The rise of the vegans.

iainment said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

DaveMehmet said:

Veggies and Vegans do get a lot of unwarranted stick but you’re not helping yourself when you make a statement that your dog is vegan.

He’s not, it’s just that YOU his owner, makes the decision for him to not eat meat.

The only vegans who get stick as far as I'm concerned, are the ones who insist on telling meat eaters that they're doing something wrong, or try and "spread the word".

Why come into a thread about the growth of veganism then? You know you'll get annoyed and annoy other people.

Because it's an open forum and if others are gonna air their opinion, I'm gonna air mine.

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

iainment said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

thewolfboy said:

As I suggested in my earlier comment, it used to be quite hard to be a vegan but now it's pretty easy with loads of prepared foods on offer. Whether or not people explore the vegan option is down to a sort of resonance as there is a spiritual vibe to it. There is a philosophy that as you stop eating flesh eating you remove a veil and you may get a bit more sensitive. It's a first step on the path to a higher consciousness. The nazarenes and many buddhists think like this.
I don't buy the vegan pets argument. Our cat eats meat/fish. Weirdly, it eats the vegan quorn when we drop a bit on the floor but generally it does not seem right to me to feed vegan food to cats and dogs. But I always wonder why we feed cats beef and lamb? It seems most unnatural! Rabbit and chicken seems far more appropriate to me but our moggy gets spoilt rotten by my wife. She would probably give it caviare if we could afford it.

Your cats also needlessly kill hundreds of song birds each year

What is your point?

Cat owners facilitate the mass, needless killing of millions of song birds every year, so that must mean they don't like animals surely

How many have you killed?

You can choose not to kill but you kill and seem to enjoy shooting animals.
Cats are unable to make that choice.

I know, but owning a cat in the first place contradicts vegan moral values though doesnt it?

Vegans don't agree with the pet industry.

Seeing as youre the self apppointed spokeswoman for Vegans, are you saying that only vegans don't agree with the pet industry, but all meat eaters do?

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

iainment said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

thewolfboy said:

As I suggested in my earlier comment, it used to be quite hard to be a vegan but now it's pretty easy with loads of prepared foods on offer. Whether or not people explore the vegan option is down to a sort of resonance as there is a spiritual vibe to it. There is a philosophy that as you stop eating flesh eating you remove a veil and you may get a bit more sensitive. It's a first step on the path to a higher consciousness. The nazarenes and many buddhists think like this.
I don't buy the vegan pets argument. Our cat eats meat/fish. Weirdly, it eats the vegan quorn when we drop a bit on the floor but generally it does not seem right to me to feed vegan food to cats and dogs. But I always wonder why we feed cats beef and lamb? It seems most unnatural! Rabbit and chicken seems far more appropriate to me but our moggy gets spoilt rotten by my wife. She would probably give it caviare if we could afford it.

Your cats also needlessly kill hundreds of song birds each year

What is your point?

Cat owners facilitate the mass, needless killing of millions of song birds every year, so that must mean they don't like animals surely

How many have you killed?

You can choose not to kill but you kill and seem to enjoy shooting animals.
Cats are unable to make that choice.

I know, but owning a cat in the first place contradicts vegan moral values though doesnt it?

Vegans don't agree with the pet industry.

Seeing as youre the self apppointed spokeswoman for Vegans, are you saying that only vegans don't agree with the pet industry, but all meat eaters do?

Where did I say this?

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

iainment said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

thewolfboy said:

As I suggested in my earlier comment, it used to be quite hard to be a vegan but now it's pretty easy with loads of prepared foods on offer. Whether or not people explore the vegan option is down to a sort of resonance as there is a spiritual vibe to it. There is a philosophy that as you stop eating flesh eating you remove a veil and you may get a bit more sensitive. It's a first step on the path to a higher consciousness. The nazarenes and many buddhists think like this.
I don't buy the vegan pets argument. Our cat eats meat/fish. Weirdly, it eats the vegan quorn when we drop a bit on the floor but generally it does not seem right to me to feed vegan food to cats and dogs. But I always wonder why we feed cats beef and lamb? It seems most unnatural! Rabbit and chicken seems far more appropriate to me but our moggy gets spoilt rotten by my wife. She would probably give it caviare if we could afford it.

Your cats also needlessly kill hundreds of song birds each year

What is your point?

Cat owners facilitate the mass, needless killing of millions of song birds every year, so that must mean they don't like animals surely

How many have you killed?

You can choose not to kill but you kill and seem to enjoy shooting animals.
Cats are unable to make that choice.

I know, but owning a cat in the first place contradicts vegan moral values though doesnt it?

