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Has Bowyer lost it?
Comments
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I know you won't, I can tell you aren't trying to point score here. My point was you are saying you are fed up of the Bowyer in and out camp sniping at eachother but your post furthers it is all. It's like saying 'no offense' before you offend someone and then say what would offend them anyway.cafctom said:
No. What I find tedious are the ‘black and white’ perceptions and finger points that are made by a section of our fans when someone is trying to make a reasoned point about where things are going wrong.Braziliance said:
But now you have just contributed to what you are finding tedious.cafctom said:The whole “where are the Bowyer in/out crowd” type comments quite common on social media after a game are becoming tedious.
I’m not “Bowyer out”, but I’m more along the lines of “I really want it to work under Bowyer, but can’t see it happening long term”. Thankfully it’s not my decision as to whether he stays, goes, who replaces him etc.What I will say though is that a 2-0 win away at Rochdale doesn’t change my view on Bowyer for better or worse, because quite frankly, that’s a result we should be getting.
Where I’ll judge Bowyer is over a string of games or a period of time. Over the past year it hasn’t been good enough - and yes, I do put some of the Championship relegation on him.If he gets to the end of the season, then so be it, it’s not as if the club is going to fold if we stay in League One for another season and we don’t go up.But if we take the rose-tinted glasses off and stop talking about loyalty and the excuses - he hasn’t been good enough for about 12 months. Again - a win away at Rochdale doesn’t change that all of a sudden
We have won and you come on a thread about him to basically say you aren't impressed by him, your post is certainly more anti-Bowyer than pro Bowyer..
Anyway he clearly hasn't lost it, never did. In the famous words of Gattuso ''Sometimes maybe good, sometimes maybe shit''. That is football unless you are an elite club.
Just how a number of our fans believe Bowyer over thinks his team, I think we overthink bad results
To express frustration with the manager’s continued mistakes and poor results does not automatically put someone in the ‘Bowyer out’ camp.Yes, my post was more ‘anti-Bowyer’ than pro-Bowyer as you put it. That is allowed isn’t it? I haven’t called him useless or abused the bloke. But this is a discussion forum about Charlton - and I’ve backed up my opinion as to why I think he has underperformed over the past 12 months.You’re more than entitled to disagree, and I won’t be shouting “where are the Bowyer in crowd?!?!” or anything to that effect the next time we lose a match.
Because ever since we left the prem there is a bit of an entitlement in this fan base that we are bigger than what we actually are. Every season we say our squad is good enough to do this and do that. Every season we only have a couple, sometimes a handful of genuinely good players thoughCallumcafc said:
A bit of revisionism going on here IMO. There were people on this forum calling him 1 goal Chuks up until September even. Davison had played well in cameo appearances and scored as many goals as Chuks had at that point.cafctom said:
I agree - But the point being that going into a must win game against a top side, why would you still be tinkering with a line up to put in a largely inexperienced player when you have your best available player on the bench? It doesn’t add up.MuttleyCAFC said:
I don't think we would have got anything from Leeds however we played or set up. There were a few games where we went ultra negative which cost us points.cafctom said:
“Insane”...really? Ok.Callumcafc said:
This is insane. Even Pep Guardiola would’ve struggled to keep us up.cafctom said:
Where I’ll judge Bowyer is over a string of games or a period of time. Over the past year it hasn’t been good enough - and yes, I do put some of the Championship relegation on him.
In my post I stated that I put some of the responsibility for the relegation on Bowyer. Not all of it. He was dealt a tough hand.
But it was still his decision making which lead to us throwing away points in injury time on many occasions.
Would Pep Guardiola have gone into a must win final game of the season against the champions elect and started an inexperienced Josh Davison up front, instead of Chuks Aneke?
When we were relegated, I did not state that I wanted Bowyer out. He deserved the chance to have a clean slate and start afresh. But now that the same excuses cannot be put in his favour for our poor performances, it does shine bit of a light on how Bowyer’s decision making likely did have an impact on our Championship relegation.
