Question time If people arent happy with Bowyer's subs, what changes would they have made?
Matthew's for Solly would be a start.
Why did Mathews not start?!
And lyle?
Some weird selections today. Some will say saving for swansea which makes no sense as derby are worse off. Plus the players look knackered now anyway, galla looked like he gave his all and pratley.
We are dead on our feet , there’s nothing left to give and we are the current worse team in this league . Every bit of dross is getting a result against us B City apart . Takeover or not , we’re gonna need some miracle to arrest this slide back towards League One oblivion . Defensively shocking beyond belief , the whole package of the team at this moment in time is a relegation outfit .
Whatever happened to playing oshilaja at right back? Thought he started wicked there at beginning of season and now we’ve moved him to dm because of injuries. We could do with him in the back 3 4 5 or however many we play there.
"Poor in posession. No shots on target until the penalty. Crossing poor. Quality poor. Got what we deserved - nothing. Second to everything tonight. No excuses. Not good enough tonight."
Bowyer's comments, not mine.
Nobody is pretending it was a good performance it wasn't. He needs to motivate the players for Swansea somehow.
That quote didn't start blaming individuals like many (including you which is very dissapointing) are doing.
just back home, as others have said we looked poor tonight, Derby who themselves were on a poor run of form looked hungrier, more energetic and had we nicked a point at the end when Hamer made a couple of saves we'd have stolen it.
The way they attacked space and made things happen as opposed to our sideways passes, looking for someone to want the ball and waiting for something to happen was obvious.I couldnt tell who had 10 men.
I get that we have a depleted squad, I get we are missing a number of key players and I know how desperate we are for the takeover to go through but, having travelled to Middlesborough, tonight and off to Swansea in a couple of days, they dont it easy for us sometimes.
Pride Park is one of the more impressive out of town souless bowls we visit in modern football, the home fans are also among the loudest we have encountered this season or last to be fair to them.
However, I wouldnt swap our Valley and the Rose, Royal Oak, River Ale House, White Swan, Bugle, Anchor & Hope and Red Red Robin for the corporate blandness of thier stadium, its superloud PA trying to manufacture an atmosphere, a tubby drummer boy belting out a beat to Palace songs with no words and the choice between Frankie and Benny's or the Cafe at Dunhelm Mills pre/post match thankyou.
Where have I blamed individuals @Redman? I'm worried about the toll this is taking on Bowyer, not blaming him and all I said on players was take a look at Purrington re the goals- his positioning is all over the place.
Tough night round my sisters watching that shit , made my 6 year old nephew (his dad’s palace) cry by starting my boys off on him with a chorus of we hate palace and we hate palace . I felt really bad ( if he was scum I wouldn’t ) I then had to go and find him and start saying we both hate millwall (social services please don’t read this ) and it’s ok (spit) to support palace . My sister says she feels sick taking him to his footy training in a palace kit . Then older niece says can her millwall boyfriend sit in the home end with us for that fixture . I mean fuck off Christmas and families .
We see the year out depleted and in disarray on the pitch, going down to a 10-man Derby. Let's hope we get some takeover news before year end, or soon after at the latest.
Twas a poor performance, all told, but we've been limping towards the line for some weeks now, with only spits and spurts of quality when we can manage it. We desperately need to resolve the ownership issue as soon as possible, and begin to add reinforcements that can reinvigorate this team in January.
Tough night round my sisters watching that shit , made my 6 year old nephew (his dad’s palace) cry by starting my boys off on him with a chorus of we hate palace and we hate palace . I felt really bad ( if he was scum I wouldn’t ) I then had to go and find him and start saying we both hate millwall (social services please don’t read this ) and it’s ok (spit) to support palace . My sister says she feels sick taking him to his footy training in a palace kit . Then older niece says can her millwall boyfriend sit in the home end for us for that fixture . I mean fuck off Christmas and families .
Just watched the first goal again. I mean, Sarr giving it away (their right-back intercepting a ball to a striker) is so far before the goal that it isn't even in the clip! What I do see is:
- Purrington running into central midfield for no reason at all - Sarr trying to fill in for Purrington and forcing the early cross - Oshilaja missing the cross - Lockyer letting his man in front of him - Solly waving a leg in the vague direction of the ball as the guy who wants it more heads in
And yet people are still insisting that Sarr is exclusively at fault! He tried to link up with Doughty, and his reward is to be blamed when it went in our goal a full ten seconds later. Absolutely ludicrous and a sign that people really will not ever give him a fair shake.
