I don't think CBT would work playing up with May. It is going to have to be Kirk, Campbell or Fraser IMO. Maybe Kanu at a push but he really needs to come off the bench. I think Fraser is worth a shout there with Anderson coming into the midfield.
I am finding it quite amusing seeing people begging for us to play 433 before we've even started playing 352 after people spent so much time on here last season asking for 433 to be ditched in favour of 442. I don't know what it is about our fans always wanting the shape to change but we seem to always want to do something different. People get absolutely livid when we don't have two strikers on and Alfie May is not a lone striker. He needs a partner. CBT has spent a lot more games in recent years playing LWB than May has on his own up front and more than Campbell has played on the right wing. I don't particularly like him there but he'll do. Ness played left-sided centre half for us last season in a two, I think he'll be ok in a three. We had one dodgy pre-season game, we really shouldn't throw away all our prep for that. We might not have the squad fully completed yet but the better thing to do is to get the players playing the shape and patterns in competitive games and then improve on the players on the pitch rather than completely avoiding it all until we have the perfect line-up. I do think we need another centre half to add competition and reduce the pressure on Ness and we definitely need another striker. I'm not sure that we'll get another LWB in as Edun will be the main one and CBT will cover. Thomas is absolutely not a wing-back. It's not my dream to start the season with Kirk or Campbell up front but we will get another striker in before the window closes, in the meantime I'd rather we play a shape we've trained for and put someone alongside May to work with him rather than guaranteeing we're setting him up to have a bad afternoon on his own up there.
I'm not particularly in favour of 4-3-3 myself and prefer the more fluid gung-ho of a 3-5-2 ...... but no matter how often the formation has been practiced, Aberdeen very easily exposed our playing of square pegs in round holes. Without specialist players to suit in some positions, we're going to be particularly vulnerable caught on the break - Orient will no doubt do their homework.
First rule of football: Don't get beat.
If our defensive play is a colander full of holes, then we need to sort the defensive strategies first. At least eliminate best we can glaring vulnerabilities. Curbs would call it back to basics.
I agree completely with your last bit. I'm concerned that our biggest issue last season was our defence but we've not done quite enough to address it yet. Having said that, if we bring in another starter CB and a first choice RWB then I will consider the job done, but for now I'm not fully happy there. There were only 12 games we didn't score in last season even when we were rubbish but we only kept 8 clean sheets. If we play 352 against Orient we'll have two players not playing in their best position. If we play 433 we'll have three players not playing in thier best role, unless we play DJ on the right for some weird reason. I just think long-term we're better off playing as we mean to go on rather than reverting at the very start. The solution to all these formation questions though is rounding out the squad, sooner we do that the better.
I thought Kirk played very well through pre season…
One poor result, of which Kirk was not responsible, and all of a sudden he’s the fall guy again.
For me it’s a toss up between him and Tyreece Campbell for who starts next to Alfie May at the weekend.
I’d probably start Kirk against Orient where we will have more of the ball. And then Campbell at Peterborough when we might want more pace to hit them on the break.
I thought Kirk played very well through pre season…
One poor result, of which Kirk was not responsible, and all of a sudden he’s the fall guy again.
For me it’s a toss up between him and Tyreece Campbell for who starts next to Alfie May at the weekend.
He has been woeful. And he’s naturally better in friendlies as it’s less obvious when he runs away screaming from a potential challenge he has to make.
You really hate him don't you!? Many posts having a go at him. Holden seems to see something in him and rumours are he is well liked in the team. His style is to not run around chasing everything (ala Morgan) and to try and play some good passes and use his football brain to get in the right place. Doesn't always work but he is willing to take risks. If he goes then he goes but if he stays we need to be a bit more patient...IMO.
Currently its a mess. We are playing a system we do not have the wingbacks for, and the defence does not look any better than last season's. Plus we only have 1 fit striker. The fact that there is a serious chance that Kirk will start up front makes me wonder just how successful this 'rebuilding' has been so far.
I thought Kirk played very well through pre season…
One poor result, of which Kirk was not responsible, and all of a sudden he’s the fall guy again.
For me it’s a toss up between him and Tyreece Campbell for who starts next to Alfie May at the weekend.
He was absolutely shambolic against Aberdeen tbh and we looked miles better as soon as he was replaced. I'd say he had a good first half against Millwall and a decent showing against Wealdstone, but he hasn't exactly blazed a trail this preseason, certainly half a dozen players have looked better than him, including Fraser, Campbell, Blackett-Taylor and Payne, who are I'd imagine some of the people he's competing against for a spot.
On the basis that we only have one striker, no left footed CB & Edun isn’t ready to play, we should play 433 on Sat:
AMB
Asiimwe Hector Jones Thomas (ok as a standard left back)
Dobbo Camara Fraser
Campbell May CBT
Worked well for us last season and will prevent us being massively exposed down the wings as per Aberdeen.
Also allows our most dangerous player to focus on what he is good at & actually be a winger.
