How can Bowyer lose it he ever had till TS took over and it only been 5 months ... Bowyer job starts in the summer
That's a valid point of view, how long would you give him after the summer?
I would suspect if it was a new manager most people would suggest 3 transfer windows is amount of fair time to rebuild a squad?
So no questions asked for another 2 years?
Well Bowyers had 2 transfer windows (August & January) since TS took over & has signed around 15 players in that time .
He's been backed. This is his team & his responsibility . If he gets until December as some are suggesting, that's another transfer window & potentially another season gone
I know he gets bombarded with messages on Twitter, but I'd be interested to know if TS reads this forum. I'm guessing not, but it would give him an insight into the fickle support of football fans generally and at Charlton in particular
Whilst I accept that is generally true, I don't think fans that are calling time on Bowyer are being fickle in this instance. We've been poor for a sustained period now & the season is slipping away
Are you for real? This period of time you are talking about is less than half of a season?
Portsmouth have had several seasons in this division now and have obviously not made it on each occasion, does that mean it’s time for Jackett to go? They are now looking strong contenders again this season...they have allowed him to build! Bowyer has not been given that opportunity, and typically the impatient charlton fan base which we are....call him out! I make a lot of you wrong!
Portsmouth have made the play offs at least two season running and are likely to make it 3 in a row. We are not going to make the play offs. Theres the difference
if Portsmouth failed to make the play offs, despite having one of the biggest and most expensive squads in the league (purrington, Pearce, The new winger, Schwartz) cost is over £1m) jacket would be under pressure. who else in the league has spent money?
but we are over achieving! That comment has done it for me, you’ve lost me now lee.
I’ve asked the question before on this thread but didn’t get any real response.
This is aimed directly at those stating that we need stability, we should repay loyalty, we can only win with Inniss/Famewo etc...
Would you be so willing to deflect the blame from the current manager if it were Robinson, Luzon, Slade etc? Be honest.
Wow, Robinson, Slade and Luzon?! Their golden periods of managing Charlton can be measured in minutes and hours rather than months and years. All three got far more financial backing than Bowyer as well.
What an extraordinary comparison. In answer to your question, I'd be just as willing to deflect blame from those three if they'd had two and a half years of over- achievement before hitting a bad spell. But they didn't. The end.
Bowyer has been backed financially in the last window. But yet doesn’t start the players involved.
How many league 1 clubs have spent money on players?
I’ve asked the question before on this thread but didn’t get any real response.
This is aimed directly at those stating that we need stability, we should repay loyalty, we can only win with Inniss/Famewo etc...
Would you be so willing to deflect the blame from the current manager if it were Robinson, Luzon, Slade etc? Be honest.
Wow, Robinson, Slade and Luzon?! Their golden periods of managing Charlton can be measured in minutes and hours rather than months and years. All three got far more financial backing than Bowyer as well.
What an extraordinary comparison. In answer to your question, I'd be just as willing to deflect blame from those three if they'd had two and a half years of over- achievement before hitting a bad spell. But they didn't. The end.
“Extraordinary comparison”? Christ, you were trying to compare the situation with Liverpool and Jurgen Klopp earlier.
The fact of the matter for me is that yesterday didn't make me turn. I had no complaints about the starting line up and I think it is a set up we should persevere with as far as possible. We did ok in spells. We responded well to their goals but when we got to a point where we needed to go up a gear we didn't. Gillingham rallied a bit and these short rallies resulted in goals. That for me is as much to do with confidence, or lack of it, as anything else. And I blame Bowyer for that lack of confidence.
I think the behaviours that have led to that are not as marked as before. We are now seeing a consistency of selection and Bowyer is taking his anger out on opponents rather than his own players. But when you have crossed a line, it isn't always the simple matter of taking a step back and expecting things to change. Whilst the vast majority of professional footballers will go out and do their jobs, that team ethic and willingness to run through brick walls for the manager and team can be the difference between a happy dressing room and a not so happy one.
