Pseudoscience is one word not two. I bet you even think Psychotherapist is three words.......Psycho the rapist.
Riiiight. Because the key point in SHG's post is the spelling of a word, not the exposition of your 'source' as a bunch of non-independent shills for the vegan 'cause'. Way to deflect the serious with the spurious...
Your second point makes no sense as a statement, and surely can't be considered a 'joke' either, so not sure where you were going with that...
After being vegan for a month he had lost 4kg and brought in his belt by a notch. Along with the fall in his belly fat, his cholesterol also fell by 12%.
This weight loss is a calorie deficit nothing to do with being vegan.
The cholesterol is probably quite a lot to do with being a vegan.
I have highish cholesterol. The GP told me that the largest factor in this is heredity and altering diet only accounts for about 10% - which would be the case here.
My LDL cholesterol is 1.9 so my doctor reluctantly agreed to remove statins from my prescription without finding out why it dropped so much. That was 6 months ago. Last week my doctor had to remove all my other prescription medications (not that I had been taking them) including blood pressure and diabetes medications because my readings had returned to normal. My doctor did not even want to know how I had done this in fact she seemed almost disappointed that I had proved her wrong because she said to me a year ago that is was not possible to reverse diabetes. So by way of eating whole food plant based nutrition I have reversed my diabetes, cholesterol levels and high blood pressure lost over three stone so my BMI is now 21.3, I no longer have spots on my back, hemorrhoid's, bleeding gums, receding hair, joint pain, tiredness, constipation or upset stomachs, cracking finger nails, indigestion, brewers droop, receding gums and have more energy and sleep better. Doctors do not learn about nutrition and are only just slowly beginning to understand that it is far better to treat the cause than the symptoms. All I am trying to do on here is get this message over to you, sure I know I will take a lot of stick on a football forum for trying and I know it will be difficult. Three years ago I would of been one of the people on here doing just that. No way three years ago would I ever of considered giving up meat, eggs and dairy, no way, but I am bloody glad I did. My medical record over the last three years is proof enough for me and all I am trying to do is tell others that you can be much healthier without prescription drugs by changing your diet. It is not about living longer but living a better life free from the ailments that come with age caused by the western diet. I have been asked to do a few talks by diabetes groups about how I have managed to reverse my diabetes and have come up against the same arguments from them as I have on here but some do grasp it and now I can present my medical history to back up what I am trying to say. It was a great feeling going for my dental check last week when asked by the dentist if my drugs had changed.
I'd genuinely sooner eat meat and kick the bucket 10 years prematurely. IF being vegan was ever proven to be more healthy
It's not about you mate, I am sure there are many morally wrong things people would like to do like steal or tax dodge but it harms others around you despite your own gain. It's quite literally damaging the planet, forget health.
This thread seems to have taken a turn for the worse again. Loads of petty digs and looking for arguments rather than a discussion.
Sorry mate, you've completely taken my post out of context, then accused others of having petty digs and looking for arguments.
My post was in line with the direction the thread had gone, regarding the supposed health benefits relating to a vegan diet and claims that it is healthier to be vegan than eating meat.
"This is correct in part, the plant based wholefood diet is proven to be healthier and gives a reduced risk of cholesterol, cancer and heart disease when eaten in a calorie controlled diet than an omnivore diet.
I admit this. I am quite happy to continue to eat some meat."
Many smokers make the same choice.
I don't smoke cheers.
What about the damage done to the farmland by nutrient depletion through excessive farmland forced plant growth?
You might be able to smell at this time of year a rather potent smell... That is the resolution... Muck spreading... guess where the muck is collected from?
YEP the muck is collected from cattle and bulls within the meat industry or dairy farms, chucked into vats, delivered to farms and spread across the farmland to add nutrition back into the soil to grow your next batch of lettuce, beans, soy, grain tomatoes, potatoes, cabbages..... Do I need to go on?
I will...
What do you think about the number of innocent farm living mice, moles, insects and other wildlife that are killed as a direct result of farming the foods for these whole food plant based diets?
Does this make the vegetable and fruit agricultural industries as bad as meat and dairy in terms of numbers of animals killed?
There is no sure fire way to know, however I'd wager that your own industry is not as clean and animal friendly as you'd like to believe whilst admitting too much meat is eaten.
After being vegan for a month he had lost 4kg and brought in his belt by a notch. Along with the fall in his belly fat, his cholesterol also fell by 12%.
This weight loss is a calorie deficit nothing to do with being vegan.
The cholesterol is probably quite a lot to do with being a vegan.
I have highish cholesterol. The GP told me that the largest factor in this is heredity and altering diet only accounts for about 10% - which would be the case here.