I honestly could not recall a time in recent history where we have put out a team and I've thought player to player we look great. It's one of the most frustrating bits about this forum when that debate happens. None of us watch other sides or follow their club etc but we always assume we have better players than the rest of the league, particularly in this league. 'This squad shouldn't be where it is' etc
We done well to even compete last season, we will never know but we probably would have stayed up if Lyle played, one of the few players left on the books that was championship quality, can't say much for the rest of them bar Phillips, Cullen and maybe Lockyer3 -
I think the self entitlement went a long time ago personally. We expected Robinson to do better, we did when he left. We expected to be competitive the next season and we went up, look at that team in hindsight, only Purrington, Pratley and Parker haven’t gone on to better things of those that started that game. 99% of our fans expected to struggle last season, the big disappointment was that we put ourselves in a great position and shouldn’t really have got relegated if you look at the table in the November.Braziliance said:
I know you won't, I can tell you aren't trying to point score here. My point was you are saying you are fed up of the Bowyer in and out camp sniping at eachother but your post furthers it is all. It's like saying 'no offense' before you offend someone and then say what would offend them anyway.cafctom said:
No. What I find tedious are the ‘black and white’ perceptions and finger points that are made by a section of our fans when someone is trying to make a reasoned point about where things are going wrong.Braziliance said:
But now you have just contributed to what you are finding tedious.cafctom said:The whole “where are the Bowyer in/out crowd” type comments quite common on social media after a game are becoming tedious.
I’m not “Bowyer out”, but I’m more along the lines of “I really want it to work under Bowyer, but can’t see it happening long term”. Thankfully it’s not my decision as to whether he stays, goes, who replaces him etc.What I will say though is that a 2-0 win away at Rochdale doesn’t change my view on Bowyer for better or worse, because quite frankly, that’s a result we should be getting.
Where I’ll judge Bowyer is over a string of games or a period of time. Over the past year it hasn’t been good enough - and yes, I do put some of the Championship relegation on him.If he gets to the end of the season, then so be it, it’s not as if the club is going to fold if we stay in League One for another season and we don’t go up.But if we take the rose-tinted glasses off and stop talking about loyalty and the excuses - he hasn’t been good enough for about 12 months. Again - a win away at Rochdale doesn’t change that all of a sudden
We have won and you come on a thread about him to basically say you aren't impressed by him, your post is certainly more anti-Bowyer than pro Bowyer..
Anyway he clearly hasn't lost it, never did. In the famous words of Gattuso ''Sometimes maybe good, sometimes maybe shit''. That is football unless you are an elite club.
Just how a number of our fans believe Bowyer over thinks his team, I think we overthink bad results
To express frustration with the manager’s continued mistakes and poor results does not automatically put someone in the ‘Bowyer out’ camp.Yes, my post was more ‘anti-Bowyer’ than pro-Bowyer as you put it. That is allowed isn’t it? I haven’t called him useless or abused the bloke. But this is a discussion forum about Charlton - and I’ve backed up my opinion as to why I think he has underperformed over the past 12 months.You’re more than entitled to disagree, and I won’t be shouting “where are the Bowyer in crowd?!?!” or anything to that effect the next time we lose a match.
Because ever since we left the prem there is a bit of an entitlement in this fan base that we are bigger than what we actually are. Every season we say our squad is good enough to do this and do that. Every season we only have a couple, sometimes a handful of genuinely good players thoughCallumcafc said:
A bit of revisionism going on here IMO. There were people on this forum calling him 1 goal Chuks up until September even. Davison had played well in cameo appearances and scored as many goals as Chuks had at that point.cafctom said:
I agree - But the point being that going into a must win game against a top side, why would you still be tinkering with a line up to put in a largely inexperienced player when you have your best available player on the bench? It doesn’t add up.MuttleyCAFC said:
I don't think we would have got anything from Leeds however we played or set up. There were a few games where we went ultra negative which cost us points.cafctom said:
“Insane”...really? Ok.Callumcafc said:
This is insane. Even Pep Guardiola would’ve struggled to keep us up.cafctom said:
Where I’ll judge Bowyer is over a string of games or a period of time. Over the past year it hasn’t been good enough - and yes, I do put some of the Championship relegation on him.
In my post I stated that I put some of the responsibility for the relegation on Bowyer. Not all of it. He was dealt a tough hand.
But it was still his decision making which lead to us throwing away points in injury time on many occasions.
Would Pep Guardiola have gone into a must win final game of the season against the champions elect and started an inexperienced Josh Davison up front, instead of Chuks Aneke?
When we were relegated, I did not state that I wanted Bowyer out. He deserved the chance to have a clean slate and start afresh. But now that the same excuses cannot be put in his favour for our poor performances, it does shine bit of a light on how Bowyer’s decision making likely did have an impact on our Championship relegation.
