Read all the key takeouts from his press conference and, well, there was nothing there that made me feel any more confident unfortunately. Its a trite phrase but he sounds like he’s lost the plot. I get that we fans see the game through a narrow and largely uninformed prism, but when you get to a point where nearly all the fanbase is united about the main issue - we hardly create any chances, even in games we won- and the manager doesnt even remotely refer to it, thats a bad sign. I think if a reporter asked him “in retrospect was it a mistake not to keep Alfie May? “ he’d go into full meltdown.
Why did he drop the captain…did this cause an upset within the team…has his tactics confused the pattern of play (I don’t mind ugly if we win but a toothless display is another thing).
I was just thinking about the problems at Manchester United and Eric ten Hag and wondering whether there were any similarities? 🥸🤓
Why did he drop the captain…did this cause an upset within the team…has his tactics confused the pattern of play (I don’t mind ugly if we win but a toothless display is another thing).
I was just thinking about the problems at Manchester United and Eric ten Hag and wondering whether there were any similarities? 🥸🤓
I really can’t get behind any calls to sack another manager when he stopped the bleeding post Holden & Appleton.
If this losing run continues much longer maybe there’s a conversation to have approaching Christmas.
We were 3-0 down to the team with the worst Xg/Xa.
They had crap stats tonight as well, it’s not as if they created much and deserved to have scored three times.
It’s a “when it rains it pours” situation right now. We could with a team not putting two in the top corner from outside the area when we’re trying to break a losing run.
That was only the fourth time this L1 season where a team has managed to score twice from outside the area. There’s been 102 matches played. 1 in 25.5. Once every couple of weeks it happens. It happened tonight.
We have problems AND we were very unlucky at the same time to make for an especially shit evening all around.
But that's because we gave then acres of space on the edge of the box. These weren't 30-yard worldies, they were simply well placed shots from the edge of the box under no pressure. That's calamitous defending, and the hard-to-breakdown, no easy goals thing that Jones had going (and was his only real selling point this season) us clearly gone.
Berry was about as tight as you’d ask a midfielder to be on the edge of the box. Sinclair got the shot off and went top corner anyway.
Anderson was a marginally out of position but threw his body at the shot to get in the way. Lindsay’s shot went in the top corner anyway.
Everyone is talking as if we rolled out the red carpet for them on both occasions. We didn’t do anything close to that and sometimes the shot just flies in the net anyway despite your best effort.
Our closing down certainly wasn’t any worse than you’ll see from Bristol Rovers or other sides at our level.
Nonsense. Many/most teams block shots like "their lives depend on it". Neither Berry nor Anderson did their utmost to stop the shots.
Berry was tight to his man - it would have been nice to see him be more aggressive in that moment and snapping at heels but he’s an attack minded player that hasn’t been picked for his tackling so I’m hardly surprised that that’s how it played out.
Anderson literally threw his whole body at the shot, he just didn’t get anything on it because his starting position was poor.
Coventry had a shot last night from outside the area that hardly any Bristol Rovers players bothered to block, yet their shots flew into the net and his was tipped over. 🤷♂️
Exactly, Berry was reasonably tight to the scorer but made a half hearted attempt to block. He certainly didn't "throw" his body in the way and if he had of done the shot would have been blocked.
Yes I also agree that Anderson did throw his body at the shot but as you say he was too far away to block the shot.
Both shots could and should have been blocked if the defending was better.
We’re a League One side, it’s not going to be perfect every time. Usually you can get away with not being perfect because the oppo are also a League One side who aren’t perfect.
We should strive to be better - this isn’t me throwing my hands up and saying it doesn’t matter. Even if we start winning games 3-0 every week, training should be working towards how do we start winning 4-0 every week.
Instead, this is me saying shit happens in football and the result of midweek’s game alone isn’t a big enough reason, for me, to start calling for the manager’s head.
But the criticism isn't (just) about last result. It's about that performance and several leading up to it. Jones team and tactics were set up for a solid defence and an energetic press, what we've got is an open invitation to have a crack from distance and a press that couldn't crush a grape. Its tedious but effective when it works, but it's quite manifestly NOT working.
I don't want perfect every time. I would quite like "not embarrassingly bad every time" though.
Blackpool was bad team selection and an off five minute spell which included a strange own goal - we then peppered them for the entire second half and they were somewhat lucky to hold on.
Stevenage was disappointing that we let them bully us - I take a bit of comfort from the fact they did exactly the same to Wrexham three days later, with the same scoreline.
Bristol Rovers was also disappointing but I hope their lads bought lottery tickets because their luck was definitely in with their shooting for the evening.
Our football at this early point in the season hasn’t been inspiring and it’s felt like most matches could go either way by an odd goal - that’s been true throughout. Just as we were a bit lucky to beat Wigan, I think we’ve been a bit unlucky against Blackpool and Bristol Rovers.
Agree that it’s not been pretty so far but if our baseline is that we’ll win half our games and lose the other half, we’re already doing better than last year and we’ve still got plenty of time for this new squad to gel and improve.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
Read all the key takeouts from his press conference and, well, there was nothing there that made me feel any more confident unfortunately. Its a trite phrase but he sounds like he’s lost the plot. I get that we fans see the game through a narrow and largely uninformed prism, but when you get to a point where nearly all the fanbase is united about the main issue - we hardly create any chances, even in games we won- and the manager doesnt even remotely refer to it, thats a bad sign. I think if a reporter asked him “in retrospect was it a mistake not to keep Alfie May? “ he’d go into full meltdown.
I don't think he's lost the plot, but he is definitely guilty of over thinking things and tinkering with the team selection too much.
Early on in the season, whilst not playing great, we were very solid and didn't concede many. He needs to get back to that and stop switching up 4-5 players every game. We're going to get bad performances, we're an average league one side with average players. But i think if he sticks with a preferred XI, keep the defence that looked solid early on, start with Godden and Leaburn up front, and then we'll soon start winning again, although probably not tomorrow.
The team selection since Blackpool feels far too slapdash to be a success. Making 5 changes every week is never going to make any kind of success.
With everyone fit I'd want a spine of Mannion,Mitchell,Coventry,Godden and Leaburn starting every game - I think Ramsay and Edwards are pretty nailed down too. Currently it feels far too much like names out of a hat in terms of who's going to start and even what the formation will be.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
That is sort of what's happened though. When we were winning, a lot of people were saying it was tight games, and the scorelines and stats suggested they were.