Vegans don't agree with the pet industry.

Lurker said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

iainment said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

thewolfboy said:

As I suggested in my earlier comment, it used to be quite hard to be a vegan but now it's pretty easy with loads of prepared foods on offer. Whether or not people explore the vegan option is down to a sort of resonance as there is a spiritual vibe to it. There is a philosophy that as you stop eating flesh eating you remove a veil and you may get a bit more sensitive. It's a first step on the path to a higher consciousness. The nazarenes and many buddhists think like this.
I don't buy the vegan pets argument. Our cat eats meat/fish. Weirdly, it eats the vegan quorn when we drop a bit on the floor but generally it does not seem right to me to feed vegan food to cats and dogs. But I always wonder why we feed cats beef and lamb? It seems most unnatural! Rabbit and chicken seems far more appropriate to me but our moggy gets spoilt rotten by my wife. She would probably give it caviare if we could afford it.

Your cats also needlessly kill hundreds of song birds each year

What is your point?

Cat owners facilitate the mass, needless killing of millions of song birds every year, so that must mean they don't like animals surely

How many have you killed?

You can choose not to kill but you kill and seem to enjoy shooting animals.
Cats are unable to make that choice.

I know, but owning a cat in the first place contradicts vegan moral values though doesnt it?

Vegans don't agree with the pet industry.

Seeing as youre the self apppointed spokeswoman for Vegans, are you saying that only vegans don't agree with the pet industry, but all meat eaters do?

Give it a rest.

Give what a rest?

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Leuth said:

iainment said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

DaveMehmet said:

Veggies and Vegans do get a lot of unwarranted stick but you’re not helping yourself when you make a statement that your dog is vegan.

He’s not, it’s just that YOU his owner, makes the decision for him to not eat meat.

The only vegans who get stick as far as I'm concerned, are the ones who insist on telling meat eaters that they're doing something wrong, or try and "spread the word".

Why come into a thread about the growth of veganism then? You know you'll get annoyed and annoy other people.

Big Rob is here for game and game alone tbf

I'm not, it absolutely infuriates me that people make a life choice and then take the moral high ground with those who live a normal life.

To be fair, drastically reduced meat consumption will almost certainly become a practical necessity within our projected lifetimes, for reasons of energy and climate. And as I said before, ethical farming will probably become law at some stage.

I'm aware that the hunting of wild animals, such as practised by your big self, is subject to plenty of restrictions and regulations. I wonder what a draft constitution on the farming of captive livestock would look like. I don't think it would be too much of an imposition upon habitual meat-eaters to consider this.

As an addendum, I also enjoyed Simon Amstell's (fairly militant, but thankfully quite funny) TV movie on a projected timescale for national veganism. I don't think it will ever be absolute myself, but I think, for reasons explained above, that meat will increasingly become a delicacy.

Milking it by hand, obviously

Leuth said:

Milking it by hand mouth, obviously

I had vegan food for dinner tonight tasted good and cutting down on meat and dairy makes me feel better.

Not a vegan though. Have no problem feeding the dogs meat, don’t really think about it. If I did I might worry about it more

Dunno how vegans square that away with themselves tbf.

Braziliance said:

Leroy Ambrose said:

Braziliance said:

bobmunro said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

thewolfboy said:

As I suggested in my earlier comment, it used to be quite hard to be a vegan but now it's pretty easy with loads of prepared foods on offer. Whether or not people explore the vegan option is down to a sort of resonance as there is a spiritual vibe to it. There is a philosophy that as you stop eating flesh eating you remove a veil and you may get a bit more sensitive. It's a first step on the path to a higher consciousness. The nazarenes and many buddhists think like this.
I don't buy the vegan pets argument. Our cat eats meat/fish. Weirdly, it eats the vegan quorn when we drop a bit on the floor but generally it does not seem right to me to feed vegan food to cats and dogs. But I always wonder why we feed cats beef and lamb? It seems most unnatural! Rabbit and chicken seems far more appropriate to me but our moggy gets spoilt rotten by my wife. She would probably give it caviare if we could afford it.

Your cats also needlessly kill hundreds of song birds each year

What is your point?

Cat owners facilitate the mass, needless killing of millions of song birds every year, so that must mean they don't like animals surely

Again no one has said cats are perfect, you have missed the point. I hate cats toying with birds, unfortunately you can't tell a cat otherwise. A human has the ability to know right from wrong though

Are you saying humans eating animals is wrong, or just the wrong choice? Big difference.

It's both. It's the wrong choice for the environment and it's the wrong choice morally. Absolute facts. Not even an argument.

