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Post-match Thread: Charlton Athletic vs Shrewsbury Town | Saturday 23rd April 2022
Comments
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People on here after Mania's stats immediately jumped to Jackson's defense that he didn't have a few players for a couple of games.ForeverAddickted said:
Haha - Shut upSELR_addicks said:
So less games than Stockley/Washington played under Jackson. But that's allowed to be an excuse.ForeverAddickted said:
Purrington played under Adkins, albeit just the two full games against Gillingham and Bolton.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
You said that Adkins didnt play Purrington - I corrected you, dont then suddenly change your line of the argument
I came and said Adkins also had to deal with injuries and literally every manager has to deal with them.
Excuses for one is allowed but not the other I suppose.1 -
You said Adkins didnt have Purrington... I gave you an example when he didSELR_addicks said:
People on here after Mania's stats immediately jumped to Jackson's defense that he didn't have a few players for a couple of games.ForeverAddickted said:
Haha - Shut upSELR_addicks said:
So less games than Stockley/Washington played under Jackson. But that's allowed to be an excuse.ForeverAddickted said:
Purrington played under Adkins, albeit just the two full games against Gillingham and Bolton.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
You said that Adkins didnt play Purrington - I corrected you, dont then suddenly change your line of the argument
I came and said Adkins also had to deal with injuries and literally every manager has to deal with them.
Excuses for one is allowed but not the other I suppose.
Thats it... end of story... end of discussion
I dont care about excuses as to who had someone available or whatever - I'm simply calling you out where you're once again coming out with something that is wrong.3 -
As soon as we scored second goal Kanu should have been on, Jackson you are a fool.7
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It was most definitely true at the time. Why not resurrect the old thread and remind yourself, if you now can't remember?SELR_addicks said:
We also had a play-off thread because jackson won a couple of games.Oggy Red said:
I'll agree with you that Adkins started the season with a mighty handicap, he didn't have a full squad let alone a match-fit side.SELR_addicks said:
Jackson played Aneke for 90 minutes two games in a row and ran him into the ground.Oggy Red said:
Oh, come on ...... Jacko hasn't seen much of Aneke, Fraser or JFC either.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
Purrington was injured pre-season but was fit again after a month and played under Adkins.
Maybe we might have seen JFC play a couple more games recently - but I don't know and you don't know, whether it's a meds team instruction to keep him on the bench?
Anyway JFC wants to play Dobson'e role. Should Jacko have dropped Dobson?
Purrington played two full games because of how unfit he was, that's all.
Fraser has been available for at least two months under Jackson.
I'm just saying that people love to line-up and excuse Jackson's poor form because of injuries. But will discount the handicap that Adkins was given to work with.
Whatever the issues surrounding Adkins culminating in his sacking, that's not even a level playing field - and IMO directly contributed to our shockingly poor start.
Don't forget Jacko inherited what Adkins couldn't cope with, the team in 22nd place, in the relegation positions.
Gawd knows, at the time we even had a long thread on here chewing the fat on whether we would be relegated; the Doomsters and Gloomsters were in their element.
I don't know what you expected from a rookie manager learning his trade, and of course his inexperience will lead to mistakes and misjudgements .... but are we in 22nd place now? If we were, we'd already be relegated.
Many people seem to have underestimated what Jacko has achieved. Sure, he didn't get us into the playoffs from 22nd place, but truthfully, what were you expecting? Last October, you'd have grabbed us finishing the season around 12th place when many at that time were convinced we'd be dumped into the Fourth Division for the first time in our history.
Jacko isn't the Messiah, well not yet, anyway ha ha ....... but seriously, let's see how the team rebuilding goes and the first dozen games of next season, eh?
By then you might have changed your mind about Jacko. Or calamity, I might even have to change mine!
So saying it was all doom and gloom wasnt true. People on here genuinely believed we had a squad capable of the playoffs in the first month of Jackson taking over.
You say: "People on here genuinely believed we had a squad capable of the playoffs in the first month of Jackson taking over."
They might have done, but their opinions were made at that time, 6 months ago. They were just people's own personal opinions, just like yours.
I'm not here to change your mind ...... but I will reiterate, when Adkins was sacked after yet another abysmal home defeat and mired deep in the relegation positions in 22nd place, Jacko took the reins returning home with well deserved victory at then 2nd in the League Sunderland. My God, I thought that was a breath of fresh air, didn't you?
