should have got him in the summer along with Twine. But we dithered & delayed and finally had to go for Lee towards deadline day.
You snooze you lose.
Love how easy you make how you think it should be sound.
Well, both players were available in the summer & 90% of posters on here thought we should go for them. Twine is pulling up trees at MK, is their top goalscorer & has almost double the amount of our top goalscorer.
But we decided on a different strategy which by late August was showed to be pants & we panicked, bringing in players like Arter & Souare.
But them I said all this last summer so no Captain Hindsight here. I was told to be patient, trust the process & it would all be ok in the end.
So don't worry, we can all be patient and wait for Monday evening because of course we haven't had 4 weeks to sign players have we....🙄
Sorry Golfie, the Captain hindsight was not aimed at you specifically!
Can't be arsed if Burstow goes. Valley Gold membership each season to buy players that we get to see for a few months if they are half decent and have potential at playing at the higher level and they leave.
If that is our business model now and we are now a Crewe or Peterborough then so be it but I won't be forking out for it each season if players are just going to be sell on commodities. Not even worth having the VG priority tickets when we're not in the same league as millwall or palace as we are shite in the cup in both results and draws.
All our decent prospects end up going to Championship or Premier league clubs to bolster their sides. We don't have the resources and/ or ambition to keep hold of them and perhaps build a team that will progress us up the leagues.
We used to beat Chelsea and Spurs who now use us as loan recipients to develop their abundance of youngsters to be resold at profit or rehab their injured players.
Fed up with it all really. I accept that it's the reality of the modern game but it's shite and makes me wonder what the point of it is as the "one day" optimism and hope that keeps us turning up every week seems even more futile with each passing season.
Seeing the future stars of the premier league for 5 minutes before they're off down the road to villa or whoever doesn't cut it.
First things first he not going anywhere .. second this is why TS agreed to take over the 12 mill development of the training ground and academy so we can get back to grade one status which will stop teams taking our players without proper transfer fee
If he goes we will get a "proper transfer fee" because he has signed a professional contract. You could right what you know on the back of a stamp with a sharpie. The square root of fuck all.
should have got him in the summer along with Twine. But we dithered & delayed and finally had to go for Lee towards deadline day.
You snooze you lose.
Love how easy you make how you think it should be sound.
Well, both players were available in the summer & 90% of posters on here thought we should go for them. Twine is pulling up trees at MK, is their top goalscorer & has almost double the amount of our top goalscorer.
But we decided on a different strategy which by late August was showed to be pants & we panicked, bringing in players like Arter & Souare.
But them I said all this last summer & was told to be patient, trust the process & it would all be ok in the end.
You have a fantastic way of over simplifying everything. If only football was as simple as ‘I think this player is a really good player so let’s buy him’.
should have got him in the summer along with Twine. But we dithered & delayed and finally had to go for Lee towards deadline day.
You snooze you lose.
We did not make any bid for Twine and Ipswich offers silly wages to get him.. now that could be an issue for the player when trying tho move .. so now we did not dither at all
Is this the Twine that plays for MK Dons or his long lost brother that plays for Ipswich under a fake name?
This season feels like it could really be one to regret for a good few reasons but the academy feels like a major one.
We have the best crop of youngsters in terms or quality & quantity that I can ever remember and not getting out of this league could see us lose many of them for not a lot of money or appearances.
The difference between being in this crappy league and the Champ is as we know massive in terms of keeping our kids both fiscally and the football.
Just maybe if we’d gone a bit bigger or done our business a earlier or a bit better we’d be in the mix and in a much better place to be able to sign up the likes of Mason, Kanu, Adigun, Beadle and the rest to better contracts and selling on our terms for a change.
It’s always felt like the summer was a massive missed opportunity.
If I have to consider how absolutely ridiculous it was for us not to try to sign Scott Twine last summer again I think I'm going to need a long lie down!
Ticked every box - apart from our black one
Ogilvie and Twine seemed the no brainers for me, I know this isn't Football Manager and that easy, but they seemed two very good fits, and on frees so you'd think we could have done more with wages.
"We will not be selling our good young players" or words to that effect. This is a vital test now with Burstow.
I will be absolutely gutted if he goes.
If he went for £20,000,000, would any of us be disappointed? For £2,000,000, I know we all would.
