Having to stockpile food will be bad enough for the UK, but is there a realistic chance there could be a medicine shortage as well? Interested to know likelihood of this as I have an uncle going through chemotherapy at the moment.
I’d say pretty much anything is possible. I’d like to think that it won’t come to that, but for once I’d agree with Mr Hunt that the chances are growing day by day.
The most alarming thing is that our politicians still seem unsure of the consequences of a no deal scenario and are actively burying their heads in the sand.
The no deal scenario will not happen. Firstly it would never get through the Commons, and secondly the civil unrest would be unmanageable.
I still believe it will be EEA/EFTA or we stay.
I understand that the Commons has a natural majority against a no-deal scenario. However what worries me, is that like it or not, there is a deadline. One which we imposed. So what happens, and I am genuinely asking a question to which i don't know the answer, if the Govt. says in October we cannot secure a deal, so we leave without one, and the Commons votes against it? Sure they have voted against it, but what have they then told the Govt to do? Go back and continue negotiations? Maybe, but time is running out. The silly mare triggered Article 50. I don't think it is possible to say "oh hang on there's a bit of a delay here,, give us a few more months" is it? I know many EU people would like to facilitate the UK changing its mind, but as we keep being told, it's a rules based organisation. We triggered Article 50, not them. Out means Out. No?
I mean, i really am not sure, and would love to be wrong on this...on the technical point...
Anyone?
Why would the EU27 unanimously agree to extend the deadline and when. The presence of a deadline is forcing the government to move towards a rational position. They are not there yet and it's highly unlikely there will be an October agreement. So the deadline and the threat of No Deal can be leveraged by both Barnier and May to ram through something acceptable to both sides - perhaps in December?
Barnier and May will have a good understanding of their positions - more will become visible later in the year. But whatever evolves will be opposed by the hard Brexiteers as well as by Labour.
The alternative option is for Parliament to revoke Article 50 but that is unlikely at this stage. As the tension ramps up the call for a second referendum may become even more popular. With respect to polls on the desirability of a second referendum, this has gone from an 18 point lead for "no" back in April 2017 to an eight point lead in Q2 2018. And now we have a lead for yes over the last month. Please see this link showing many polls on this and other questions.
This appears to have coincided with more and more issues being played out in the media and discussions within the Tory Party as well as with M.Barnier.
At the same time, Unite support a second referendum "if conditions are right". And the Momentum activist is close to her 4,000 target which might drive a vote within Momentum on this issue BEFORE the Labour Party conference. In other words the landscape is shifting and it's all democratic - perhaps not how Corbyn wants to play things but Labour is far, far more than Corbyn. If he cedes ground on this and the grotesque row about anti-semitism then he might be on the home straight for the next election?
There is an equally powerful argument to state that a second referendum lets May and the Tories out of jail and should therefore be avoided at this time. In other words, better to allow tension to rise and for the May administration to collapse first as the Alt-Right launch a challenge.
So in answer to the question, the UK is being pushed into making a decision. The two possible solutions which avoid "no deal" chaos are revoking article 50 or a BINO option. Neither of these are supported by May nor Corbyn. However the majority of Labour supporters do.
Since there is an outline transition agreement from April 2019 - December 2020 which is effectively the status quo, May and Barnier have one job which is to get an agreement over the line with the basics agreed.
Therefore, it's all a question of who blinks first later in 2018 as the deadline looms.
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
I look at it from the other way round. As things are we are heading for a hard Brexit, if the Tories change their leader we are more likely to have a hard Brexit as the right wing of their party is more strident. If we have an election and the Tories get back in we will have a hard Brexit.
The only chance for a soft or no Brexit is to vote for whoever has the best chance of beating the Tories. We will all have to do some nose holding to do that. I still hold the hope that the sensible members of the Labour party will win out, the evidence is that they have softened their stance, have not ruled out a second referendum and have a policy to remain in something that looks like a Customers Union and a Single Market.
