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England Cricket Team Summer 2019 -ICC World Cup and Ashes etc
Comments
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Reported that Denly is opening and Roy will bat 4.
It probably should have been done at the start of the series but having got this far it's not what I would have done. Although probably unfair to throw a young guy in on debut in the middle of an ashes series like I would with Sibley.1 -
Friday now looking wet most of the day
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Not surprised, couldn't drop Labuschagne. Will be a very quick line up if Siddle is the one not picked.killerandflash said:0 -
I just about agree to it. On evidence, I think Denly opening and Roy at 4 scores more runs than vice versa.cantersaddick said:Reported that Denly is opening and Roy will bat 4.
It probably should have been done at the start of the series but having got this far it's not what I would have done. Although probably unfair to throw a young guy in on debut in the middle of an ashes series like I would with Sibley.
But it is indeed unfair to "sacrifice" Denly in the hope that Roy pans out at 4. He should probably be dropped but like you said, is it fair to chuck in Sibley for 4 absolutely massive innings.4 -
If you're going to play a "white ball" player at 4, then you might as well recall Eoin Morgan who at least does have some pedigree in his earlier career when he played in the Test team.cafcfan1990 said:
I just about agree to it. On evidence, I think Denly opening and Roy at 4 scores more runs than vice versa.cantersaddick said:Reported that Denly is opening and Roy will bat 4.
It probably should have been done at the start of the series but having got this far it's not what I would have done. Although probably unfair to throw a young guy in on debut in the middle of an ashes series like I would with Sibley.
But it is indeed unfair to "sacrifice" Denly in the hope that Roy pans out at 4. He should probably be dropped but like you said, is it fair to chuck in Sibley for 4 absolutely massive innings.
It's harsh on Denly as batting at 3 or 4 this series, he's never had the luxury of coming in with plenty of runs on the board and an old ball. If he fails, then chances are Roy will still be facing a nearly new ball and fresh bowlers anyway...2 -
They're not going to call Morgan back, was always going to be Roy or Pope.killerandflash said:
If you're going to play a "white ball" player at 4, then you might as well recall Eoin Morgan who at least does have some pedigree in his earlier career when he played in the Test team.cafcfan1990 said:
I just about agree to it. On evidence, I think Denly opening and Roy at 4 scores more runs than vice versa.cantersaddick said:Reported that Denly is opening and Roy will bat 4.
It probably should have been done at the start of the series but having got this far it's not what I would have done. Although probably unfair to throw a young guy in on debut in the middle of an ashes series like I would with Sibley.
But it is indeed unfair to "sacrifice" Denly in the hope that Roy pans out at 4. He should probably be dropped but like you said, is it fair to chuck in Sibley for 4 absolutely massive innings.
It's harsh on Denly as batting at 3 or 4 this series, he's never had the luxury of coming in with plenty of runs on the board and an old ball. If he fails, then chances are Roy will still be facing a nearly new ball and fresh bowlers anyway...0 -
Australia have players out of form they drop them.....0
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Probably the right thing to do if we were the other side of the world and couldn't get anyone else. Pathetic by the selectors.cantersaddick said:Reported that Denly is opening and Roy will bat 4.
It probably should have been done at the start of the series but having got this far it's not what I would have done. Although probably unfair to throw a young guy in on debut in the middle of an ashes series like I would with Sibley.
If they thought Denly was the answer to open, why was he originally picked, less than a year ago on the basis he could bat in the lower order and bowl leg spin? It's almost like he went to the west indies because we won in Sri Lanka and kept the same squad then was picked as the least crap option.
Denly is a very good player (any sports man that has the career he has obviously is) but what evidence is there that he is one of the best openers in England?
And Roy, well the mind boggles, the shoe horned him in, now they are adding him to the long list of stroke makers who should bat no higher than 6 or 7. We already have 4 in the team! There isn't room if he can't open.
You can't go into a test series with 2 proper batsmen and expect to win it! Shocking.2 -
At this rate Stokes will be moved up to 4 next with Roy at No 7...Cafc43v3r said:
Probably the right thing to do if we were the other side of the world and couldn't get anyone else. Pathetic by the selectors.cantersaddick said:Reported that Denly is opening and Roy will bat 4.
It probably should have been done at the start of the series but having got this far it's not what I would have done. Although probably unfair to throw a young guy in on debut in the middle of an ashes series like I would with Sibley.
If they thought Denly was the answer to open, why was he originally picked, less than a year ago on the basis he could bat in the lower order and bowl leg spin? It's almost like he went to the west indies because we won in Sri Lanka and kept the same squad then was picked as the least crap option.
Denly is a very good player (any sports man that has the career he has obviously is) but what evidence is there that he is one of the best openers in England?
And Roy, well the mind boggles, the shoe horned him in, now they are adding him to the long list of stroke makers who should bat no higher than 6 or 7. We already have 4 in the team! There isn't room if he can't open.