Going back to the behaviours, we need to draw a comparison with Bowyer pre biblical injury issues and ESI and post. He takes over Robinson's mess and despite it looking unlikely we would go on the run we needed to make the play offs, he was puffing out his chest and telling us we would. This followed into the next season and when we got promoted. Everything was going in the right direction. Compare Bowyer's comments in interviews then with now. Where he was positive, he is now negative. A couple of examples. We were all in agreement that five subs would help us. No, Bowyer voted against it and was negative about it. Bowyer was moaning about the cap and rightly so for quite a while. Then when it is removed he focuses on the negatives of its removal. A positive manager talks these things up, whatever he truly thinks, to promote confidence.
Allied to this negativity which flowed over into how we approached games, there was his behaviours towards players and even fans. I don't have to go into the details, we all know them. It was crazy behaviour in plain sight. I don't understand why some of us can't take a step back and see the difference. It is something that happens in relationships. Something happens and then despite trying hard to get things back to where you were, you can't. Some managers can do great when things are going well and everybody is moving forwards together and can be terrible when things start to go wrong and they haven't got the answers. Pardew was a manager with a decent career before and after us, but due to some challenges outside of his call, and poor choices he lost his way and was never going to get it back in his current job. It was interesting that with a clean slate his career took an upturn.
It was of interest that Pratley and Watson told fans that there had not been a big clear the air meeting. To me it would have been a logical step. Sorry lads, I lost it a bit for a while due to all the pressures but give me another chance and let's have a clean slate to move forwards from. I believe that would help but Bowyer is not the sort to reset. He has to be told not to rather than find it from within. The players he has directly wronged have moved on, but it does have an impact on those left behind too.
Another defeat for Liverpool today. 2 wins from the last 7 games, not won at home since mid-December.
Van Dijk's injured, blah, blah, blah, Gomez is injured, blah, blah, blah. As if that's a reasonable excuse! Klopp's clearly lost it, bloke hasn't got a clue. Can't believe they've not sacked him yet and brought in Paul Jones or Danny Cowley.
Good comparison if it wasn't for Liverpools succes over the last few years
Yeah I know, ridiculous comparison by me. Klopp's barely spent a penny, whereas Bowyer's had his pick of lower league free transfers and inexperienced loanees. I bet Klopp would have jumped at the chance to sign Macaulay Bonne for £100k and Deli Oshilaja on a free. And Bowyer had the advantage of Lyle Taylor refusing to play, whilst poor old Jurgen had to put up with Mo Salah expecting to start every week.
Klopp's had barely any support from Liverpool's billionaire owners whereas good old Roland couldn't get his wallet out quick enough. Really you have to say it's an absolute disgrace that Bowyer wasn't sacked straight after the play off final.
Oh but hang on, he was sacked straight after the play-off final, and all the stupid Charlton fans complained about it because they ridiculously thought he'd worked a miracle in getting us promoted, so Roland reinstated him, so that we had to put up with him nearly keeping us up with the lowest budget in the Championship and absolute meltdown going on behind the scenes with the ownership.
Yep, you're right. You're definitely right.
OK its exactly the same situation
No, it clearly isn't exactly the same situation, so a bit odd of you to cite Klopp's success over the last few years, implying that Bowyer hasn't had any success, when he quite obviously had given the circumstances he was working under.
Has it been successful though? Yes we went up but came straight back down. He could easily leave us in a very similar position to the one he took over in.
Admittedly the circumstances have mostly been horrendous, so progress was a long shot. Unfortunately for him it’s not anymore so he’s open to a lot more criticism.
Bowyer might well turn out not to be the man, but I think he's earned the right to at least pick his first choice team a couple of times before we discard him. What's more, I think we owe him that, for staying last summer when there were offers from elsewhere and we were changing owners every other week, and for staying the year before despite being rewarded for promotion by getting the sack.
Not expecting to convince anyone to change their mind, but I can't get over how short some of your memories are, and how keen you are for us to become "that sort of club".