My LDL cholesterol is 1.9 so my doctor reluctantly agreed to remove statins from my prescription without finding out why it dropped so much. That was 6 months ago. Last week my doctor had to remove all my other prescription medications (not that I had been taking them) including blood pressure and diabetes medications because my readings had returned to normal. My doctor did not even want to know how I had done this in fact she seemed almost disappointed that I had proved her wrong because she said to me a year ago that is was not possible to reverse diabetes. So by way of eating whole food plant based nutrition I have reversed my diabetes, cholesterol levels and high blood pressure lost over three stone so my BMI is now 21.3, I no longer have spots on my back, hemorrhoid's, bleeding gums, receding hair, joint pain, tiredness, constipation or upset stomachs, cracking finger nails, indigestion, brewers droop, receding gums and have more energy and sleep better. Doctors do not learn about nutrition and are only just slowly beginning to understand that it is far better to treat the cause than the symptoms. All I am trying to do on here is get this message over to you, sure I know I will take a lot of stick on a football forum for trying and I know it will be difficult. Three years ago I would of been one of the people on here doing just that. No way three years ago would I ever of considered giving up meat, eggs and dairy, no way, but I am bloody glad I did. My medical record over the last three years is proof enough for me and all I am trying to do is tell others that you can be much healthier without prescription drugs by changing your diet. It is not about living longer but living a better life free from the ailments that come with age caused by the western diet. I have been asked to do a few talks by diabetes groups about how I have managed to reverse my diabetes and have come up against the same arguments from them as I have on here but some do grasp it and now I can present my medical history to back up what I am trying to say. It was a great feeling going for my dental check last week when asked by the dentist if my drugs had changed.
I'd genuinely sooner eat meat and kick the bucket 10 years prematurely. IF being vegan was ever proven to be more healthy
It's not about you mate, I am sure there are many morally wrong things people would like to do like steal or tax dodge but it harms others around you despite your own gain. It's quite literally damaging the planet, forget health.
This thread seems to have taken a turn for the worse again. Loads of petty digs and looking for arguments rather than a discussion.
I'd genuinely sooner eat meat and kick the bucket 10 years prematurely. IF being vegan was ever proven to be more healthy
It's not about you mate, I am sure there are many morally wrong things people would like to do like steal or tax dodge but it harms others around you despite your own gain. It's quite literally damaging the planet, forget health.
This thread seems to have taken a turn for the worse again. Loads of petty digs and looking for arguments rather than a discussion.
Sorry mate, you've completely taken my post out of context, then accused others of having petty digs and looking for arguments.
My post was in line with the direction the thread had gone, regarding the supposed health benefits relating to a vegan diet and claims that it is healthier to be vegan than eating meat.
You said you would sooner eat meat even if it was to cause a more premature death. I've told you it's not all about you and it's more than a healthy diet so you shouldn't have that mindset is all. Being Vegan is about damage control and prolonging the planet as long as possible for the future generations as well as whatever else has been said.
If I have misunderstood then my bad but it came across as another 'i'll eat all the meat I want' stance rather than a productive point
For enthusiastic meat eaters the word 'vegan' or 'vegetarian' seems to act like a red flag and sends them into attack mode. Ibborg, Leroy and Dazzler to name but three seem to want to destroy anything positive about veganism. Begs the question why? A vegan diet will be perfect for some people but not all. My mum brought me up as a vegetarian from a baby and the social services team in the early 1950's warned her that she would be putting my life at risk unless she fed me meat/fish. Bonkers actually and very ignorant but this was the establishment line! Vegetarians were derided as 'cranks.' I never try to convert my buddies even when they suffer from gout and diabetes and am always genuinely surprised when they like my food because I know that they generally enjoy rich foods. Mind you they will snipe at me if they catch me wearing leather shoes! From my time supporting the vegan society I know that there are many reasons for becoming a vegan. Mine is compassion for the creatures but for others it is for health or environmental issues. People get very passionate about it. It reminds me that the most vehement anti-smokers are usually ex smokers themselves! Anyhow, for what it's worth I am a healthy guy in my late 60's. Is it my vegan/veggie diet or DNA or something else? I don't know and don't really care but I am pleased that I have not caused any living creature to be sacrificed for my diet/taste buds.
For enthusiastic meat eaters the word 'vegan' or 'vegetarian' seems to act like a red flag and sends them into attack mode. Ibborg, Leroy and Dazzler to name but three seem to want to destroy anything positive about veganism.
This is correct in part, the plant based wholefood diet is *allegedly* proven to be healthier and is proven to reduce risks of cholesterol, cancer and heart disease when eaten in a calorie controlled diet more than an omnivore diet.
I admit this. I am quite happy to continue to eat some meat.
There's a shit ton of positivity to come out of veganism and vegetarianism but it is the holier than thou posturing of the likes of @Stevelamb that pisses me and other posters off.