I think Bolton was our best performance, but we caught them at a good time, Shrewsbury was a naff performance, could have gone either way.
We were pitiful against Blackpool in the first half, Stevenage genuinely outplayed us, and Bristol Rovers looked very comfortable until their arsehole fell out late on.
We could genuinely be lower in the table, fortunately we aren't. Bit worried after the next 3 games we may be though, 3 very tough games.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
That is sort of what's happened though. When we were winning, a lot of people were saying it was tight games, and the scorelines and stats suggested they were.
I think Bolton was our best performance, but we caught them at a good time, Shrewsbury was a naff performance, could have gone either way.
We were pitiful against Blackpool in the first half, Stevenage genuinely outplayed us, and Bristol Rovers looked very comfortable until their arsehole fell out late on.
We could genuinely be lower in the table, fortunately we aren't. Bit worried after the next 3 games we may be though, 3 very tough games.
Just as Shrewsbury and Wigan could’ve gone the other way, so could Stevenage and Bristol Rovers.
Chuks through on goal at 0-0 last weekend - he sticks that away and we probably win that game.
Bristol Rovers don’t stick one in the top corner from 25 yards with a weaker foot shot & Lloyd Jones heads in from two yards out, we’re ahead at half time, not behind.
Thelo Asgaard sticks the ball in the net and isn’t dispossessed at the last second by a brilliant Ramsay tackle, Wigan probably win that game.
Football results are almost always about fine margins and the way we are playing at the moment (keep it tight at the back, don’t create that much going forwards) magnifies that. It’s why I think we’re capable of beating Birmingham and simultaneously losing at Cambridge.
We have work to do to be better on the ball so that we can start to move away from most games being coin flips.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
Jonesball needs everything to work to be successful. You need the strikers to be pressing, the midfield to have lots of energy and the defence to be solid, and keep that up all game to wear the other team down. If all 3 come together you get results, not aesthetically pleasing ones but results.
But if those things don't work you get what we've currently got. An open invitation to try a long range shot, an ineffective group of passengers in midfield and strikers who don't know what to do in the box on the rare occasion they end up there.
If you want to call it luck or skills or training, the point is that whatever we were doing has stopped working and Jones is apparently either unwilling or incapable of making the right changes to fix it.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
That is sort of what's happened though. When we were winning, a lot of people were saying it was tight games, and the scorelines and stats suggested they were.
I think Bolton was our best performance, but we caught them at a good time, Shrewsbury was a naff performance, could have gone either way.
We were pitiful against Blackpool in the first half, Stevenage genuinely outplayed us, and Bristol Rovers looked very comfortable until their arsehole fell out late on.
We could genuinely be lower in the table, fortunately we aren't. Bit worried after the next 3 games we may be though, 3 very tough games.
Just as Shrewsbury and Wigan could’ve gone the other way, so could Stevenage and Bristol Rovers.
Chuks through on goal at 0-0 last weekend - he sticks that away and we probably win that game.
Bristol Rovers don’t stick one in the top corner from 25 yards with a weaker foot shot & Lloyd Jones heads in from two yards out, we’re ahead at half time, not behind.
Thelo Asgaard sticks the ball in the net and isn’t dispossessed at the last second by a brilliant Ramsay tackle, Wigan probably win that game.
Football results are almost always about fine margins and the way we are playing at the moment (keep it tight at the back, don’t create that much going forwards) magnifies that. It’s why I think we’re capable of beating Birmingham and simultaneously losing at Cambridge.
We have work to do to be better on the ball so that we can start to move away from most games being coin flips.
Not all games are won on such fine margins. We've played nearly every game on them. Play games where it's always a flip of the coin and you run the risk of ending up where we are. I don't see how this stuff makes anything look better.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
It all evens itself out our inept defending creates the situation for these amazing goals by the oppo and the oppo having players brave enough with enough ability to execute we did do this against Orient coin flips can go either way we’ve had some go our way and I think Stevenage was a coin flip but no way we’re Rovers or Blackpool coin flips
13th in League One is probably about right for how we’ve done … shit
He stopped the rot when he came in and made the team difficult to beat. This season started well although the last few results have been disappointing. He has a lot more credit in the bank with me before any talk of the sack.
I really can’t get behind any calls to sack another manager when he stopped the bleeding post Holden & Appleton.
If this losing run continues much longer maybe there’s a conversation to have approaching Christmas.
We were 3-0 down to the team with the worst Xg/Xa.
They had crap stats tonight as well, it’s not as if they created much and deserved to have scored three times.
It’s a “when it rains it pours” situation right now. We could with a team not putting two in the top corner from outside the area when we’re trying to break a losing run.
That was only the fourth time this L1 season where a team has managed to score twice from outside the area. There’s been 102 matches played. 1 in 25.5. Once every couple of weeks it happens. It happened tonight.
We have problems AND we were very unlucky at the same time to make for an especially shit evening all around.
But that's because we gave then acres of space on the edge of the box. These weren't 30-yard worldies, they were simply well placed shots from the edge of the box under no pressure. That's calamitous defending, and the hard-to-breakdown, no easy goals thing that Jones had going (and was his only real selling point this season) us clearly gone.
Berry was about as tight as you’d ask a midfielder to be on the edge of the box. Sinclair got the shot off and went top corner anyway.
Anderson was a marginally out of position but threw his body at the shot to get in the way. Lindsay’s shot went in the top corner anyway.
Everyone is talking as if we rolled out the red carpet for them on both occasions. We didn’t do anything close to that and sometimes the shot just flies in the net anyway despite your best effort.
Our closing down certainly wasn’t any worse than you’ll see from Bristol Rovers or other sides at our level.
Nonsense. Many/most teams block shots like "their lives depend on it". Neither Berry nor Anderson did their utmost to stop the shots.
Berry was tight to his man - it would have been nice to see him be more aggressive in that moment and snapping at heels but he’s an attack minded player that hasn’t been picked for his tackling so I’m hardly surprised that that’s how it played out.
Anderson literally threw his whole body at the shot, he just didn’t get anything on it because his starting position was poor.