I honestly could not recall a time in recent history where we have put out a team and I've thought player to player we look great. It's one of the most frustrating bits about this forum when that debate happens. None of us watch other sides or follow their club etc but we always assume we have better players than the rest of the league, particularly in this league. 'This squad shouldn't be where it is' etc
We done well to even compete last season, we will never know but we probably would have stayed up if Lyle played, one of the few players left on the books that was championship quality, can't say much for the rest of them bar Phillips, Cullen and maybe LockyerThis season is tricky because we are bouncing back as a club and had to rush around getting a squad. Despite that, we have the players to be competitive and the results over the last couple of months have been unacceptable. I’m not talking walking the league and I don’t disagree with your point about a lack of knowledge of other squads, but it’s undeniable that we’ve been on an awful run. Undoubtedly expectations rose because of our form, I think that was the same last season. Unfortunately when you over achieve the underachieving looks even worse.3 -
You've either missed the point I was making or I need to explain it better.Braziliance said:
I know you won't, I can tell you aren't trying to point score here. My point was you are saying you are fed up of the Bowyer in and out camp sniping at eachother but your post furthers it is all. It's like saying 'no offense' before you offend someone and then say what would offend them anyway.cafctom said:
No. What I find tedious are the ‘black and white’ perceptions and finger points that are made by a section of our fans when someone is trying to make a reasoned point about where things are going wrong.Braziliance said:
But now you have just contributed to what you are finding tedious.cafctom said:The whole “where are the Bowyer in/out crowd” type comments quite common on social media after a game are becoming tedious.
I’m not “Bowyer out”, but I’m more along the lines of “I really want it to work under Bowyer, but can’t see it happening long term”. Thankfully it’s not my decision as to whether he stays, goes, who replaces him etc.What I will say though is that a 2-0 win away at Rochdale doesn’t change my view on Bowyer for better or worse, because quite frankly, that’s a result we should be getting.
Where I’ll judge Bowyer is over a string of games or a period of time. Over the past year it hasn’t been good enough - and yes, I do put some of the Championship relegation on him.If he gets to the end of the season, then so be it, it’s not as if the club is going to fold if we stay in League One for another season and we don’t go up.But if we take the rose-tinted glasses off and stop talking about loyalty and the excuses - he hasn’t been good enough for about 12 months. Again - a win away at Rochdale doesn’t change that all of a sudden
We have won and you come on a thread about him to basically say you aren't impressed by him, your post is certainly more anti-Bowyer than pro Bowyer..
Anyway he clearly hasn't lost it, never did. In the famous words of Gattuso ''Sometimes maybe good, sometimes maybe shit''. That is football unless you are an elite club.
Just how a number of our fans believe Bowyer over thinks his team, I think we overthink bad results
To express frustration with the manager’s continued mistakes and poor results does not automatically put someone in the ‘Bowyer out’ camp.Yes, my post was more ‘anti-Bowyer’ than pro-Bowyer as you put it. That is allowed isn’t it? I haven’t called him useless or abused the bloke. But this is a discussion forum about Charlton - and I’ve backed up my opinion as to why I think he has underperformed over the past 12 months.You’re more than entitled to disagree, and I won’t be shouting “where are the Bowyer in crowd?!?!” or anything to that effect the next time we lose a match.
It is correct that I am tired with the sniping between the 'Bowyer in' and 'Bowyer out' factions.
But you're going to need to explain to me how my post has furthered that? I've not tried to goad, belittle or antagonize those who are Bowyer supporters - I've simply put my opinions across regarding Bowyer's performance as part of the debate that has now run for 63 pages, and done my best to back it up with reasoning. I've no issue with fans debating the manager's performances/ability if its done in a manner that is based on debate rather than merely making digs at those who disagree.
What I've expressed a dislike with, and what I've tried to do are two different things entirely IMO.1 -
Here you go fellas... Thought Id bump this5
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It’ll be the refs fault today! 🤬1
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No way , we should stay up
tough tough league5 -
TrUsT tHe PrOcEsS1
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93 pages by the end of the night1
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Look forward to the summer and a new spirit of positivity from a leadership team. This season has gone.2
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It’s every week, you can write the script before a ball is kicked.
Bowyer will moan about worldies being scored against us but the only reasonis because we back off every single time and invite other teams to shoot from just outside the box. That defending for the third today was nothing short of disgraceful.
This team are horrible to watch, we need a change if we are to have any chance of promotion.We will miss out on top 6 with bowyer in charge and with this team and the standard of the league, it is beyond abysmal.14 - Sponsored links:
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Don't think there was much else Bows could do today tbh.
We are clearly missing crowds at home.10 -
How rude... Not even a thank you for saving everyone from searching for the threadForeverAddickted said:Here you go fellas... Thought Id bump this
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We are rubbish. The odd ok performance and win then utter mediocrity game after game. Gillingham are awful. His time has run out2
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How does a new manager change the defence Jesus Christ.