Yeah, we had a good turn round in form which lifted the club. We held our own against the promotion chasing clubs and struggled against the minnows, but then we're Charlton ....I've witnessed more than half a century of that. Sure, some of us were doing the maths and having a little premature ejaculation .... but I'll repeat, did you really expect us to go from 22nd place to the playoffs?
Anyway, thank your lucky stars that the threat of relegation is a distant memory and instead, we're finishing the season around 12th.
Oh, and don't forget to thank Jacko on the way out!
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Certainly a fool is revealed, not sure if its Jackson though.Hartleypete said:As soon as we scored second goal Kanu should have been on, Jackson you are a fool.1 -
I was sober and wide awake and also have very little recollection of any football being played!grumpyaddick said:I was very tired and quite drunk for most of that match and have very little recollection of any football being played.9 -
I don't know any more than you do, Jimmy - or anybody else for that matter.JamesSeed said:
Does it really matter what JFC wants? Surely a guy with his ability could play a more attacking role? Remember the hattrick he scored at the Valley three or four years ago. Don’t think he was playing defensive role that day at least.Oggy Red said:
Oh, come on ...... Jacko hasn't seen much of Aneke, Fraser or JFC either.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
Purrington was injured pre-season but was fit again after a month and played under Adkins.
Maybe we might have seen JFC play a couple more games recently - but I don't know and you don't know, whether it's a meds team instruction to keep him on the bench?
Anyway JFC wants to play Dobson'e role. Should Jacko have dropped Dobson?Not Morgan’s biggest fan, but he’s been decent over the last couple of games. Has he done enough though?
We don't know how fit JFC is, whether he's being restricted by the Medical team or even where he fits in with others in the gameplan.
We also don't know what's going on behind the scenes, with his contract running down.
Morgan, well he has the ability with the ball, for sure.
But it's what he does without the ball that seems to be his weakness.
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We are second in the league for most headed goals with 18.killerandflash said:2 assists for Morgan makes 7 for the season, the most out of any Charlton player this season incidentally
I'd be interested in the stats for the type of goal we score, as I suspect the percentage of goals we score from set pieces or headers is quite high, especially with Stockley and Chuks in the air.
Wigan lead with 22.
Sunderland and Wycombe both on 17, Rotherham 15.2 -
Adkins was playing with Kirk who has turned out to be an effective player in the Championship for Blackpool.SELR_addicks said:
So less games than Stockley/Washington played under Jackson. But that's allowed to be an excuse.ForeverAddickted said:
Purrington played under Adkins, albeit just the two full games against Gillingham and Bolton.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
See, we can do this back and forth all day.0 - Sponsored links:
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That is quite interesting yes. Would love to compare the injury lists between the two. I am almost positive Jackson would’ve got a few more points with all of his players available.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Not to excuse the poor losses against the likes of Lincoln and Morecambe more recently. Unfortunate this team still has a nasty loss in them on any given matchday and that is what will stop this group from challenging top six, no matter who is in charge.
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He missed a header from six yards out in the 96th minute which will have accounted for the 0.4 spike right at the end of the graph.cafcsinger said:
Am I missing something here? How does Claire have an XG of 0.5 when all I can remember is him having a shot for 35 yards, and Washington misses two 1 on 1's but has 0.3?Scoham said:
According to the bloke’s questionable xG model (sources from live text feeds!), that was the best chance of the game.
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Conor Washington’s missed 1on1 shortly before was given roughly 0.25 xG according to the graph. Stockley’s bullet header that put us 1-0 up shortly afterwards was given about 0.35 xG.
Washington = green
Stockley = blue
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Our true level is showing by the number of points we've taken against the best teams in the division this season
Wigan - 0
Rotherham - 4
MKD - 0
Sunderland - 4
Plymouth - 3
Wycombe - 0
Wednesday - 1
Oxford - 0
That's 12 out of 480 -
Whist it is important to look at that and it does help show that we need to improve against the better teams. It is also worth noting that our run against the best teams of the league was also when we were missing all our strikers.killerandflash said:Our true level is showing by the number of points we've taken against the best teams in the division this season
Wigan - 0
Rotherham - 4
MKD - 0
Sunderland - 4
Plymouth - 3
Wycombe - 0
Wednesday - 1
Oxford - 0
That's 12 out of 48
What that does prove quite rightly though is that we do need to improve our strength in depth.0 -
There number 11, Udoh looked decent, had a great run and nearly scored.2
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What about when we were relegated from the Champ though? Our record against the top teams was good. Ultimately we’ve just been pretty poor regardless of oppositionkillerandflash said:Our true level is showing by the number of points we've taken against the best teams in the division this season
Wigan - 0
Rotherham - 4
MKD - 0
Sunderland - 4
Plymouth - 3
Wycombe - 0
Wednesday - 1
Oxford - 0
That's 12 out of 48
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People complain about Adkins dropping Dobson.Callumcafc said:
Adkins was playing with Kirk who has turned out to be an effective player in the Championship for Blackpool.SELR_addicks said:
So less games than Stockley/Washington played under Jackson. But that's allowed to be an excuse.ForeverAddickted said:
Purrington played under Adkins, albeit just the two full games against Gillingham and Bolton.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
See, we can do this back and forth all day.
