I can understand people being protective of Jackson but the truth is he is not worth his place in the starting eleven anymore.
The truth is Jackson hasn't been worth his place in the starting eleven for a couple of years. Leave him on the bench, he's good for 15 mins & could even grab you a goal.
Does he get slower the more he is on the pitch? No. He was good before recent pressing tactics found out his lack of pace. He can't do a job for 5,10,15 minutes let alone 90. Good in his day, a talisman but now a busted flush. The fact he can't see it, diminishes him. Even Ali recognised it was time to go and called it a day.
A potential manager but not a sub or starter.
That's ridiculous. He's had a few poor games this year but some very good ones too. Plenty of average ones as well. He may not be the player he was and probably shouldn't be starting every week but as rotation/bench option he is good enough.
he's finished playing out wide, but set the team up correctly and he's still worth a spot, 3 at the back and a 5 man midfield he could easily play the 'quarterback' role - trouble is we probably don't have the other personnel to play a system like that
But he really hasn't been a standout player for most of this time. That Norwich goal was a case in point. Get run ragged in midfield for 85 minutes, scuff one in off the defender's heel and suddenly all the criticism is invalid. While a goalscoring threat in the box, Jackson really doesn't bring much else to the team. He doesn't challenge, pass, move or cross. He's a great guy and a club legend but when is the last time any of you saw him dominate in midfield? Maybe that first half against Brentford under Luzon before he went off injured?
he's finished playing out wide, but set the team up correctly and he's still worth a spot, 3 at the back and a 5 man midfield he could easily play the 'quarterback' role - trouble is we probably don't have the other personnel to play a system like that
still love the bloke though
Literally the only way we could get relegated to L2 is if we built a team around JJ
he's finished playing out wide, but set the team up correctly and he's still worth a spot, 3 at the back and a 5 man midfield he could easily play the 'quarterback' role - trouble is we probably don't have the other personnel to play a system like that
still love the bloke though
I love Jacko, but he should be a sub. It's almost like playing with 10 men when he starts and it's compounded, if he starts in midfield with the other older players Foley & Crofts.
But he really hasn't been a standout player for most of this time. That Norwich goal was a case in point. Get run ragged in midfield for 85 minutes, scuff one in off the defender's heel and suddenly all the criticism is invalid. While a goalscoring threat in the box, Jackson really doesn't bring much else to the team. He doesn't challenge, pass, move or cross. He's a great guy and a club legend but when is the last time any of you saw him dominate in midfield? Maybe that first half against Brentford under Luzon before he went off injured?
Quite. Kinsella's a club legend, but I wouldn't want him starting in midfield anymore. We transferred Kins out when his knees were shot. All legends careers have to come to an end.
Probably the worst thing about Jackson's current run in the team is that he's been taking the set-pieces. What is the point of playing him if you're not going to have him in the box trying to score?
Anyway, I really think he'll be a fantastic manager and have a management career that dwarfs his playing achievements - like, he'll be remembered as a manager. I'd be delighted if that was with us.
I want to see a performance like yesterday in the centre of the park, instead of out wide, before I agree with the thread title.
I still feel he offers something.
I would like to see Lookman, Ulvestad, Jackson, Botaka against MK in the cup.
Didn't Jacko start in central midfield with Crofts, and Ulvestad on the left, against Swindon? No need to repeat that experiment.
It was a diamond, so it was completely different. Jackson was at the tip, Ulvestad and Foley were in the wide-central roles and Crofts was at the base. Jackson was essentially out of position at number 10 and there was no pace whatsoever to get the ball up the pitch. Every single member of that midfield was positioned in a way that didn't play to their strengths and it was an insane decision from Slade
manilow is right in that the longer JJ's career goes on, the more chance this thread has of ringing true.
I don't agree however that it was wrong of the original poster to put it up when he did for debate. JJ has tirelessly shown his class time after time with all the goals and good performances he has had in between, but he's had some poor games as well.
Take last season. After his emphatic return to the team scoring against Fulham and Brum he did dick all imo.