You can't go into a test series with 2 proper batsmen and expect to win it! Shocking.0 -
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I quite like the idea about Morgan batting at 4,however i vaguely recall hearing from his post match interview after the Somerset game that he had retired from red ball - could be wrong.0
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We used to pick players based purely on form... in the 90’s and it was an utter disastersupaclive said:Australia have players out of form they drop them.....1 -
Pattinson is rested as they try to protect the workload on his back.0
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A touring party can't drop everyone. I think the point trying to be made is that the Aussies are more ruthless in selection than us. If Australia had two batsmen averaging under 10 in a home series after 3 matches, they would be dropped. At this rate, Roy will have an average lower than monty panesar but will still be given more playing time.Chizz said:
Selected series batting averagessupaclive said:Australia have players out of form they drop them.....
Pattinson 23.00 dropped
Khawaja 20.33 dropped
Harris 13.50 not dropped
Warner 13.16 not dropped
Paine 12.83 not dropped1 -
Or end up with Buttler or Bairstow at 4, brilliant when you are already 30/2killerandflash said:
At this rate Stokes will be moved up to 4 next with Roy at No 7...Cafc43v3r said:
Probably the right thing to do if we were the other side of the world and couldn't get anyone else. Pathetic by the selectors.cantersaddick said:Reported that Denly is opening and Roy will bat 4.
It probably should have been done at the start of the series but having got this far it's not what I would have done. Although probably unfair to throw a young guy in on debut in the middle of an ashes series like I would with Sibley.
If they thought Denly was the answer to open, why was he originally picked, less than a year ago on the basis he could bat in the lower order and bowl leg spin? It's almost like he went to the west indies because we won in Sri Lanka and kept the same squad then was picked as the least crap option.
Denly is a very good player (any sports man that has the career he has obviously is) but what evidence is there that he is one of the best openers in England?
And Roy, well the mind boggles, the shoe horned him in, now they are adding him to the long list of stroke makers who should bat no higher than 6 or 7. We already have 4 in the team! There isn't room if he can't open.
You can't go into a test series with 2 proper batsmen and expect to win it! Shocking.0 -
Do you think Australia are being "ruthless" with regards to David Warner?Todds_right_hook said:
A touring party can't drop everyone. I think the point trying to be made is that the Aussies are more ruthless in selection than us. If Australia had two batsmen averaging under 10 in a home series after 3 matches, they would be dropped. At this rate, Roy will have an average lower than monty panesar but will still be given more playing time.Chizz said:
Selected series batting averagessupaclive said:Australia have players out of form they drop them.....
Pattinson 23.00 dropped
Khawaja 20.33 dropped
Harris 13.50 not dropped
Warner 13.16 not dropped
Paine 12.83 not dropped0 -
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Seems likely that he will have bowled fewer overs than any bowler picked for the next Test, on either side.The_President said:Pattinson is rested as they try to protect the workload on his back.0 -
I'm with you on this one.Chizz said:
Do you think Australia are being "ruthless" with regards to David Warner?Todds_right_hook said:
A touring party can't drop everyone. I think the point trying to be made is that the Aussies are more ruthless in selection than us. If Australia had two batsmen averaging under 10 in a home series after 3 matches, they would be dropped. At this rate, Roy will have an average lower than monty panesar but will still be given more playing time.Chizz said:
Selected series batting averagessupaclive said:Australia have players out of form they drop them.....
Pattinson 23.00 dropped
Khawaja 20.33 dropped
Harris 13.50 not dropped
Warner 13.16 not dropped
Paine 12.83 not dropped
I don't think Australia are being particularly ruthless. Smith's injury forced a change and they can't drop Labuschagne so they had to choose either Khawaja, Head or Wade. Khawaja is the one least in form so goes. Pretty simply really and England would do exactly the same I would imagine if an injury forced Root out and the replacement came in and did well.
Of course, not that it would take a lot of persuading to drop Roy or Buttler if the above happened.0 -
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Ridiculous decision to pick Overton over Curran.Why pick Overton? Why are they frightened to pick Curran? He has shown he has the ability to play test cricket and offers us something different.Woakes looked knackered last test so i can understand resting him but not with Overton.Buttler should be dropped for this test.Hasnt offered anything yet this series and looks shot to pieces.Still nevermind il be there cheering the boys on Thursday abd Friday.1
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Warner is out of form, but I worry there could still be a couple of big scores from him, in the last 2 tests, sadly I don't think Jason Roy will ever be a test batsman.
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Overton’s first test wicket was?greenwichred68 said:Ridiculous decision to pick Overton over Curran.Why pick Overton? Why are they frightened to pick Curran? He has shown he has the ability to play test cricket and offers us something different.Woakes looked knackered last test so i can understand resting him but not with Overton.Buttler should be dropped for this test.Hasnt offered anything yet this series and looks shot to pieces.Still nevermind il be there cheering the boys on Thursday abd Friday.0 -
I think Sam Curran can consider himself unlucky.