Eat Vegan if you like, but don't be preachy about it.
I don't want you to eat meat if you don't believe in it, so why should I have to not eat meat because you believe in it.
If veganism continues to grow it will force a reduction of meat availability.
If one day I have to go vegan because meat and dairy are no longer available, then fine.
However until that day I will continue to live how humanity has for thousands of years. As an omnivore.
BTW I am disgusted by this new Carnivore diet sweeping the world... Championed by Jordan Pieterson and his family... That is gluttony and greed. We need vegetables and plant based foods in our diet.
The OP is almost the exact reason people have stereotypes, preconceptions and even hatred for vegans. And he doesn’t even seem to see the irony. Why hasn’t he been banned yet?
Pseudoscience is one word not two. I bet you even think Psychotherapist is three words.......Psycho the rapist.
Riiiight. Because the key point in SHG's post is the spelling of a word, not the exposition of your 'source' as a bunch of non-independent shills for the vegan 'cause'. Way to deflect the serious with the spurious...
Your second point makes no sense as a statement, and surely can't be considered a 'joke' either, so not sure where you were going with that...
I'm pretty sure that it was a joke when it was on the Benny Hill show. Perhaps it can now be categorised under, 'things that some people might have found funny in the 70s'.
Waitrose becomes the latest supermarket to commit to vegan labelling. It is in the process of introducing clear vegan labelling for its own-brand products.
'When veganism is presented as something that is normal, those who may be a little sceptical are more inclined to give it a try.’
Waitrose becomes the latest supermarket to commit to vegan labelling. It is in the process of introducing clear vegan labelling for its own-brand products.
'When veganism is presented as something that is normal, those who may be a little sceptical are more inclined to give it a try.’
Waitrose becomes the latest supermarket to commit to vegan labelling. It is in the process of introducing clear vegan labelling for its own-brand products.
'When veganism is presented as something that is normal, those who may be a little sceptical are more inclined to give it a try.’
Welcome this. Why not. Information is always a good thing. I do doubt that having information on a packet is more likely to encourage anyone to have a try though.
Waitrose becomes the latest supermarket to commit to vegan labelling. It is in the process of introducing clear vegan labelling for its own-brand products.
'When veganism is presented as something that is normal, those who may be a little sceptical are more inclined to give it a try.’
Welcome this. Why not. Information is always a good thing. I do doubt that having information on a packet is more likely to encourage anyone to have a try though.
Yeah I don't think... "Hmm I'm gonna try this dish because it says vegetarian" as it is. I don't think I'll change based on labelling tbh. If I fancy a vegetarian or vegan meal, generally I'll just get on with it and I won't even tell people...
I haven't looked at this thread for ages. it is everything that CL should be. Bonkers, provocative bonkers, reactive bonkers and some more digressive bonkers for those who feel the bonkers isn't bonkers enough for them. Then put on repeat.
If vegans are against all use of animals I assume they are against having pets? If not, how is that different to using donkeys down a mine?
I’ve sent one of my cats up the chimney to retrieve a pigeon that had got stuck once but only cos next door wouldn’t lend me their three year old child. Usually he just sleeps on my bed.
If vegans are against all use of animals I assume they are against having pets? If not, how is that different to using donkeys down a mine?
I’ve sent one of my cats up the chimney to retrieve a pigeon that had got stuck once but only cos next door wouldn’t lend me their three year old child. Usually he just sleeps on my bed.
I haven't looked at this thread for ages. it is everything that CL should be. Bonkers, provocative bonkers, reactive bonkers and some more digressive bonkers for those who feel the bonkers isn't bonkers enough for them. Then put on repeat.
If vegans are against all use of animals I assume they are against having pets? If not, how is that different to using donkeys down a mine?
I’ve sent one of my cats up the chimney to retrieve a pigeon that had got stuck once but only cos next door wouldn’t lend me their three year old child. Usually he just sleeps on my bed.
Next door's three year old sleeps on your bed??
Little bastard keeps sneaking in. I’ve put spikes on top of my fence to try and stop him getting in that way and sprayed copious amounts of lion piss around (thanks CL for the tips) but nothing seems to deter the bugger.
If vegans are against all use of animals I assume they are against having pets? If not, how is that different to using donkeys down a mine?
I’ve sent one of my cats up the chimney to retrieve a pigeon that had got stuck once but only cos next door wouldn’t lend me their three year old child. Usually he just sleeps on my bed.
Next door's three year old sleeps on your bed??
Little bastard keeps sneaking in. I’ve put spikes on top of my fence to try and stop him getting in that way and sprayed copious amounts of lion piss around (thanks CL for the tips) but nothing seems to deter the bugger.