Someone said above he's good for 65-70 m ins. He certainly wasn't on Saturday, I don't think he even looked in the game for 10 minutes.
I don't think any player will say their time is up, certainly at 34 but personally I feel many more poor games for him now rather than better ones if he starts.
But he really hasn't been a standout player for most of this time. That Norwich goal was a case in point. Get run ragged in midfield for 85 minutes, scuff one in off the defender's heel and suddenly all the criticism is invalid. While a goalscoring threat in the box, Jackson really doesn't bring much else to the team. He doesn't challenge, pass, move or cross. He's a great guy and a club legend but when is the last time any of you saw him dominate in midfield? Maybe that first half against Brentford under Luzon before he went off injured?
Doesn't cross? In the 2 mins of high lists on sky's website from Saturday they show the protests both goals and 2 other moves. One of them is Jacko putting a lovely ball into the box that Josh couldn't quite get on the end of.
He may not have had a good game on Saturday but he was certainly decent against Port Vale. Came in from the left well and was always the extra man in the box which allowed Magennis to get free for his goal.
His performances have been mixed this year but he still has plenty to offer. I still reckon he'll get 10 goals this season if he stays fit.
I don't want to see him picked on the left but alongside Freddie in the centre he wouldna bad option at all.
Yes, February 2014 ie 2 years and 9 months ago this thread was started. Go back and read the same old nonsense every time he had a less than brilliant game.
That is so long ago that Duchalet has seen a Charlton game live since then and we've had 28 managers.
Of course if you keep saying a 30+ player is passed it you are going to be right eventually but remember people were writing him off the last time we were in league one FFS.
IMHO Jackson shouldn't be starting or even playing wide. Powell said the same after the League 1 winning season.
In the middle with mobile, younger, faster players around him he has something to offer in experience, passing and goals as he's shown time and time again including this season.
His career at this level is coming to an end and it would make more sense to have him on the bench more often than not but he started v Scunthorpe and we won playing good football. And Jacko scored but for many memories are short, blinkers are large and prejudices ingrained.
I really hope Robinson gets the backing to buy two or three extra midfielders and JJ can be used more sparingly and so to more effect.
The real crime here isn't that JJ is getting old but that the club still haven't found his replacement.
And everything, say, Josh Magennis says or does indicates that he isn't proud? I think we've got plenty of good guys who get it right now.
I don't know about Magennis (such a statement would probably upset his parent club) but this is the Jacko thread.
I'm pretty sure Magennis is here as one of our own players? Either way, I agree with you - this is a Jacko thread.
I understand exactly what was meant by saying Jacko was one of the "real Charlton" players, and he has been "real Charlton" throughout a really difficult time. I wonder how much of an overall impact he's had in the dressing room as a form of continuity for the players whilst managers have been revolving in-and-out. Let's not forget that even Katrien understands this connection with the fan-base enough to rope Jacko in to some the attempts at winning us over.
I can't fault Jacko as a Charlton player - he's exactly the type of player we all love to see; one who seems to genuinely have an affinity to the club, who can lead from the front and provide some support for those around him. His performance vs Cardiff during our first season in The Championship, where we 0-2 down and he pulled us back level, epitomises him.
That said, he is getting on a bit - and although he may not be as completely knackered as some are saying, @Henry Irving has hit the nail on the head about the real failure being no replacement for him. You can't blame him for playing in a midfield that's completely devoid of options.. but I'm pretty sure I've read one person blaming him for precisely that in this thread?! I dare say Jacko himself understands that he's coming to the end of his career, the game is getting more difficult and injuries are taking a bigger toll... but he doesn't exactly pick himself for the squad does he?
Jackson has got 4 goals this season, more than any other non-forward in the squad and 2 behind our overall top scorer, Ademola Lookman. I would imagine his goals scored per goalscoring opportunity ratio is probably significantly higher than anyone else in the squad, and the ability to convert chances into goals is a talent that shouldn't be taken for granted.
