One man's straight talking is another man's bullying. No idea what has gone on or what has been said to who, but we know Bowyer doesn't really sugar coat things, he speaks his mind, even in interviews, and he;s not really too bothered if it ruffles a few feathers. He's quite old school in that respect - entirely possible he's been giving what he probably feels are a few home s truths to players and some of them maybe don't appreciate the way the message is being delivered. Possibly a bit of a generational divide there too - it's a generalization, but people over a certain age always tend to think people under a certain age are a bit soft.
I don't believe Bowyer is a bully or is out to deliberately upset or belittle anyone, but entirely possible that he's too blunt for some people and that his manner has upset some.
Williams may also have had his own problems.
The players putting this out into the public arena need to have a good look at themselves. I think it is a despicable thing to do. Williams seems to be liked by everyone and deserves so much better from his old team mates. Makes him sound weak and I don’t think he is. I have to say that if I had learnt something like this from a player I would not be putting it out there. Ironic that Bowyer is being accused of bullying, and is now being bullied.
That's it. If you want an illustration of my point about delusional fans, here you go.
What it is important to say is that sometimes people snap and it isn't their intention to feed information.
I think J Block and myself have not given the detail of what we know (from different players and different sources) or which player is responsible. But obviously, if you know something you believe is wrong it is hard to support the people/person you think are in the wrong. Especially when it isn't a massive leap to predict and then see the damage it is doing.
You really are arrogant aren’t you. Delusional my arse. So we are expected to believe everything you say because you say it.
How did he make him cry? Why did he make him cry? Did he mean to make him cry? Why has it taken over a month to come out? Why are the circumstances not out here? We are expected to believe that these poor victimised players are so desperate that they are at snapping point and need to unload themselves to a couple of fans. They are members of the players Union FFS.
They should stand up for themselves or take matters up via the management line - like everyone else in work has to do. That is the right way to do things. Not creeping behind peoples backs and making unsubstantiated allegations. Their behaviour is worse.
The last claim was that Bowyer does not discuss tactics with players. Believing that is delusional. Pure fantasy. There is so much to criticise on team selection, formations and results, but these underhand snide comments are below contempt.
if they were fabricatede, you would be right, but as usual, you're wrong
It does not matter if they are true. Don’t you get it?
i do get it - 'telling tales and all that - u r one of the very few who still thinks that LB staying at charlton is best for the club - you are in a very very small minority now but the reality is that things leak out - players talk to other players, they talk to friends and family etc etc - its always happened and always will
One man's straight talking is another man's bullying. No idea what has gone on or what has been said to who, but we know Bowyer doesn't really sugar coat things, he speaks his mind, even in interviews, and he;s not really too bothered if it ruffles a few feathers. He's quite old school in that respect - entirely possible he's been giving what he probably feels are a few home s truths to players and some of them maybe don't appreciate the way the message is being delivered. Possibly a bit of a generational divide there too - it's a generalization, but people over a certain age always tend to think people under a certain age are a bit soft.
I don't believe Bowyer is a bully or is out to deliberately upset or belittle anyone, but entirely possible that he's too blunt for some people and that his manner has upset some.
Williams may also have had his own problems.
The players putting this out into the public arena need to have a good look at themselves. I think it is a despicable thing to do. Williams seems to be liked by everyone and deserves so much better from his old team mates. Makes him sound weak and I don’t think he is. I have to say that if I had learnt something like this from a player I would not be putting it out there. Ironic that Bowyer is being accused of bullying, and is now being bullied.
That's it. If you want an illustration of my point about delusional fans, here you go.
What it is important to say is that sometimes people snap and it isn't their intention to feed information.
I think J Block and myself have not given the detail of what we know (from different players and different sources) or which player is responsible. But obviously, if you know something you believe is wrong it is hard to support the people/person you think are in the wrong. Especially when it isn't a massive leap to predict and then see the damage it is doing.
You really are arrogant aren’t you. Delusional my arse. So we are expected to believe everything you say because you say it.
How did he make him cry? Why did he make him cry? Did he mean to make him cry? Why has it taken over a month to come out? Why are the circumstances not out here? We are expected to believe that these poor victimised players are so desperate that they are at snapping point and need to unload themselves to a couple of fans. They are members of the players Union FFS.