This comment keeps coming up. None of us want Charlton to become "that sort of club" no matter how many times it gets thrown around as a pretty weak ad hominem. Nor are memories short- most of us aren't denying Bowyer got us promoted or that it wasn't a great moment. But there comes a point that you have to ask, what is the point that he has to go? At what point has Bowyer crossed the line?
If we fail to get top six, is that it? It was the stated aim for the first half of this season but suddenly now we're overachieving whilst being outside of it.
I will always love Bowyer for being a part of the Wembley moments, and it felt all the better having someone 'proper Charlton' at the helm, but how long can that season be held up as a get out of jail free card?
I think he should get until the end of the season to try and get playoffs, for what its worth, but I wouldn't go as far as to give him until December or even longer as some have suggested if he misses the top six target.
Well we're not too far apart then. Whilst I personally would give him until December, I recognise that managers don't normally get that amount of time these days, and if we play out the remainder of the season in the same fashion as the last two months then I don't really expect him to stay, and you won't find me on here in May protesting about his dismissal if that's how it plays out.
But this thread started on 8 January - the transfer window had barely opened and he'd spent the season working with a squad that had been assembled at the last minute and already there were people saying he had to go - and it's snowballed ever since. There's loads of people on here calling for his head and saying that he needs to go now, regardless of what's gone before. I find that attitude hard to stomach, and it does make us "that kind of club".
He did get the opportunity to make some of that right though. The decision to sign another CM and not a CB was ridiculous. My biggest issue with Bowyer has always been his love of a CM. It's almost an obsession because I genuinely do not believe it makes sense at times. The salary cap was difficult, but it brings extra scrutiny/pressure because you can't afford to get much wrong. For me, he got that one wrong
On the match thread I posted the players we had at the start of the season.
Amos, Purrington, Oshilaja, Pearce, Pratley, Morgan, Williams, Lapslie, Oztumer, Doughty, Aneke, Bonne, Davison plus U23s and Barker.
To me that midfield looks reasonably ok, certainly not an area which was the main priority for strengthening, yet 2 of the first 3 signings Gilbey and Levitt were midfielders.
Because last season we had a few injuries in midfield in the first half, Bowyer had gone massively overboard with midfielders since then. The likes of Smith (the other one) and Davis last January typified this.
Absolutely, we're currently starting JFC, Shinnie and Pratley. You then have direct replacements for each of those with Gilbey, Morgan and Watson (plus Shinnie is playing RM anyway). How he looked at that midfield and thought we needed Smith I have no idea.
My major criticism of Bowyer has been that he has no idea what his best team or formation is. It's nice to have options and variety but it's something he needs to sort out.
He has, it’s clearly 4-4-2 and he’s stuck with it for most of the recent games.
Where I see an is our defending as a team. We got back in numbers yesterday which is better than we were doing in games like Rochdale at home, but we need a few of those players to better close down players outside the box.
This has always been a feature of Bowyer teams hasn't it? We were talking about this last year because it's so noticeable that we don't close people down around the area. I remember someone saying that it's a tactical choice to not close them down, since statistically speaking, it's better to encourage long-range efforts.
That tactic may have worked with Phillips in goal. With Amos not so.
How can Bowyer lose it he ever had till TS took over and it only been 5 months ... Bowyer job starts in the summer
That's a valid point of view, how long would you give him after the summer?
I would suspect if it was a new manager most people would suggest 3 transfer windows is amount of fair time to rebuild a squad?
So no questions asked for another 2 years?
Well Bowyers had 2 transfer windows (August & January) since TS took over & has signed around 15 players in that time .
He's been backed. This is his team & his responsibility . If he gets until December as some are suggesting, that's another transfer window & potentially another season gone
You can see how much he rated some of the players signed in that first window by how long their contracts given were. Quite a few seemed just a case of getting bodies in.
Why does the modern football fan support their team as if time is running out? As if every season is the last. No wonder manager turnover is so high these days. Transition seasons aren't allowed to exist.