The fee for Lookman for example was pretty decent, indeed he hasn't really progressed much since then
He hasn't really progressed?!
You think he'd have been better off staying at Charlton? 82 appearances in the PL, 22 in the Bundesliga by the age of 24?
Two seasons of football at 24...really, how exhausting. By the time Billy Bonds was 21 he had played 2 plus seasons and went on to play 663 more for West Ham. Paul Went had played 50 for Leyton Orient by the time he was 17 and came to Charlton. Alan Campbell had played 198 games by the time he was 21 ! Likewise Mike Bailey 151 by the time he was 24, Lennie Glover 177 by the age of 24. All youth products , mostly ours . They'll had long careers too.
82 by the cage of 24 is part time football really.
You seem to be living in the past.
And you're not adding things up.
82 in the PL, 22 in the Bundesliga and 45 games for us. 150 in total. 25 appearances per season on average since his breakthrough is pretty good.
I looked at our own youth products. These days young players are 'seemingly to delicate to play much. 25 a season is part time. Once every two weeks. Hardly back breaking work. Infact I played more as youth, once playing 3 times over a weekend. The hoary old living in the past jibe cuts no ice here. I cannot hardly quote from the bfuture can I ?
During an era when training was 3 laps round the pitch, a run up and down the terraces, followed by a sprint. The hard work, tactics and team building was done in the pub over a pint and a fag.
Ah, those were the days @Oggy 😉 A pre match meal was pie and chips, fag at half time and several beers after. Tactics consistent of, if the oppo are fast kick them and if they’re not kick them twice. 😂
This season feels like it could really be one to regret for a good few reasons but the academy feels like a major one.
We have the best crop of youngsters in terms or quality & quantity that I can ever remember and not getting out of this league could see us lose many of them for not a lot of money or appearances.
The difference between being in this crappy league and the Champ is as we know massive in terms of keeping our kids both fiscally and the football.
Just maybe if we’d gone a bit bigger or done our business a earlier or a bit better we’d be in the mix and in a much better place to be able to sign up the likes of Mason, Kanu, Adigun, Beadle and the rest to better contracts and selling on our terms for a change.
It’s always felt like the summer was a massive missed opportunity.
It not just a bit. Sandsgssrd should have gone earlier in signing new recruits and have found the cash for the best available. Now he is paying the price of not doing so.
should have got him in the summer along with Twine. But we dithered & delayed and finally had to go for Lee towards deadline day.
You snooze you lose.
We did not make any bid for Twine and Ipswich offers silly wages to get him.. now that could be an issue for the player when trying tho move .. so now we did not dither at all
When did he sign for Ipswich? He’s at MKD you plum.
"We will not be selling our good young players" or words to that effect. This is a vital test now with Burstow.
I will be absolutely gutted if he goes.
If he went for £20,000,000, would any of us be disappointed? For £2,000,000, I know we all would.
The fee for Lookman for example was pretty decent, indeed he hasn't really progressed much since then
He hasn't really progressed?!
You think he'd have been better off staying at Charlton? 82 appearances in the PL, 22 in the Bundesliga by the age of 24?
Two seasons of football at 24...really, how exhausting. By the time Billy Bonds was 21 he had played 2 plus seasons and went on to play 663 more for West Ham. Paul Went had played 50 for Leyton Orient by the time he was 17 and came to Charlton. Alan Campbell had played 198 games by the time he was 21 ! Likewise Mike Bailey 151 by the time he was 24, Lennie Glover 177 by the age of 24. All youth products , mostly ours . They'll had long careers too.
82 by the cage of 24 is part time football really.
You seem to be living in the past.
And you're not adding things up.
82 in the PL, 22 in the Bundesliga and 45 games for us. 150 in total. 25 appearances per season on average since his breakthrough is pretty good.
I looked at our own youth products. These days young players are 'seemingly to delicate to play much. 25 a season is part time. Once every two weeks. Hardly back breaking work. Infact I played more as youth, once playing 3 times over a weekend. The hoary old living in the past jibe cuts no ice here. I cannot hardly quote from the bfuture can I ?
"We will not be selling our good young players" or words to that effect. This is a vital test now with Burstow.
I will be absolutely gutted if he goes.
If he went for £20,000,000, would any of us be disappointed? For £2,000,000, I know we all would.
The fee for Lookman for example was pretty decent, indeed he hasn't really progressed much since then
He hasn't really progressed?!