They should stand up for themselves or take matters up via the management line - like everyone else in work has to do. That is the right way to do things. Not creeping behind peoples backs and making unsubstantiated allegations. Their behaviour is worse.
The last claim was that Bowyer does not discuss tactics with players. Believing that is delusional. Pure fantasy. There is so much to criticise on team selection, formations and results, but these underhand snide comments are below contempt.
Plenty of good people suffer bullying. Plenty of good people witness bullying yet nothing changes. If only it was as simple as you make it out. I’ve worked in a setting where a whole group, ten or more were the subject of bullying. It’s nowhere near as straightforward confronting a bully as you might think.
I agree. And in a lot of bullying cases the accused is surprised, if not shocked, as it was never their intention to bully someone. Often they are very upset themselves.
We all have a responsibility in the workplace to stamp out bullying. There is a right way to do this. Bullies need to be pulled up and need and to change or go. No question. There is no place in the workplace for a bully.
But I have also seen managers bullied, and one of the ways this is achieved is by the spreading of lies and half truths to undermine everything they are trying to do. Quite often they are aware of what is being said but cannot respond because conversations are confidential.
One man's straight talking is another man's bullying. No idea what has gone on or what has been said to who, but we know Bowyer doesn't really sugar coat things, he speaks his mind, even in interviews, and he;s not really too bothered if it ruffles a few feathers. He's quite old school in that respect - entirely possible he's been giving what he probably feels are a few home s truths to players and some of them maybe don't appreciate the way the message is being delivered. Possibly a bit of a generational divide there too - it's a generalization, but people over a certain age always tend to think people under a certain age are a bit soft.
I don't believe Bowyer is a bully or is out to deliberately upset or belittle anyone, but entirely possible that he's too blunt for some people and that his manner has upset some.
Williams may also have had his own problems.
The players putting this out into the public arena need to have a good look at themselves. I think it is a despicable thing to do. Williams seems to be liked by everyone and deserves so much better from his old team mates. Makes him sound weak and I don’t think he is. I have to say that if I had learnt something like this from a player I would not be putting it out there. Ironic that Bowyer is being accused of bullying, and is now being bullied.
That's it. If you want an illustration of my point about delusional fans, here you go.
What it is important to say is that sometimes people snap and it isn't their intention to feed information.
I think J Block and myself have not given the detail of what we know (from different players and different sources) or which player is responsible. But obviously, if you know something you believe is wrong it is hard to support the people/person you think are in the wrong. Especially when it isn't a massive leap to predict and then see the damage it is doing.
You really are arrogant aren’t you. Delusional my arse. So we are expected to believe everything you say because you say it.
How did he make him cry? Why did he make him cry? Did he mean to make him cry? Why has it taken over a month to come out? Why are the circumstances not out here? We are expected to believe that these poor victimised players are so desperate that they are at snapping point and need to unload themselves to a couple of fans. They are members of the players Union FFS.
They should stand up for themselves or take matters up via the management line - like everyone else in work has to do. That is the right way to do things. Not creeping behind peoples backs and making unsubstantiated allegations. Their behaviour is worse.
The last claim was that Bowyer does not discuss tactics with players. Believing that is delusional. Pure fantasy. There is so much to criticise on team selection, formations and results, but these underhand snide comments are below contempt.
Have you ever heard a player stand in front of the press and criticise a manager? There again, most managers have too much class to publicly rebuke a player in the way that LB has done to at least a dozen players in the last year. In fact, I cannot think of any other industry where management would do that. Can you?
One man's straight talking is another man's bullying. No idea what has gone on or what has been said to who, but we know Bowyer doesn't really sugar coat things, he speaks his mind, even in interviews, and he;s not really too bothered if it ruffles a few feathers. He's quite old school in that respect - entirely possible he's been giving what he probably feels are a few home s truths to players and some of them maybe don't appreciate the way the message is being delivered. Possibly a bit of a generational divide there too - it's a generalization, but people over a certain age always tend to think people under a certain age are a bit soft.
I don't believe Bowyer is a bully or is out to deliberately upset or belittle anyone, but entirely possible that he's too blunt for some people and that his manner has upset some.
Williams may also have had his own problems.
The players putting this out into the public arena need to have a good look at themselves. I think it is a despicable thing to do. Williams seems to be liked by everyone and deserves so much better from his old team mates. Makes him sound weak and I don’t think he is. I have to say that if I had learnt something like this from a player I would not be putting it out there. Ironic that Bowyer is being accused of bullying, and is now being bullied.
