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Has Bowyer lost it?
Comments
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Says we need to strengthen in every position in the transfer window.
A ringing endorsement of the players he has. What does he do when he doesn't get this mythical 10 signings?1 -
Yeah don't think he was actually too bad tonight.
Pearce is old enough to not make the same mistake several times in 95 minutes.3 -
I mean, in the main they were. I didn’t like the constant calling out of players individually, and the Maddison thing was beyond the pale, but saying that a team performance wasn’t good enough when it wasn’t is fair enough.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.Ultimately Bowyer isn’t going anywhere, so my hope is that he learns from his mistakes and based on some more sensible team selections and post match comments it feels like he might be.2 -
In terms of Bowyer tonight, had Gunter slotted in a SIMPLE header we would say he did well. He was critical of the defence but didn't single anybody out which is fine. That is a positive. I am livid at Pearce and Gunter so I'm sure Bowyer is, but digging them out by name is not what the manager should do.
You can see a team that lacks confidence though. The inability not to finish opponents off when they are there for the taking and the mistakes. Bowyer has played a part in that but it feels to me he is trying to sort himself out. No football could be played on that pitch so he set up alright for it for me.4 -
Struggle to see how tonight was Bowyers fault at all. The team was about right and we made a couple of crucial errors in a scrappy game.30
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Yes.0
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Shit. Those comments about us not moving fast enough to bring a player in. He just needs to shut up sometimes.
How is it going to help?2 -
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.14 -
Would you really come out midway through a season and say that we need strengthening in every position?Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
Sure he can think that, but actually coming out and saying it demoralises every player in that locker room. He doesn't think you're worth being in the team and can't wait to buy someone better than you.
Especially when we sign 2 players at best this window and still have 6 months of most of these first teamers.2 -
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.2 - Sponsored links:
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Desperately needs a win against Swindon now0
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I I took bowyers comments as we need a defender, midfielder and attacker, not that we need 10 new players18
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It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
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I don't think that's controversial, I think it's weird. What "good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two" players can you magic up for a couple of grand a week?Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
Amos is better than that, so is Williams. If they leave in the summer I don't think you'll see either of them rock up at a Gillingham.2 -
Also they're only charged at £1,300 a week each so even if you got 'as good as' players you'd be getting less value.Cafc43v3r said:
I don't think that's controversial, I think it's weird. What "good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two" players can you magic up for a couple of grand a week?Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
Amos is better than that, so is Williams. If they leave in the summer I don't think you'll see either of them rock up at a Gillingham.2 -
No-one in the Championship wanted them or they wouldn't be here now. If Charlton in League One is their ceiling, I don't think their contracts are worth renewing at the money they're on.Cafc43v3r said:
I don't think that's controversial, I think it's weird. What "good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two" players can you magic up for a couple of grand a week?Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
Amos is better than that, so is Williams. If they leave in the summer I don't think you'll see either of them rock up at a Gillingham.
I think you'll be surprised re: the Gillingham comment. Who envisioned Solly dropping to Ebbsfleet?2 -
Not if you replace Williams with a player who can regularly play 90 minutes.Dazzler21 said:
Also they're only charged at £1,300 a week each so even if you got 'as good as' players you'd be getting less value.Cafc43v3r said:
I don't think that's controversial, I think it's weird. What "good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two" players can you magic up for a couple of grand a week?Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
Amos is better than that, so is Williams. If they leave in the summer I don't think you'll see either of them rock up at a Gillingham.4 -
Ah quite fair indeed.Scoham said:
Not if you replace Williams with a player who can regularly play 90 minutes.Dazzler21 said:
Also they're only charged at £1,300 a week each so even if you got 'as good as' players you'd be getting less value.Cafc43v3r said:
I don't think that's controversial, I think it's weird. What "good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two" players can you magic up for a couple of grand a week?Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
Amos is better than that, so is Williams. If they leave in the summer I don't think you'll see either of them rock up at a Gillingham.1 -
Yes. I believe, in my opinion, that he has lost the dressing room, but I also believe that someone has had a word in his ear about toning down the level of public criticism towards the players as i've seen an improvement in that regard in recent interviews.i_b_b_o_r_g said:
It was "clear that he lost the dressing room" the other day, according to you, but now the results have gone the other, it's "clear that someone’s had a word in his ear”.Gravesend_Addick said:I think it's clear someone has had a word in his ear. Much calmer and more supportive of players in recent interviews.
Good to see
What is "clear" to me is that Bowyer’s position has swung from a no-lose situation (While the panto was in town) to a no-win situation, overnight literally. And there were far too many people jumping the gun, calling for him to be sacked far too prematurely the other day. That's referencing purely the people who were calling for hm to go, and not those who were merely questioning his tactics.
I don't see why both my observations can't be true & I stand by both statements3 -
Re Solly probably anyone that watched him over the last 2 years, he is sadly no where near the player he was.Callumcafc said:
No-one in the Championship wanted them or they wouldn't be here now. If Charlton in League One is their ceiling, I don't think their contracts are worth renewing at the money they're on.Cafc43v3r said:
I don't think that's controversial, I think it's weird. What "good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two" players can you magic up for a couple of grand a week?Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
Amos is better than that, so is Williams. If they leave in the summer I don't think you'll see either of them rock up at a Gillingham.
I think you'll be surprised re: the Gillingham comment. Who envisioned Solly dropping to Ebbsfleet?
