There is nothing wrong with voicing opinions on players (one mans meat is another mans poison) but booing him and cheering when he is taken off is unacceptable.
Good luck Morgan. He had his limitations but he always gave more than 100%, which is a hell of a lot more than we can say about a lot of players who have pulled on our shirt in the last few years.
He's gone on to a club with greater quality and higher ambitions than us (until we get rid of the Belgians), which I think, more than anything else, is testament to his professionalism, hard work and determination to make the best of himself. Again, if all the players we've had passing through in the last few years showed the same guts as Morgan we probably wouldn't be in League One now.
Where have I challenged the right of anyone to express their opinion. Far from it I actively encourage it but it does not mean such opinion is above comment. I simply position another argument.
I admit I object to the view any professional player is shit and the endless extrapolation they will never have a career. Play at any level of the pyramid and you will know the difference between the professional, semi professional and amateur. The comparison in the speed of movement and thought, of natural technique, of the physicality, in the competiveness, in the drive and determination is all too easy to see.
Most young professionals put in a lot of graft, work hard on their game to pursue becoming the best they can be. Pursuing their own version of the "The Hunger Games" the odds are "are never in their favour" and any weakness will be found out. Yet a few will get there by sheer will power and continue to learn and grow through their career. I respect that.
Derek Hales dumped out of a couple of clubs gained traction with Luton, found a place with us and developed into a very effective player before he went to Derby and West Ham where he effectively failed. However the player who came back was 3 times the footballer who had left a few years earlier. He had grafted and developed his game and became a legend.
I remember playing with one guy once on Chelsea's books, badly injured his pro chance had gone. He spent a few seasons as a professional/ semi pro in Australia. He actually played with a slight limp and struggled for pace, but had great technical ability. He was near impossible to mark, one of my few talents as a defender. Glance away and he would be gone in a split second time after time after time. It was instinctive he was a natural. He was an argumentative and stroppy bastard but you could but respect a talent like that.
Another lad had played for Spennymoor, had been on Sunderlands' books. He was a great striker of the ball and told of extra training sessions with a young pro by the name of Sharkey. They spent an extra hour after every training session on shooting practice volleying shots from the edge of the box. Sharkey could on demand in quick time hit either stanchion with an unerring accuracy each and every time. It was instinctive. He described it as almost mesmeric.
So I have a basic respect for players who play and have played at a level I could only dream of.
Many will inevitably fall by the wayside. The profession is unforgiving but if a guy puts it on the line week in week out, and even though he struggles to perform is still the guy put in the team then it says he has something about him. He has my respect. Can anyone over the past 3 years suggest any player who has performed consistently well for the club over even half a season? Maybe Magennis, Berg Gudmundsson, Cousins, Ben Haim, Bulot out of 70 plus senior professionals?
At that point forgive me for looking for answers as to why Fox is struggling rather than a simplistic he must be shit or he is stealing a living. I suggest the young man, judged by his peers at least, is anything but.....however to each their own.
Where have I challenged the right of anyone to express their opinion. Far from it I actively encourage it but it does not mean such opinion is above comment. I simply position another argument.
I admit I object to the view any professional player is shit and the endless extrapolation they will never have a career. Play at any level of the pyramid and you will know the difference between the professional, semi professional and amateur. The comparison in the speed of movement and thought, of natural technique, of the physicality, in the competiveness, in the drive and determination is all too easy to see.
Most young professionals put in a lot of graft, work hard on their game to pursue becoming the best they can be. Pursuing their own version of the "The Hunger Games" the odds are "are never in their favour" and any weakness will be found out. Yet a few will get there by sheer will power and continue to learn and grow through their career. I respect that.
Derek Hales dumped out of a couple of clubs gained traction with Luton, found a place with us and developed into a very effective player before he went to Derby and West Ham where he effectively failed. However the player who came back was 3 times the footballer who had left a few years earlier. He had grafted and developed his game and became a legend.
I remember playing with one guy once on Chelsea's books, badly injured his pro chance had gone. He spent a few seasons as a professional/ semi pro in Australia. He actually played with a slight limp and struggled for pace, but had great technical ability. He was near impossible to mark, one of my few talents as a defender. Glance away and he would be gone in a split second time after time after time. It was instinctive he was a natural. He was an argumentative and stroppy bastard but you could but respect a talent like that.