That's it. If you want an illustration of my point about delusional fans, here you go.
What it is important to say is that sometimes people snap and it isn't their intention to feed information.
I think J Block and myself have not given the detail of what we know (from different players and different sources) or which player is responsible. But obviously, if you know something you believe is wrong it is hard to support the people/person you think are in the wrong. Especially when it isn't a massive leap to predict and then see the damage it is doing.
You really are arrogant aren’t you. Delusional my arse. So we are expected to believe everything you say because you say it.
How did he make him cry? Why did he make him cry? Did he mean to make him cry? Why has it taken over a month to come out? Why are the circumstances not out here? We are expected to believe that these poor victimised players are so desperate that they are at snapping point and need to unload themselves to a couple of fans. They are members of the players Union FFS.
They should stand up for themselves or take matters up via the management line - like everyone else in work has to do. That is the right way to do things. Not creeping behind peoples backs and making unsubstantiated allegations. Their behaviour is worse.
The last claim was that Bowyer does not discuss tactics with players. Believing that is delusional. Pure fantasy. There is so much to criticise on team selection, formations and results, but these underhand snide comments are below contempt.
if they were fabricatede, you would be right, but as usual, you're wrong
It does not matter if they are true. Don’t you get it?
i do get it - 'telling tales and all that - u r one of the very few who still thinks that LB staying at charlton is best for the club - you are in a very very small minority now but the reality is that things leak out - players talk to other players, they talk to friends and family etc etc - its always happened and always will
Really? And what evidence do you have for that, and what difference has that got to do with appropriate and inappropriate behaviour?
We all have pseudonyms on here, we don't know who each person is or the people that have given them information about the team. It is all innuendo, no real names just unsubstantiated rumour. I don't know what LB said or didn't say, I don't know who said any of it as they don't use their real names. All this leaves a bad taste and denigrates this site. If you know something then have the balls to be honest and say who you are, who told you or shut up!
do you know redrobo? you could try comforting each other if that helps?
We all have pseudonyms on here, we don't know who each person is or the people that have given them information about the team. It is all innuendo, no real names just unsubstantiated rumour. I don't know what LB said or didn't say, I don't know who said any of it as they don't use their real names. All this leaves a bad taste and denigrates this site. If you know something then have the balls to be honest and say who you are, who told you or shut up!
One man's straight talking is another man's bullying. No idea what has gone on or what has been said to who, but we know Bowyer doesn't really sugar coat things, he speaks his mind, even in interviews, and he;s not really too bothered if it ruffles a few feathers. He's quite old school in that respect - entirely possible he's been giving what he probably feels are a few home s truths to players and some of them maybe don't appreciate the way the message is being delivered. Possibly a bit of a generational divide there too - it's a generalization, but people over a certain age always tend to think people under a certain age are a bit soft.
I don't believe Bowyer is a bully or is out to deliberately upset or belittle anyone, but entirely possible that he's too blunt for some people and that his manner has upset some.
Williams may also have had his own problems.
The players putting this out into the public arena need to have a good look at themselves. I think it is a despicable thing to do. Williams seems to be liked by everyone and deserves so much better from his old team mates. Makes him sound weak and I don’t think he is. I have to say that if I had learnt something like this from a player I would not be putting it out there. Ironic that Bowyer is being accused of bullying, and is now being bullied.
That's it. If you want an illustration of my point about delusional fans, here you go.
What it is important to say is that sometimes people snap and it isn't their intention to feed information.
I think J Block and myself have not given the detail of what we know (from different players and different sources) or which player is responsible. But obviously, if you know something you believe is wrong it is hard to support the people/person you think are in the wrong. Especially when it isn't a massive leap to predict and then see the damage it is doing.
You really are arrogant aren’t you. Delusional my arse. So we are expected to believe everything you say because you say it.
How did he make him cry? Why did he make him cry? Did he mean to make him cry? Why has it taken over a month to come out? Why are the circumstances not out here? We are expected to believe that these poor victimised players are so desperate that they are at snapping point and need to unload themselves to a couple of fans. They are members of the players Union FFS.
They should stand up for themselves or take matters up via the management line - like everyone else in work has to do. That is the right way to do things. Not creeping behind peoples backs and making unsubstantiated allegations. Their behaviour is worse.