How can Bowyer lose it he ever had till TS took over and it only been 5 months ... Bowyer job starts in the summer
That's a valid point of view, how long would you give him after the summer?
I would suspect if it was a new manager most people would suggest 3 transfer windows is amount of fair time to rebuild a squad?
So no questions asked for another 2 years?
Well Bowyers had 2 transfer windows (August & January) since TS took over & has signed around 15 players in that time .
He's been backed. This is his team & his responsibility . If he gets until December as some are suggesting, that's another transfer window & potentially another season gone
You can see how much he rated some of the players signed in that first window by how long their contracts given were. Quite a few seemed just a case of getting bodies in.
Why does the modern football fan support their team as if time is running out? As if every season is the last. No wonder manager turnover is so high these days. Transition seasons simply aren't allowed to exist.
Bowyer will definitely last to the end of the season and will probably start next season in charge. The question is what is a realistic expectations. Surely it’s must be top 2 and everything else is failure as we were competing for the play offs whilst in transition.
Sandgaard won’t have ticket number and booing from the crowd to base his decision but he will have Valley pass number. Can’t see purchases remaining high when lockdown is over and whilst we are playing mid table against Crewe on a really warm sunny day.
Top 6 isn’t going to happen, my expectations to the end of the season is to sort our defence out stop leaking goals, sort our discipline out and make sure we are capable of winning games when going a goal down.That is the backbone of any success
How can Bowyer lose it he ever had till TS took over and it only been 5 months ... Bowyer job starts in the summer
That's a valid point of view, how long would you give him after the summer?
I would suspect if it was a new manager most people would suggest 3 transfer windows is amount of fair time to rebuild a squad?
So no questions asked for another 2 years?
Well Bowyers had 2 transfer windows (August & January) since TS took over & has signed around 15 players in that time .
He's been backed. This is his team & his responsibility . If he gets until December as some are suggesting, that's another transfer window & potentially another season gone
You can see how much he rated some of the players signed in that first window by how long their contracts given were. Quite a few seemed just a case of getting bodies in.
Why does the modern football fan support their team as if time is running out? As if every season is the last. No wonder manager turnover is so high these days. Transition seasons aren't allowed to exist.
I don't think fans have been inpatient though. We were relegated last season under Bowyer. A new owner has come in, allowed him to rebuild the squad & results are still poor. He's bought players in, publicly criticised them & moved them on within a few months. He signed those players, so it's his responsibility.
Anyway we're going round in circles here. We're just going back & forth between those who think Bowyer should stay & those that think he should go. It's just the same arguments over & over again.
I may avoid this thread for a while, or maybe admin should close it.
How can Bowyer lose it he ever had till TS took over and it only been 5 months ... Bowyer job starts in the summer
That's a valid point of view, how long would you give him after the summer?
I would suspect if it was a new manager most people would suggest 3 transfer windows is amount of fair time to rebuild a squad?
So no questions asked for another 2 years?
Well Bowyers had 2 transfer windows (August & January) since TS took over & has signed around 15 players in that time .
He's been backed. This is his team & his responsibility . If he gets until December as some are suggesting, that's another transfer window & potentially another season gone
You can see how much he rated some of the players signed in that first window by how long their contracts given were. Quite a few seemed just a case of getting bodies in.
Why does the modern football fan support their team as if time is running out? As if every season is the last. No wonder manager turnover is so high these days. Transition seasons aren't allowed to exist.
I don't think fans have been inpatient though. We were relegated last season under Bowyer. A new owner has come in, allowed him to rebuild the squad & results are still poor. He's bought players in, publicly criticised them & moved them on within a few months. He signed those players, so it's his responsibility.
My points still remain. He gave some of them 1-year contracts, clearly stop-gap solutions in a time-tight situation. At the time of those signings, don't need to remind you that we were playing a midfield of Vennings, Oztumer & Levitt.
Another defeat for Liverpool today. 2 wins from the last 7 games, not won at home since mid-December.