Another lad had played for Spennymoor, had been on Sunderlands' books. He was a great striker of the ball and told of extra training sessions with a young pro by the name of Sharkey. They spent an extra hour after every training session on shooting practice volleying shots from the edge of the box. Sharkey could on demand in quick time hit either stanchion with an unerring accuracy each and every time. It was instinctive. He described it as almost mesmeric.
So I have a basic respect for players who play and have played at a level I could only dream of.
Many will inevitably fall by the wayside. The profession is unforgiving but if a I guy puts it on the line week in week out, and even though he struggles to perform is still the guy put in the team then it says he has something about him. He has my respect. Can anyone over the past 3 years suggest any player who has performed consistently well for the club over even half a season? Maybe Magennis, Berg Gudmundsson, Cousins, Ben Haim, Bulot out of 70 plus senior professionals?
At that point forgive me for looking for answers as to why Fox is struggling rather than a simplistic he must be shit or he is stealing a living. I suggest the young man, judged by his peers at least, is anything but.....however to each their own.
Some players are better than others - some managers rate certain players and others rate other players. PG at Man City didn't rate Hart too highly! I disagree with him and think he is better than what was brought in - I think I have a point there even if he is a legendary manager without any argument. I think you were implying that people shouldn't say a player is not good enough in their opinion if professionals/more qualified people clearly think he is. Apologies if I misunderstood. But I think people are perfectly entitled to voice that view and they may be right because professionals are sometimes wrong and they certainly don't all agree so which ones are right and which ones are wrong? The fact that a fan making a comment is not a professional manager doesn't make them right or wrong. Football is a game of opinions and is the better for it.
What is not right is players are disrespected/insulted. Fox deserves better than that. But you may think he is a championship player, I may think he is league one. It is right to look for answers and it may be as simple as the way we play doesn't suit him. It may be he is lacking in certain areas that will always hold him back. We may get some more clues soon enough. I do wish him well.
I think he's worth no more than a few hundred grand. Would be stupid to sell him for less than 500k as we need the bodies etc but anything with 7 figures in would be wonderful business for Charlton, terrible for the buyer.
That being said, if we can flog him for £300k and re-sign Foley for free on another 6 month deal and stick him in at left back, that will look good on the profit/loss sheet this year and combined with the Lookman deal, should mean that KM is in for a well-deserved hefty divi payout at the end of this year. And nobody can begrudge her that.
See in fairness I can't see the hype over Foley,he just gets the ball and goes backwards where as someone like Fox who would attempt to go forward would lose the ball at times but get slated for it. I think the fact Robinson has let Foley go proves that!
Nothing wrong with your logic altogether, merely making an observation on Foley!
Dear me. I wasn't genuinely suggesting that! I thought foley was mediocre at best anyway and to sign him to play at left back would be loopy. I was mocking the club's greedy mismanagement of the squad.
As @Alwaysneil stated, I thought Fox suffered particularly from the team set up and the lack of cover he received from the left midfield and their defensive covering duties. That said, change itself is the lifeblood of football and its time for Fox to go. Lets face it, this team needs shaking up. I just hope the next combination can find a winning formula.
I hope Fox finds his feet at SW, at the very least he deserves a break from the moronic abuse he received at the Valley.
When you think you know a lot about football, a transfer happens that makes you step back and think that you don't know as much as you thought you did.
Where have I challenged the right of anyone to express their opinion. Far from it I actively encourage it but it does not mean such opinion is above comment. I simply position another argument.
I admit I object to the view any professional player is shit and the endless extrapolation they will never have a career. Play at any level of the pyramid and you will know the difference between the professional, semi professional and amateur. The comparison in the speed of movement and thought, of natural technique, of the physicality, in the competiveness, in the drive and determination is all too easy to see.
Most young professionals put in a lot of graft, work hard on their game to pursue becoming the best they can be. Pursuing their own version of the "The Hunger Games" the odds are "are never in their favour" and any weakness will be found out. Yet a few will get there by sheer will power and continue to learn and grow through their career. I respect that.