Oh piss off. Its not morally wrong. Read carefully:
YOUR MORAL CODE != ABSOLUTE
Just because YOU believe something, doesn't make it right.
To draw a parallel:
Billions of people believe homosexuality is somehow 'immoral'
Billions of people think you shouldn't have sex for any purpose other than procreation
Billions of people think their imaginary friend tells them what to do and that people who don't believe he/she/it exists are morally reprehensible

See where I'm going with this?

This always happens. People don't like the truth so they get angry. It is 100% morally wrong. Taking an innocent live is wrong. Don't bring religion or sexual orientation into it cause they can't be compared to what I'm saying.

And now back to what I originally said before people felt the need to justify their weak will power for the greater good (trying to say that without sounding like the villagers from hot fuzz) I simply don't care what you eat. Just do not try and justify it as you can't.

We won't even start on abortion then

See

Braziliance said:

bobmunro said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

thewolfboy said:

As I suggested in my earlier comment, it used to be quite hard to be a vegan but now it's pretty easy with loads of prepared foods on offer. Whether or not people explore the vegan option is down to a sort of resonance as there is a spiritual vibe to it. There is a philosophy that as you stop eating flesh eating you remove a veil and you may get a bit more sensitive. It's a first step on the path to a higher consciousness. The nazarenes and many buddhists think like this.
I don't buy the vegan pets argument. Our cat eats meat/fish. Weirdly, it eats the vegan quorn when we drop a bit on the floor but generally it does not seem right to me to feed vegan food to cats and dogs. But I always wonder why we feed cats beef and lamb? It seems most unnatural! Rabbit and chicken seems far more appropriate to me but our moggy gets spoilt rotten by my wife. She would probably give it caviare if we could afford it.

Your cats also needlessly kill hundreds of song birds each year

What is your point?

Cat owners facilitate the mass, needless killing of millions of song birds every year, so that must mean they don't like animals surely

Again no one has said cats are perfect, you have missed the point. I hate cats toying with birds, unfortunately you can't tell a cat otherwise. A human has the ability to know right from wrong though

Are you saying humans eating animals is wrong, or just the wrong choice? Big difference.

It's both. It's the wrong choice for the environment and it's the wrong choice morally. Absolute facts. Not even an argument.

Ah, now I understand, anyone who eats meat is morally wrong, "absolute facts, not even an argument".

Says who exactly?

My nan used to say it was morally wrong not to go to Church on a Sunday, in fact when I worked on a Sunday I think she wanted to have me exorcised, she simply couldn't believe it.

Jokes aside, @Braziliance I think where you fall down is that you start quoting morals, start stating that it's all facts that we shouldn't be eating meat and that because we are intelligent enough to be able to make a choice (unlike cats for example) that we should make the choice you do.

Thats simply dictating how people should live their lives, it's not a crime to eat meat (or not to) anymore than it's not a crime to drink alcohol, I personally choose not to but that doesn't make anyone who does morally wrong for doing so.

I'm sure it's 100% true we don't 'need' to eat meat to survive, we also don't need to drink anything but water, don't need to fly on a plane, practice religion, drive a car, wear clothes and 1001 other things, doesn't mean it's morally wrong to do any of those things, it's a choice we make.

seth plum said:

bobmunro said:

In total, there are around 20 amino acids that the human body uses to build proteins.

These amino acids are classified as either essential or non-essential.

Your body can produce non-essential amino acids. However, it cannot produce essential amino acids, which need to be obtained through your diet.

For optimal health, your body needs all the essential amino acids in the right ratios.

Animal protein sources, such as meat, fish, poultry, eggs and dairy, are similar to the protein found in your body.

These are considered to be complete sources of protein because they contain all of the essential amino acids that your body needs to function effectively.

On the contrary, plant protein sources, such as beans, lentils and nuts are considered to be incomplete, as they lack one or more of the essential amino acids that your body needs (1).

Some sources report soy protein as complete. However, two essential amino acids are only found in small amounts in soy, so it isn't comparable to animal protein.

#justsayin

It has also been suggested that certain amino acids are assimilated 'more easily' from meat than from protein.
However what you say also demonstrates that humans don't have to eat meat as the only way to get all the nutrition, soy protein does indeed allow for the consumption of the range of nutrients needed. It is indeed comparable, even though you say that in that comparison you reckon meat is better than soy because of 'amounts'.
I suppose what I am saying is that it is realistic to describe man as an omnivore, but that it is not essential for a balanced diet for man to eat meat, fish, eggs and dairy.
It seems to come down to a matter of choice, taste and convenience rather than a matter of scientific necessity.

I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all