Save yourself the embarrassment today lads5 -
If that’s true, in mid Feb, it’s an absolute disgrace.Wheresmeticket? said:Look forward to the summer and a new spirit of positivity from a leadership team. This season has gone.1 -
As fans you have to decide whether it's either the players or coaches fault that:
We never seem to be able to close players down.
When the play changes from us attacking to defending we look all over the place defensively.
We rarely win the second ball.
Our defensive/midfield headers never seem to go to a Charlton shirt.
Because that's something seriously wrong at the moment.
1 - Sponsored links:
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ForeverAddickted said:Here you go fellas... Thought Id bump this
You want to get me started don't you!
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As someone said in the match thread, no crowds at home are probably saving his bacon, Danish bacon.carly burn said:Don't think there was much else Bows could do today tbh.
We are clearly missing crowds at home.
I just think Bowyer is a shit coach, a Charlton legend BUT a shit coach.
May come to him with more experience but it will keep us in L1, along with shit refs and pub teams of course!
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Scoring a goal normally comes from an attacking play, you were asking about how we improve our (woeful) defence.esseffect said:2 -
You don’t get promoted out of this league if you’re a shit coach...soapy_jones said:
As someone said in the match thread, no crowds at home are probably saving his bacon, Danish bacon.carly burn said:Don't think there was much else Bows could do today tbh.
We are clearly missing crowds at home.
I just think Bowyer is a shit coach, a Charlton legend BUT a shit coach.
May come to him with more experience but it will keep us in L1, along with shit refs and pub teams of course!5 -
Out now.2
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You do if you have a squad of players that have proved they were far too good for this league. And could only scrape through in the play-offs.Callumcafc said:
You don’t get promoted out of this league if you’re a shit coach...soapy_jones said:
As someone said in the match thread, no crowds at home are probably saving his bacon, Danish bacon.carly burn said:Don't think there was much else Bows could do today tbh.
We are clearly missing crowds at home.
I just think Bowyer is a shit coach, a Charlton legend BUT a shit coach.
May come to him with more experience but it will keep us in L1, along with shit refs and pub teams of course!5 -
Reckon we should sack him and bring in a L1 stalwart like Steve Evans.SELR_addicks said:
You do if you have a squad of players that have proved they were far too good for this league. And could only scrape through in the play-offs.Callumcafc said:
You don’t get promoted out of this league if you’re a shit coach...soapy_jones said:
As someone said in the match thread, no crowds at home are probably saving his bacon, Danish bacon.carly burn said:Don't think there was much else Bows could do today tbh.
We are clearly missing crowds at home.
I just think Bowyer is a shit coach, a Charlton legend BUT a shit coach.
May come to him with more experience but it will keep us in L1, along with shit refs and pub teams of course!13 -
Honestly trying to work out if this is a joke.Callumcafc said:
You don’t get promoted out of this league if you’re a shit coach...soapy_jones said:
As someone said in the match thread, no crowds at home are probably saving his bacon, Danish bacon.carly burn said:Don't think there was much else Bows could do today tbh.
We are clearly missing crowds at home.
I just think Bowyer is a shit coach, a Charlton legend BUT a shit coach.
May come to him with more experience but it will keep us in L1, along with shit refs and pub teams of course!0 -
Tell me what league players from that winning team are playing in now.Callumcafc said:
You don’t get promoted out of this league if you’re a shit coach...soapy_jones said:
As someone said in the match thread, no crowds at home are probably saving his bacon, Danish bacon.carly burn said:Don't think there was much else Bows could do today tbh.
We are clearly missing crowds at home.
I just think Bowyer is a shit coach, a Charlton legend BUT a shit coach.
May come to him with more experience but it will keep us in L1, along with shit refs and pub teams of course!
You've still got to do the job for sure, but considering that XI are all championship and above quality you should be getting promoted.
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J BLOCK said:It’s every week, you can write the script before a ball is kicked.
Bowyer will moan about worldies being scored against us but the only reasonis because we back off every single time and invite other teams to shoot from just outside the box. That defending for the third today was nothing short of disgraceful.
This team are horrible to watch, we need a change if we are to have any chance of promotion.We will miss out on top 6 with bowyer in charge and with this team and the standard of the league, it is beyond abysmal.Okay, we disagree on things, I get that. I am not winding up here.Is my loyalty to Bowyer displaced? Coupled with thinking stability and Sandgaard's view of Bowyer so wrong.0
This discussion has been closed.