The truth is, as always, that our electoral system stinks.
"Accountability - worst case scenario - everything goes wrong/ UK crashes and burns -how do they pay for what they have done. They being a term they coined when they started using identity as a weapon. "
Listening to convo at a gig was interesting, aggression growing, heard it few times recently, guilty of it myself with a particular local gobshite. I don't take kindly to the language of treachery etc from soft handed perma tanned ex this or that. Ex coppers actually round this way back from there latest holiday pontificating about this place or those people or the scum that live here or there.. Top of my list must be Cameron. Can't help it sadly, got this constant feeling there has to be a public reckoning for what has been caused.
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
"I now think our best hope for survival is to stay inside the serial killer's meat locker"
Brexiteers like Boris, JRM and others arrogantly assume that 100% of the 51.9% voted for a hard or no Brexit, despite them and many of the leavers promising we could leave and stay in Customs Union. Hence leaving without a soft option or stay would be against the will of the people.
This is the obvious point purposely missed by politicians going on about the will of the people. It is pretty safe to say that all those who voted remain would prefer a soft Brexit to a hard one, but it is also clear that a percentage of leavers would have wanted a soft Brexit. Polls since the vote bear this out, and the figures are too large to dismiss that the soft option is the will of the people.
Of course our democratic system is all about ignoring the will of the people so it is the instinct of politicians to totally ignore the preference of those who voted remain as if they don't exist. I'm sure most brexiters, beyond any doubt, wanted a hard brexit but that is only relevant if you are intent on ignoring the will of the people and ignoring everybody else.
The fact is the preference is clearly for a Norway type arrangement, and if you allow for margin of errors in polls, it is pretty clear the difference is too high for this not to be the case. I think this is yet another deceipt from hard leave politicians and this country will be divided for many years to come if a hard Brexit is forced on us!
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
I look at it from the other way round. As things are we are heading for a hard Brexit, if the Tories change their leader we are more likely to have a hard Brexit as the right wing of their party is more strident. If we have an election and the Tories get back in we will have a hard Brexit.
The only chance for a soft or no Brexit is to vote for whoever has the best chance of beating the Tories. We will all have to do some nose holding to do that. I still hold the hope that the sensible members of the Labour party will win out, the evidence is that they have softened their stance, have not ruled out a second referendum and have a policy to remain in something that looks like a Customers Union and a Single Market.
The truth is, as always, that our electoral system stinks.
If there was an election, I could see a non-political business funded organisation campaigning for remain supporting MPs of an any colour, trying to turn the election into a second referendum.
Brexiteers like Boris, JRM and others arrogantly assume that 100% of the 51.9% voted for a hard or no Brexit, despite them and many of the leavers promising we could leave and stay in Customs Union. Hence leaving without a soft option or stay would be against the will of the people.
This is the obvious point purposely missed by politicians going on about the will of the people. It is pretty safe to say that all those who voted remain would prefer a soft Brexit to a hard one, but it is also clear that a percentage of leavers would have wanted a soft Brexit. Polls since the vote bear this out, and the figures are too large to dismiss that the soft option is the will of the people.
Of course our democratic system is all about ignoring the will of the people so it is the instinct of politicians to totally ignore the preference of those who voted remain as if they don't exist. I'm sure most brexiters, beyond any doubt, wanted a hard brexit but that is only relevant if you are intent on ignoring the will of the people and ignoring everybody else.
The fact is the preference is clearly for a Norway type arrangement, and if you allow for margin of errors in polls, it is pretty clear the difference is too high for this not to be the case. I think this is yet another deceipt from hard leave politicians and this country will be divided for many years to come if a hard Brexit is forced on us!
The ballot paper merely asked voters if they wanted to 'Leave the European Union' - there was no discussion of how this was to be done and I don't remember any debate re hard or soft Brexit. I'm assuming voters thought it was a simple process and that all the planning was in place.