Coventry had a shot last night from outside the area that hardly any Bristol Rovers players bothered to block, yet their shots flew into the net and his was tipped over. 🤷♂️
Exactly, Berry was reasonably tight to the scorer but made a half hearted attempt to block. He certainly didn't "throw" his body in the way and if he had of done the shot would have been blocked.
Yes I also agree that Anderson did throw his body at the shot but as you say he was too far away to block the shot.
Both shots could and should have been blocked if the defending was better.
We’re a League One side, it’s not going to be perfect every time. Usually you can get away with not being perfect because the oppo are also a League One side who aren’t perfect.
We should strive to be better - this isn’t me throwing my hands up and saying it doesn’t matter. Even if we start winning games 3-0 every week, training should be working towards how do we start winning 4-0 every week.
Instead, this is me saying shit happens in football and the result of midweek’s game alone isn’t a big enough reason, for me, to start calling for the manager’s head.
But the criticism isn't (just) about last result. It's about that performance and several leading up to it. Jones team and tactics were set up for a solid defence and an energetic press, what we've got is an open invitation to have a crack from distance and a press that couldn't crush a grape. Its tedious but effective when it works, but it's quite manifestly NOT working.
I don't want perfect every time. I would quite like "not embarrassingly bad every time" though.
Blackpool was bad team selection and an off five minute spell which included a strange own goal - we then peppered them for the entire second half and they were somewhat lucky to hold on.
Stevenage was disappointing that we let them bully us - I take a bit of comfort from the fact they did exactly the same to Wrexham three days later, with the same scoreline.
Bristol Rovers was also disappointing but I hope their lads bought lottery tickets because their luck was definitely in with their shooting for the evening.
Our football at this early point in the season hasn’t been inspiring and it’s felt like most matches could go either way by an odd goal - that’s been true throughout. Just as we were a bit lucky to beat Wigan, I think we’ve been a bit unlucky against Blackpool and Bristol Rovers.
Agree that it’s not been pretty so far but if our baseline is that we’ll win half our games and lose the other half, we’re already doing better than last year and we’ve still got plenty of time for this new squad to gel and improve.
Doing better than last season is a bar so low it's almost on the floor.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
That is sort of what's happened though. When we were winning, a lot of people were saying it was tight games, and the scorelines and stats suggested they were.
I think Bolton was our best performance, but we caught them at a good time, Shrewsbury was a naff performance, could have gone either way.
We were pitiful against Blackpool in the first half, Stevenage genuinely outplayed us, and Bristol Rovers looked very comfortable until their arsehole fell out late on.
We could genuinely be lower in the table, fortunately we aren't. Bit worried after the next 3 games we may be though, 3 very tough games.
Just as Shrewsbury and Wigan could’ve gone the other way, so could Stevenage and Bristol Rovers.
Chuks through on goal at 0-0 last weekend - he sticks that away and we probably win that game.
Bristol Rovers don’t stick one in the top corner from 25 yards with a weaker foot shot & Lloyd Jones heads in from two yards out, we’re ahead at half time, not behind.
Thelo Asgaard sticks the ball in the net and isn’t dispossessed at the last second by a brilliant Ramsay tackle, Wigan probably win that game.
Football results are almost always about fine margins and the way we are playing at the moment (keep it tight at the back, don’t create that much going forwards) magnifies that. It’s why I think we’re capable of beating Birmingham and simultaneously losing at Cambridge.
We have work to do to be better on the ball so that we can start to move away from most games being coin flips.
Not all games are won on such fine margins. We've played nearly every game on them. Play games where it's always a flip of the coin and you run the risk of ending up where we are. I don't see how this stuff makes anything look better.
Being better is comparative, at that point I’m talking better than “sacking your manager” form which is a low bar but it’s what this thread started as - whereas I think you’re probably comparing to our actual ambitions?
Because I agree that being mid table isn’t good enough. Obviously, no one would be happy with that by the end of the season. We’re only nine games in and have 37 still to play - plenty of time to improve.
We’re already much improved defensively from the mess Jones inherited - let’s give him some time to build off of that foundation instead of more chopping and changing after a couple of losses.
I really can’t get behind any calls to sack another manager when he stopped the bleeding post Holden & Appleton.
If this losing run continues much longer maybe there’s a conversation to have approaching Christmas.
We were 3-0 down to the team with the worst Xg/Xa.
They had crap stats tonight as well, it’s not as if they created much and deserved to have scored three times.
It’s a “when it rains it pours” situation right now. We could with a team not putting two in the top corner from outside the area when we’re trying to break a losing run.
That was only the fourth time this L1 season where a team has managed to score twice from outside the area. There’s been 102 matches played. 1 in 25.5. Once every couple of weeks it happens. It happened tonight.
We have problems AND we were very unlucky at the same time to make for an especially shit evening all around.
But that's because we gave then acres of space on the edge of the box. These weren't 30-yard worldies, they were simply well placed shots from the edge of the box under no pressure. That's calamitous defending, and the hard-to-breakdown, no easy goals thing that Jones had going (and was his only real selling point this season) us clearly gone.
Berry was about as tight as you’d ask a midfielder to be on the edge of the box. Sinclair got the shot off and went top corner anyway.
Anderson was a marginally out of position but threw his body at the shot to get in the way. Lindsay’s shot went in the top corner anyway.
Everyone is talking as if we rolled out the red carpet for them on both occasions. We didn’t do anything close to that and sometimes the shot just flies in the net anyway despite your best effort.
Our closing down certainly wasn’t any worse than you’ll see from Bristol Rovers or other sides at our level.
Nonsense. Many/most teams block shots like "their lives depend on it". Neither Berry nor Anderson did their utmost to stop the shots.
Berry was tight to his man - it would have been nice to see him be more aggressive in that moment and snapping at heels but he’s an attack minded player that hasn’t been picked for his tackling so I’m hardly surprised that that’s how it played out.
Anderson literally threw his whole body at the shot, he just didn’t get anything on it because his starting position was poor.
Coventry had a shot last night from outside the area that hardly any Bristol Rovers players bothered to block, yet their shots flew into the net and his was tipped over. 🤷♂️
Exactly, Berry was reasonably tight to the scorer but made a half hearted attempt to block. He certainly didn't "throw" his body in the way and if he had of done the shot would have been blocked.
