I'm usually supportive of protestors and believe that the right to protest is a very important one, even if I don't always agree with the aims of a particular protest. There are some though, who consistently take an anti position and seem to revel in reporting any negative facts they can in the aim of discrediting protestors through mass character assassination without ever tackling the arguments.
I have to say I'm struggling with this though, the risks are far too high and the benefits too tenuous for this to be a sensible approach. I get that people are angry about George Floyd's murder and that there are great concerns about racism in this country as well as in the US. Surely in the current situation though it would make more sense to find an alternative method of speaking out. After all, it's only a week or so ago that there were reports on the news about the government not doing enough to prevent Covid amongst ethnic minority communities. This seems to fly in the face of that.
......and why over this death in USA - what about the many, many deaths in South American, African, Asian countries including those caused by the Russian and Chinese states? Are only minority north American lives worth breaking distancing rules for?
I think any protestor not socially distancing is a dangerous prick. I think the impetus for such a protest is a mixture of outrage over George Floyd and the feeling of pressure that the virus is particularly deadly for BAME people.
......and why over this death in USA - what about the many, many deaths in South American, African, Asian countries including those caused by the Russian and Chinese states? Are only minority north American lives worth breaking distancing rules for?
All very selective.
That's what irritates me. The way people demonstrate against the US, you'd have thought it was the worst country in the world, and every other country in the world was a bastion of liberal values, with regards to free speech, democracy, race relations, LGBT+ rights etc
How many anti China marches have there been in the UK, despite the appalling crackdown on their Muslim Uighur minorities? How many Hollywood stars have spoken out about it...or are they worried that China would ban their movies?
Does anyone think the recent request of using face masks on public transport will finally open up the workplace to resemble something Pre-March? Maybe TfL are at the point they need to get public back on transport and indicating the use of face masks, providing a degree of comfort to the customer? As for the increase in cycling, be interesting to see the figures when those dark nights draw in.
Does anyone think the recent request of using face masks on public transport will finally open up the workplace to resemble something Pre-March? Maybe TfL are at the point they need to get public back on transport and indicating the use of face masks, providing a degree of comfort to the customer? As for the increase in cycling, be interesting to see the figures when those dark nights draw in.
The wearing of face masks on public transport seems to coincide with non essential retail opening (mid June) so I assume they were expecting more workers to be going back?
I'm usually supportive of protestors and believe that the right to protest is a very important one, even if I don't always agree with the aims of a particular protest. There are some though, who consistently take an anti position and seem to revel in reporting any negative facts they can in the aim of discrediting protestors through mass character assassination without ever tackling the arguments.
I have to say I'm struggling with this though, the risks are far too high and the benefits too tenuous for this to be a sensible approach. I get that people are angry about George Floyd's murder and that there are great concerns about racism in this country as well as in the US. Surely in the current situation though it would make more sense to find an alternative method of speaking out. After all, it's only a week or so ago that there were reports on the news about the government not doing enough to prevent Covid amongst ethnic minority communities. This seems to fly in the face of that.
This. I’m outraged that a guy got handled that way by the police and ultimately died for the unproven crime of having a fake $20 bill. I seriously doubt that this would have happened to a white person.
I think a more powerful message would have been for everyone to log onto zoom at 5pm during the next prime minister up date and cause the system to crash and prevent questions, causing the prime minister embarrassment
i have thought of that now, in 2 minutes. I’m not sure if it would have worked but my point is, there are other ways to protest if planned properly rather than congregate in public during a pandemic that has cost 40,000 lives on our shores alone.
I'm usually supportive of protestors and believe that the right to protest is a very important one, even if I don't always agree with the aims of a particular protest. There are some though, who consistently take an anti position and seem to revel in reporting any negative facts they can in the aim of discrediting protestors through mass character assassination without ever tackling the arguments.
I have to say I'm struggling with this though, the risks are far too high and the benefits too tenuous for this to be a sensible approach. I get that people are angry about George Floyd's murder and that there are great concerns about racism in this country as well as in the US. Surely in the current situation though it would make more sense to find an alternative method of speaking out. After all, it's only a week or so ago that there were reports on the news about the government not doing enough to prevent Covid amongst ethnic minority communities. This seems to fly in the face of that.
What “alternative method of speaking out” would you suggest to challenge historical systemic injustice?