You think he'd have been better off staying at Charlton? 82 appearances in the PL, 22 in the Bundesliga by the age of 24?
Two seasons of football at 24...really, how exhausting. By the time Billy Bonds was 21 he had played 2 plus seasons and went on to play 663 more for West Ham. Paul Went had played 50 for Leyton Orient by the time he was 17 and came to Charlton. Alan Campbell had played 198 games by the time he was 21 ! Likewise Mike Bailey 151 by the time he was 24, Lennie Glover 177 by the age of 24. All youth products , mostly ours . They'll had long careers too.
82 by the cage of 24 is part time football really.
You seem to be living in the past.
And you're not adding things up.
82 in the PL, 22 in the Bundesliga and 45 games for us. 150 in total. 25 appearances per season on average since his breakthrough is pretty good.
I looked at our own youth products. These days young players are 'seemingly to delicate to play much. 25 a season is part time. Once every two weeks. Hardly back breaking work. Infact I played more as youth, once playing 3 times over a weekend. The hoary old living in the past jibe cuts no ice here. I cannot hardly quote from the bfuture can I ?
During an era when training was 3 laps round the pitch, a run up and down the terraces, followed by a sprint. The hard work, tactics and team building was done in the pub over a pint and a fag.
Ah, those were the days @Oggy 😉 A pre match meal was pie and chips, fag at half time and several beers after. Tactics consistent of, if the oppo are fast kick them and if they’re not kick them twice. 😂
Apparently according to my mum fans, chips and beer was available but a lot of other foods were not. Especially chips as potatoes were not on the ration. Hence chips a lot. The only problem with your nonsense moment is that people of that era did more work of a physical nature, ate less compared with the ideal for the effort and at the end of the war were fitter and eager that the Fat chumps of the modern times. It follows that the footballers were as well. So as my dear old mum would say, "Put that in your pipe and smoke it". In other words belt up.
You really are a rude, ignorant, revolting individual.
This season feels like it could really be one to regret for a good few reasons but the academy feels like a major one.
We have the best crop of youngsters in terms or quality & quantity that I can ever remember and not getting out of this league could see us lose many of them for not a lot of money or appearances.
The difference between being in this crappy league and the Champ is as we know massive in terms of keeping our kids both fiscally and the football.
Just maybe if we’d gone a bit bigger or done our business a earlier or a bit better we’d be in the mix and in a much better place to be able to sign up the likes of Mason, Kanu, Adigun, Beadle and the rest to better contracts and selling on our terms for a change.
It’s always felt like the summer was a massive missed opportunity.
It not just a bit. Sandsgssrd should have gone earlier in signing new recruits and have found the cash for the best available. Now he is paying the price of not doing so.
That's the sad thing, we're now probably paying more playing catch up, buy cheap, buy twice etc.
Can't be arsed if Burstow goes. Valley Gold membership each season to buy players that we get to see for a few months if they are half decent and have potential at playing at the higher level and they leave.
If that is our business model now and we are now a Crewe or Peterborough then so be it but I won't be forking out for it each season if players are just going to be sell on commodities. Not even worth having the VG priority tickets when we're not in the same league as millwall or palace as we are shite in the cup in both results and draws.
All our decent prospects end up going to Championship or Premier league clubs to bolster their sides. We don't have the resources and/ or ambition to keep hold of them and perhaps build a team that will progress us up the leagues.
We used to beat Chelsea and Spurs who now use us as loan recipients to develop their abundance of youngsters to be resold at profit or rehab their injured players.
Fed up with it all really. I accept that it's the reality of the modern game but it's shite and makes me wonder what the point of it is as the "one day" optimism and hope that keeps us turning up every week seems even more futile with each passing season.
Seeing the future stars of the premier league for 5 minutes before they're off down the road to villa or whoever doesn't cut it.
First things first he not going anywhere .. second this is why TS agreed to take over the 12 mill development of the training ground and academy so we can get back to grade one status which will stop teams taking our players without proper transfer fee
Can't be arsed if Burstow goes. Valley Gold membership each season to buy players that we get to see for a few months if they are half decent and have potential at playing at the higher level and they leave.
If that is our business model now and we are now a Crewe or Peterborough then so be it but I won't be forking out for it each season if players are just going to be sell on commodities. Not even worth having the VG priority tickets when we're not in the same league as millwall or palace as we are shite in the cup in both results and draws.