Yes I also agree that Anderson did throw his body at the shot but as you say he was too far away to block the shot.
Both shots could and should have been blocked if the defending was better.
We’re a League One side, it’s not going to be perfect every time. Usually you can get away with not being perfect because the oppo are also a League One side who aren’t perfect.
We should strive to be better - this isn’t me throwing my hands up and saying it doesn’t matter. Even if we start winning games 3-0 every week, training should be working towards how do we start winning 4-0 every week.
Instead, this is me saying shit happens in football and the result of midweek’s game alone isn’t a big enough reason, for me, to start calling for the manager’s head.
But the criticism isn't (just) about last result. It's about that performance and several leading up to it. Jones team and tactics were set up for a solid defence and an energetic press, what we've got is an open invitation to have a crack from distance and a press that couldn't crush a grape. Its tedious but effective when it works, but it's quite manifestly NOT working.
I don't want perfect every time. I would quite like "not embarrassingly bad every time" though.
Blackpool was bad team selection and an off five minute spell which included a strange own goal - we then peppered them for the entire second half and they were somewhat lucky to hold on.
Stevenage was disappointing that we let them bully us - I take a bit of comfort from the fact they did exactly the same to Wrexham three days later, with the same scoreline.
Bristol Rovers was also disappointing but I hope their lads bought lottery tickets because their luck was definitely in with their shooting for the evening.
Our football at this early point in the season hasn’t been inspiring and it’s felt like most matches could go either way by an odd goal - that’s been true throughout. Just as we were a bit lucky to beat Wigan, I think we’ve been a bit unlucky against Blackpool and Bristol Rovers.
Agree that it’s not been pretty so far but if our baseline is that we’ll win half our games and lose the other half, we’re already doing better than last year and we’ve still got plenty of time for this new squad to gel and improve.
Doing better than last season is a bar so low it's almost on the floor.
Is it worth sacking a manager over is my point - I would say no, there’s been enough positive signs despite a run of recent bad form.
I reckon I’ve mentioned this ten times on here but 1) no Cnut reads what I write 2) plenty of you have the memory of a goldfish
very early on in Jones’s tenure Alfie spoke to my mate who half knew Alfie from junior footy , he said “Jones doesn’t fancy me and I’ve tried to talk to him about it but he blanks me “ and that he was happy at Charlton Two months later my mate had another convo and Alfie May said “still no discussion , he doesn’t rate me “
Alfie knew the manager was forcing him out and of course financially he’s benefitted but it would never have come to this if the manager had rated him there would be no discussion with other clubs unless he was clearly tapped up .
Mitchell when dropped said to someone Jones didn’t give him a reason , that’s poor management
Jones has all the enthusiasm in the world but he’s crackers imo and has limited man management ability . I’ll say it now he won’t get us promoted . We all want him to but it’s not happening imo
Football is not the game it was years back when everyone was playing on the same level playing field .
I’d rather roll the dice and give someone else a go if there’s no real improvement up to Christmas. Jones deserves to be given at least that and realistically probably the end of the season if it doesn’t get to out of hand .
I like Jones, but I 100% agree with this.
His enthusiasm is great & infectious, but his man management appears to be very poor
fair comment, BUT to me his touchline antics look contrived and trying to show to us all, players and fans, how COMMITTED he is, could be his 'ersatz passion' has the reverse effect on the team and inhibits them. I want less showmanship and more playermanagementship
I really can’t get behind any calls to sack another manager when he stopped the bleeding post Holden & Appleton.
If this losing run continues much longer maybe there’s a conversation to have approaching Christmas.
We were 3-0 down to the team with the worst Xg/Xa.
They had crap stats tonight as well, it’s not as if they created much and deserved to have scored three times.
It’s a “when it rains it pours” situation right now. We could with a team not putting two in the top corner from outside the area when we’re trying to break a losing run.
That was only the fourth time this L1 season where a team has managed to score twice from outside the area. There’s been 102 matches played. 1 in 25.5. Once every couple of weeks it happens. It happened tonight.
We have problems AND we were very unlucky at the same time to make for an especially shit evening all around.
But that's because we gave then acres of space on the edge of the box. These weren't 30-yard worldies, they were simply well placed shots from the edge of the box under no pressure. That's calamitous defending, and the hard-to-breakdown, no easy goals thing that Jones had going (and was his only real selling point this season) us clearly gone.
Berry was about as tight as you’d ask a midfielder to be on the edge of the box. Sinclair got the shot off and went top corner anyway.
Anderson was a marginally out of position but threw his body at the shot to get in the way. Lindsay’s shot went in the top corner anyway.
Everyone is talking as if we rolled out the red carpet for them on both occasions. We didn’t do anything close to that and sometimes the shot just flies in the net anyway despite your best effort.
Our closing down certainly wasn’t any worse than you’ll see from Bristol Rovers or other sides at our level.
Nonsense. Many/most teams block shots like "their lives depend on it". Neither Berry nor Anderson did their utmost to stop the shots.
Berry was tight to his man - it would have been nice to see him be more aggressive in that moment and snapping at heels but he’s an attack minded player that hasn’t been picked for his tackling so I’m hardly surprised that that’s how it played out.
Anderson literally threw his whole body at the shot, he just didn’t get anything on it because his starting position was poor.
Coventry had a shot last night from outside the area that hardly any Bristol Rovers players bothered to block, yet their shots flew into the net and his was tipped over. 🤷♂️
Exactly, Berry was reasonably tight to the scorer but made a half hearted attempt to block. He certainly didn't "throw" his body in the way and if he had of done the shot would have been blocked.
Yes I also agree that Anderson did throw his body at the shot but as you say he was too far away to block the shot.
Both shots could and should have been blocked if the defending was better.
We’re a League One side, it’s not going to be perfect every time. Usually you can get away with not being perfect because the oppo are also a League One side who aren’t perfect.
We should strive to be better - this isn’t me throwing my hands up and saying it doesn’t matter. Even if we start winning games 3-0 every week, training should be working towards how do we start winning 4-0 every week.
Instead, this is me saying shit happens in football and the result of midweek’s game alone isn’t a big enough reason, for me, to start calling for the manager’s head.
But the criticism isn't (just) about last result. It's about that performance and several leading up to it. Jones team and tactics were set up for a solid defence and an energetic press, what we've got is an open invitation to have a crack from distance and a press that couldn't crush a grape. Its tedious but effective when it works, but it's quite manifestly NOT working.