The last claim was that Bowyer does not discuss tactics with players. Believing that is delusional. Pure fantasy. There is so much to criticise on team selection, formations and results, but these underhand snide comments are below contempt.
if they were fabricatede, you would be right, but as usual, you're wrong
It does not matter if they are true. Don’t you get it?
i do get it - 'telling tales and all that - u r one of the very few who still thinks that LB staying at charlton is best for the club - you are in a very very small minority now but the reality is that things leak out - players talk to other players, they talk to friends and family etc etc - its always happened and always will
We now have four different posters with first hand accounts of Bowyer’s bullying, I’d say that’s new for us. Sure we have the odd poster that has real transfer news etc. But I can’t remember a time before where four people have heard from players of what’s happened and been said in dressing room or training ground.
We all have pseudonyms on here, we don't know who each person is or the people that have given them information about the team. It is all innuendo, no real names just unsubstantiated rumour. I don't know what LB said or didn't say, I don't know who said any of it as they don't use their real names. All this leaves a bad taste and denigrates this site. If you know something then have the balls to be honest and say who you are, who told you or shut up!
One man's straight talking is another man's bullying. No idea what has gone on or what has been said to who, but we know Bowyer doesn't really sugar coat things, he speaks his mind, even in interviews, and he;s not really too bothered if it ruffles a few feathers. He's quite old school in that respect - entirely possible he's been giving what he probably feels are a few home s truths to players and some of them maybe don't appreciate the way the message is being delivered. Possibly a bit of a generational divide there too - it's a generalization, but people over a certain age always tend to think people under a certain age are a bit soft.
I don't believe Bowyer is a bully or is out to deliberately upset or belittle anyone, but entirely possible that he's too blunt for some people and that his manner has upset some.
Williams may also have had his own problems.
The players putting this out into the public arena need to have a good look at themselves. I think it is a despicable thing to do. Williams seems to be liked by everyone and deserves so much better from his old team mates. Makes him sound weak and I don’t think he is. I have to say that if I had learnt something like this from a player I would not be putting it out there. Ironic that Bowyer is being accused of bullying, and is now being bullied.
That's it. If you want an illustration of my point about delusional fans, here you go.
What it is important to say is that sometimes people snap and it isn't their intention to feed information.
I think J Block and myself have not given the detail of what we know (from different players and different sources) or which player is responsible. But obviously, if you know something you believe is wrong it is hard to support the people/person you think are in the wrong. Especially when it isn't a massive leap to predict and then see the damage it is doing.
You really are arrogant aren’t you. Delusional my arse. So we are expected to believe everything you say because you say it.
How did he make him cry? Why did he make him cry? Did he mean to make him cry? Why has it taken over a month to come out? Why are the circumstances not out here? We are expected to believe that these poor victimised players are so desperate that they are at snapping point and need to unload themselves to a couple of fans. They are members of the players Union FFS.
They should stand up for themselves or take matters up via the management line - like everyone else in work has to do. That is the right way to do things. Not creeping behind peoples backs and making unsubstantiated allegations. Their behaviour is worse.
The last claim was that Bowyer does not discuss tactics with players. Believing that is delusional. Pure fantasy. There is so much to criticise on team selection, formations and results, but these underhand snide comments are below contempt.
if they were fabricatede, you would be right, but as usual, you're wrong
It does not matter if they are true. Don’t you get it?
i do get it - 'telling tales and all that - u r one of the very few who still thinks that LB staying at charlton is best for the club - you are in a very very small minority now but the reality is that things leak out - players talk to other players, they talk to friends and family etc etc - its always happened and always will
We now have four different posters with first hand accounts of Bowyer’s bullying, I’d say that’s new for us. Sure we have the odd poster that has real transfer news etc. But I can’t remember a time before where four people have heard from players of what’s happened and been said in dressing room or training ground.
I would make no comment on whether there was any bullying as I don't know, I wasn't there.
I'm happy to comment on team selections and tactics because I do know (watching the games).
All I would say is we've heard for years of managers throwing tea cups. Fergie throwing and hitting Beckham in the face with a boot etc etc etc. Fergie's hairdryer. I heard Mouhrino saying to the Spurs players you've all got to be c%nts on the pitch.