Brexiteers like Boris, JRM and others arrogantly assume that 100% of the 51.9% voted for a hard or no Brexit, despite them and many of the leavers promising we could leave and stay in Customs Union. Hence leaving without a soft option or stay would be against the will of the people.
This is the obvious point purposely missed by politicians going on about the will of the people. It is pretty safe to say that all those who voted remain would prefer a soft Brexit to a hard one, but it is also clear that a percentage of leavers would have wanted a soft Brexit. Polls since the vote bear this out, and the figures are too large to dismiss that the soft option is the will of the people.
Of course our democratic system is all about ignoring the will of the people so it is the instinct of politicians to totally ignore the preference of those who voted remain as if they don't exist. I'm sure most brexiters, beyond any doubt, wanted a hard brexit but that is only relevant if you are intent on ignoring the will of the people and ignoring everybody else.
The fact is the preference is clearly for a Norway type arrangement, and if you allow for margin of errors in polls, it is pretty clear the difference is too high for this not to be the case. I think this is yet another deceipt from hard leave politicians and this country will be divided for many years to come if a hard Brexit is forced on us!
The ballot paper merely asked voters if they wanted to 'Leave the European Union' - there was no discussion of how this was to be done and I don't remember any debate re hard or soft Brexit. I'm assuming voters thought it was a simple process and that all the planning was in place.
This is the root of the problem. The 'yes/no' choice was supposed to be so terrifying that they assumed nobody would ever vote for Leave.
If you were asking directions for Brexit, the only answer would be "Well, I wouldn't start from here!"
It was a massive problem and could have been solved with a modicum of planning. Like you said, Cameron didn't believe he would lose so didn't bother to do it properly.`
It was a massive problem and could have been solved with a modicum of planning. Like you said, Cameron didn't believe he would lose so didn't bother to do it properly.`
@seriously_red ( and others). I could be wrong but I am sure I had learned from some expert source or other that we cannot just "revoke" Article 50 ourselves, when we feel like it. apart from anything else, if it were that easy you'd have Viktor Orban invoking it every few months in order to get what he wants. I exaggerate of course, but I believe the principle is like that.
@seriously_red ( and others). I could be wrong but I am sure I had learned from some expert source or other that we cannot just "revoke" Article 50 ourselves, when we feel like it. apart from anything else, if it were that easy you'd have Viktor Orban invoking it every few months in order to get what he wants. I exaggerate of course, but I believe the principle is like that.
I will try to look it up.
My understanding is that Article 50, and the TFEU generally says nothing about the process of revocation, so we would be in uncharted waters (it does, however mention the, Article 49, process for seeking to rejoin).
So, as it is untested in the ECJ/CJEU, legal people can claim all sorts of things up until such a time as a judgement is made.
My own feeling is that it is unlikely that it would allow unilateral revocation by the UK, when the simpler extension of the Article 50 time limit requires unanimity in the EU Council.
@seriously_red ( and others). I could be wrong but I am sure I had learned from some expert source or other that we cannot just "revoke" Article 50 ourselves, when we feel like it. apart from anything else, if it were that easy you'd have Viktor Orban invoking it every few months in order to get what he wants. I exaggerate of course, but I believe the principle is like that.
Lord Kerr who drafted it, says it can. But David Allen Green says there is no specific clause dealing with that, and goes on to take a swipe at how badly it was drafted, by diplomats not lawyers. By whom he presumably means Lord Kerr.
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
Labour has a problem with bigoted cranks in the party but when you find yourself actually saying this, the right-wing media have done a full number on you
I mean, you might not actually be wrong, depending on how people are able to view the relative merits of the major political parties objectively, but...I mean, if Corbyn is done, what are the Tories?
I mean, you might not actually be wrong, depending on how people are able to view the relative merits of the major political parties objectively, but...I mean, if Corbyn is done, what are the Tories?
