I can't say I've seen anyone recently saying Clare isn't good enough. But most people recognise that he had a poor game on Saturday.
Clare isn't good enough at the job we signed him for. The fact he is good enough at something else is a very happy happenstance.
Clare hasn't played the role we signed him for since Adkins left. Think he needs to be given that chance. I think that his future still lies in the midfield with Lavelle coming back into the rcb when he is fit
I can't say I've seen anyone recently saying Clare isn't good enough. But most people recognise that he had a poor game on Saturday.
Clare isn't good enough at the job we signed him for. The fact he is good enough at something else is a very happy happenstance.
Clare hasn't played the role we signed him for since Adkins left. Think he needs to be given that chance. I think that his future still lies in the midfield with Lavelle coming back into the rcb when he is fit
He was in the main, poor under Adkins, its no coincidence that Oxford play the system we tried to play and they thought he wasn't good enough either and was more effective elsewhere. Either right back or Burton in that case.
I can't say I've seen anyone recently saying Clare isn't good enough. But most people recognise that he had a poor game on Saturday.
Clare isn't good enough at the job we signed him for. The fact he is good enough at something else is a very happy happenstance.
Clare hasn't played the role we signed him for since Adkins left. Think he needs to be given that chance. I think that his future still lies in the midfield with Lavelle coming back into the rcb when he is fit
He was in the main, poor under Adkins, its no coincidence that Oxford play the system we tried to play and they thought he wasn't good enough either and was more effective elsewhere. Either right back or Burton in that case.
Maybe, but he hasn’t had much of a chance at CM. Dobson also started his Charlton career poorly and both were written off.
I can't say I've seen anyone recently saying Clare isn't good enough. But most people recognise that he had a poor game on Saturday.
Clare isn't good enough at the job we signed him for. The fact he is good enough at something else is a very happy happenstance.
Clare hasn't played the role we signed him for since Adkins left. Think he needs to be given that chance. I think that his future still lies in the midfield with Lavelle coming back into the rcb when he is fit
He was in the main, poor under Adkins, its no coincidence that Oxford play the system we tried to play and they thought he wasn't good enough either and was more effective elsewhere. Either right back or Burton in that case.
I think he was too quickly written off. I think he has shown in his energetic displays since Jackson has taken over that he has the ability to play further forward. I would quite like to see him in the rwb role to be fair, but I don't know how good a crosser of the ball he is. Either way, I like him and think he has a future here. I'm sadly not so optimistic the same can be said for Albie.
Morgan actually can ping a ball (accuracy not the greatest) but I can’t remember the last time we or anyone had a decent potshots on goal , where the goalie may fumble it push it back in to play and give us a chance a bit like Hendo has done for the oppo recently … no one has got the balls and the ability to have a shot they’d rather crab it to you to yo to you … fucking shit and that’s why we’re 14th in league one and looking utter crap , athletes with limited ability or just limited liability . Morgan looked at the better end of our sea of shit on Saturday whooopee , load of crap , worst ever performing Charlton team …
Cannot get my head around the negativity towards him on here. Yes, he's inconsistent but he is also one of the few creative players we have. Has good vision, can pass, can cross and he's one of our own. I honestly don't get it.
He was playing the Championship at 19 and now some say he's a League 2 player??? How? He was one of our better players yesterday, but we should get rid..? Mystified.
I think that was more to do with a transfer embargo and a lengthy injury list rather than his actual ability.
Oshilaja, Pratley, Lapslie, Dempsey, Vennings, Davison and Davis all made championship appearances for us that season, doesn't mean they're good enough now. If we aspire to get out of this league (via promotion not relegation) then Morgan simply isn't of a good enough level.
Morgan just doesn’t have the natural ability needed at L1 level, let alone anything higher. He has been given ample opportunity but has failed each time. He was given the no 10 shirt by Adkins but failed. I can understand people wanting him to do well because ‘he’s one of our own’ but he has proven time and time again he just doesn’t have what it takes. Time to move on from Albie I’m afraid. He won’t help us move up the league(s).
If it was a kid that had 10-20 appearances off the bench I would agree with you. The guy has been given multiple opportunities to shine and improve and he never takes a single one. He regresses constantly when given a run of games, what is the point for the 6th time? It ain't working for him here.
Cannot get my head around the negativity towards him on here. Yes, he's inconsistent but he is also one of the few creative players we have. Has good vision, can pass, can cross and he's one of our own. I honestly don't get it.