TBH given the images of crowding on the beaches etc a couple of weeks ago I think it’s a bit rich to say people shouldn’t protest over such a worthy cause. Lockdown was dead (if it ever really started) weeks ago in this country and I have no issue with people using their right to protest for something as important as this.
......and why over this death in USA - what about the many, many deaths in South American, African, Asian countries including those caused by the Russian and Chinese states? Are only minority north American lives worth breaking distancing rules for?
All very selective.
That's what irritates me. The way people demonstrate against the US, you'd have thought it was the worst country in the world, and every other country in the world was a bastion of liberal values, with regards to free speech, democracy, race relations, LGBT+ rights etc
How many anti China marches have there been in the UK, despite the appalling crackdown on their Muslim Uighur minorities? How many Hollywood stars have spoken out about it...or are they worried that China would ban their movies?
Our culture is significantly more influenced by African Americans than it is by Uighur Muslims in China. Doesn’t mean that their mistreatment is any more acceptable, but also doesn’t mean that trying to highlight and protest discrimination against one ethnic group is less worthy. Not sure why it would “irritate you” in any case.
My concern regarding the protests is obviously regarding a 2nd wave. The other concern is the the BAME community have a higher percentage of deaths yet these people are out protesting. im sure some will have elderly relatives or those in the higher risk categories.
Could be disastrous for those groups. All racial groups were represented but if we are to believe the figures then surely this isn’t going to help this social group.
I'm usually supportive of protestors and believe that the right to protest is a very important one, even if I don't always agree with the aims of a particular protest. There are some though, who consistently take an anti position and seem to revel in reporting any negative facts they can in the aim of discrediting protestors through mass character assassination without ever tackling the arguments.
I have to say I'm struggling with this though, the risks are far too high and the benefits too tenuous for this to be a sensible approach. I get that people are angry about George Floyd's murder and that there are great concerns about racism in this country as well as in the US. Surely in the current situation though it would make more sense to find an alternative method of speaking out. After all, it's only a week or so ago that there were reports on the news about the government not doing enough to prevent Covid amongst ethnic minority communities. This seems to fly in the face of that.
What “alternative method of speaking out” would you suggest to challenge historical systemic injustice?
TBH given the images of crowding on the beaches etc a couple of weeks ago I think it’s a bit rich to say people shouldn’t protest over such a worthy cause. Lockdown was dead (if it ever really started) weeks ago in this country and I have no issue with people using their right to protest for something as important as this.
It’s only rich if a person on a crowded beach said it. For the majority who are still being sensible, still not seeing family or friends due to health issues, seeing protestors on mass is demoralising. Mass gatherings will result in increased infections, whether localised or national and will increase my home prison sentence. Is that fair?
Lockdown is dead, most are keeping to social distancing measures. The protestors mainly didn’t, that’s wrong!
My concern regarding the protests is obviously regarding a 2nd wave. The other concern is the the BAME community have a higher percentage of deaths yet these people are out protesting. im sure some will have elderly relatives or those in the higher risk categories.
Could be disastrous for those groups. All racial groups were represented but if we are to believe the figures then surely this isn’t going to help this social group.
And that’s what I don’t get. A week ago, the government and nhs were called racist by some media outlets for not doing enough to protect BAME communities. Now these same communities are at increased risk due to protestors having a mass gathering! Crazy
The protests are actually deflecting attention away from the Government's handing of the pandemic.
I do not agree with protesting whilst we are in the middle of a pandemic and considering the recent report that found that BAME people are more likely to die from Covid19 than white people, it is stupid for so many people from that community to go against all rules on social distancing. When the infection rate rises it will be easy for the Government to say that it is the fault of the protesters, rather than any relaxtion of the 'lockdown'.
Exactly, such a shit argument ‘oh well it won’t be the fault of white people at the beach’. Yes it will, along with the dickhead protestors up London. Both will be to blame, along with anyone else not adhering to social distancing.
Neither are wise in the current climate, but I feel like the protests (which I broadly support by the way) will contribute much more to any increase in the virus transmission rate then people going to the beach.
I assume large quantities of people would have gone to the beach would be families and small groups of people, who would have got there by driving and would have found it easier to social distance in what would have been hotter weather.
I could be wrong but I imagine lots of people got to the protests by public transport, the weather is cooler, and there is pretty much limited social distancing and lots of mixing of different households. Many of them are wearing masks though which is good.