Better "supported" both overtly and covertly. You kind of alluded it to one of the support bases in your earlier post. Sorry to say...
I mean, you might not actually be wrong, depending on how people are able to view the relative merits of the major political parties objectively, but...I mean, if Corbyn is done, what are the Tories?
I think the majority of people are completely disillusioned with both of the main parties.
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
Labour has a problem with bigoted cranks in the party but when you find yourself actually saying this, the right-wing media have done a full number on you
I have been walking round singing 'oh tommy tommy, tommy tommy tommy tommy robinson' and I did wonder why
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
Labour has a problem with bigoted cranks in the party but when you find yourself actually saying this, the right-wing media have done a full number on you
I have been walking round singing 'oh tommy tommy, tommy tommy tommy tommy robinson' and I did wonder why
I mean, you might not actually be wrong, depending on how people are able to view the relative merits of the major political parties objectively, but...I mean, if Corbyn is done, what are the Tories?
By done I mean I think this whole blow up has harmed his chances of attracting voters that may be on the fence/the type he needs to get into power. I will always vote labour on the basis that they're the only party that can realistically stop the tossers that are the Tory party getting into power, but I think this anti antisemitism will affect those that may swing. I don't know, just musing
I mean, you might not actually be wrong, depending on how people are able to view the relative merits of the major political parties objectively, but...I mean, if Corbyn is done, what are the Tories?
By done I mean I think this whole blow up has harmed his chances of attracting voters that may be on the fence/the type he needs to get into power. I will always vote labour on the basis that they're the only party that can realistically stop the tossers that are the Tory party getting into power, but I think this anti antisemitism will affect those that may swing. I don't know, just musing
The shambles that is the current Labour party are enabling, through their sheer ineptitude, the Tory party to wreck the country. If you are a fan of moderate centre left politics I’m not sure how you could possibly vote Labour in its present guise.
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
Labour has a problem with bigoted cranks in the party but when you find yourself actually saying this, the right-wing media have done a full number on you
I have been walking round singing 'oh tommy tommy, tommy tommy tommy tommy robinson' and I did wonder why
He's been advising Corbyn.
Oddly enough both the EDL and far right parties in Italy (and possibly the Front Nationale in France) are very pro Benjamin Netanyahu and the nation state of Israel. Rather than bringing me any comfort this actually scares me.
1. Is it just a beard to hide/disguise their true selves? 2. Is it fueled by Islamophobia i.e. does it piss off Muslims or is the enemy of my enemy my friend? 3. Is it the end of days/Jews in Jerusalem/God returning scenario beloved by British Christians (Balfour) in the late 19th/early 20th and USA Christians today? 4. Is it just recognition of a nationalist government, like they want to be? 5. Or is it combination of the above?
Whatever it is, it worries me. Perhaps I am paranoid but I feel we/Jews are being used as human shields for Nationalists and recognising the nation state of Israel means there is a convenient place to deport people to in the future. Should the need arise, so to speak.
I am also worried about Jews being used to attack the left, historically it has never ended well for us/Jews we when this has happened.
The first concentration camp was Dachau, originally built soon after Hitler came to power for political enemies of the state who were Communists and Social Democrats. After a while Jewish political enemies were interned there but treated even worse and then other groups like Gypsies, Homosexuals and Jehovah's Witnesses.
So for me the template is to destroy those who are organised and will stand against you then you have a clear run at the real target. I worry this is what is happening.
I mean, you might not actually be wrong, depending on how people are able to view the relative merits of the major political parties objectively, but...I mean, if Corbyn is done, what are the Tories?
By done I mean I think this whole blow up has harmed his chances of attracting voters that may be on the fence/the type he needs to get into power. I will always vote labour on the basis that they're the only party that can realistically stop the tossers that are the Tory party getting into power, but I think this anti antisemitism will affect those that may swing. I don't know, just musing
The shambles that is the current Labour party are enabling, through their sheer ineptitude, the Tory party to wreck the country. If you are a fan of moderate centre left politics I’m not sure how you could possibly vote Labour in its present guise.