Could he be carrying an injury hence Overton?0 -
Followed by 6 more at 42.28 ?cafcfan1990 said:
Overton’s first test wicket was?greenwichred68 said:Ridiculous decision to pick Overton over Curran.Why pick Overton? Why are they frightened to pick Curran? He has shown he has the ability to play test cricket and offers us something different.Woakes looked knackered last test so i can understand resting him but not with Overton.Buttler should be dropped for this test.Hasnt offered anything yet this series and looks shot to pieces.Still nevermind il be there cheering the boys on Thursday abd Friday.2 -
Overton will play in place of woakes0
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With regards to Sam Curran, and whether he should be brought in as a replacement for Chris Woakes, I think they're not keen on picking Curran for the current Ashes because his recent record simply isn't good enough. His 2019 Test bowling average is 47.25. That's the worst of any England bowler, including those not considered for the up-coming match, like Moeen Ali (28.88) and Oli Stone (9.66). He's taken four Test wickets in 2019, compared to Woakes' 15.greenwichred68 said:Ridiculous decision to pick Overton over Curran.Why pick Overton? Why are they frightened to pick Curran? He has shown he has the ability to play test cricket and offers us something different.Woakes looked knackered last test so i can understand resting him but not with Overton.Buttler should be dropped for this test.Hasnt offered anything yet this series and looks shot to pieces.Still nevermind il be there cheering the boys on Thursday abd Friday.
As batters, there's no comparison, obviously. Woakes has a highest Test score of 137* whiles Curran hasn't scored a century in Tests, first class matches or one-dayers.
Curran and Woakes both played in the win versus Ireland. Neither performed heroics with the bat. Curran picked up 3 first innings wickets and Woakes helped bowl England to victory with 6-17. Since then, however, Woakes has scored runs at 28 and taken wickets at 29 in the Ashes, making him the second-ranked all-rounder on either side. Curran has scored 14 runs and taken one wicket at 92 in first class matches. If you drop a player, you should bring in someone who is either better or in better form, or, preferably, both. At the moment, Curran is neither.
The numbers simply do not stack up: there's no case for bringing Curran into the side.
I am sure he will play a lot of cricket for England. And I think it will be more of a batting all-rounder (like Stokes) than a bowling all-rounder (like Woakes). But that's all for the future. Happily, he has time on his side.
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So, what has Overton done this season to deserve selection?
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My point is, if you have a squad of 16 or 17? You can’t make many changes. I’m guessing they could fly someone in but that person would have played very little cricketChizz said:
Do you think Australia are being "ruthless" with regards to David Warner?Todds_right_hook said:
A touring party can't drop everyone. I think the point trying to be made is that the Aussies are more ruthless in selection than us. If Australia had two batsmen averaging under 10 in a home series after 3 matches, they would be dropped. At this rate, Roy will have an average lower than monty panesar but will still be given more playing time.Chizz said:
Selected series batting averagessupaclive said:Australia have players out of form they drop them.....
Pattinson 23.00 dropped
Khawaja 20.33 dropped
Harris 13.50 not dropped
Warner 13.16 not dropped
Paine 12.83 not dropped0 -
I don't think anyone is saying to have him above Woakes. But the decision to rest Woakes has been taken and personally I think its the right one, he has looked viably tired and has had a huge workload this summer after some pretty serious injuries and surgery over the winter.Chizz said:
With regards to Sam Curran, and whether he should be brought in as a replacement for Chris Woakes, I think they're not keen on picking Curran for the current Ashes because his recent record simply isn't good enough. His 2019 Test bowling average is 47.25. That's the worst of any England bowler, including those not considered for the up-coming match, like Moeen Ali (28.88) and Oli Stone (9.66). He's taken four Test wickets in 2019, compared to Woakes' 15.greenwichred68 said:Ridiculous decision to pick Overton over Curran.Why pick Overton? Why are they frightened to pick Curran? He has shown he has the ability to play test cricket and offers us something different.Woakes looked knackered last test so i can understand resting him but not with Overton.Buttler should be dropped for this test.Hasnt offered anything yet this series and looks shot to pieces.Still nevermind il be there cheering the boys on Thursday abd Friday.
As batters, there's no comparison, obviously. Woakes has a highest Test score of 137* whiles Curran hasn't scored a century in Tests, first class matches or one-dayers.
Curran and Woakes both played in the win versus Ireland. Neither performed heroics with the bat. Curran picked up 3 first innings wickets and Woakes helped bowl England to victory with 6-17. Since then, however, Woakes has scored runs at 28 and taken wickets at 29 in the Ashes, making him the second-ranked all-rounder on either side. Curran has scored 14 runs and taken one wicket at 92 in first class matches. If you drop a player, you should bring in someone who is either better or in better form, or, preferably, both. At the moment, Curran is neither.
The numbers simply do not stack up: there's no case for bringing Curran into the side.
I am sure he will play a lot of cricket for England. And I think it will be more of a batting all-rounder (like Stokes) than a bowling all-rounder (like Woakes). But that's all for the future. Happily, he has time on his side.
Having made that call then surely it would be Curran to be brought in. He is next in line having been in the squad for every match so far. He is a swing bowler which is closest like for like in terms of skills to Woakes and Anderson. Overton is a seam/line bowler and another right arm 80-85 mph. at least with Sam we would have a left arm variation and a swing bowler.
Seems odd to me.1