To be honest, my non scientific opinion is if/when we do get a '2nd peak' it won't be until after summer anyway so the likelihood is that neither of these events will make to much difference to the virus in the short term.
Exactly, such a shit argument ‘oh well it won’t be the fault of white people at the beach’. Yes it will, along with the dickhead protestors up London. Both will be to blame, along with anyone else not adhering to social distancing.
Agree. People of all races have been to the beach, people of all races have been protested. All are helping keep the r rating around 1.....thanks to all selfish pricks who are incapable of doing the right thing
......and why over this death in USA - what about the many, many deaths in South American, African, Asian countries including those caused by the Russian and Chinese states? Are only minority north American lives worth breaking distancing rules for?
All very selective.
That's what irritates me. The way people demonstrate against the US, you'd have thought it was the worst country in the world, and every other country in the world was a bastion of liberal values, with regards to free speech, democracy, race relations, LGBT+ rights etc
How many anti China marches have there been in the UK, despite the appalling crackdown on their Muslim Uighur minorities? How many Hollywood stars have spoken out about it...or are they worried that China would ban their movies?
Our culture is significantly more influenced by African Americans than it is by Uighur Muslims in China. Doesn’t mean that their mistreatment is any more acceptable, but also doesn’t mean that trying to highlight and protest discrimination against one ethnic group is less worthy. Not sure why it would “irritate you” in any case.
But it's ALWAYS anti US marches, or marches caused by an incident in the US.
Anthony Joshua for example was very happy to get a MASSIVE payment to fight in that bastion of free speech, gay rights and equal opportunities for women Saudi Arabia last December.
Does anyone think the recent request of using face masks on public transport will finally open up the workplace to resemble something Pre-March? Maybe TfL are at the point they need to get public back on transport and indicating the use of face masks, providing a degree of comfort to the customer? As for the increase in cycling, be interesting to see the figures when those dark nights draw in.
Yes.
The anouncement of face masks to be used from the 15th June is not coincidence that non-essential shops are due to open. I do not know why the Government did not make this anouncement three months ago.
Exactly, such a shit argument ‘oh well it won’t be the fault of white people at the beach’. Yes it will, along with the dickhead protestors up London. Both will be to blame, along with anyone else not adhering to social distancing.
I find the disregard for social distancing by people to be downright disrespectful to the situation and to people who are adhering to it.
Popped into my local largish ASDA for my weekly shop yesterday. Usually go half hour before shutting, i can still get most of what I want and there are less knobheads around.
Now I don't get shocked, i realise that in my area there is a high percentage per 1000 head of population of complete morons, but I was last evening. Hordes of young chavvy twats ignoring social distancing rules and just strolling in and out of the shop in groups. I thought about why i would be so bothered a bit and came to the conclusion, it was the utter selfishness on display.
I reckon September/October for the next plateau. Unfortunately, statistics wise it won't be those total cnuts i saw last night, it will be the vulnerable and yours and my treasured friends and relatives that pay the price.
As for those twats up in Parliament Square, do they not do irony? Black Lives Matter? When the BME population is so susceptable in this pandemic... mind boggles.
" Thousands & thousands outside the US Embassy now" - BBC News.
That is ridiculous, they are throwing away all the hard work of those who have obeyed the rules. They are just as bad as Dominic Cummings.
I don't recall seeing Dominic Cummings rioting in central London , defacing war memorials or throwing missiles and bicycles at police and their horses.
Maybe I missed him doing those things while I have been banged up indoors adhering to the lockdown advice for the last three months.
Deaths in England and Wales during or following police custody in the last 10 years: 163, of whom 23 (14%) were from ethnic minorities.
Deaths in UK due to Covid-19 in last 3 moths: Approx 40,000, of whom around 16% were from ethnic minorities (Approx 6,500).
Covid is by far this biggest killer in absolute terms and is more discriminatory in percentage terms. It is quite possible, though it would be very difficult to prove, that more people will die as a result of demonstrators breaking social distancing rules than as a result of bad policing. Misguided, is the politest thing this particular lily-livered liberal can say about the protesters.
" Thousands & thousands outside the US Embassy now" - BBC News.
That is ridiculous, they are throwing away all the hard work of those who have obeyed the rules. They are just as bad as Dominic Cummings.