He was playing the Championship at 19 and now some say he's a League 2 player??? How? He was one of our better players yesterday, but we should get rid..? Mystified.
He played championship football because we were under an embargo and couldn't sign anyone else. Didn't we have Davison, Vennings And Henry on against WBA in the champ too? Doesn't mean they're all championship level players.
If it was a kid that had 10-20 appearances off the bench I would agree with you. The guy has been given multiple opportunities to shine and improve and he never takes a single one. He regresses constantly when given a run of games, what is the point for the 6th time? It ain't working for him here.
because we have no one else and Lee and Gilbey look shattered week in, week out on 60 minutes.
I'd rather we got in that other attacking midfield player that Jacko declared he needs, but until then why not use him when the others tire?
Cannot get my head around the negativity towards him on here. Yes, he's inconsistent but he is also one of the few creative players we have. Has good vision, can pass, can cross and he's one of our own. I honestly don't get it.
He was playing the Championship at 19 and now some say he's a League 2 player??? How? He was one of our better players yesterday, but we should get rid..? Mystified.
He played championship football because we were under an embargo and couldn't sign anyone else. Didn't we have Davison, Vennings And Henry on against WBA in the champ too? Doesn't mean they're all championship level players.
Edit: I see Chris has already made this point
The difference between Morgan playing in the Championship compared with the others mentioned, is the fact that Albie played a bit part role in League One. He had a decent run of games at the season, which deservedly earnt him a starting place in the Play-Off semi-finals.
It was a dead rubber, but Albie's pass to Taylor for one of the goals against Rochdale (which helped us finish 3rd) was one of those moments where Albie has shown his potential - Frustratingly he hasnt shown it enough.
By the time we got to the Championship; Albie was a squad player, rather than a green U23 thrown in out of desperation.
He was even involved against Blackburn on the opening day - Seem to recall him (and many others) disappointing against Forest Green, which resulted in others coming in on loan, and him going out on loan to Ebbsfleet. He then came back into the fold around November time initially because of the injury crisis.
If it was a kid that had 10-20 appearances off the bench I would agree with you. The guy has been given multiple opportunities to shine and improve and he never takes a single one. He regresses constantly when given a run of games, what is the point for the 6th time? It ain't working for him here.
because we have no one else and Lee and Gilbey look shattered week in, week out on 60 minutes.
I'd rather we got in that other attacking midfield player that Jacko declared he needs, but until then why not use him when the others tire?
Despite being 21, he’s in negative credit with a lot of the fan base and as a result won’t be judged the same as other poor performers.
Notice how certain fans are dismissive when he does something well, but are often the first to pipe up when he makes a mistake.
He probably won’t go on to be a success here, but bloody hell do some people need to get off his back and let the lad play football. If he’s good enough he’ll make it, if he’s not he won’t - nobody needs the snide remarks waiting for him to fail.
Despite being 21, he’s in negative credit with a lot of the fan base and as a result won’t be judged the same as other poor performers.
Notice how certain fans are dismissive when he does something well, but are often the first to pipe up when he makes a mistake.
He probably won’t go on to be a success here, but bloody hell do some people need to get off his back and let the lad play football. If he’s good enough he’ll make it, if he’s not he won’t - nobody needs the snide remarks waiting for him to fail.
He's had a hundred games. He's been involved in four distinct seasons. Who have our fans given that long with such little return? I'd say he gets judged a HELL of a lot more charitably than other poor performers!
Despite being 21, he’s in negative credit with a lot of the fan base and as a result won’t be judged the same as other poor performers.
Notice how certain fans are dismissive when he does something well, but are often the first to pipe up when he makes a mistake.
He probably won’t go on to be a success here, but bloody hell do some people need to get off his back and let the lad play football. If he’s good enough he’ll make it, if he’s not he won’t - nobody needs the snide remarks waiting for him to fail.
He's had a hundred games. He's been involved in four distinct seasons. Who have our fans given that long with such little return? I'd say he gets judged a HELL of a lot more charitably than other poor performers!
I’m not saying you should set up a fan page for him, but the next time someone comes on here and says “thought he played well today”, I hope the usual suspects try and sleep on it before they take us round the merry-go-round of why he’s shit and always will be.
Also. Our formation? Where we only have one wide player on each side (and they end up being 'ineffectual' whenever the opposition can put two men on them)? Yeah, that's to allow the midfield to play a little more. With three of them in there, of course they have more space, and of course they can look to drive forward and make play. Gilbey has made a Charlton career out of driving forward with the ball (usually down a blind alley but I digress). Morgan was, apparently, able to do likewise a few times.