We all can see that we have a depleted squad. That we are playing youngsters that have not played a league game ever....and even senior pro's are out on their feet by 70 mins.
BUT.
That not an excuse for leaving a player unmarked 8 yards from goal (I can't remember one of our players having that type of chance even last season) or having a free kick 10 yards into their half & instead of lumping it forward playing it backwards 20 yards. These are schoolboy errors. Solly I'm afraid just can't cut the mustard. Re-run that match back again & see how many times he passes backwards compared to forwards. He does it all the time. With him & Purrington in the side we have no momentum out wide. We don't play with wingers (or anyone with any pace) and so it's their job to get forward with the ball.....more so when playing as wingbacks. Both can't beat a man & even when they do get high up the pitch their crossing is woeful (then again so are most of the rest of the team). I don't think I've seen a team dominate so much & come away with hardly troubling the goalkeeper.
As for the team set up & changing it as the game goes on. LB is out of his depth. We had Oshilaja playing in midfield & Pratley in defence... wtf ?? Surely it should be the other way round. Or drop Solly & put Oshilaja at RB (although I cant see why Matthews can't play 2 games in a week.....be had 3 months to get up to speed fitness wise & hasn't been injured). Doughty should be at LB as his pace gives us an attacking threat down that side.
The team is so unbalanced its unreal. And as pp's have said, it's not as if it's the defenders who are out injured. I said on the preview thread that we were doomed as soon as I saw the team sheet at 6.45pm. I have no idea what Ledley has done to not even get on the pitch for 20 mins over the last 3 games. Why pay his wages this month & not use him?. I'm sure a bit of experience instead of throwing on Dempsey would have been better. Or Matthews come to that.
Gah. Football coaching badges are not worth a light. I have no fucking clue what they do every day in training but if you can't even get the basics right like taking on your man or getting a cross onto the box then we might as all pack up & go home. It's such an easy game. Get the ball forward & have a shot.
Sarr can't defend and had a liability of a second half? He cut out at least 2 dangerous crosses in the second half and made a brilliantly-timed last man challenge. He isn't unfit - he's played a lot of games in a very short space of time, so when Gallagher lost the ball from his pass he wasn't able to recover to catch up with the Derby players - others should have helped! Phillips saved it anyway. Sarr did a lot of good defending. It is completely mystifying why some people want to make him the scapegoat when he gives more than many others
To be honest mate I think you are a bit blinkered when it comes to him. Another goal conceded tonight as a result of his poor pass. It’s not about him giving more than the others when the whole of the back line look poor at the moment. It’s about him not being good enough defensively at this level. It will continue to happen time and time again
It wasn't a defensive action. He played a ball that two players could have come for, neither did and so the Derby player stole in and took it. A bad pass? Yes. It should gave been better, but two of our players didn't come for the pass. That's basics.
His defensive work tonight was decent. He did most things right. Lockyer probably made a similar number of errors but was protected by a defender beside him in Solly. Purrington was too busy heading off on an adventure that Bilbo Baggins would be proud of to offer Sarr either an option or to support him when Derby intercepted.
Sorry but Sarr is so far off Championship football it is painful. End of the season when he leaves he will drift into the wilderness of French Division 2 subs bench's and end up with a post Charlton career like Anil Koc's.
Nice fella, doesn't hide and nd I will wish him well but he is not a good defender. His miss placed pass was a key contributor to the first goal but he is just dreadful. Goes to ground too easily, I just have no confidence in him whatsoever. Will always support a player in our team but I will certainly not miss him when he goes.
I blame the clown who gave him a four year contract.
Tough night round my sisters watching that shit , made my 6 year old nephew (his dad’s palace) cry by starting my boys off on him with a chorus of we hate palace and we hate palace . I felt really bad ( if he was scum I wouldn’t ) I then had to go and find him and start saying we both hate millwall (social services please don’t read this ) and it’s ok (spit) to support palace . My sister says she feels sick taking him to his footy training in a palace kit . Then older niece says can her millwall boyfriend sit in the home end for us for that fixture . I mean fuck off Christmas and families .