We can't renew them on what they are on because of the cap, they only count as the league average so its a mute point.0 - Sponsored links:
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I also believe the best way for a promotion aspiring squad to save some of the budget is to loan a keeper, it's worked well for other side's in this league and the championship, if we have a solidified back 4 a keeper is easy enough to bed in compared to let's say a loanee centre back or centre mid. Amos (although I rate him) wages will be the most for a league 1 keeper and he's hardly showing he is the stand out keeper in this league. Nathan Baxter did very well for Accrington against us for instance and I imagine he isn't taking up even close to Amos wage bill.Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
I think next season we need to see if AMB is ready or loan a prem goalie0 -
Bowyer isn’t loosing it, but he may be losing it.
I think he is trying not to loose it but sometimes he still does lose it.6 -
Bowyer has definitely lost the snazzy jumpers he used to wear. Perhaps like Samson, without them he loses all his strength4
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Not sure it matters to be honest. You need to loan 5/6 decent players, don’t think their position matters. If you have a decent keeper, why get rid of him to loan one in. That’s an extra outfield player you need to sign rather than loan.Braziliance said:
I also believe the best way for a promotion aspiring squad to save some of the budget is to loan a keeper, it's worked well for other side's in this league and the championship, if we have a solidified back 4 a keeper is easy enough to bed in compared to let's say a loanee centre back or centre mid. Amos (although I rate him) wages will be the most for a league 1 keeper and he's hardly showing he is the stand out keeper in this league. Nathan Baxter did very well for Accrington against us for instance and I imagine he isn't taking up even close to Amos wage bill.Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
I think next season we need to see if AMB is ready or loan a prem goalie1 -
Love Bowyer, Love his honesty.
Seems to see what I see. Seems to react to what I see.
Maybe some never played in a team that wanted to win.
Maybe never been in a situation when that mattered.
Maybe some do not understand what that means.
To be in a team. To be against it.
I hate quitters.
I hate negativity.
It is never over until it is.
Fit in or fuck off.
Stay together and fight.
Never surrender.
Win or lose, we do it together.5 -
I think in our circumstance it would, with loans it will sometimes be the case of a prem team paying so long as they play, Amos is probably on 2x what the average league 1 player is I imagine more or less, a goalie is a lot easier to get every other season until the rest of your team is set, back lines, mids and striker pairings take a lot more work.cafcfan1990 said:
Not sure it matters to be honest. You need to loan 5/6 decent players, don’t think their position matters. If you have a decent keeper, why get rid of him to loan one in. That’s an extra outfield player you need to sign rather than loan.Braziliance said:
I also believe the best way for a promotion aspiring squad to save some of the budget is to loan a keeper, it's worked well for other side's in this league and the championship, if we have a solidified back 4 a keeper is easy enough to bed in compared to let's say a loanee centre back or centre mid. Amos (although I rate him) wages will be the most for a league 1 keeper and he's hardly showing he is the stand out keeper in this league. Nathan Baxter did very well for Accrington against us for instance and I imagine he isn't taking up even close to Amos wage bill.Callumcafc said:
It might be controversial but yes I would. I think the wages can be better spent on players that have potential to go beyond good-to-decent tier three, relegation fodder tier two. Yes Bowyer signed two of them but once again, they were signed under very difficult circumstances.Cafc43v3r said:
So you would get rid of Amos, JFC and Williams, or actually just not have them at all? Bowyer signed 2 of them in the first place.Callumcafc said:
Really don't understand this point of view. Every player in the squad that was signed pre-Sandgaard was signed under very limiting circumstances and most likely will not have been first choice targets. A clear out will be needed, whether Bowyer is in charge or someone else is.SELR_addicks said:Again comes out and calls the players crap. Not really here for it. You picked them Bowyer, live with it.
You've also got older heads like Amos, Forster-Caskey and Williams who used the one year extension option in their contracts with us because they knew they were unlikely to get better offers elsewhere. Meanwhile, half decent players like Lockyer jumped ship.
What about Washington and Gilbey who signed them pre Thomas? Someone really wanted them else they wouldn't have risked administration or begged the EFL to let them sign them.
What about Watson, Maddison and Gunter who Bowyer wanted last season?
He spent the full cap, it's not like he was forced to sign nobodies or play a bunch of kids.
I think next season we need to see if AMB is ready or loan a prem goalie
I am just saying for next season I don't see the need for Amos assuming he is still on high wages and we need to save money, could be invested in better areas imo0 -
Agree with this.cafcfan1990 said:Struggle to see how tonight was Bowyers fault at all. The team was about right and we made a couple of crucial errors in a scrappy game.
I'll be honest and admit that 3-4 games ago i was one who thought he'd lost it, ranting and calling players out after games. But the last 2 performances have been better, it's clear he hasn't lost the dressing room or anything and there's no way Bowyer can be blamed for last night.
Ultimately we're just not very good at the back. I'm confident that if Inniss and Famewo had played last night then we'd have won. Pearce can't make the mistakes he's been making, let the ball bounce v Accrington, striker runs on and scores and we let the ball bounce last night, their guy equalises. Simple basic errors that a manager can't really be accountable for.
However in the same way i didn't get carried away at the weekend (as lets face it, we scored via a lucky goal from a corner and they could've equalised at the end), i'm not getting carried away after last nights defeat. We're still capable of getting defenders back and going on an unbeaten run as a lot of sides in this league are not very good.4 -
The only thing i'd question Bowyer on is some players seem 'undroppable' no mater how bad they play. Gunter has been relatively poor, he's made mistakes, he's given away penalties, yet whenever there is a right back choice, he plays ahead of Matthews every time. Why?
Pearce was poor for a couple of games, misses a game v suspension which we win and keep a clean sheet, yet he comes straight back in to make more mistakes.
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This thread is almost as irritating as the “come in number 4” one .2
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With the salary cap I think we are down here for a few years ....1
This discussion has been closed.