Did he create anything?
Did we win the midfield battle?
I'm aware this line of thinking opens up Lee to similar criticism, but I find him to be a much cleverer footballer who generally makes much better decisions. And he hasn't had four seasons to prove otherwise.
Also. Our formation? Where we only have one wide player on each side (and they end up being 'ineffectual' whenever the opposition can put two men on them)? Yeah, that's to allow the midfield to play a little more. With three of them in there, of course they have more space, and of course they can look to drive forward and make play. Gilbey has made a Charlton career out of driving forward with the ball (usually down a blind alley but I digress). Morgan was, apparently, able to do likewise a few times.
Did he create anything?
Did we win the midfield battle?
I'm aware this line of thinking opens up Lee to similar criticism, but I find him to be a much cleverer footballer who generally makes much better decisions. And he hasn't had four seasons to prove otherwise.
Put in a damned good corner that Inniss scored from (looking at the images on the Post Match Thread) - You're right though, and am not being sarcastic, its nothing to shout home about but for the last few games we've been crying out for someone to put in a decent cross / set-piece
Lee and Jaiyesimi could learn something from that.
Their own threads are no where to be seen picking apart their performances though are there?
He's always had a decent set-piece. When we scored at MK Dons earlier this season it was from a peachy Morgan delivery. For the remainder of the game he gave an exhibition of complete midfield inadequacy in the face of Twine and chums.
The best Morgan displays I've seen for us have been when he's sat deeper and sprayed passes to wide players to get attacks going. Dobson does that for us, AND he tackles and intercepts, and exudes a calmness Morgan simply doesn't have.
Also. Our formation? Where we only have one wide player on each side (and they end up being 'ineffectual' whenever the opposition can put two men on them)? Yeah, that's to allow the midfield to play a little more. With three of them in there, of course they have more space, and of course they can look to drive forward and make play. Gilbey has made a Charlton career out of driving forward with the ball (usually down a blind alley but I digress). Morgan was, apparently, able to do likewise a few times.
Did he create anything?
Did we win the midfield battle?
I'm aware this line of thinking opens up Lee to similar criticism, but I find him to be a much cleverer footballer who generally makes much better decisions. And he hasn't had four seasons to prove otherwise.
Put in a damned good corner that Inniss scored from (looking at the images on the Post Match Thread) - You're right though, and am not being sarcastic, its nothing to shout home about but for the last few games we've been crying out for someone to put in a decent cross / set-piece
Lee and Jaiyesimi could learn something from that.
Their own threads are no where to be seen picking apart their performances though are there?
Lee shouldn't have to be taking set-pieces (he should be in the box, he has a decent leap), but there's nobody else (honestly I'd try Dobson). He has disappointed by missing most of his chances and his final ball isn't always on the right wavelength as our strikers but I'd say he's still knitting things together with a neatness that nobody else in our squad can muster.
DJ has had to learn a new position, become a solid defender, provide our wing threat and now try to do the same on his wrong foot; he had the toughest assignment of all on Saturday and maybe it was merciful that he was hooked at half-time. He has the best touch in the squad besides Lee and I reckon he'd flourish alongside more technical players (unlike, say, Roadrunner Gilbey).
Neither of them are our biggest problem. Our biggest problem has always, always, always been getting the ball from the midfield to the strikers. And that's as much on the strikers as the midfield. Chuks and Washington might work; we'll see. I'm expecting a fairly radical transformation once we can play a credible forward line.
Also. Our formation? Where we only have one wide player on each side (and they end up being 'ineffectual' whenever the opposition can put two men on them)? Yeah, that's to allow the midfield to play a little more. With three of them in there, of course they have more space, and of course they can look to drive forward and make play. Gilbey has made a Charlton career out of driving forward with the ball (usually down a blind alley but I digress). Morgan was, apparently, able to do likewise a few times.
Did he create anything?
Did we win the midfield battle?
I'm aware this line of thinking opens up Lee to similar criticism, but I find him to be a much cleverer footballer who generally makes much better decisions. And he hasn't had four seasons to prove otherwise.
Put in a damned good corner that Inniss scored from (looking at the images on the Post Match Thread) - You're right though, and am not being sarcastic, its nothing to shout home about but for the last few games we've been crying out for someone to put in a decent cross / set-piece
Lee and Jaiyesimi could learn something from that.
Their own threads are no where to be seen picking apart their performances though are there?