Derek Hales dumped out of a couple of clubs gained traction with Luton, found a place with us and developed into a very effective player before he went to Derby and West Ham where he effectively failed. However the player who came back was 3 times the footballer who had left a few years earlier. He had grafted and developed his game and became a legend.
I remember playing with one guy once on Chelsea's books, badly injured his pro chance had gone. He spent a few seasons as a professional/ semi pro in Australia. He actually played with a slight limp and struggled for pace, but had great technical ability. He was near impossible to mark, one of my few talents as a defender. Glance away and he would be gone in a split second time after time after time. It was instinctive he was a natural. He was an argumentative and stroppy bastard but you could but respect a talent like that.
Another lad had played for Spennymoor, had been on Sunderlands' books. He was a great striker of the ball and told of extra training sessions with a young pro by the name of Sharkey. They spent an extra hour after every training session on shooting practice volleying shots from the edge of the box. Sharkey could on demand in quick time hit either stanchion with an unerring accuracy each and every time. It was instinctive. He described it as almost mesmeric.
So I have a basic respect for players who play and have played at a level I could only dream of.
Many will inevitably fall by the wayside. The profession is unforgiving but if a I guy puts it on the line week in week out, and even though he struggles to perform is still the guy put in the team then it says he has something about him. He has my respect. Can anyone over the past 3 years suggest any player who has performed consistently well for the club over even half a season? Maybe Magennis, Berg Gudmundsson, Cousins, Ben Haim, Bulot out of 70 plus senior professionals?
At that point forgive me for looking for answers as to why Fox is struggling rather than a simplistic he must be shit or he is stealing a living. I suggest the young man, judged by his peers at least, is anything but.....however to each their own.
Very clearly the 8 previous professional coaches, the coaches at Wales, Birmingham, Sheffield Wednesday and reportedly Derby know far less than the Charlton supporter footballing intelligentsia.
The latter 3 have attempted to sign him while none of the former over the previous 3 years sought to replace him.
Just sometimes it is worth remembering professionals just sometimes do know what they are doing.
Just how many bosses, assistant managers, assistant managers assistants have you had over the past 3yrs. Just how many different faces have you had to work with in a close team unit in a competitive environment.
Botaka, Holmes, Lookman, Chicksen, Jackson, Ulvestad, Berg Gudmundsson, Bergdich, Cousins, Harriott, Cebellos, Bulot, Cook, Eagles, McAleny have all been tried to a greater or lesser degree.
All that before we even consider the Centre Back combinations who set the platform for where any full back plays.
His main failure was that he a) was not Wiggins b) he was front and centre through a club house in turmoil.
He may not be your preferred style of full back - I always preferred a Phil Warman over a Harry Cripps, who had the turning circle of an aircraft carrier but I respected them both.
As we have seen countless times before one mans "rubbish" is another mans "jewel".
However he "polishes up" and his future turns out I thank the young man for his considerable efforts on our behalf and wish him the very best for his future. Played in squad that offers him stability, constancy and balance I am comfortable he will contribute.
The first post of yours that I don't agree with. I don't rate Fox for the following reasons. He is too slow to play full back in the modern game. I watch a lot of football from U16, U18 and U23 level. The model for full backs now is smaller and faster, that is why many wingers are being turned into full backs. Fox's positional sense is not great. Too many times he gets drawn into the middle. Yes his attitude is great and he always gives 100 per cent but that should be a given. I think Sheffield Wed have bought him as a cheap squad player. They already have two left backs with one out injured. In my fifty six years of watching Charlton I have never booed one of our players and I never will do. Charlton fans want a scapegoat and Fox fitted the bill as did Makienock last season.
Very clearly the 8 previous professional coaches, the coaches at Wales, Birmingham, Sheffield Wednesday and reportedly Derby know far less than the Charlton supporter footballing intelligentsia.
The latter 3 have attempted to sign him while none of the former over the previous 3 years sought to replace him.
Just sometimes it is worth remembering professionals just sometimes do know what they are doing.