But Jackson drops Kirk who is playing effective football in the division above.
We can do.0 -
Jackson played Kirk as a wingback. Adkins played him in his natural positionSELR_addicks said:
People complain about Adkins dropping Dobson.Callumcafc said:
Adkins was playing with Kirk who has turned out to be an effective player in the Championship for Blackpool.SELR_addicks said:
So less games than Stockley/Washington played under Jackson. But that's allowed to be an excuse.ForeverAddickted said:
Purrington played under Adkins, albeit just the two full games against Gillingham and Bolton.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
See, we can do this back and forth all day.
But Jackson drops Kirk who is playing effective football in the division above.
We can do.0 -
Without a natural left-back, everyone at Crewe said Kirk was at his best playing with an overlapping full back.Chunes said:
Jackson played Kirk as a wingback. Adkins played him in his natural positionSELR_addicks said:
People complain about Adkins dropping Dobson.Callumcafc said:
Adkins was playing with Kirk who has turned out to be an effective player in the Championship for Blackpool.SELR_addicks said:
So less games than Stockley/Washington played under Jackson. But that's allowed to be an excuse.ForeverAddickted said:
Purrington played under Adkins, albeit just the two full games against Gillingham and Bolton.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
See, we can do this back and forth all day.
But Jackson drops Kirk who is playing effective football in the division above.
We can do.
We didn't learn and went into the season with Gunter playing Left back.0 - Sponsored links:
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I thought we brought in Roddy to play behind him? Oh wait...SELR_addicks said:
Without a natural left-back, everyone at Crewe said Kirk was at his best playing with an overlapping full back.Chunes said:
Jackson played Kirk as a wingback. Adkins played him in his natural positionSELR_addicks said:
People complain about Adkins dropping Dobson.Callumcafc said:
Adkins was playing with Kirk who has turned out to be an effective player in the Championship for Blackpool.SELR_addicks said:
So less games than Stockley/Washington played under Jackson. But that's allowed to be an excuse.ForeverAddickted said:
Purrington played under Adkins, albeit just the two full games against Gillingham and Bolton.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
See, we can do this back and forth all day.
But Jackson drops Kirk who is playing effective football in the division above.
We can do.
We didn't learn and went into the season with Gunter playing Left back.
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So you think giving a young promising lad 40 seconds is an act of management genius when the game was already long won, yep agree I know who the fool is.thenewbie said:
Certainly a fool is revealed, not sure if its Jackson though.Hartleypete said:As soon as we scored second goal Kanu should have been on, Jackson you are a fool.1 -
Sat N lower behind the goal, second row for the Morecambe game. There was a guy to my left, one or two rows back. He kept going out to the steps, abusing the keeper. My gf brought his anti social behaviour to my attention. H e also had a son with him about 11 or 12 yo. He actually thought he was really funny, turning around looking at our fans with a big grin on his face.
Wished I had reported him, or better still given him a slap...3 -
So we win the game 2-0 and we now sayHartleypete said:
So you think giving a young promising lad 40 seconds is an act of management genius when the game was already long won, yep agree I know who the fool is.thenewbie said:
Certainly a fool is revealed, not sure if its Jackson though.Hartleypete said:As soon as we scored second goal Kanu should have been on, Jackson you are a fool.
' we may have won but look at what time on the clock he made his subs'1 -
I am sure tha Kanu appreciated running on the pitch just in time to turn around and walk off 40 seconds later. If chosen for the Ipswich game he may actually get a whole minute. Why bother unless it was to run the clock down. Would certainly demotivate me.Stonewallpenalty19 said:
So we win the game 2-0 and we now sayHartleypete said:
So you think giving a young promising lad 40 seconds is an act of management genius when the game was already long won, yep agree I know who the fool is.thenewbie said:
Certainly a fool is revealed, not sure if its Jackson though.Hartleypete said:As soon as we scored second goal Kanu should have been on, Jackson you are a fool.