Naby has taken on the Marmite role previously occupied by the likes of Kishishev and Leaburn; loved or hated. If it were another player that had given the ball away at that point would they be coming in for the same amount of stick? Not that I've seen the poor pass as I've only seen the highlights and it was too early in the passage of play to be shown! I think the rest of the defence, Solly in particular, should have done better.
As for the second, with eleven against ten, to leave a man totally unmarked is criminal. Sarr to blame anyone?
Naby has taken on the Marmite role previously occupied by the likes of Kishishev and Leaburn; loved or hated. If it were another player that had given the ball away at that point would they be coming in for the same amount of stick? Not that I've seen the poor pass as I've only seen the highlights and it was too early in the passage of play to be shown! I think the rest of the defence, Solly in particular, should have done better.
As for the second, with eleven against ten, to leave a man totally unmarked is criminal. Sarr to blame anyone?
(A reported) 8k a week with us, will become £80 a week with the next club.
Yet another game we lost by one goal, and yet another game one of those goals we condeded was from a terrible bit of basic defending.
But yeah injuries.
So you think Doughty | Dempsey | Davison | Morgan | Vennings would all be involved with the First Team if it werent for injuries?
Yeah, okay!!
6 weeks or so ago 1 played at Dulwich Hamlet, 1 played at Bromley, 1 played at Ebbsfleet, 1 played at Enfield. At the end of last season 1 had not made a league game and was battered and bruised and bloodied by Derby, 1 was playing for Orient in non league. Every player has been asked to put in a shift over and above! The fact that we even get a team out that does not concede a hat full is testimony to the management of Bowyer and the grit of the players out there!
It was a totally inept performance: The one thing we are all agreed on, including the manager. Against Bristol City, our goals came from Route one, and right from the start of the game, our shape was clear, with Doughty and Matthews as wing backs.
Last night from the first minute we were an accident waiting to happen and should've been 1 down in 30 seconds but for Phillips. Having Rooney on the bench (just watching) galvanised Derby and they didn't look like the team that were so poor at the valley; But we weren't the team that was so good in that 3-0 victory.
No manager could cope with having to play so many young players in midfield and attack, ask Eddie Howe at Bournemouth and he will say 4 points from 30 when you lose 8 or 9 players and play reserves. We have lost a dozen from the squad !
We needed a snowstorm from Lapland after the Bristol city game so we could rest up but instead we got a shitstorm from the players and the mandatory meltdown on CL. Tough times and we needed a takeover done and dusted back in the summer. With even more players in the Medical room than on the training pitch, our Goal difference could take a hammering next month. The fans need to stay behind the team and not lambast the players despite the countless errors.
From a weird and unique owner to a possible "strange". This window is vital for our future, on and off the pitch.
I don't want this to sound the wrong way as I am not fit to lick Bowyer's books as a manager, but one thing I understand that I think he has to learn is that sometimes you have to compromise your principles to look for a way to win. We couldn't play Taylor and Bonne together as we did against Bristol City, so how can we trouble them? That is a question you have to find an answer for and I really don't think Bowyer tried to do that yesterday. The answer may be a desperate one and compromise the way he wants to play the game, and it may not have worked but try to f*ing find it or lose the game for certain.
I can even point him in the right direction for Swansea. Ugly long ball with a big lump up front playing alongside Taylor. It might not work but a) they will not be expecting it and b) we are not in a position to outplay them at this moment in time. It isn't something we can or even should do every game, but it is what we need to do in our next one!
Just watched the first goal again. I mean, Sarr giving it away (their right-back intercepting a ball to a striker) is so far before the goal that it isn't even in the clip! What I do see is:
- Purrington running into central midfield for no reason at all - Sarr trying to fill in for Purrington and forcing the early cross - Oshilaja missing the cross - Lockyer letting his man in front of him - Solly waving a leg in the vague direction of the ball as the guy who wants it more heads in
And yet people are still insisting that Sarr is exclusively at fault! He tried to link up with Doughty, and his reward is to be blamed when it went in our goal a full ten seconds later. Absolutely ludicrous and a sign that people really will not ever give him a fair shake.
I don’t have the replay to hand now but from memory Sarrs pass was not intercepted it was given to the player on a plate and it’s almost as if Sarr is not looking up when he passes. I love Naby because he can produce some lovely skills on the ball and puts in a shift when defending but he is also an accident waiting to happen and that’s what’s bothering me.