I don't want perfect every time. I would quite like "not embarrassingly bad every time" though.
Blackpool was bad team selection and an off five minute spell which included a strange own goal - we then peppered them for the entire second half and they were somewhat lucky to hold on.
Stevenage was disappointing that we let them bully us - I take a bit of comfort from the fact they did exactly the same to Wrexham three days later, with the same scoreline.
Bristol Rovers was also disappointing but I hope their lads bought lottery tickets because their luck was definitely in with their shooting for the evening.
Our football at this early point in the season hasn’t been inspiring and it’s felt like most matches could go either way by an odd goal - that’s been true throughout. Just as we were a bit lucky to beat Wigan, I think we’ve been a bit unlucky against Blackpool and Bristol Rovers.
Agree that it’s not been pretty so far but if our baseline is that we’ll win half our games and lose the other half, we’re already doing better than last year and we’ve still got plenty of time for this new squad to gel and improve.
Doing better than last season is a bar so low it's almost on the floor.
Is it worth sacking a manager over is my point - I would say no, there’s been enough positive signs despite a run of recent bad form.
With all due respect you'd find a positive from a 5-0 defeat.
I really can’t get behind any calls to sack another manager when he stopped the bleeding post Holden & Appleton.
If this losing run continues much longer maybe there’s a conversation to have approaching Christmas.
We were 3-0 down to the team with the worst Xg/Xa.
They had crap stats tonight as well, it’s not as if they created much and deserved to have scored three times.
It’s a “when it rains it pours” situation right now. We could with a team not putting two in the top corner from outside the area when we’re trying to break a losing run.
That was only the fourth time this L1 season where a team has managed to score twice from outside the area. There’s been 102 matches played. 1 in 25.5. Once every couple of weeks it happens. It happened tonight.
We have problems AND we were very unlucky at the same time to make for an especially shit evening all around.
But that's because we gave then acres of space on the edge of the box. These weren't 30-yard worldies, they were simply well placed shots from the edge of the box under no pressure. That's calamitous defending, and the hard-to-breakdown, no easy goals thing that Jones had going (and was his only real selling point this season) us clearly gone.
Berry was about as tight as you’d ask a midfielder to be on the edge of the box. Sinclair got the shot off and went top corner anyway.
Anderson was a marginally out of position but threw his body at the shot to get in the way. Lindsay’s shot went in the top corner anyway.
Everyone is talking as if we rolled out the red carpet for them on both occasions. We didn’t do anything close to that and sometimes the shot just flies in the net anyway despite your best effort.
Our closing down certainly wasn’t any worse than you’ll see from Bristol Rovers or other sides at our level.
Nonsense. Many/most teams block shots like "their lives depend on it". Neither Berry nor Anderson did their utmost to stop the shots.
Berry was tight to his man - it would have been nice to see him be more aggressive in that moment and snapping at heels but he’s an attack minded player that hasn’t been picked for his tackling so I’m hardly surprised that that’s how it played out.
Anderson literally threw his whole body at the shot, he just didn’t get anything on it because his starting position was poor.
Coventry had a shot last night from outside the area that hardly any Bristol Rovers players bothered to block, yet their shots flew into the net and his was tipped over. 🤷♂️
Exactly, Berry was reasonably tight to the scorer but made a half hearted attempt to block. He certainly didn't "throw" his body in the way and if he had of done the shot would have been blocked.
Yes I also agree that Anderson did throw his body at the shot but as you say he was too far away to block the shot.
Both shots could and should have been blocked if the defending was better.
We’re a League One side, it’s not going to be perfect every time. Usually you can get away with not being perfect because the oppo are also a League One side who aren’t perfect.
We should strive to be better - this isn’t me throwing my hands up and saying it doesn’t matter. Even if we start winning games 3-0 every week, training should be working towards how do we start winning 4-0 every week.
Instead, this is me saying shit happens in football and the result of midweek’s game alone isn’t a big enough reason, for me, to start calling for the manager’s head.
But the criticism isn't (just) about last result. It's about that performance and several leading up to it. Jones team and tactics were set up for a solid defence and an energetic press, what we've got is an open invitation to have a crack from distance and a press that couldn't crush a grape. Its tedious but effective when it works, but it's quite manifestly NOT working.
I don't want perfect every time. I would quite like "not embarrassingly bad every time" though.
Blackpool was bad team selection and an off five minute spell which included a strange own goal - we then peppered them for the entire second half and they were somewhat lucky to hold on.
Stevenage was disappointing that we let them bully us - I take a bit of comfort from the fact they did exactly the same to Wrexham three days later, with the same scoreline.
Bristol Rovers was also disappointing but I hope their lads bought lottery tickets because their luck was definitely in with their shooting for the evening.
Our football at this early point in the season hasn’t been inspiring and it’s felt like most matches could go either way by an odd goal - that’s been true throughout. Just as we were a bit lucky to beat Wigan, I think we’ve been a bit unlucky against Blackpool and Bristol Rovers.
Agree that it’s not been pretty so far but if our baseline is that we’ll win half our games and lose the other half, we’re already doing better than last year and we’ve still got plenty of time for this new squad to gel and improve.
Doing better than last season is a bar so low it's almost on the floor.
Is it worth sacking a manager over is my point - I would say no, there’s been enough positive signs despite a run of recent bad form.
At this point no it's not but then I don't think that many people are actually at the actively wanting him gone stage - more acknowledging that its not going well (to put it mildly) and that a change in form is needed, and fast.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
That is sort of what's happened though. When we were winning, a lot of people were saying it was tight games, and the scorelines and stats suggested they were.
I think Bolton was our best performance, but we caught them at a good time, Shrewsbury was a naff performance, could have gone either way.
We were pitiful against Blackpool in the first half, Stevenage genuinely outplayed us, and Bristol Rovers looked very comfortable until their arsehole fell out late on.
We could genuinely be lower in the table, fortunately we aren't. Bit worried after the next 3 games we may be though, 3 very tough games.
Just as Shrewsbury and Wigan could’ve gone the other way, so could Stevenage and Bristol Rovers.
Chuks through on goal at 0-0 last weekend - he sticks that away and we probably win that game.