So whatever Bowyer did or didn't say let's not pretend for one moment that he is somehow unique. I would assume shouting at the players was and possibly still is the norm. I have to agree with others that I've never heard of a footballer crying before (they may have, but I've never heard it).
I can barely imagine for example playing Millwall away last season and Bowyer laying into the players at half time, telling them to get stuck in, because we're too soft and all the players burst into tears.
This thread encapsulates how totally depressing it is being a Charlton fan at the moment.
cheer up - we've been in much worse positions than this - we've got a good owner and once he makes the inevitable decision, we can start looking up again
Think you need to know the full story and context before fuming. And none of us probably will ever know it.
I witnessed a colleague break down in tears whilst receiving criticism from our manager many moons ago. We only found out much later that they were going through a messy divorce at the time which was playing havoc with the emotions.
Just one example of a multitude of scenarios that could be at play here.
Id be interested to see if things have soured since Roddy appeared on the scene....oddly and I can't explain this feeling, but I took an instant dislike to him in an interview. Could this be an issue between Bowyer and Roddy that's unsettling the squad?
I know who Id prefer out of the two and his surname doesn't begin with R
This thread encapsulates how totally depressing it is being a Charlton fan at the moment.
cheer up - we've been in much worse positions than this - we've got a good owner and once he makes the inevitable decision, we can start looking up again
Think you need to know the full story and context before fuming. And none of us probably will ever know it.
I witnessed a colleague break down in tears whilst receiving criticism from our manager many moons ago. We only found out much later that they were going through a messy divorce at the time which was playing havoc with the emotions.
Just one example of a multitude of scenarios that could be at play here.
Absolutely, and we have no context to make an informed judgement. Serious issues or exaggerated tittle tattle?
One man's straight talking is another man's bullying. No idea what has gone on or what has been said to who, but we know Bowyer doesn't really sugar coat things, he speaks his mind, even in interviews, and he;s not really too bothered if it ruffles a few feathers. He's quite old school in that respect - entirely possible he's been giving what he probably feels are a few home s truths to players and some of them maybe don't appreciate the way the message is being delivered. Possibly a bit of a generational divide there too - it's a generalization, but people over a certain age always tend to think people under a certain age are a bit soft.
I don't believe Bowyer is a bully or is out to deliberately upset or belittle anyone, but entirely possible that he's too blunt for some people and that his manner has upset some.
Williams may also have had his own problems.
The players putting this out into the public arena need to have a good look at themselves. I think it is a despicable thing to do. Williams seems to be liked by everyone and deserves so much better from his old team mates. Makes him sound weak and I don’t think he is. I have to say that if I had learnt something like this from a player I would not be putting it out there. Ironic that Bowyer is being accused of bullying, and is now being bullied.
That's it. If you want an illustration of my point about delusional fans, here you go.
What it is important to say is that sometimes people snap and it isn't their intention to feed information.
I think J Block and myself have not given the detail of what we know (from different players and different sources) or which player is responsible. But obviously, if you know something you believe is wrong it is hard to support the people/person you think are in the wrong. Especially when it isn't a massive leap to predict and then see the damage it is doing.
You really are arrogant aren’t you. Delusional my arse. So we are expected to believe everything you say because you say it.
How did he make him cry? Why did he make him cry? Did he mean to make him cry? Why has it taken over a month to come out? Why are the circumstances not out here? We are expected to believe that these poor victimised players are so desperate that they are at snapping point and need to unload themselves to a couple of fans. They are members of the players Union FFS.
They should stand up for themselves or take matters up via the management line - like everyone else in work has to do. That is the right way to do things. Not creeping behind peoples backs and making unsubstantiated allegations. Their behaviour is worse.
The last claim was that Bowyer does not discuss tactics with players. Believing that is delusional. Pure fantasy. There is so much to criticise on team selection, formations and results, but these underhand snide comments are below contempt.
if they were fabricatede, you would be right, but as usual, you're wrong
It does not matter if they are true. Don’t you get it?
i do get it - 'telling tales and all that - u r one of the very few who still thinks that LB staying at charlton is best for the club - you are in a very very small minority now but the reality is that things leak out - players talk to other players, they talk to friends and family etc etc - its always happened and always will
We now have four different posters with first hand accounts of Bowyer’s bullying, I’d say that’s new for us. Sure we have the odd poster that has real transfer news etc. But I can’t remember a time before where four people have heard from players of what’s happened and been said in dressing room or training ground.