I think both can be true. Naby can play great passes and always looks to do something positive with it, but a decent number of his passes can go astray. The solution is to make the passes easier whilst accepting some will still go astray. That is simply by giving him the time and for players to show for him. That last bit is very important and it is where Morgan is being carried at this stage in his career. What our other defenders do, at this time with our depleted squad, when opponents try to press is pass to each other and give the problem to somebody else. When Naby is playing they invariably use him as the out ball.
Yes he gave the ball away and yes it was a poor pass, but it should have been defended better from that point and another weakness is our inability to stop players running at us and the number of balls that come into our box too easily from wide positions. Blame Sarr all you want for that but the issue is a more complex one. When you have a lack of creativity in the side, players like Sarr are important unless you move to the dark side of the game. personally, I think Bowyer needs to move to the dark side for a game or two until he gets his players back who can make something happen. Completely different level but I managed an U-18 side last season and compromised everything I believe in in football to get wins at any cost and it worked. Sometimes it is an assessment between some chance or absolutely no chance. If some chance requires you to go against your principles, you do it.
At this moment in time, we have four players who can make something happen. That isn't slagging off other players who may have a greater responsibility to stop things happening, which is another issue in itself, but those four players are Sarr, Gallagher, Bonne and Taylor. Yesterday we only had three at any given point in the game and that isn't enough at this level. If you have five or six the whole dynamic changes. How many of those type of players will we have against Swansea?
I think Sarr plays well almost every game,but,he will always make a mistake somewhere along the way,which quite often costs us a goal.Lockyear for all his great defensive work,is suspect in the passing department.Now,I dont want to blame anyone,but if there was an out ball to good midfielders the play would be in the other half more often,giving the defense a breather which at the moment theydo not get.
I think Sarr plays well almost every game,but,he will always make a mistake somewhere along the way,which quite often costs us a goal.Lockyear for all his great defensive work,is suspect in the passing department.Now,I dont want to blame anyone,but if there was an out ball to good midfielders the play would be in the other half more often,giving the defense a breather which at the moment theydo not get.
Exactly right. Look for the obvious and you don't always find the answer.
Comments
Every bit of dross is getting a result against us B City apart .
Takeover or not , we’re gonna need some miracle to arrest this slide back towards League One oblivion .
Defensively shocking beyond belief , the whole package of the team at this moment in time is a relegation outfit .
That quote didn't start blaming individuals like many (including you which is very dissapointing) are doing.
FFs let's stick together!
The way they attacked space and made things happen as opposed to our sideways passes, looking for someone to want the ball and waiting for something to happen was obvious.I couldnt tell who had 10 men.
I get that we have a depleted squad, I get we are missing a number of key players and I know how desperate we are for the takeover to go through but, having travelled to Middlesborough, tonight and off to Swansea in a couple of days, they dont it easy for us sometimes.
Pride Park is one of the more impressive out of town souless bowls we visit in modern football, the home fans are also among the loudest we have encountered this season or last to be fair to them.
However, I wouldnt swap our Valley and the Rose, Royal Oak, River Ale House, White Swan, Bugle, Anchor & Hope and Red Red Robin for the corporate blandness of thier stadium, its superloud PA trying to manufacture an atmosphere, a tubby drummer boy belting out a beat to Palace songs with no words and the choice between Frankie and Benny's or the Cafe at Dunhelm Mills pre/post match thankyou.
Up the Addicks and heres to the takeover
I felt really bad ( if he was scum I wouldn’t )
I then had to go and find him and start saying we both hate millwall (social services please don’t read this ) and it’s ok (spit) to support palace .
My sister says she feels sick taking him to his footy training in a palace kit .
Then older niece says can her millwall boyfriend sit in the home end with us for that fixture .
I mean fuck off Christmas and families .
Catalogue of disasters that lot
Some funny stuff too, though
- Purrington running into central midfield for no reason at all
- Sarr trying to fill in for Purrington and forcing the early cross
- Oshilaja missing the cross
- Lockyer letting his man in front of him
- Solly waving a leg in the vague direction of the ball as the guy who wants it more heads in
And yet people are still insisting that Sarr is exclusively at fault! He tried to link up with Doughty, and his reward is to be blamed when it went in our goal a full ten seconds later. Absolutely ludicrous and a sign that people really will not ever give him a fair shake.