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
Labour has a problem with bigoted cranks in the party but when you find yourself actually saying this, the right-wing media have done a full number on you
I have been walking round singing 'oh tommy tommy, tommy tommy tommy tommy robinson' and I did wonder why
He's been advising Corbyn.
Oddly enough both the EDL and far right parties in Italy (and possibly the Front Nationale in France) are very pro Benjamin Netanyahu and the nation state of Israel. Rather than bringing me any comfort this actually scares me.
1. Is it just a beard to hide/disguise their true selves? 2. Is it fueled by Islamophobia i.e. does it piss off Muslims or is the enemy of my enemy my friend? 3. Is it the end of days/Jews in Jerusalem/God returning scenario beloved by British Christians (Balfour) in the late 19th/early 20th and USA Christians today? 4. Is it just recognition of a nationalist government, like they want to be? 5. Or is it combination of the above?
Whatever it is, it worries me. Perhaps I am paranoid but I feel we/Jews are being used as human shields for Nationalists and recognising the nation state of Israel means there is a convenient place to deport people to in the future. Should the need arise, so to speak.
I am also worried about Jews being used to attack the left, historically it has never ended well for us/Jews we when this has happened.
The first concentration camp was Dachau, originally built soon after Hitler came to power for political enemies of the state who were Communists and Social Democrats. After a while Jewish political enemies were interned there but treated even worse and then other groups like Gypsies, Homosexuals and Jehovah's Witnesses.
So for me the template is to destroy those who are organised and will stand against you then you have a clear run at the real target. I worry this is what is happening.
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
Labour has a problem with bigoted cranks in the party but when you find yourself actually saying this, the right-wing media have done a full number on you
I have been walking round singing 'oh tommy tommy, tommy tommy tommy tommy robinson' and I did wonder why
He's been advising Corbyn.
Oddly enough both the EDL and far right parties in Italy (and possibly the Front Nationale in France) are very pro Benjamin Netanyahu and the nation state of Israel. Rather than bringing me any comfort this actually scares me.
1. Is it just a beard to hide/disguise their true selves? 2. Is it fueled by Islamophobia i.e. does it piss off Muslims or is the enemy of my enemy my friend? 3. Is it the end of days/Jews in Jerusalem/God returning scenario beloved by British Christians (Balfour) in the late 19th/early 20th and USA Christians today? 4. Is it just recognition of a nationalist government, like they want to be? 5. Or is it combination of the above?
Whatever it is, it worries me. Perhaps I am paranoid but I feel we/Jews are being used as human shields for Nationalists and recognising the nation state of Israel means there is a convenient place to deport people to in the future. Should the need arise, so to speak.
I am also worried about Jews being used to attack the left, historically it has never ended well for us/Jews we when this has happened.
The first concentration camp was Dachau, originally built soon after Hitler came to power for political enemies of the state who were Communists and Social Democrats. After a while Jewish political enemies were interned there but treated even worse and then other groups like Gypsies, Homosexuals and Jehovah's Witnesses.
So for me the template is to destroy those who are organised and will stand against you then you have a clear run at the real target. I worry this is what is happening.
Trump seems very Pro Israel but I'm assuming he's doing this to get at the Muslims. I'm not really clear what Labour is trying to do....
I mean, you might not actually be wrong, depending on how people are able to view the relative merits of the major political parties objectively, but...I mean, if Corbyn is done, what are the Tories?
By done I mean I think this whole blow up has harmed his chances of attracting voters that may be on the fence/the type he needs to get into power. I will always vote labour on the basis that they're the only party that can realistically stop the tossers that are the Tory party getting into power, but I think this anti antisemitism will affect those that may swing. I don't know, just musing
The shambles that is the current Labour party are enabling, through their sheer ineptitude, the Tory party to wreck the country. If you are a fan of moderate centre left politics I’m not sure how you could possibly vote Labour in its present guise.