I would make no comment on whether there was any bullying as I don't know, I wasn't there.
I'm happy to comment on team selections and tactics because I do know (watching the games).
All I would say is we've heard for years of managers throwing team cups. Fergie throwing and hitting Beckham in the face with a boot etc etc etc. Fergie's hairdryer. I heard Mouhrino saying to the Spurs players you've all got to be c%nts on the pitch.
So whatever Bowyer did or didn't say let's not pretend for one moment that he is somehow unique. I would assume shouting at the players was and possibly still is the norm. I have to agree with others that I've never heard of a footballer crying before (they may have, but I've never heard it).
I can barely imagine for example playing Millwall away last season and Bowyer laying into the players at half time, telling them to get stuck in, because we're too soft and all the players burst into tears.
With no context to it, as you say you weren't there, you can't say crying on its own is a sign of weakness or being soft.
Lawrence Dallaglio, Paul Gascoigne, Marco Tardelli and, almost, Stuart Pearce all cried on the pitch, for different reason. It doesn't make them soft. Does it?
There is a big difference between crying, in an emotional situation, and running to HR because your "feelings" have been hurt. There is no shame in the former.
If a number of senior pros felt the need to step in and took exception to what was said then it might suggest that what was said went above and beyond the usual bollocking players sometime get, but all speculation without the context on my part
I'm fuming. To do that to a lovely fella like JW. Fcuking bully.
Ooo come on now ! bully is a strong word if he was that im sure we would have known about it over the last few years and heard plenty of other stories from the past but we havent!
we all make mistakes dont we and maybe on this occasion bowyer did over step the line through anger/disappointment, pressure on him who knows added to the fact we dont know JW and whats going on in his life it could hve been a number of things that added up to that moment with bowyer
to label bowyer names because of an isolated incident like this after all he has done for us is abit strong i personally think as others have said managers up and down the leagues shout and scream at players and call them out in the media even in the prem just look at mourinho
If the rumours are true about Bowyer and Williams then it shows that Bowyer is a bit of a nasty piece of work, obviously a big IF still at this point.
He was banging the drum to us saying that Williams was a mentality based player, got to show he's loved etc, some way of showing it if he is making him upset.
I am sure the truth will all come out at some point
I'm fuming. To do that to a lovely fella like JW. Fcuking bully.
Ooo come on now ! bully is a strong word if he was that im sure we would have known about it over the last few years and heard plenty of other stories from the past but we havent!
we all make mistakes dont we and maybe on this occasion bowyer did over step the line through anger/disappointment, pressure on him who knows added to the fact we dont know JW and whats going on in his life it could hve been a number of things that added up to that moment with bowyer
to label bowyer names because of an isolated incident like this after all he has done for us is abit strong i personally think as others have said managers up and down the leagues shout and scream at players and call them out in the media even in the prem just look at mourinho
It is yes but you can see why people think that.
Launching into one of the smallest and (by all accounts) nicest players around and after working with him for a while he would probably know that Williams wouldn't say or do anything back.
Would Bowyer have said/done the same to Pearce, Aneke or Inniss? I doubt it.
I'm fuming. To do that to a lovely fella like JW. Fcuking bully.
Ooo come on now ! bully is a strong word if he was that im sure we would have known about it over the last few years and heard plenty of other stories from the past but we havent!
we all make mistakes dont we and maybe on this occasion bowyer did over step the line through anger/disappointment, pressure on him who knows added to the fact we dont know JW and whats going on in his life it could hve been a number of things that added up to that moment with bowyer
to label bowyer names because of an isolated incident like this after all he has done for us is abit strong i personally think as others have said managers up and down the leagues shout and scream at players and call them out in the media even in the prem just look at mourinho
Bowyer once took such exception to a supposed team mate that he physically took a swing at him live on the pitch. And we all know that there are certain unsavoury things that happened in the past that paint a less than flattering picture.
I don't know if this particular incident is true or not but LB is certainly no angel. Of course he should get the chance to learn from past mistakes but forgiving is not forgetting.
(FOR CLARITY: I am not even implying or suggesting that Bowyer has or would physically attacked JW. Simply stating that high standards and a short temper are not unknown quantities.)
But I only wanted him out when he started being ultra negative and digging out players. I was very positive towards him before that.
Quote button is your friend Mutts, hard to keep up with who you are responding to without the use of it.