Bristol Rovers don’t stick one in the top corner from 25 yards with a weaker foot shot & Lloyd Jones heads in from two yards out, we’re ahead at half time, not behind.
Thelo Asgaard sticks the ball in the net and isn’t dispossessed at the last second by a brilliant Ramsay tackle, Wigan probably win that game.
Football results are almost always about fine margins and the way we are playing at the moment (keep it tight at the back, don’t create that much going forwards) magnifies that. It’s why I think we’re capable of beating Birmingham and simultaneously losing at Cambridge.
We have work to do to be better on the ball so that we can start to move away from most games being coin flips.
Not all games are won on such fine margins. We've played nearly every game on them. Play games where it's always a flip of the coin and you run the risk of ending up where we are. I don't see how this stuff makes anything look better.
Being better is comparative, at that point I’m talking better than “sacking your manager” form which is a low bar but it’s what this thread started as - whereas I think you’re probably comparing to our actual ambitions?
Because I agree that being mid table isn’t good enough. Obviously, no one would be happy with that by the end of the season. We’re only nine games in and have 37 still to play - plenty of time to improve.
We’re already much improved defensively from the mess Jones inherited - let’s give him some time to build off of that foundation instead of more chopping and changing after a couple of losses.
On that part I agree, sacking him would be mad and the speed people are turning on him is frightening.
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
That is sort of what's happened though. When we were winning, a lot of people were saying it was tight games, and the scorelines and stats suggested they were.
I think Bolton was our best performance, but we caught them at a good time, Shrewsbury was a naff performance, could have gone either way.
We were pitiful against Blackpool in the first half, Stevenage genuinely outplayed us, and Bristol Rovers looked very comfortable until their arsehole fell out late on.
We could genuinely be lower in the table, fortunately we aren't. Bit worried after the next 3 games we may be though, 3 very tough games.
Just as Shrewsbury and Wigan could’ve gone the other way, so could Stevenage and Bristol Rovers.
Chuks through on goal at 0-0 last weekend - he sticks that away and we probably win that game.
Bristol Rovers don’t stick one in the top corner from 25 yards with a weaker foot shot & Lloyd Jones heads in from two yards out, we’re ahead at half time, not behind.
Thelo Asgaard sticks the ball in the net and isn’t dispossessed at the last second by a brilliant Ramsay tackle, Wigan probably win that game.
Football results are almost always about fine margins and the way we are playing at the moment (keep it tight at the back, don’t create that much going forwards) magnifies that. It’s why I think we’re capable of beating Birmingham and simultaneously losing at Cambridge.
We have work to do to be better on the ball so that we can start to move away from most games being coin flips.
Just gonna have to disagree with you on this one, sorry Cal.
You are talking about isolated events of the game, we should be creating more and scoring more, that's why these games are coming down to luck. It's not like we are missing chance after chance and then going a goal down.
Of course there could be an argument to be made that the scorlines are so close that it could have gone either way, but the gameplay itself says otherwise. This games we have lost we have thoroughly deserved to, and the games we have won have been fairly scrappy except Bolton imo.
The way we play is allowing these games to be so close, and from what I've seen so far, when we are losing, we didn't have much chance of winning. The style is dreadful, it's up to Jones to now fix that.
One thing that does give me a small bit of hope is that a lot of Luton fans said they started the season slowly, hopefully this is Nathan getting all the rough patches out of the squad early on and we'll get on a run sometime soon where it all clicks and we start carving sides open a bit more, got to be an optimist otherwise what's the point in going
Blackpool took the foot off the gas and sat back on the lead and it worked they got the result . Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points . we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
I just don’t buy that.
So when we’ve won (4 out of 9 btw) it’s been us being lucky in coin flip games but when we’ve lost it’s just us being shit and not being unlucky in coin flip games?
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
That is sort of what's happened though. When we were winning, a lot of people were saying it was tight games, and the scorelines and stats suggested they were.
I think Bolton was our best performance, but we caught them at a good time, Shrewsbury was a naff performance, could have gone either way.
We were pitiful against Blackpool in the first half, Stevenage genuinely outplayed us, and Bristol Rovers looked very comfortable until their arsehole fell out late on.
We could genuinely be lower in the table, fortunately we aren't. Bit worried after the next 3 games we may be though, 3 very tough games.
Just as Shrewsbury and Wigan could’ve gone the other way, so could Stevenage and Bristol Rovers.
Chuks through on goal at 0-0 last weekend - he sticks that away and we probably win that game.
Bristol Rovers don’t stick one in the top corner from 25 yards with a weaker foot shot & Lloyd Jones heads in from two yards out, we’re ahead at half time, not behind.
Thelo Asgaard sticks the ball in the net and isn’t dispossessed at the last second by a brilliant Ramsay tackle, Wigan probably win that game.
Football results are almost always about fine margins and the way we are playing at the moment (keep it tight at the back, don’t create that much going forwards) magnifies that. It’s why I think we’re capable of beating Birmingham and simultaneously losing at Cambridge.
We have work to do to be better on the ball so that we can start to move away from most games being coin flips.
Not all games are won on such fine margins. We've played nearly every game on them. Play games where it's always a flip of the coin and you run the risk of ending up where we are. I don't see how this stuff makes anything look better.
Being better is comparative, at that point I’m talking better than “sacking your manager” form which is a low bar but it’s what this thread started as - whereas I think you’re probably comparing to our actual ambitions?
Because I agree that being mid table isn’t good enough. Obviously, no one would be happy with that by the end of the season. We’re only nine games in and have 37 still to play - plenty of time to improve.
We’re already much improved defensively from the mess Jones inherited - let’s give him some time to build off of that foundation instead of more chopping and changing after a couple of losses.
On that part I agree, sacking him would be mad and the speed people are turning on him is frightening.
when a manager puts out a side that shows no sign of improving and is actually deteriorating, where there is no excitement, no creativity just endeavour, and a reluctance to vary his tactics, then I think we are entitled to be concerned.
I don't want him sacked, I just want him made aware by the SMT, in no uncertain terms, that it's not good enough, that he needs to be more adaptable, and that we must see improvements sharpish.
I really can’t get behind any calls to sack another manager when he stopped the bleeding post Holden & Appleton.
If this losing run continues much longer maybe there’s a conversation to have approaching Christmas.