Would like to see this line-up on Saturday.
So would I but sadly as other poster said. Can’t see anyway that DH is going to after literally almost the entire pre season playing 3-5-2 suddenly go after all that first competitive game we’re playing 4-3-3 just can’t see it happening.
More than likely the team that started was his favoured potential line up with maybe 2-3 positions up for grabs. As even if we got a striker in now he like Taylor and Edun they won’t be thrown straight in I believe.
I'm sure any striker signed this week would at least make the bench.
I don't get the attitude from some of its ok Edun, Taylor etc will be fit in a few weeks. Points in the first couple of games are just as important as any others this season, you dont get more points as the season progresses. A good start is imperative. We finished 30 odd points off automatics last season, that's a hell of a lot to overturn.
And about 7 of the starting 11 will be from.last seasons piss poor effort.
Can’t argue with any of that except we have the reality that two players we wanted and tracked are not yet quite ready. It’s not ideal but it’s where we are. We might have been able to sign a couple of oven ready, I’ll not use turkeys despite the temptation but they might not be either as good as Taylor and Edun or who Holden wanted. If we go into Orient with what we have then we’ll have to get on with it.
Currently its a mess. We are playing a system we do not have the wingbacks for, and the defence does not look any better than last season's. Plus we only have 1 fit striker. The fact that there is a serious chance that Kirk will start up front makes me wonder just how successful this 'rebuilding' has been so far.
Holden clearly has a preferred formation that he wants to drill into the players and hopefully that will be rewarded once the last couple of pieces of the jigsaw fall into place.
For one, I don’t think we’re nearly as far away as some suggest - we’d be confident against Orient if Leaburn was available.
For two, any formation is going to require hours of drilling on the training pitch. How much time does Holden want to take away from 3-5-2 to practice a formation that will only be preferred for one or two games?
Kirk is the epitome of a luxury player - apparently only effective with an attacking left back behind him doing all the work so he can apply the final pass - yes he can pick a pass and shoot but has no pace and can't beat his man - won't do battle with a centre back and hold the ball up so useless as a striker and goes too quiet to be effective in any midfield formation we might try - if Holden is picking him in the friendlies its because he has little choice as we don't have a complete squad yet. He could start the first couple of games and still be off if a) we strengthen the squad and b) some team is prepared to buy him.
Kirk hasn't just become a forward because we don't have anybody else to play there and he's done okay in friendlies when afforded time and space in his pink boots.
I really don't see how Kirk gets in ahead of Campbell. OK if Campbell isn't the alternative I'd rather have DJ than Kirk, or even Kanu up front with May which I don't think has been tried yet. The way I see it there are at least those three players I'd have in the team ahead of Kirk.
You really hate him don't you!? Many posts having a go at him. Holden seems to see something in him and rumours are he is well liked in the team. His style is to not run around chasing everything (ala Morgan) and to try and play some good passes and use his football brain to get in the right place. Doesn't always work but he is willing to take risks. If he goes then he goes but if he stays we need to be a bit more patient...IMO.
I'm not against Kirk, but I am definitely against him playing that forward role. If we're not playing with wingers then I'd move him on. Please no more square pegs.
Currently its a mess. We are playing a system we do not have the wingbacks for, and the defence does not look any better than last season's. Plus we only have 1 fit striker. The fact that there is a serious chance that Kirk will start up front makes me wonder just how successful this 'rebuilding' has been so far.
Holden clearly has a preferred formation that he wants to drill into the players and hopefully that will be rewarded once the last couple of pieces of the jigsaw fall into place.
For one, I don’t think we’re nearly as far away as some suggest - we’d be confident against Orient if Leaburn was available.
For two, any formation is going to require hours of drilling on the training pitch. How much time does Holden want to take away from 3-5-2 to practice a formation that will only be preferred for one or two games?
We’re in a better place now than either of the last 2 seasons at this stage. It’s a low bar but still a positive
I don't think we would go past the summer transfer window without bringing in another forward, when that happens Kirk will either need to up his game or be moved on. I didn't think he did too bad against Millwall and the goal he scored is what he needs to do if selected, arriving late and getting on the end of a very good pass. I would love him to blossom into the player we all would like to see but I have my doubts.
Comments
One poor result, of which Kirk was not responsible, and all of a sudden he’s the fall guy again.
For me it’s a toss up between him and Tyreece Campbell for who starts next to Alfie May at the weekend.
Assume it's behind closed doors or a Charlton XI game.
Give him a decent strike partner and he will ne a huge success
For one, I don’t think we’re nearly as far away as some suggest - we’d be confident against Orient if Leaburn was available.
For two, any formation is going to require hours of drilling on the training pitch. How much time does Holden want to take away from 3-5-2 to practice a formation that will only be preferred for one or two games?
*phew,sentence over*
The way I see it there are at least those three players I'd have in the team ahead of Kirk.
Fill sure had he not been injured against Welling we would have sold him.
Really glad we can improve him over the next 5 months. He is the hub which we can work around.