We all can see that we have a depleted squad. That we are playing youngsters that have not played a league game ever....and even senior pro's are out on their feet by 70 mins.
BUT.
That not an excuse for leaving a player unmarked 8 yards from goal (I can't remember one of our players having that type of chance even last season) or having a free kick 10 yards into their half & instead of lumping it forward playing it backwards 20 yards. These are schoolboy errors. Solly I'm afraid just can't cut the mustard. Re-run that match back again & see how many times he passes backwards compared to forwards. He does it all the time. With him & Purrington in the side we have no momentum out wide. We don't play with wingers (or anyone with any pace) and so it's their job to get forward with the ball.....more so when playing as wingbacks. Both can't beat a man & even when they do get high up the pitch their crossing is woeful (then again so are most of the rest of the team). I don't think I've seen a team dominate so much & come away with hardly troubling the goalkeeper.
As for the team set up & changing it as the game goes on. LB is out of his depth. We had Oshilaja playing in midfield & Pratley in defence... wtf ?? Surely it should be the other way round. Or drop Solly & put Oshilaja at RB (although I cant see why Matthews can't play 2 games in a week.....be had 3 months to get up to speed fitness wise & hasn't been injured). Doughty should be at LB as his pace gives us an attacking threat down that side.
The team is so unbalanced its unreal. And as pp's have said, it's not as if it's the defenders who are out injured. I said on the preview thread that we were doomed as soon as I saw the team sheet at 6.45pm. I have no idea what Ledley has done to not even get on the pitch for 20 mins over the last 3 games. Why pay his wages this month & not use him?. I'm sure a bit of experience instead of throwing on Dempsey would have been better. Or Matthews come to that.
Gah. Football coaching badges are not worth a light. I have no fucking clue what they do every day in training but if you can't even get the basics right like taking on your man or getting a cross onto the box then we might as all pack up & go home. It's such an easy game. Get the ball forward & have a shot.
Against Bristol City, our goals came from Route one, and right from the start of the game, our shape was clear, with Doughty and Matthews as wing backs.
Last night from the first minute we were an accident waiting to happen and should've been 1 down in 30 seconds but for Phillips.
Having Rooney on the bench (just watching) galvanised Derby and they didn't look like the team that were so poor at the valley; But we weren't the team that was so good in that 3-0 victory.
No manager could cope with having to play so many young players in midfield and attack, ask Eddie Howe at Bournemouth and he will say 4 points from 30 when you lose 8 or 9 players and play reserves. We have lost a dozen from the squad !
We needed a snowstorm from Lapland after the Bristol city game so we could rest up but instead we got a shitstorm from the players and the mandatory meltdown on CL. Tough times and we needed a takeover done and dusted back in the summer.
With even more players in the Medical room than on the training pitch, our Goal difference could take a hammering next month.
The fans need to stay behind the team and not lambast the players despite the countless errors.
From a weird and unique owner to a possible "strange". This window is vital for our future, on and off the pitch.
I can even point him in the right direction for Swansea. Ugly long ball with a big lump up front playing alongside Taylor. It might not work but a) they will not be expecting it and b) we are not in a position to outplay them at this moment in time. It isn't something we can or even should do every game, but it is what we need to do in our next one!
Yes he gave the ball away and yes it was a poor pass, but it should have been defended better from that point and another weakness is our inability to stop players running at us and the number of balls that come into our box too easily from wide positions. Blame Sarr all you want for that but the issue is a more complex one. When you have a lack of creativity in the side, players like Sarr are important unless you move to the dark side of the game. personally, I think Bowyer needs to move to the dark side for a game or two until he gets his players back who can make something happen. Completely different level but I managed an U-18 side last season and compromised everything I believe in in football to get wins at any cost and it worked. Sometimes it is an assessment between some chance or absolutely no chance. If some chance requires you to go against your principles, you do it.
At this moment in time, we have four players who can make something happen. That isn't slagging off other players who may have a greater responsibility to stop things happening, which is another issue in itself, but those four players are Sarr, Gallagher, Bonne and Taylor. Yesterday we only had three at any given point in the game and that isn't enough at this level. If you have five or six the whole dynamic changes. How many of those type of players will we have against Swansea?