Apologies. I don't think it is hard to work out the point I am making though whether you agree with it or not.
For what it's worth Muttley I agree with your thoughts on this whole sordid mess... LB needs to go or relegation is a strong possibility.
I've always found your postings to be very balanced so I'm a bit gobsmacked at some of the comments made towards you but this is what supporting Charlton is like... A big family who don't always agree with each other but the love of the club doesn't change!
I'm not bothered about it mate. I called this a few months back when we still had a chance of a winning season. The people trying to land the blows are the ostriches and it is usually the messenger these people aim at. It was the same with Southall. All good here, apart from one big fat wasted season that could unthinkably get worse.
This
The Gillingham 2-3 game was when I finally went from on the fence to bowyer out.
The Blackpool 0-3 I went from bowyer out to what the fuck is going on he’s lost the plot.
I think that the Gillingham game was a tipping point for a lot of us but the Burton game was def the WTF moment for me, i'm afraid by the time we got to Blackpool I had resigned myself to the inevitable defeat, unlike me, i like to be positive but WTFF.
You'll know we are finally down the pan when my chum @Lincsaddick predicts a defeat.
Comments
We support Charlton Athletic son.
We all have a responsibility in the workplace to stamp out bullying. There is a right way to do this. Bullies need to be pulled up and need and to change or go. No question. There is no place in the workplace for a bully.
But I have also seen managers bullied, and one of the ways this is achieved is by the spreading of lies and half truths to undermine everything they are trying to do. Quite often they are aware of what is being said but cannot respond because conversations are confidential.
Both are equally wrong.
Have you ever heard a player stand in front of the press and criticise a manager? There again, most managers have too much class to publicly rebuke a player in the way that LB has done to at least a dozen players in the last year. In fact, I cannot think of any other industry where management would do that. Can you?
We're moving to Croyden
I'm happy to comment on team selections and tactics because I do know (watching the games).
All I would say is we've heard for years of managers throwing tea cups.
Fergie throwing and hitting Beckham in the face with a boot etc etc etc.
Fergie's hairdryer.
I heard Mouhrino saying to the Spurs players you've all got to be c%nts on the pitch.
So whatever Bowyer did or didn't say let's not pretend for one moment that he is somehow unique.
I would assume shouting at the players was and possibly still is the norm.
I have to agree with others that I've never heard of a footballer crying before (they may have, but I've never heard it).
I can barely imagine for example playing Millwall away last season and Bowyer laying into the players at half time, telling them to get stuck in, because we're too soft and all the players burst into tears.
I witnessed a colleague break down in tears whilst receiving criticism from our manager many moons ago. We only found out much later that they were going through a messy divorce at the time which was playing havoc with the emotions.
Just one example of a multitude of scenarios that could be at play here.
I know who Id prefer out of the two and his surname doesn't begin with R
Serious issues or exaggerated tittle tattle?
Lawrence Dallaglio, Paul Gascoigne, Marco Tardelli and, almost, Stuart Pearce all cried on the pitch, for different reason. It doesn't make them soft. Does it?
There is a big difference between crying, in an emotional situation, and running to HR because your "feelings" have been hurt. There is no shame in the former.
if he was that im sure we would have known about it over the last few years and heard plenty of other stories from the past but we havent!
we all make mistakes dont we and maybe on this occasion bowyer did over step the line through anger/disappointment, pressure on him who knows
added to the fact we dont know JW and whats going on in his life it could hve been a number of things that added up to that moment with bowyer
to label bowyer names because of an isolated incident like this after all he has done for us is abit strong i personally think
as others have said managers up and down the leagues shout and scream at players and call them out in the media even in the prem just look at mourinho
He was banging the drum to us saying that Williams was a mentality based player, got to show he's loved etc, some way of showing it if he is making him upset.
I am sure the truth will all come out at some point
Launching into one of the smallest and (by all accounts) nicest players around and after working with him for a while he would probably know that Williams wouldn't say or do anything back.
Would Bowyer have said/done the same to Pearce, Aneke or Inniss? I doubt it.
I don't know if this particular incident is true or not but LB is certainly no angel. Of course he should get the chance to learn from past mistakes but forgiving is not forgetting.
(FOR CLARITY: I am not even implying or suggesting that Bowyer has or would physically attacked JW. Simply stating that high standards and a short temper are not unknown quantities.)