All our decent prospects end up going to Championship or Premier league clubs to bolster their sides. We don't have the resources and/ or ambition to keep hold of them and perhaps build a team that will progress us up the leagues.
We used to beat Chelsea and Spurs who now use us as loan recipients to develop their abundance of youngsters to be resold at profit or rehab their injured players.
Fed up with it all really. I accept that it's the reality of the modern game but it's shite and makes me wonder what the point of it is as the "one day" optimism and hope that keeps us turning up every week seems even more futile with each passing season.
Seeing the future stars of the premier league for 5 minutes before they're off down the road to villa or whoever doesn't cut it.
First things first he not going anywhere .. second this is why TS agreed to take over the 12 mill development of the training ground and academy so we can get back to grade one status which will stop teams taking our players without proper transfer fee
Wonder how many of those calling for Twine, 1 knew of him before this summer or would have moaned if we had signed him?
This gets said quite a lot and I’m genuinely curious why. Is it because most fans don’t keep up with the league or listen to many football podcasts?
Scott Twine was universally raved about last season, 10+ goals and assists for two rubbish teams. If you have any sort of digital presence then you’ve probably seen some of his wonder goals.
The fact MK Dons got him means we had every chance if we had tried, which is a shame. Hopefully we can pick up the next one.
Wonder how many of those calling for Twine, 1 knew of him before this summer or would have moaned if we had signed him?
This gets said quite a lot and I’m genuinely curious why. Is it because most fans don’t keep up with the league or listen to many football podcasts?
Scott Twine was universally raved about last season, 10+ goals and assists for two rubbish teams. If you have any sort of digital presence then you’ve probably seen some of his wonder goals.
The fact MK Dons got him means we had every chance if we had tried, which is a shame. Hopefully we can pick up the next one.
Why if he went to MK Dons would he have chosen Charlton instead. We could have approached Eisa but didn't. There is a reason for both. We under rated them, could not afford them, didn't notice them or they gave us the elbow.
Well of course it’s one of those 4, congratulations on covering every angle. But why wouldn’t he have chosen Charlton over MK Dons? Find it hard to believe we couldn’t have competed with then financially and expectations were fairly high.
Wonder how many of those calling for Twine, 1 knew of him before this summer or would have moaned if we had signed him?
This gets said quite a lot and I’m genuinely curious why. Is it because most fans don’t keep up with the league or listen to many football podcasts?
Scott Twine was universally raved about last season, 10+ goals and assists for two rubbish teams. If you have any sort of digital presence then you’ve probably seen some of his wonder goals.
The fact MK Dons got him means we had every chance if we had tried, which is a shame. Hopefully we can pick up the next one.
Why if he went to MK Dons would he have chosen Charlton instead. We could have approached Eisa but didn't. There is a reason for both. We under rated them, could not afford them, didn't notice them or they gave us the elbow.
Thanks for explaining why transfers don’t go through 🙄
I can be negative and moany but man you really do take some beating.
Also totally agree that any fan of EFL football would have been very aware of Twine and that only grown this season. Probably the finest talent in the bottom two leagues right now.
Can't be arsed if Burstow goes. Valley Gold membership each season to buy players that we get to see for a few months if they are half decent and have potential at playing at the higher level and they leave.
If that is our business model now and we are now a Crewe or Peterborough then so be it but I won't be forking out for it each season if players are just going to be sell on commodities. Not even worth having the VG priority tickets when we're not in the same league as millwall or palace as we are shite in the cup in both results and draws.
All our decent prospects end up going to Championship or Premier league clubs to bolster their sides. We don't have the resources and/ or ambition to keep hold of them and perhaps build a team that will progress us up the leagues.
We used to beat Chelsea and Spurs who now use us as loan recipients to develop their abundance of youngsters to be resold at profit or rehab their injured players.
Fed up with it all really. I accept that it's the reality of the modern game but it's shite and makes me wonder what the point of it is as the "one day" optimism and hope that keeps us turning up every week seems even more futile with each passing season.
Seeing the future stars of the premier league for 5 minutes before they're off down the road to villa or whoever doesn't cut it.
First things first he not going anywhere .. second this is why TS agreed to take over the 12 mill development of the training ground and academy so we can get back to grade one status which will stop teams taking our players without proper transfer fee
If TS is gonna spend £12 mil developing real estate he does not own he is madder than I thought he was.