Van Dijk's injured, blah, blah, blah, Gomez is injured, blah, blah, blah. As if that's a reasonable excuse! Klopp's clearly lost it, bloke hasn't got a clue. Can't believe they've not sacked him yet and brought in Paul Jones or Danny Cowley.
Good comparison if it wasn't for Liverpools succes over the last few years
Yeah I know, ridiculous comparison by me. Klopp's barely spent a penny, whereas Bowyer's had his pick of lower league free transfers and inexperienced loanees. I bet Klopp would have jumped at the chance to sign Macaulay Bonne for £100k and Deli Oshilaja on a free. And Bowyer had the advantage of Lyle Taylor refusing to play, whilst poor old Jurgen had to put up with Mo Salah expecting to start every week.
Klopp's had barely any support from Liverpool's billionaire owners whereas good old Roland couldn't get his wallet out quick enough. Really you have to say it's an absolute disgrace that Bowyer wasn't sacked straight after the play off final.
Oh but hang on, he was sacked straight after the play-off final, and all the stupid Charlton fans complained about it because they ridiculously thought he'd worked a miracle in getting us promoted, so Roland reinstated him, so that we had to put up with him nearly keeping us up with the lowest budget in the Championship and absolute meltdown going on behind the scenes with the ownership.
Yep, you're right. You're definitely right.
OK its exactly the same situation
No, it clearly isn't exactly the same situation, so a bit odd of you to cite Klopp's success over the last few years, implying that Bowyer hasn't had any success, when he quite obviously had given the circumstances he was working under.
Has it been successful though? Yes we went up but came straight back down. He could easily leave us in a very similar position to the one he took over in.
Admittedly the circumstances have mostly been horrendous, so progress was a long shot. Unfortunately for him it’s not anymore so he’s open to a lot more criticism.
Bowyer might well turn out not to be the man, but I think he's earned the right to at least pick his first choice team a couple of times before we discard him. What's more, I think we owe him that, for staying last summer when there were offers from elsewhere and we were changing owners every other week, and for staying the year before despite being rewarded for promotion by getting the sack.
Not expecting to convince anyone to change their mind, but I can't get over how short some of your memories are, and how keen you are for us to become "that sort of club".
This comment keeps coming up. None of us want Charlton to become "that sort of club" no matter how many times it gets thrown around as a pretty weak ad hominem. Nor are memories short- most of us aren't denying Bowyer got us promoted or that it wasn't a great moment. But there comes a point that you have to ask, what is the point that he has to go? At what point has Bowyer crossed the line?
If we fail to get top six, is that it? It was the stated aim for the first half of this season but suddenly now we're overachieving whilst being outside of it.
I will always love Bowyer for being a part of the Wembley moments, and it felt all the better having someone 'proper Charlton' at the helm, but how long can that season be held up as a get out of jail free card?
I think he should get until the end of the season to try and get playoffs, for what its worth, but I wouldn't go as far as to give him until December or even longer as some have suggested if he misses the top six target.
Well we're not too far apart then. Whilst I personally would give him until December, I recognise that managers don't normally get that amount of time these days, and if we play out the remainder of the season in the same fashion as the last two months then I don't really expect him to stay, and you won't find me on here in May protesting about his dismissal if that's how it plays out.
But this thread started on 8 January - the transfer window had barely opened and he'd spent the season working with a squad that had been assembled at the last minute and already there were people saying he had to go - and it's snowballed ever since. There's loads of people on here calling for his head and saying that he needs to go now, regardless of what's gone before. I find that attitude hard to stomach, and it does make us "that kind of club".
He did get the opportunity to make some of that right though. The decision to sign another CM and not a CB was ridiculous. My biggest issue with Bowyer has always been his love of a CM. It's almost an obsession because I genuinely do not believe it makes sense at times. The salary cap was difficult, but it brings extra scrutiny/pressure because you can't afford to get much wrong. For me, he got that one wrong
On the match thread I posted the players we had at the start of the season.