Can't criticise Lee without being turned on, because his dad use to work on the turnstiles
Also. Our formation? Where we only have one wide player on each side (and they end up being 'ineffectual' whenever the opposition can put two men on them)? Yeah, that's to allow the midfield to play a little more. With three of them in there, of course they have more space, and of course they can look to drive forward and make play. Gilbey has made a Charlton career out of driving forward with the ball (usually down a blind alley but I digress). Morgan was, apparently, able to do likewise a few times.
Did he create anything?
Did we win the midfield battle?
I'm aware this line of thinking opens up Lee to similar criticism, but I find him to be a much cleverer footballer who generally makes much better decisions. And he hasn't had four seasons to prove otherwise.
Put in a damned good corner that Inniss scored from (looking at the images on the Post Match Thread) - You're right though, and am not being sarcastic, its nothing to shout home about but for the last few games we've been crying out for someone to put in a decent cross / set-piece
Lee and Jaiyesimi could learn something from that.
Their own threads are no where to be seen picking apart their performances though are there?
Can't criticise Lee without being turned on, because his dad use to work on the turnstiles
I guess there is a certain affinity towards him because he came through the youth team and naturally we all want youngsters to come through and do well. But anyone thinking he's good enough is a bit blinkered.
If we'd signed him a couple of years ago from another club there's no way he'd be getting the same support. Half this forum (and admittedly seemingly our manager) have written Kirk off after about 6 games.
Personally i think we should try and get him a league 2 loan. A change of scenery, regular football and dropping down a level might be the boost he needs (same as going to Crawley did for Grant). Kind of a wake up call 'shit if i don't perform here, then i could be non-league in a couple of years'.
Comments
no one has got the balls and the ability to have a shot they’d rather crab it to you to yo to you … fucking shit and that’s why we’re 14th in league one and looking utter crap , athletes with limited ability or just limited liability .
Morgan looked at the better end of our sea of shit on Saturday whooopee , load of crap , worst ever performing Charlton team …
Oshilaja, Pratley, Lapslie, Dempsey, Vennings, Davison and Davis all made championship appearances for us that season, doesn't mean they're good enough now. If we aspire to get out of this league (via promotion not relegation) then Morgan simply isn't of a good enough level.
Looking like an average footballer = build our team around him for the 5th time.
Simply stating he looks no worse than his counterparts and could be used a bit more, probably as a sub.
Edit: I see Chris has already made this point
I'd rather we got in that other attacking midfield player that Jacko declared he needs, but until then why not use him when the others tire?
It was a dead rubber, but Albie's pass to Taylor for one of the goals against Rochdale (which helped us finish 3rd) was one of those moments where Albie has shown his potential - Frustratingly he hasnt shown it enough.
By the time we got to the Championship; Albie was a squad player, rather than a green U23 thrown in out of desperation.
He was even involved against Blackburn on the opening day - Seem to recall him (and many others) disappointing against Forest Green, which resulted in others coming in on loan, and him going out on loan to Ebbsfleet. He then came back into the fold around November time initially because of the injury crisis.
Did he create anything?
Did we win the midfield battle?
I'm aware this line of thinking opens up Lee to similar criticism, but I find him to be a much cleverer footballer who generally makes much better decisions. And he hasn't had four seasons to prove otherwise.
Lee and Jaiyesimi could learn something from that.
Their own threads are no where to be seen picking apart their performances though are there?
The best Morgan displays I've seen for us have been when he's sat deeper and sprayed passes to wide players to get attacks going. Dobson does that for us, AND he tackles and intercepts, and exudes a calmness Morgan simply doesn't have.
DJ has had to learn a new position, become a solid defender, provide our wing threat and now try to do the same on his wrong foot; he had the toughest assignment of all on Saturday and maybe it was merciful that he was hooked at half-time. He has the best touch in the squad besides Lee and I reckon he'd flourish alongside more technical players (unlike, say, Roadrunner Gilbey).
Neither of them are our biggest problem. Our biggest problem has always, always, always been getting the ball from the midfield to the strikers. And that's as much on the strikers as the midfield. Chuks and Washington might work; we'll see. I'm expecting a fairly radical transformation once we can play a credible forward line.
Genius.
If we'd signed him a couple of years ago from another club there's no way he'd be getting the same support. Half this forum (and admittedly seemingly our manager) have written Kirk off after about 6 games.
Personally i think we should try and get him a league 2 loan. A change of scenery, regular football and dropping down a level might be the boost he needs (same as going to Crawley did for Grant). Kind of a wake up call 'shit if i don't perform here, then i could be non-league in a couple of years'.