We were 3-0 down to the team with the worst Xg/Xa.
They had crap stats tonight as well, it’s not as if they created much and deserved to have scored three times.
It’s a “when it rains it pours” situation right now. We could with a team not putting two in the top corner from outside the area when we’re trying to break a losing run.
That was only the fourth time this L1 season where a team has managed to score twice from outside the area. There’s been 102 matches played. 1 in 25.5. Once every couple of weeks it happens. It happened tonight.
We have problems AND we were very unlucky at the same time to make for an especially shit evening all around.
But that's because we gave then acres of space on the edge of the box. These weren't 30-yard worldies, they were simply well placed shots from the edge of the box under no pressure. That's calamitous defending, and the hard-to-breakdown, no easy goals thing that Jones had going (and was his only real selling point this season) us clearly gone.
Berry was about as tight as you’d ask a midfielder to be on the edge of the box. Sinclair got the shot off and went top corner anyway.
Anderson was a marginally out of position but threw his body at the shot to get in the way. Lindsay’s shot went in the top corner anyway.
Everyone is talking as if we rolled out the red carpet for them on both occasions. We didn’t do anything close to that and sometimes the shot just flies in the net anyway despite your best effort.
Our closing down certainly wasn’t any worse than you’ll see from Bristol Rovers or other sides at our level.
Nonsense. Many/most teams block shots like "their lives depend on it". Neither Berry nor Anderson did their utmost to stop the shots.
Berry was tight to his man - it would have been nice to see him be more aggressive in that moment and snapping at heels but he’s an attack minded player that hasn’t been picked for his tackling so I’m hardly surprised that that’s how it played out.
Anderson literally threw his whole body at the shot, he just didn’t get anything on it because his starting position was poor.
Coventry had a shot last night from outside the area that hardly any Bristol Rovers players bothered to block, yet their shots flew into the net and his was tipped over. 🤷♂️
Exactly, Berry was reasonably tight to the scorer but made a half hearted attempt to block. He certainly didn't "throw" his body in the way and if he had of done the shot would have been blocked.
Yes I also agree that Anderson did throw his body at the shot but as you say he was too far away to block the shot.
Both shots could and should have been blocked if the defending was better.
We’re a League One side, it’s not going to be perfect every time. Usually you can get away with not being perfect because the oppo are also a League One side who aren’t perfect.
We should strive to be better - this isn’t me throwing my hands up and saying it doesn’t matter. Even if we start winning games 3-0 every week, training should be working towards how do we start winning 4-0 every week.
Instead, this is me saying shit happens in football and the result of midweek’s game alone isn’t a big enough reason, for me, to start calling for the manager’s head.
But the criticism isn't (just) about last result. It's about that performance and several leading up to it. Jones team and tactics were set up for a solid defence and an energetic press, what we've got is an open invitation to have a crack from distance and a press that couldn't crush a grape. Its tedious but effective when it works, but it's quite manifestly NOT working.
I don't want perfect every time. I would quite like "not embarrassingly bad every time" though.
Blackpool was bad team selection and an off five minute spell which included a strange own goal - we then peppered them for the entire second half and they were somewhat lucky to hold on.
Stevenage was disappointing that we let them bully us - I take a bit of comfort from the fact they did exactly the same to Wrexham three days later, with the same scoreline.
Bristol Rovers was also disappointing but I hope their lads bought lottery tickets because their luck was definitely in with their shooting for the evening.
Our football at this early point in the season hasn’t been inspiring and it’s felt like most matches could go either way by an odd goal - that’s been true throughout. Just as we were a bit lucky to beat Wigan, I think we’ve been a bit unlucky against Blackpool and Bristol Rovers.
Agree that it’s not been pretty so far but if our baseline is that we’ll win half our games and lose the other half, we’re already doing better than last year and we’ve still got plenty of time for this new squad to gel and improve.
Wow! There is hope and there is delusional. You just crossed that line.
I really can’t get behind any calls to sack another manager when he stopped the bleeding post Holden & Appleton.
If this losing run continues much longer maybe there’s a conversation to have approaching Christmas.
We were 3-0 down to the team with the worst Xg/Xa.
They had crap stats tonight as well, it’s not as if they created much and deserved to have scored three times.
It’s a “when it rains it pours” situation right now. We could with a team not putting two in the top corner from outside the area when we’re trying to break a losing run.
That was only the fourth time this L1 season where a team has managed to score twice from outside the area. There’s been 102 matches played. 1 in 25.5. Once every couple of weeks it happens. It happened tonight.
We have problems AND we were very unlucky at the same time to make for an especially shit evening all around.
But that's because we gave then acres of space on the edge of the box. These weren't 30-yard worldies, they were simply well placed shots from the edge of the box under no pressure. That's calamitous defending, and the hard-to-breakdown, no easy goals thing that Jones had going (and was his only real selling point this season) us clearly gone.
Berry was about as tight as you’d ask a midfielder to be on the edge of the box. Sinclair got the shot off and went top corner anyway.
Anderson was a marginally out of position but threw his body at the shot to get in the way. Lindsay’s shot went in the top corner anyway.
Everyone is talking as if we rolled out the red carpet for them on both occasions. We didn’t do anything close to that and sometimes the shot just flies in the net anyway despite your best effort.
Our closing down certainly wasn’t any worse than you’ll see from Bristol Rovers or other sides at our level.
Nonsense. Many/most teams block shots like "their lives depend on it". Neither Berry nor Anderson did their utmost to stop the shots.
Berry was tight to his man - it would have been nice to see him be more aggressive in that moment and snapping at heels but he’s an attack minded player that hasn’t been picked for his tackling so I’m hardly surprised that that’s how it played out.
Anderson literally threw his whole body at the shot, he just didn’t get anything on it because his starting position was poor.
Coventry had a shot last night from outside the area that hardly any Bristol Rovers players bothered to block, yet their shots flew into the net and his was tipped over. 🤷♂️
Exactly, Berry was reasonably tight to the scorer but made a half hearted attempt to block. He certainly didn't "throw" his body in the way and if he had of done the shot would have been blocked.
Yes I also agree that Anderson did throw his body at the shot but as you say he was too far away to block the shot.
Both shots could and should have been blocked if the defending was better.