Amos, Purrington, Oshilaja, Pearce, Pratley, Morgan, Williams, Lapslie, Oztumer, Doughty, Aneke, Bonne, Davison plus U23s and Barker.
To me that midfield looks reasonably ok, certainly not an area which was the main priority for strengthening, yet 2 of the first 3 signings Gilbey and Levitt were midfielders.
Because last season we had a few injuries in midfield in the first half, Bowyer had gone massively overboard with midfielders since then. The likes of Smith (the other one) and Davis last January typified this.
Absolutely, we're currently starting JFC, Shinnie and Pratley. You then have direct replacements for each of those with Gilbey, Morgan and Watson (plus Shinnie is playing RM anyway). How he looked at that midfield and thought we needed Smith I have no idea.
My major criticism of Bowyer has been that he has no idea what his best team or formation is. It's nice to have options and variety but it's something he needs to sort out.
He has, it’s clearly 4-4-2 and he’s stuck with it for most of the recent games.
Where I see an is our defending as a team. We got back in numbers yesterday which is better than we were doing in games like Rochdale at home, but we need a few of those players to better close down players outside the box.
This has always been a feature of Bowyer teams hasn't it? We were talking about this last year because it's so noticeable that we don't close people down around the area. I remember someone saying that it's a tactical choice to not close them down, since statistically speaking, it's better to encourage long-range efforts.
There needs to be a balance and clearly we’re not getting it right at the moment.
I understand that quality is needed but how much does fitness and desire come in to the winning algorithm. I'd start again next season with youth as the core of the team. Experience counts for shit this season as results have shown. I have said it before, the Lincoln' boss looked at his squad at the end of last season and despite being a winning combination , he knew change was required for succes in League One. He slaughteed the old boys bringing the average player age down from 31 to 22. The result is well known.
Before the thread closes....Bowyer stay! Football is all about sentimentality. Our pre-match commentary shows us how we love our history. Bowyer is part of that so I hope he can be brought along with our future plans.
I had a stream with no commentary on it yesterday so could listen quite well to all the goings on. Bows seemed to spend most of the ref shouting at the ref demanding free kicks and telling the ref to book gills players. Started wondering if this could be affecting us negatively as the refs maybe pissed off with him and give more fouls against us?
I had a stream with no commentary on it yesterday so could listen quite well to all the goings on. Bows seemed to spend most of the ref shouting at the ref demanding free kicks and telling the ref to book gills players. Started wondering if this could be affecting us negatively as the refs maybe pissed off with him and give more fouls against us?
Surprised you could hear Bowyer over Steve Evans! :-)
It’s not just the bad results for me it’s the way Lee carries himself & come across. The way it’s never his fault ie the fans, players , refs & now opposing managers! Take the blame yourself man it’s your poor team selections, poor substitutions , poor tactics. The defence has been weakened but my god playing Pratley & Gunter in the back four for so long with Deji eventually on the bench not playing & refusing to sign any defenders saying we can’t find anyone better/don’t need anyone is insane! Picking on & slagging certain players & not others for the same mistakes! Now he says he is overachieving......what.
I’m wondering if his one of those managers that can have an impact initially & then drops off aka Mourinho! Really think it’s time for a change & to freshen the place up now.
I had a stream with no commentary on it yesterday so could listen quite well to all the goings on. Bows seemed to spend most of the ref shouting at the ref demanding free kicks and telling the ref to book gills players. Started wondering if this could be affecting us negatively as the refs maybe pissed off with him and give more fouls against us?
Surprised you could hear Bowyer over Steve Evans! :-)
Could hear a lot of both but easy to tell who's who with accents
I had a stream with no commentary on it yesterday so could listen quite well to all the goings on. Bows seemed to spend most of the ref shouting at the ref demanding free kicks and telling the ref to book gills players. Started wondering if this could be affecting us negatively as the refs maybe pissed off with him and give more fouls against us?