Who do you suggest? SNP or the Greens?
I don’t suggest that you vote for anyone, it’s your choice, I just don’t see how anyone who wants a soft (or no Brexit) and who believes in moderate centre left politics could vote Labour when they are led by a man who believes in neither of those things.
Lib Dem, Greens, SNP (although the “N” in that name is an issue for me) all exist but in most constituencies there will also be at least one decent independent candidate.
We’re reaching an interesting phase of Brexit now. Lots of scenarios being suggested and as a staunch remainer I cling to the hope that Brexit is reversed.
However. I’m beginning to think that scenario is now more likely under Teresa May and the conservatives than if she was forced to call a general election as a result of a vote of no confidence as per the posts above and the result meant that Corbyn came to power. Corbyn is a brexiteer. He just hasn’t got the courage to say it. That tells me all I need to know about the man and the reason I can’t vote for him.
i think corbyn's done now after all this anti semitism
Labour has a problem with bigoted cranks in the party but when you find yourself actually saying this, the right-wing media have done a full number on you
I have been walking round singing 'oh tommy tommy, tommy tommy tommy tommy robinson' and I did wonder why
He's been advising Corbyn.
Oddly enough both the EDL and far right parties in Italy (and possibly the Front Nationale in France) are very pro Benjamin Netanyahu and the nation state of Israel. Rather than bringing me any comfort this actually scares me.
1. Is it just a beard to hide/disguise their true selves? 2. Is it fueled by Islamophobia i.e. does it piss off Muslims or is the enemy of my enemy my friend? 3. Is it the end of days/Jews in Jerusalem/God returning scenario beloved by British Christians (Balfour) in the late 19th/early 20th and USA Christians today? 4. Is it just recognition of a nationalist government, like they want to be? 5. Or is it combination of the above?
Whatever it is, it worries me. Perhaps I am paranoid but I feel we/Jews are being used as human shields for Nationalists and recognising the nation state of Israel means there is a convenient place to deport people to in the future. Should the need arise, so to speak.
I am also worried about Jews being used to attack the left, historically it has never ended well for us/Jews we when this has happened.
The first concentration camp was Dachau, originally built soon after Hitler came to power for political enemies of the state who were Communists and Social Democrats. After a while Jewish political enemies were interned there but treated even worse and then other groups like Gypsies, Homosexuals and Jehovah's Witnesses.
So for me the template is to destroy those who are organised and will stand against you then you have a clear run at the real target. I worry this is what is happening.
Comments
Barnier and May will have a good understanding of their positions - more will become visible later in the year. But whatever evolves will be opposed by the hard Brexiteers as well as by Labour.
The alternative option is for Parliament to revoke Article 50 but that is unlikely at this stage. As the tension ramps up the call for a second referendum may become even more popular. With respect to polls on the desirability of a second referendum, this has gone from an 18 point lead for "no" back in April 2017 to an eight point lead in Q2 2018. And now we have a lead for yes over the last month. Please see this link showing many polls on this and other questions.
This appears to have coincided with more and more issues being played out in the media and discussions within the Tory Party as well as with M.Barnier.
At the same time, Unite support a second referendum "if conditions are right". And the Momentum activist is close to her 4,000 target which might drive a vote within Momentum on this issue BEFORE the Labour Party conference. In other words the landscape is shifting and it's all democratic - perhaps not how Corbyn wants to play things but Labour is far, far more than Corbyn. If he cedes ground on this and the grotesque row about anti-semitism then he might be on the home straight for the next election?
There is an equally powerful argument to state that a second referendum lets May and the Tories out of jail and should therefore be avoided at this time. In other words, better to allow tension to rise and for the May administration to collapse first as the Alt-Right launch a challenge.