We’re a League One side, it’s not going to be perfect every time. Usually you can get away with not being perfect because the oppo are also a League One side who aren’t perfect.
We should strive to be better - this isn’t me throwing my hands up and saying it doesn’t matter. Even if we start winning games 3-0 every week, training should be working towards how do we start winning 4-0 every week.
Instead, this is me saying shit happens in football and the result of midweek’s game alone isn’t a big enough reason, for me, to start calling for the manager’s head.
But the criticism isn't (just) about last result. It's about that performance and several leading up to it. Jones team and tactics were set up for a solid defence and an energetic press, what we've got is an open invitation to have a crack from distance and a press that couldn't crush a grape. Its tedious but effective when it works, but it's quite manifestly NOT working.
I don't want perfect every time. I would quite like "not embarrassingly bad every time" though.
Blackpool was bad team selection and an off five minute spell which included a strange own goal - we then peppered them for the entire second half and they were somewhat lucky to hold on.
Stevenage was disappointing that we let them bully us - I take a bit of comfort from the fact they did exactly the same to Wrexham three days later, with the same scoreline.
Bristol Rovers was also disappointing but I hope their lads bought lottery tickets because their luck was definitely in with their shooting for the evening.
Our football at this early point in the season hasn’t been inspiring and it’s felt like most matches could go either way by an odd goal - that’s been true throughout. Just as we were a bit lucky to beat Wigan, I think we’ve been a bit unlucky against Blackpool and Bristol Rovers.
Agree that it’s not been pretty so far but if our baseline is that we’ll win half our games and lose the other half, we’re already doing better than last year and we’ve still got plenty of time for this new squad to gel and improve.
Fair play Jones. Funny, not so stubborn, change formation and guess what we win.. oh and Godden still doing better than May this time last year. buzzing after that.
Comments
Stevenage was disappointing that we let them bully us - I take a bit of comfort from the fact they did exactly the same to Wrexham three days later, with the same scoreline.
Bristol Rovers was also disappointing but I hope their lads bought lottery tickets because their luck was definitely in with their shooting for the evening.
Our football at this early point in the season hasn’t been inspiring and it’s felt like most matches could go either way by an odd goal - that’s been true throughout. Just as we were a bit lucky to beat Wigan, I think we’ve been a bit unlucky against Blackpool and Bristol Rovers.
Agree that it’s not been pretty so far but if our baseline is that we’ll win half our games and lose the other half, we’re already doing better than last year and we’ve still got plenty of time for this new squad to gel and improve.
Bristol Rovers whilst not as comfortable weren’t afraid to have a pop and with great skill and our shit defending got a couple of good goals and then them being shit gave us a minuscule opportunity , no doubt if the results were the other way round you’d be purring about how great we were at controlling the game and getting 3 points .
we were shit against Wigan , Orient and Shrewsbury proper coin flip games and the results could have gone either way
Blackpool and Bristol Rovers no way were we unlucky , we were just shit .
Early on in the season, whilst not playing great, we were very solid and didn't concede many. He needs to get back to that and stop switching up 4-5 players every game. We're going to get bad performances, we're an average league one side with average players. But i think if he sticks with a preferred XI, keep the defence that looked solid early on, start with Godden and Leaburn up front, and then we'll soon start winning again, although probably not tomorrow.
With everyone fit I'd want a spine of Mannion,Mitchell,Coventry,Godden and Leaburn starting every game - I think Ramsay and Edwards are pretty nailed down too. Currently it feels far too much like names out of a hat in terms of who's going to start and even what the formation will be.
So really, we’re lucky to be as high as 13th? Again I don’t buy it.
The lucky to win, deserved to lose thing sounds like something a fan would think up while their club is on a losing streak…
I think Bolton was our best performance, but we caught them at a good time, Shrewsbury was a naff performance, could have gone either way.
We were pitiful against Blackpool in the first half, Stevenage genuinely outplayed us, and Bristol Rovers looked very comfortable until their arsehole fell out late on.
We could genuinely be lower in the table, fortunately we aren't. Bit worried after the next 3 games we may be though, 3 very tough games.
Chuks through on goal at 0-0 last weekend - he sticks that away and we probably win that game.
Bristol Rovers don’t stick one in the top corner from 25 yards with a weaker foot shot & Lloyd Jones heads in from two yards out, we’re ahead at half time, not behind.
Thelo Asgaard sticks the ball in the net and isn’t dispossessed at the last second by a brilliant Ramsay tackle, Wigan probably win that game.
Football results are almost always about fine margins and the way we are playing at the moment (keep it tight at the back, don’t create that much going forwards) magnifies that. It’s why I think we’re capable of beating Birmingham and simultaneously losing at Cambridge.
We have work to do to be better on the ball so that we can start to move away from most games being coin flips.
But if those things don't work you get what we've currently got. An open invitation to try a long range shot, an ineffective group of passengers in midfield and strikers who don't know what to do in the box on the rare occasion they end up there.
If you want to call it luck or skills or training, the point is that whatever we were doing has stopped working and Jones is apparently either unwilling or incapable of making the right changes to fix it.
our inept defending creates the situation for these amazing goals by the oppo and the oppo having players brave enough with enough ability to execute
we did do this against Orient
coin flips can go either way
we’ve had some go our way and I think Stevenage was a coin flip but no way we’re Rovers or Blackpool coin flips
13th in League One is probably about right for how we’ve done … shit
We’re already much improved defensively from the mess Jones inherited - let’s give him some time to build off of that foundation instead of more chopping and changing after a couple of losses.
I want less showmanship and more playermanagementship
You are talking about isolated events of the game, we should be creating more and scoring more, that's why these games are coming down to luck. It's not like we are missing chance after chance and then going a goal down.
Of course there could be an argument to be made that the scorlines are so close that it could have gone either way, but the gameplay itself says otherwise. This games we have lost we have thoroughly deserved to, and the games we have won have been fairly scrappy except Bolton imo.
The way we play is allowing these games to be so close, and from what I've seen so far, when we are losing, we didn't have much chance of winning. The style is dreadful, it's up to Jones to now fix that.
I don't want him sacked, I just want him made aware by the SMT, in no uncertain terms, that it's not good enough, that he needs to be more adaptable, and that we must see improvements sharpish.
oh and Godden still doing better than May this time last year.
buzzing after that.