Wonder how many of those calling for Twine, 1 knew of him before this summer or would have moaned if we had signed him?
This gets said quite a lot and I’m genuinely curious why. Is it because most fans don’t keep up with the league or listen to many football podcasts?
Scott Twine was universally raved about last season, 10+ goals and assists for two rubbish teams. If you have any sort of digital presence then you’ve probably seen some of his wonder goals.
The fact MK Dons got him means we had every chance if we had tried, which is a shame. Hopefully we can pick up the next one.
Why if he went to MK Dons would he have chosen Charlton instead. We could have approached Eisa but didn't. There is a reason for both. We under rated them, could not afford them, didn't notice them or they gave us the elbow.
Thanks for explaining why transfers don’t go through 🙄
I can be negative and moany but man you really do take some beating.
Also totally agree that any fan of EFL football would have been very aware of Twine and that only grown this season. Probably the finest talent in the bottom two leagues right now.
I think if you gave most people the choice out of Twine and Fraser last sumer most would have gone for Fraser. Including the professionals.
It's quite easy to say we should or should have signed Twine either now or in the summer. But equally people were raving about Dale, the two Randalls, Dempsey, Kirk, Lowery, Jephcott and God knows who else.
Rember the tutting when we didn't sign Graham and Edwards?
Most of them have done sod all.
It would have been great to get Twine, on hindsight but it wasn't a "no brainer".
Wonder how many of those calling for Twine, 1 knew of him before this summer or would have moaned if we had signed him?
This gets said quite a lot and I’m genuinely curious why. Is it because most fans don’t keep up with the league or listen to many football podcasts?
Scott Twine was universally raved about last season, 10+ goals and assists for two rubbish teams. If you have any sort of digital presence then you’ve probably seen some of his wonder goals.
The fact MK Dons got him means we had every chance if we had tried, which is a shame. Hopefully we can pick up the next one.
Why if he went to MK Dons would he have chosen Charlton instead. We could have approached Eisa but didn't. There is a reason for both. We under rated them, could not afford them, didn't notice them or they gave us the elbow.
Thanks for explaining why transfers don’t go through 🙄
I can be negative and moany but man you really do take some beating.
Also totally agree that any fan of EFL football would have been very aware of Twine and that only grown this season. Probably the finest talent in the bottom two leagues right now.
I think if you gave most people the choice out of Twine and Fraser last sumer most would have gone for Fraser. Including the professionals.
It's quite easy to say we should or should have signed Twine either now or in the summer. But equally people were raving about Dale, the two Randalls, Dempsey, Kirk, Lowery, Jephcott and God knows who else.
Rember the tutting when we didn't sign Graham and Edwards?
Most of them have done sod all.
It would have been great to get Twine, on hindsight but it wasn't a "no brainer".
I think they are too different for a straight comparison but honestly I’d have gone for Twine - simply as I’d guess less competition coming from L2 and he was free vs. the 700k for Fraser.
Of your list Lowery was the other one to really impress me and did again the other week.
Wonder how many of those calling for Twine, 1 knew of him before this summer or would have moaned if we had signed him?
This gets said quite a lot and I’m genuinely curious why. Is it because most fans don’t keep up with the league or listen to many football podcasts?
Scott Twine was universally raved about last season, 10+ goals and assists for two rubbish teams. If you have any sort of digital presence then you’ve probably seen some of his wonder goals.
The fact MK Dons got him means we had every chance if we had tried, which is a shame. Hopefully we can pick up the next one.
Why if he went to MK Dons would he have chosen Charlton instead. We could have approached Eisa but didn't. There is a reason for both. We under rated them, could not afford them, didn't notice them or they gave us the elbow.
Well of course it’s one of those 4, congratulations on covering every angle. But why wouldn’t he have chosen Charlton over MK Dons? Find it hard to believe we couldn’t have competed with then financially and expectations were fairly high.
Your sarcastic comment becomes you. Naturally I covered every angle so some bloke like you , anxious to make a dig, could not say I hadn't covered every angle. Anyway it isn't hard to believe we couldn't compete because Twine and Eisa went to MK Dons and they paid a biggish fee for Eisa to Peterborough , which, I believe, we wouldn't meet.