' we may have won but look at what time on the clock he made his subs'4 -
Deary me I remember when that was our biggest problem. Feels like two lifetimes ago.Chunes said:
I thought we brought in Roddy to play behind him? Oh wait...SELR_addicks said:
Without a natural left-back, everyone at Crewe said Kirk was at his best playing with an overlapping full back.Chunes said:
Jackson played Kirk as a wingback. Adkins played him in his natural positionSELR_addicks said:
People complain about Adkins dropping Dobson.Callumcafc said:
Adkins was playing with Kirk who has turned out to be an effective player in the Championship for Blackpool.SELR_addicks said:
So less games than Stockley/Washington played under Jackson. But that's allowed to be an excuse.ForeverAddickted said:
Purrington played under Adkins, albeit just the two full games against Gillingham and Bolton.SELR_addicks said:
Excuses for one manager and not the other.Oggy Red said:
Yeah ..... but Adkins had all his strikers to choose from.Manic_mania said:In fact here's a stat - the 13 teams we played before JJ took over -we managed to put 9 points on the board - would JJ have done any better? Well in the return fixtures against all of those 13 teams JJ's return was... 10 points.
Jacko went half a dozen successive games against promotion chasing teams without a striker.
Stats are totally meaningless without context.
Adkins didn't have Aneke either. Didn't have Fraser. Didn't have Forster-Caskey back. Didn't have Purrington.
See, we can do this back and forth all day.
But Jackson drops Kirk who is playing effective football in the division above.
We can do.
We didn't learn and went into the season with Gunter playing Left back.1 -
Yep how will he ever get over it?Bromley Graham said:
I am sure tha Kanu appreciated running on the pitch just in time to turn around and walk off 40 seconds later. If chosen for the Ipswich game he may actually get a whole minute. Why bother unless it was to run the clock down. Would certainly demotivate me.Stonewallpenalty19 said:
So we win the game 2-0 and we now sayHartleypete said:
So you think giving a young promising lad 40 seconds is an act of management genius when the game was already long won, yep agree I know who the fool is.thenewbie said:
Certainly a fool is revealed, not sure if its Jackson though.Hartleypete said:As soon as we scored second goal Kanu should have been on, Jackson you are a fool.
' we may have won but look at what time on the clock he made his subs'0 -
It's not the biggest thing but yes, giving a forward seconds rather than 10/20 minutes isn't great.
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Young lad, proven goal scorer gets 40 seconds when we are 2 nil up. How would you feel?Stonewallpenalty19 said:
Yep how will he ever get over it?Bromley Graham said:
I am sure tha Kanu appreciated running on the pitch just in time to turn around and walk off 40 seconds later. If chosen for the Ipswich game he may actually get a whole minute. Why bother unless it was to run the clock down. Would certainly demotivate me.Stonewallpenalty19 said:
So we win the game 2-0 and we now sayHartleypete said:
So you think giving a young promising lad 40 seconds is an act of management genius when the game was already long won, yep agree I know who the fool is.thenewbie said:
Certainly a fool is revealed, not sure if its Jackson though.Hartleypete said:As soon as we scored second goal Kanu should have been on, Jackson you are a fool.
' we may have won but look at what time on the clock he made his subs'
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Probably your first 2 words is the answer to your question.Bromley Graham said:
Young lad, proven goal scorer gets 40 seconds when we are 2 nil up. How would you feel?Stonewallpenalty19 said:
Yep how will he ever get over it?Bromley Graham said:
I am sure tha Kanu appreciated running on the pitch just in time to turn around and walk off 40 seconds later. If chosen for the Ipswich game he may actually get a whole minute. Why bother unless it was to run the clock down. Would certainly demotivate me.Stonewallpenalty19 said:
So we win the game 2-0 and we now sayHartleypete said:
So you think giving a young promising lad 40 seconds is an act of management genius when the game was already long won, yep agree I know who the fool is.thenewbie said:
Certainly a fool is revealed, not sure if its Jackson though.Hartleypete said:As soon as we scored second goal Kanu should have been on, Jackson you are a fool.
' we may have won but look at what time on the clock he made his subs'
If his ego is that bad that he has to play a certain amount of minutes or he will sulk then he isn't going to get far.
And when has he been a proven goal scorer in league one?0
