.3% growth in Q1 will be a massive blow to the Tories. Positioning yourself as the party to boost the economy doesn't work when the numbers shoot you in the foot a week before the vote.
It can be spun both ways regarding the election:
Tories - fragile recovery not the time to change tack. Labour - evidence that the Tory policy is beginning to spring a leak.
The truth is that no politician can reasonably claim that they can control the economy.
The wealth of the richest grows ever higher. This is at the expense of the hard working poor.
Same old Labour bollox. Why are the poor so hard working in comparison to everyone else?!
Don't assume everyone with wealth was born with a silver spoon in their mouth.
And even if they were, that silver spoon was bought and placed by someone that was very successful and worked hard.
Lots of people work hard from all walks of life. The issue I have with a lot of lefties is this major chip on the shoulder with anyone who has bought success to themselves. It's life - everyone will know someone that has been more financially successful than them. Friend of mine has just bought a house for £2.5m in Virginia Water. My first thought is 'bloody well done pal' not 'oooo I hope Labour get in so he gets hammered with some bolloxy mansion tax'.
So to be clear, in your judgement aside from "same old Labour Bollox".....the quote from the Billionaire about the "The top 1% will share 36-37 % of income and the bottom 50 % will share 1% " is just down to good honest hard work.
Comments
http://www.lbc.co.uk/ed-miliband-on-lbc-send-us-your-questions-108533
#Barnsleylife
The fact is, the people say 'this is ruining the good points you've made', they're actually saying 'you posted something previously I agreed with, but I disagree with this because it means criticising Labour, so you must be wrong'.
Some on here have their only issue seemingly as lazy work shy scroungers. I do not agree that Labour supports or encourages these, but the money the country spends on them compared to other things means that other policies should be looked at too. If you make a decision on just that one thing – the tip of the iceberg, it cannot be an informed decision and it is based on your prejudice rather than grasp of the numbers etc... For instance benefit overpayments due to fraud represent .7% of the welfare budget, where as overpayments due to errors represent 1.3%. You don't get people angry about errors in the same way as fraud.
I went through one of your linked articles in detail a while back and showed how it was made up of 90% typical anti Miliband Daily Telegraph spin. So hardly a fact based article supporting your view as you claimed.
On your latest link about the woman who blamed Labour for the treatment her mother received in the NHS, do you not believe that for every woman/family that feels this way there is another woman/family that has had exactly the same experience in the NHS but blames the Tories?
Both main political parties have mixed success at running as government. All governments make mistakes , all governments waste money , all government do some good stuff. It is in my view not very illuminating to engage in a polemic argument which suggests that one or other of the main parties is absolutely appalling or outstanding. It is however the downside of an adversarial political system. The very design of the House of Commons demonstrates this. I suspect that both of the main parties are relatively similar in terms of their managership of the governmental system. I think who can manage government well, is an important question. But not as important as the question of the values and philosophies of the parties.
On that front I could never vote Conservative. There very name suggests their desire to preserve the status quo particularly on issues of social justice. They are a party , in my view that institutionalises advantage, whilst pretending they want you and I to really succeed. Trickle down economics has abysmally failed and issues of social justice are largely changed by radical dissent and uprising ( see women's votes, ending of slaverery, race issues in the USA, unfair work practices etc
The wealth of the richest grows ever higher. This is at the expense of the hard working poor. In this country and overseas. Capitalism is dead Feudalsim lives.
IF NOTHING CHANGES IN ANOTHER 30 YEARS, THE TOP 1 PERCENT WILL SHARE 36-37 PERCENT OF INCOME, AND THE BOTTOM 50 PERCENT WILL SHARE 6 [PERCENT]. THAT’S NOT A CAPITALIST ECONOMY ANYMORE, THAT’S A FEUDALIST ECONOMY. THIS IS JUST MATH. IT’S VERY SIMPLE MATH.
- Billionaire Nick Hanauer
If you believe that the Tories want to really give up their privilege I think you are naive. If you think they are gifted and blessed with super human gifts that enable them to govern in a far more superior way than the Labour Party I think you have been sold a lie ! ( I am not a member of any political party )
She states in the interview that she called up a Labour MP who put the phone down on her and that she found it disgusting Labour were claiming to be the party of the NHS given their head in the sand attitude to any wrongdoing or malpractice occurring on the watch. Again, I'm not in the business of defending the Tories, just posting some balance that not everyone agrees that Labour are the best custodians of the NHS. Even Labour voters in Wales agree with this woman.
FWIW some of the things you say make sense, and are agreeable to me, however they are completely outweighed by the constant, constant snipes at Labour, as I have said I have not decided where my X will go yet.
You know I'm right when I say no matter who is voted in, tons of people will whinge and whine about it as promises are ignored and targets missed.
phe-nom-e-non
[fi-nom-uh-non, -nuh n]
Spell Syllables
Synonyms
Examples
Word Origin
noun, plural phenomena [fi-nom-uh-nuh] (Show IPA), or especially for 3, phenomenons.
1.
a fact, occurrence, or circumstance observed or observable:
to study the phenomena of nature.
2.
something that is impressive or extraordinary.
3.
a remarkable or exceptional person; prodigy; wonder.
4.
Philosophy. a.an appearance or immediate object of awareness in experience.
b. Kantianism. a thing as it appears to and is constructed by the mind, as distinguished from a noumenon, or thing-in-itself.
OK then.
Don't assume everyone with wealth was born with a silver spoon in their mouth.
And even if they were, that silver spoon was bought and placed by someone that was very successful and worked hard.
Lots of people work hard from all walks of life. The issue I have with a lot of lefties is this major chip on the shoulder with anyone who has bought success to themselves. It's life - everyone will know someone that has been more financially successful than them. Friend of mine has just bought a house for £2.5m in Virginia Water. My first thought is 'bloody well done pal' not 'oooo I hope Labour get in so he gets hammered with some bolloxy mansion tax'.
GDP figures of only 0.3% growth in Q1 will be a massive blow to the Tories. Positioning yourself as the party to boost the economy doesn't work when the numbers shoot you in the foot a week before the vote.
Tories - fragile recovery not the time to change tack.
Labour - evidence that the Tory policy is beginning to spring a leak.
The truth is that no politician can reasonably claim that they can control the economy.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/apr/28/ed-miliband-spotted-leaving-russell-brand-london-home
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-32492591
Thank-you for your shrewd and canny insights !