If we bought two good central midfield players to do the running, so that Jacko wasn't required to do that anymore and could concentrate on making passes and being in the box at the right time, I think that Jacko could once again look like a decent player, he'd score more and create more because he wouldn't be occupied with attempting to carry out jobs that he's no longer capable of.
If we bought two good central midfield players to play alongside Crofts, Crofts would still look bang average.
That's not to say that Jacko is irreplaceable, or that we should be trying to build a side around him.
This feels a bit like the Rooney debate to me. Rooney is always the focus for criticism after a poor England performance, but just because he's not quite the player he used to be, doesn't mean he's the weakest player in the side. It's the same with Jackson - if I had an unlimited budget to replace 3 players from Saturday's Charlton side, there would be others I'd get rid off before Jacko, so I don't really get why he always seems to get the brunt of the criticism.
Jackson has got 4 goals this season, more than any other non-forward in the squad and 2 behind our overall top scorer, Ademola Lookman. I would imagine his goals scored per goalscoring opportunity ratio is probably significantly higher than anyone else in the squad, and the ability to convert chances into goals is a talent that shouldn't be taken for granted.
If we bought two good central midfield players to do the running, so that Jacko wasn't required to do that anymore and could concentrate on making passes and being in the box at the right time, I think that Jacko could once again look like a decent player, he'd score more and create more because he wouldn't be occupied with attempting to carry out jobs that he's no longer capable of.
If we bought two good central midfield players to play alongside Crofts, Crofts would still look bang average.
That's not to say that Jacko is irreplaceable, or that we should be trying to build a side around him.
This feels a bit like the Rooney debate to me. Rooney is always the focus for criticism after a poor England performance, but just because he's not quite the player he used to be, doesn't mean he's the weakest player in the side. It's the same with Jackson - if I had an unlimited budget to replace 3 players from Saturday's Charlton side, there would be others I'd get rid off before Jacko, so I don't really get why he always seems to get the brunt of the criticism.
Because the people who have been writing him off for years, literally years, are desperate to justify their previously false claims that his legs were gone, blah blah blah.
Don't give them facts like he's scored 4 goals as those goals don't count, only poor performances are seen or commented on.
Yes, February 2014 ie 2 years and 9 months ago this thread was started. Go back and read the same old nonsense every time he had a less than brilliant game.
That is so long ago that Duchalet has seen a Charlton game live since then and we've had 28 managers.
Of course if you keep saying a 30+ player is passed it you are going to be right eventually but remember people were writing him off the last time we were in league one FFS.
IMHO Jackson shouldn't be starting or even playing wide. Powell said the same after the League 1 winning season.
In the middle with mobile, younger, faster players around him he has something to offer in experience, passing and goals as he's shown time and time again including this season.
His career at this level is coming to an end and it would make more sense to have him on the bench more often than not but he started v Scunthorpe and we won playing good football. And Jacko scored but for many memories are short, blinkers are large and prejudices ingrained.
I really hope Robinson gets the backing to buy two or three extra midfielders and JJ can be used more sparingly and so to more effect.
The real crime here isn't that JJ is getting old but that the club still haven't found his replacement.
This is it in a nutshell. Jacko himself will freely admit he isnt up the the required standard to start games regularly, but what other options do we have? Well Chicksen and Botaka for starters..... but we still need to get some younger CMs in January, which will allow for some cameos off the bench later in the game when the opposition have tired.
He was poor today and offered nothing. Was correct to take him off
A bit like near enough all of our players today then.
Why don't we have threads like this for Andrew Crofts and Kevin Foley week in and week out?
No one is a bigger fan of Jacko than me, but on Saturday I saw this thread, and stand by what I thought Saturday night he had a poor game and had to come off.
Doesn't mean he should never play again, he simply was poor on Saturday.
Crofts and Foley on Saturday were better, not by much, but we're better
Comments
still love the bloke though
I still feel he offers something.
I would like to see Lookman, Ulvestad, Jackson, Botaka against MK in the cup.
One of the few things left of the real CAFC since those Belgians started tinkering.