I agree on Eisa, no way would we have paid that fee when we had signed Stockley and fully planned to play 1 up top. Not sure you’re correct on Twine.
Wonder how many of those calling for Twine, 1 knew of him before this summer or would have moaned if we had signed him?
This gets said quite a lot and I’m genuinely curious why. Is it because most fans don’t keep up with the league or listen to many football podcasts?
Scott Twine was universally raved about last season, 10+ goals and assists for two rubbish teams. If you have any sort of digital presence then you’ve probably seen some of his wonder goals.
The fact MK Dons got him means we had every chance if we had tried, which is a shame. Hopefully we can pick up the next one.
Why if he went to MK Dons would he have chosen Charlton instead. We could have approached Eisa but didn't. There is a reason for both. We under rated them, could not afford them, didn't notice them or they gave us the elbow.
Thanks for explaining why transfers don’t go through 🙄
I can be negative and moany but man you really do take some beating.
Also totally agree that any fan of EFL football would have been very aware of Twine and that only grown this season. Probably the finest talent in the bottom two leagues right now.
I think if you gave most people the choice out of Twine and Fraser last sumer most would have gone for Fraser. Including the professionals.
It's quite easy to say we should or should have signed Twine either now or in the summer. But equally people were raving about Dale, the two Randalls, Dempsey, Kirk, Lowery, Jephcott and God knows who else.
Rember the tutting when we didn't sign Graham and Edwards?
Most of them have done sod all.
It would have been great to get Twine, on hindsight but it wasn't a "no brainer".
I think they are too different for a straight comparison but honestly I’d have gone for Twine - simply as I’d guess less competition coming from L2 and he was free vs. the 700k for Fraser.
Of your list Lowery was the other one to really impress me and did again the other week.
That's opinion which is fine but if we had signed say Fraser, Edwards and Pigott (they were all on the CL wish list) everyone would have been happy. They have all flopped, for verious reasons at Ipswich.
Everyone would now be saying we should have signed Twine, Kirk (still at Crewe) and someone else instead.
Twine is about the only one on that list that both moved and has been a 100% success.
Our recruitment was confused, slow and ultimately not good enough. But not signing Twine wasn't the ultimate issue.
SLP said we pulled out of the Browne deal, Pete O’Rourke is claiming we were beaten by Oxford.
Great to have stories for both the optimists and pessimists
I’m hoping we pulled out of the Browne deal as a result of being made aware that Ipswich will let Fraser move (& is a lower risk from an injury point of view).
Comments
We have the best crop of youngsters in terms or quality & quantity that I can ever remember and not getting out of this league could see us lose many of them for not a lot of money or appearances.
The difference between being in this crappy league and the Champ is as we know massive in terms of keeping our kids both fiscally and the football.
Just maybe if we’d gone a bit bigger or done our business a earlier or a bit better we’d be in the mix and in a much better place to be able to sign up the likes of Mason, Kanu, Adigun, Beadle and the rest to better contracts and selling on our terms for a change.
It’s always felt like the summer was a massive missed opportunity.
A pre match meal was pie and chips, fag at half time and several beers after.
Tactics consistent of, if the oppo are fast kick them and if they’re not kick them twice. 😂
Now he is paying the price of not doing so.
I know one of you is on a wind up, but I am genuinely concerned that the other one isn't!
Thanks. I feel much happier now.
The fact MK Dons got him means we had every chance if we had tried, which is a shame. Hopefully we can pick up the next one.
I can be negative and moany but man you really do take some beating.
Also totally agree that any fan of EFL football would have been very aware of Twine and that only grown this season. Probably the finest talent in the bottom two leagues right now.
It's quite easy to say we should or should have signed Twine either now or in the summer. But equally people were raving about Dale, the two Randalls, Dempsey, Kirk, Lowery, Jephcott and God knows who else.
Rember the tutting when we didn't sign Graham and Edwards?
Most of them have done sod all.
It would have been great to get Twine, on hindsight but it wasn't a "no brainer".
Of your list Lowery was the other one to really impress me and did again the other week.
Everyone would now be saying we should have signed Twine, Kirk (still at Crewe) and someone else instead.
Twine is about the only one on that list that both moved and has been a 100% success.
Our recruitment was confused, slow and ultimately not good enough. But not signing Twine wasn't the ultimate issue.
Time will tell.