If vegans are against all use of animals I assume they are against having pets? If not, how is that different to using donkeys down a mine?
I’ve sent one of my cats up the chimney to retrieve a pigeon that had got stuck once but only cos next door wouldn’t lend me their three year old child. Usually he just sleeps on my bed.
Next door's three year old sleeps on your bed??
Little bastard keeps sneaking in. I’ve put spikes on top of my fence to try and stop him getting in that way and sprayed copious amounts of lion piss around (thanks CL for the tips) but nothing seems to deter the bugger.
Offer him a trip to The Valley.
Nah, you'd have the bloody NSPCC on your back. Bloody nanny state.
If vegans are against all use of animals I assume they are against having pets? If not, how is that different to using donkeys down a mine?
I’ve sent one of my cats up the chimney to retrieve a pigeon that had got stuck once but only cos next door wouldn’t lend me their three year old child. Usually he just sleeps on my bed.
Next door's three year old sleeps on your bed??
Little bastard keeps sneaking in. I’ve put spikes on top of my fence to try and stop him getting in that way and sprayed copious amounts of lion piss around (thanks CL for the tips) but nothing seems to deter the bugger.
Have you tried talking at him about being a vegan?
Comments
Your second point makes no sense as a statement, and surely can't be considered a 'joke' either, so not sure where you were going with that...
My post was in line with the direction the thread had gone, regarding the supposed health benefits relating to a vegan diet and claims that it is healthier to be vegan than eating meat.
What about the damage done to the farmland by nutrient depletion through excessive farmland forced plant growth?
You might be able to smell at this time of year a rather potent smell... That is the resolution... Muck spreading... guess where the muck is collected from?
YEP the muck is collected from cattle and bulls within the meat industry or dairy farms, chucked into vats, delivered to farms and spread across the farmland to add nutrition back into the soil to grow your next batch of lettuce, beans, soy, grain tomatoes, potatoes, cabbages..... Do I need to go on?
I will...
What do you think about the number of innocent farm living mice, moles, insects and other wildlife that are killed as a direct result of farming the foods for these whole food plant based diets?
Does this make the vegetable and fruit agricultural industries as bad as meat and dairy in terms of numbers of animals killed?
There is no sure fire way to know, however I'd wager that your own industry is not as clean and animal friendly as you'd like to believe whilst admitting too much meat is eaten.
Things you learn.
Sadly, “this” to your second paragraph.
If I have misunderstood then my bad but it came across as another 'i'll eat all the meat I want' stance rather than a productive point
I never try to convert my buddies even when they suffer from gout and diabetes and am always genuinely surprised when they like my food because I know that they generally enjoy rich foods. Mind you they will snipe at me if they catch me wearing leather shoes!
From my time supporting the vegan society I know that there are many reasons for becoming a vegan. Mine is compassion for the creatures but for others it is for health or environmental issues. People get very passionate about it. It reminds me that the most vehement anti-smokers are usually ex smokers themselves!
Anyhow, for what it's worth I am a healthy guy in my late 60's. Is it my vegan/veggie diet or DNA or something else? I don't know and don't really care but I am pleased that I have not caused any living creature to be sacrificed for my diet/taste buds.
Eat Vegan if you like, but don't be preachy about it.
I don't want you to eat meat if you don't believe in it, so why should I have to not eat meat because you believe in it.
If veganism continues to grow it will force a reduction of meat availability.
If one day I have to go vegan because meat and dairy are no longer available, then fine.
However until that day I will continue to live how humanity has for thousands of years. As an omnivore.
BTW I am disgusted by this new Carnivore diet sweeping the world... Championed by Jordan Pieterson and his family... That is gluttony and greed. We need vegetables and plant based foods in our diet.
To remove them completely is madness.
Would we be alive were it not for horses bringing up coal and essential minerals?
Oxen and horses for travel, ploughing the land to grow our food? (yes, even vegetables).
Still if we never used animals for our survival, there would be far less bullshit on this thread, I suppose. The CIA, and many others would disagree slightly with South Korea, but the general point stands.
Monaco
Japan are generally the top 2.
As put to Steve previously, and he continues to swerve the facts, preferring anecdotal 'evidence'
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2102rank.html
It is in the process of introducing clear vegan labelling for its own-brand products.
'When veganism is presented as something that is normal, those who may be a little sceptical are more inclined to give it a try.’
I’ve sent one of my cats up the chimney to retrieve a pigeon that had got stuck once but only cos next door wouldn’t lend me their three year old child. Usually he just sleeps on my bed.
Little bastard keeps sneaking in. I’ve put spikes on top of my fence to try and stop him getting in that way and sprayed copious amounts of lion piss around (thanks CL for the tips) but nothing seems to deter the bugger.