"I am really proud to play for, and be Captain of this great football club"
I don't agree however that it was wrong of the original poster to put it up when he did for debate. JJ has tirelessly shown his class time after time with all the goals and good performances he has had in between, but he's had some poor games as well.
Take last season. After his emphatic return to the team scoring against Fulham and Brum he did dick all imo.
Someone said above he's good for 65-70 m ins. He certainly wasn't on Saturday, I don't think he even looked in the game for 10 minutes.
I don't think any player will say their time is up, certainly at 34 but personally I feel many more poor games for him now rather than better ones if he starts.
His performances have been mixed this year but he still has plenty to offer. I still reckon he'll get 10 goals this season if he stays fit.
I don't want to see him picked on the left but alongside Freddie in the centre he wouldna bad option at all.
Very different with Botaka and Lookman coming in and having two out and out wingers.
Not repeating anything - it's completely new.
Yes, February 2014 ie 2 years and 9 months ago this thread was started. Go back and read the same old nonsense every time he had a less than brilliant game.
That is so long ago that Duchalet has seen a Charlton game live since then and we've had 28 managers.
Of course if you keep saying a 30+ player is passed it you are going to be right eventually but remember people were writing him off the last time we were in league one FFS.
IMHO Jackson shouldn't be starting or even playing wide. Powell said the same after the League 1 winning season.
In the middle with mobile, younger, faster players around him he has something to offer in experience, passing and goals as he's shown time and time again including this season.
His career at this level is coming to an end and it would make more sense to have him on the bench more often than not but he started v Scunthorpe and we won playing good football. And Jacko scored but for many memories are short, blinkers are large and prejudices ingrained.
I really hope Robinson gets the backing to buy two or three extra midfielders and JJ can be used more sparingly and so to more effect.
The real crime here isn't that JJ is getting old but that the club still haven't found his replacement.
I understand exactly what was meant by saying Jacko was one of the "real Charlton" players, and he has been "real Charlton" throughout a really difficult time. I wonder how much of an overall impact he's had in the dressing room as a form of continuity for the players whilst managers have been revolving in-and-out. Let's not forget that even Katrien understands this connection with the fan-base enough to rope Jacko in to some the attempts at winning us over.
I can't fault Jacko as a Charlton player - he's exactly the type of player we all love to see; one who seems to genuinely have an affinity to the club, who can lead from the front and provide some support for those around him. His performance vs Cardiff during our first season in The Championship, where we 0-2 down and he pulled us back level, epitomises him.
That said, he is getting on a bit - and although he may not be as completely knackered as some are saying, @Henry Irving has hit the nail on the head about the real failure being no replacement for him. You can't blame him for playing in a midfield that's completely devoid of options.. but I'm pretty sure I've read one person blaming him for precisely that in this thread?! I dare say Jacko himself understands that he's coming to the end of his career, the game is getting more difficult and injuries are taking a bigger toll... but he doesn't exactly pick himself for the squad does he?
If we bought two good central midfield players to do the running, so that Jacko wasn't required to do that anymore and could concentrate on making passes and being in the box at the right time, I think that Jacko could once again look like a decent player, he'd score more and create more because he wouldn't be occupied with attempting to carry out jobs that he's no longer capable of.
If we bought two good central midfield players to play alongside Crofts, Crofts would still look bang average.
That's not to say that Jacko is irreplaceable, or that we should be trying to build a side around him.
This feels a bit like the Rooney debate to me. Rooney is always the focus for criticism after a poor England performance, but just because he's not quite the player he used to be, doesn't mean he's the weakest player in the side. It's the same with Jackson - if I had an unlimited budget to replace 3 players from Saturday's Charlton side, there would be others I'd get rid off before Jacko, so I don't really get why he always seems to get the brunt of the criticism.
Don't give them facts like he's scored 4 goals as those goals don't count, only poor performances are seen or commented on.
Doesn't mean he should never play again, he simply was poor on Saturday.
Crofts and Foley on Saturday were better, not by much, but we're better