I don't recall seeing Dominic Cummings rioting in central London , defacing war memorials or throwing missiles and bicycles at police and their horses.
Maybe I missed him doing those things while I have been banged up indoors adhering to the lockdown advice for the last three months.
I am referring to people flouting the lockdown rules which all those protestors are doing just by being part of a mass gathering. I didn't say that Dominic Cummings defaced war memorials, threw missiles and bicycles at Police.
Comments
I have to say I'm struggling with this though, the risks are far too high and the benefits too tenuous for this to be a sensible approach. I get that people are angry about George Floyd's murder and that there are great concerns about racism in this country as well as in the US. Surely in the current situation though it would make more sense to find an alternative method of speaking out. After all, it's only a week or so ago that there were reports on the news about the government not doing enough to prevent Covid amongst ethnic minority communities. This seems to fly in the face of that.
Are only minority north American lives worth breaking distancing rules for?
All very selective.
I think the impetus for such a protest is a mixture of outrage over George Floyd and the feeling of pressure that the virus is particularly deadly for BAME people.
How many anti China marches have there been in the UK, despite the appalling crackdown on their Muslim Uighur minorities? How many Hollywood stars have spoken out about it...or are they worried that China would ban their movies?
As for the increase in cycling, be interesting to see the figures when those dark nights draw in.
Cheers all 🍺
im found to spend at least an looking at this photo out of jealousy
i have thought of that now, in 2 minutes. I’m not sure if it would have worked but my point is, there are other ways to protest if planned properly rather than congregate in public during a pandemic that has cost 40,000 lives on our shores alone.
TBH given the images of crowding on the beaches etc a couple of weeks ago I think it’s a bit rich to say people shouldn’t protest over such a worthy cause. Lockdown was dead (if it ever really started) weeks ago in this country and I have no issue with people using their right to protest for something as important as this.
gutted they’re not open here.
The other concern is the the BAME community have a higher percentage of deaths yet these people are out protesting.
im sure some will have elderly relatives or those in the higher risk categories.
All racial groups were represented but if we are to believe the figures then surely this isn’t going to help this social group.
I do not agree with protesting whilst we are in the middle of a pandemic and considering the recent report that found that BAME people are more likely to die from Covid19 than white people, it is stupid for so many people from that community to go against all rules on social distancing. When the infection rate rises it will be easy for the Government to say that it is the fault of the protesters, rather than any relaxtion of the 'lockdown'.
I assume large quantities of people would have gone to the beach would be families and small groups of people, who would have got there by driving and would have found it easier to social distance in what would have been hotter weather.
I could be wrong but I imagine lots of people got to the protests by public transport, the weather is cooler, and there is pretty much limited social distancing and lots of mixing of different households. Many of them are wearing masks though which is good.
To be honest, my non scientific opinion is if/when we do get a '2nd peak' it won't be until after summer anyway so the likelihood is that neither of these events will make to much difference to the virus in the short term.
Anthony Joshua for example was very happy to get a MASSIVE payment to fight in that bastion of free speech, gay rights and equal opportunities for women Saudi Arabia last December.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Saudi_Arabia
I find the disregard for social distancing by people to be downright disrespectful to the situation and to people who are adhering to it.
Now I don't get shocked, i realise that in my area there is a high percentage per 1000 head of population of complete morons, but I was last evening. Hordes of young chavvy twats ignoring social distancing rules and just strolling in and out of the shop in groups. I thought about why i would be so bothered a bit and came to the conclusion, it was the utter selfishness on display.
I reckon September/October for the next plateau. Unfortunately, statistics wise it won't be those total cnuts i saw last night, it will be the vulnerable and yours and my treasured friends and relatives that pay the price.
As for those twats up in Parliament Square, do they not do irony? Black Lives Matter? When the BME population is so susceptable in this pandemic... mind boggles.
Maybe I missed him doing those things while I have been banged up indoors adhering to the lockdown advice for the last three months.
Deaths in UK due to Covid-19 in last 3 moths: Approx 40,000, of whom around 16% were from ethnic minorities (Approx 6,500).
Covid is by far this biggest killer in absolute terms and is more discriminatory in percentage terms. It is quite possible, though it would be very difficult to prove, that more people will die as a result of demonstrators breaking social distancing rules than as a result of bad policing. Misguided, is the politest thing this particular lily-livered liberal can say about the protesters.