Charlton Women to rebrand as "Charlton Ladies" - turned down by FA (p28)

Swisdom said:

This was brewing last week on Twitter and I was befuddled then.  I am befuddled now.
im not entirely sure what the issue is between using ladies instead of women or vice versa.

having said that it has certainlyProvoked a reaction so it might have been better asking the question as opposed to just doing it

Me neither to be honest but if all the team & Women (almost typed ladies) management have told sandgaard that it's not on why isn't he listening ( & why isn't JJ manager?)

Yes it's really less about the ladies/women differentiation and a whole lot more about TS ignoring everyone underneath him complaining about a decision he's making. Then ploughing on with the decision regardless. 

Not everything needs to be changed. Sometimes bad decisions happen and you need to humble enough to recognise you aren't always going to make the right decision. Just like Addicks to Victory instead of RRR, he needs to realise he's messed up and change it back/undo his decision. 

I'm not gonna get into the ins and outs of what is the right or wrong word to use and what is offensive in what context and what isn't because its not my place.

What is very telling is that almost every club that was using ladies has at some point in the last 15 years moved to using women. A few remain using ladies. Not a single club has moved from using women to ladies. 

That in itself shows this would be a significant backwards step.

I'm very grateful to TS for getting the women's club back under the same umbrella as the men's. It's a big part of making us feel like a proper club again. Likewise making the women team professional is huge. But get that ego in check. 

NorthheathAddick said:

The Red Robin said:

Dazzler21 said:

But why is "Ladies" offensive?!

Because it’s outdated and archaic and the women’s team have asked not to be called that. But I suppose a middle-aged man knows better. 

Is it..?,I’ve never heard a speech start with Woman & Gentleman before…🤔,anyways if the Woman’s team don’t like it I agree with them it shouldn’t be changed…

Setting and situation is important to the language used. A term can be deemed correct in a formal setting but offensive in a more professional one. 

This is all part of the transition from the Charlton Athletic Women's Team into the Charlton Athletic Cheerleading Squad. 

tangoflash said:

I personally don't give a shit either way. I support Charlton mens team. If I happen to see that the "Ladies" team won 10-0, my reaction is the same to them losing 10-0. I can't understand why people think you support the mens team, so therefore have some feeling towards the women's game. I find it annoying when the media keep intergrating it all under the same banner and injecting their news into the general mens football articles and this includes clubs doing it. I really enjoy listening to Charlton Live podcast, but every now and then they start banging on about the womens team and playing interviews of players and managers. It's not what their audience is there for. Let them have their own pod. I know I'll probably get slated for saying this, but I'll be shocked if even 5% of the users here bother following the girls game. To me, Women's football to a different sport that I have no interest in.............

similar to you, I have zero interest in the women’s game, but that’s the same zero interest I have in Men’s rugby or formula one or golf.  They’re all sports I have no time for.  However, I think with football, to elevate the female game, it in itself has had to attach it to the men’s game to generate publicity and interest, until which point it can stand on its own for popularity and commercial viability 

Given I don’t follow women’s football, I have no idea if that popularity is at that point, but it’s certainly becoming more mainstream, and that can only be a good thing.  If it helps elevate the profile of the women’s game, then what is the harm of them using Charlton, the Charlton I/we follow to do that.

Charlton TV covers a lot more than just the first team.  Last night there was the bit on the LGBQT+ work of the community trust.  If we’re talking/discussing these initiatives, then what harm the women’s team getting coverage.  We’ve got Curbs’ Santa bag or some sort of silly thing they’re also doing at the moment (which I am not knocking).  Just using it as a point that between 7-10 is a lot of time to fill on air with content.  As much as I love the men’s team, it can’t all be about the miniature of team tactics and Curbs, Minto and the studio guest analysing the 2-0 win up at Gateshead.   

They don't differentiate between the female and male teams on Sky Sports any more, so should we? Just call them Charlton Athletic and be done with it

cantersaddick said:

I'm not gonna get into the ins and outs of what is the right or wrong word to use and what is offensive in what context and what isn't because its not my place.

What is very telling is that almost every club that was using ladies has at some point in the last 15 years moved to using women. A few remain using ladies. Not a single club has moved from using women to ladies. 

That in itself shows this would be a significant backwards step.

I'm very grateful to TS for getting the women's club back under the same umbrella as the men's. It's a big part of making us feel like a proper club again. Likewise making the women team professional is huge. But get that ego in check. 

14 of the 22 teams playing in the ‘Women’ FA cup on Sunday were ladies. The bigger teams are defo mainly women though.

Surely with most things relating to how people identify self determination should be the main factor. If the players and coaching staff and other main stake holders want to be identified with the term ‘women’ not ‘ladies’ TS would seem very silly to go against that in my view.

On another note it is an interesting discussion as to whether you support the team or the club. I would be lying if I said that the results of the men’s team don’t mean far more to me than any of the others, but that doesn’t mean I won’t take pride in the progress and success of academy teams, the women’s team the upbeats and any other team that represents our club. And as a father of two daughters, I perhaps recognise the benefit of a women’s team more than I would have done in my younger days. It is important for kids growing up to have role models in all areas of interest that they can relate to and not feel that certain fields are excluded to them from the start.

PWR

I sense any objection is a generational thing.

People my age don't give a toss about names.

You know why?

Because it doesn't bloody well matter.

Major said:

PWR

I sense any objection is a generational thing.

People my age don't give a toss about names.

You know why?

Because it doesn't bloody well matter.

Do you mean men your age? Because I have yet to come across a woman of any age put their hand up and say they don’t give a toss.

I repeat.

There is no upside to this change, only unhappy players, coaches sponsors plus reputational damage.

And if as some claim names don't matter, why is the name being changed?

 Will you be equally indifferent when the men's team becomes Charlton Chargers?  It's just a name.

I doubt many in women’s football agree that this is ‘much ado about nothing’ AFKA with all due respect. 

It’s surprising that TS would back women’s football at Charlton with hard cash on one hand, and attempt to make a change which will be viewed as antagonistic and retrogressive on the other. Most bizarre. 

‘Charlton Women are set to rebrand as ‘Charlton Ladies’ in a shock decision that its players have labelled “insulting.”

The move to drop the moniker ‘women’ in favour of ‘ladies’ is understood to have been driven by Charlton’s owner, Thomas Sandgaard, the Danish-American businessman who agreed to a historic takeover of the women’s side in February this year.

A senior source at the club said the decision has sparked outrage among players, who branded the move “insulting” and “derogatory” in a club meeting with Sandgaard last Friday.

Karen Hills, who took over the championship side earlier this year and enjoyed a successful playing career with the Addicks between 2001 and 2007, is also said to be staunchly opposed to the idea.

Such are the players’ frustrations that they have reportedly drafted a letter to the Professional Footballers’ Association in a last-ditch attempt to block the name change, although Charlton have already listed the women’s team as the ‘Ladies’ Team’ on its official club website.’

blackpool72 said:

I cannot see a single reason for doing this other than he  can because he's the owner. 
It's a terrible decision and another example that the people advising him are at times inept. 
We need an experienced CEO in place to offer advice to prevent this type of thing happening. 
Addicks to victory at the end of a win being another load of bollox. 
If he refuses to listen then I'm afraid it's all about his ego.

Blaming people that advise him assumes it’s not his idea. Evidence so far suggests TS doesn’t listen to advice.