I tell you Bowyer missed a trick yesterday, Ryan Inniss should have been on the bench as kit man or something. Not as easy for Evans to bully and intimate the ref if he was there.
Bowyer should be more upset at the ref being influenced by Evans than Evans trying to do so. We were told that Evans tried to have the game postponed, he didn't manage to influence the ref then.
Looking at replays of Aneke's sending off, I think it was harsh but not something you could say was wrong. Some refs would have been lenient given the lack of intent and some wouldn't. If we could appeal it, we wouldn't win. So not sure we can say that was Evans.
Comments
He's been backed. This is his team & his responsibility . If he gets until December as some are suggesting, that's another transfer window & potentially another season gone
if Portsmouth failed to make the play offs, despite having one of the biggest and most expensive squads in the league (purrington, Pearce, The new winger, Schwartz) cost is over £1m) jacket would be under pressure. who else in the league has spent money?
but we are over achieving! That comment has done it for me, you’ve lost me now lee.
over achieving!!!!!!do one lee!
I think the behaviours that have led to that are not as marked as before. We are now seeing a consistency of selection and Bowyer is taking his anger out on opponents rather than his own players. But when you have crossed a line, it isn't always the simple matter of taking a step back and expecting things to change. Whilst the vast majority of professional footballers will go out and do their jobs, that team ethic and willingness to run through brick walls for the manager and team can be the difference between a happy dressing room and a not so happy one.
Going back to the behaviours, we need to draw a comparison with Bowyer pre biblical injury issues and ESI and post. He takes over Robinson's mess and despite it looking unlikely we would go on the run we needed to make the play offs, he was puffing out his chest and telling us we would. This followed into the next season and when we got promoted. Everything was going in the right direction. Compare Bowyer's comments in interviews then with now. Where he was positive, he is now negative. A couple of examples. We were all in agreement that five subs would help us. No, Bowyer voted against it and was negative about it. Bowyer was moaning about the cap and rightly so for quite a while. Then when it is removed he focuses on the negatives of its removal. A positive manager talks these things up, whatever he truly thinks, to promote confidence.
Allied to this negativity which flowed over into how we approached games, there was his behaviours towards players and even fans. I don't have to go into the details, we all know them. It was crazy behaviour in plain sight. I don't understand why some of us can't take a step back and see the difference. It is something that happens in relationships. Something happens and then despite trying hard to get things back to where you were, you can't. Some managers can do great when things are going well and everybody is moving forwards together and can be terrible when things start to go wrong and they haven't got the answers. Pardew was a manager with a decent career before and after us, but due to some challenges outside of his call, and poor choices he lost his way and was never going to get it back in his current job. It was interesting that with a clean slate his career took an upturn.
It was of interest that Pratley and Watson told fans that there had not been a big clear the air meeting. To me it would have been a logical step. Sorry lads, I lost it a bit for a while due to all the pressures but give me another chance and let's have a clean slate to move forwards from. I believe that would help but Bowyer is not the sort to reset. He has to be told not to rather than find it from within. The players he has directly wronged have moved on, but it does have an impact on those left behind too.
With Amos not so.
Why does the modern football fan support their team as if time is running out? As if every season is the last. No wonder manager turnover is so high these days. Transition seasons aren't allowed to exist.
Top 6 isn’t going to happen, my expectations to the end of the season is to sort our defence out stop leaking goals, sort our discipline out and make sure we are capable of winning games when going a goal down.That is the backbone of any success
I may avoid this thread for a while, or maybe admin should close it.
Before the thread closes....Bowyer stay! Football is all about sentimentality. Our pre-match commentary shows us how we love our history. Bowyer is part of that so I hope he can be brought along with our future plans.
I'm sure at 1 point I heard Bowyer shout to Evans 'sit down and shut the fuck up 😀
Looking at replays of Aneke's sending off, I think it was harsh but not something you could say was wrong. Some refs would have been lenient given the lack of intent and some wouldn't. If we could appeal it, we wouldn't win. So not sure we can say that was Evans.