So in answer to the question, the UK is being pushed into making a decision. The two possible solutions which avoid "no deal" chaos are revoking article 50 or a BINO option. Neither of these are supported by May nor Corbyn. However the majority of Labour supporters do.
Since there is an outline transition agreement from April 2019 - December 2020 which is effectively the status quo, May and Barnier have one job which is to get an agreement over the line with the basics agreed.
Therefore, it's all a question of who blinks first later in 2018 as the deadline looms.
The only chance for a soft or no Brexit is to vote for whoever has the best chance of beating the Tories. We will all have to do some nose holding to do that. I still hold the hope that the sensible members of the Labour party will win out, the evidence is that they have softened their stance, have not ruled out a second referendum and have a policy to remain in something that looks like a Customers Union and a Single Market.
The truth is, as always, that our electoral system stinks.
Listening to convo at a gig was interesting, aggression growing, heard it few times recently, guilty of it myself with a particular local gobshite. I don't take kindly to the language of treachery etc from soft handed perma tanned ex this or that. Ex coppers actually round this way back from there latest holiday pontificating about this place or those people or the scum that live here or there.. Top of my list must be Cameron. Can't help it sadly, got this constant feeling there has to be a public reckoning for what has been caused.
Of course our democratic system is all about ignoring the will of the people so it is the instinct of politicians to totally ignore the preference of those who voted remain as if they don't exist. I'm sure most brexiters, beyond any doubt, wanted a hard brexit but that is only relevant if you are intent on ignoring the will of the people and ignoring everybody else.
The fact is the preference is clearly for a Norway type arrangement, and if you allow for margin of errors in polls, it is pretty clear the difference is too high for this not to be the case. I think this is yet another deceipt from hard leave politicians and this country will be divided for many years to come if a hard Brexit is forced on us!
http://uk.businessinsider.com/norway-style-soft-brexit-most-popular-outcome-among-british-people-opinium-poll-2018-6
If you were asking directions for Brexit, the only answer would be "Well, I wouldn't start from here!"
I will try to look it up.
So, as it is untested in the ECJ/CJEU, legal people can claim all sorts of things up until such a time as a judgement is made.
My own feeling is that it is unlikely that it would allow unilateral revocation by the UK, when the simpler extension of the Article 50 time limit requires unanimity in the EU Council.
https://qz.com/1126174/brexit-can-article-50-be-revoked-the-author-of-the-clause-says-yes-legal-experts-are-unsure/
Lord Kerr who drafted it, says it can. But David Allen Green says there is no specific clause dealing with that, and goes on to take a swipe at how badly it was drafted, by diplomats not lawyers. By whom he presumably means Lord Kerr.
Another nightmare...
1. Is it just a beard to hide/disguise their true selves?
2. Is it fueled by Islamophobia i.e. does it piss off Muslims or is the enemy of my enemy my friend?
3. Is it the end of days/Jews in Jerusalem/God returning scenario beloved by British Christians (Balfour) in the late
19th/early 20th and USA Christians today?
4. Is it just recognition of a nationalist government, like they want to be?
5. Or is it combination of the above?
Whatever it is, it worries me. Perhaps I am paranoid but I feel we/Jews are being used as human shields for Nationalists and recognising the nation state of Israel means there is a convenient place to deport people to in the future. Should the need arise, so to speak.
I am also worried about Jews being used to attack the left, historically it has never ended well for us/Jews we when this has happened.
The first concentration camp was Dachau, originally built soon after Hitler came to power for political enemies of the state who were Communists and Social Democrats. After a while Jewish political enemies were interned there but treated even worse and then other groups like Gypsies, Homosexuals and Jehovah's Witnesses.
So for me the template is to destroy those who are organised and will stand against you then you have a clear run at the real target. I worry this is what is happening.
Lib Dem, Greens, SNP (although the “N” in that name is an issue for me) all exist but in most constituencies there will also be at least one decent independent candidate.