Just how many bosses, assistant managers, assistant managers assistants have you had over the past 3yrs. Just how many different faces have you had to work with in a close team unit in a competitive environment.
Botaka, Holmes, Lookman, Chicksen, Jackson, Ulvestad, Berg Gudmundsson, Bergdich, Cousins, Harriott, Cebellos, Bulot, Cook, Eagles, McAleny have all been tried to a greater or lesser degree.
All that before we even consider the Centre Back combinations who set the platform for where any full back plays.
His main failure was that he a) was not Wiggins b) he was front and centre through a club house in turmoil.
He may not be your preferred style of full back - I always preferred a Phil Warman over a Harry Cripps, who had the turning circle of an aircraft carrier but I respected them both.
As we have seen countless times before one mans "rubbish" is another mans "jewel".
However he "polishes up" and his future turns out I thank the young man for his considerable efforts on our behalf and wish him the very best for his future. Played in squad that offers him stability, constancy and balance I am comfortable he will contribute.
The first post of yours that I don't agree with. I don't rate Fox for the following reasons. He is too slow to play full back in the modern game. I watch a lot of football from U16, U18 and U23 level. The model for full backs now is smaller and faster, that is why many wingers are being turned into full backs. Fox's positional sense is not great. Too many times he gets drawn into the middle. Yes his attitude is great and he always gives 100 per cent but that should be a given. I think Sheffield Wed have bought him as a cheap squad player. They already have two left backs with one out injured. In my fifty six years of watching Charlton I have never booed one of our players and I never will do. Charlton fans want a scapegoat and Fox fitted the bill as did Makienock last season.
Yes, sitting in the East Stand, I've never seen a FB (on either side) who gets so magnetically drawn into the penalty area, and that's been under many different managers. You'd have thought he was a converted CB.
I'm one of those that thought he was/is a real prospect. I will follow his career with interest and the hope that it is a good one. Never understood why the fans have given him such a hard time.
Good luck Morgan. He had his limitations but he always gave more than 100%, which is a hell of a lot more than we can say about a lot of players who have pulled on our shirt in the last few years.
He's gone on to a club with greater quality and higher ambitions than us (until we get rid of the Belgians), which I think, more than anything else, is testament to his professionalism, hard work and determination to make the best of himself. Again, if all the players we've had passing through in the last few years showed the same guts as Morgan we probably wouldn't be in League One now.
Good luck Morgan. He had his limitations but he always gave more than 100%, which is a hell of a lot more than we can say about a lot of players who have pulled on our shirt in the last few years.
He's gone on to a club with greater quality and higher ambitions than us (until we get rid of the Belgians), which I think, more than anything else, is testament to his professionalism, hard work and determination to make the best of himself. Again, if all the players we've had passing through in the last few years showed the same guts as Morgan we probably wouldn't be in League One now.
Good luck Morgan. He had his limitations but he always gave more than 100%, which is a hell of a lot more than we can say about a lot of players who have pulled on our shirt in the last few years.
He's gone on to a club with greater quality and higher ambitions than us (until we get rid of the Belgians), which I think, more than anything else, is testament to his professionalism, hard work and determination to make the best of himself. Again, if all the players we've had passing through in the last few years showed the same guts as Morgan we probably wouldn't be in League One now.
I'm sure it's been very tough for you to listen to some of the stuff @madadd but you have done well to hold your tongue! I wish Morgan lots of luck in his career. I shall also be keeping an eye out for him.
Can you answer me one thing tho... you know when you won that place at the sponsor's dinner on here... did he tell you that you couldn't go?
Good honest lad.....some of the shyte that's been dished out has been appalling and unnecessarily harsh. Good luck young fella.....a new start for you, let's hope you make the most of it.
Full backs should stay central and not mark the winger until the ball goes out to them. This is not being out of position. We were spoilt by Wiggins who had the pace to stay central and either intercept or block a cross when ball went wide. Solly used to do same but no longer has speed to do so.
Comments
He's gone on to a club with greater quality and higher ambitions than us (until we get rid of the Belgians), which I think, more than anything else, is testament to his professionalism, hard work and determination to make the best of himself. Again, if all the players we've had passing through in the last few years showed the same guts as Morgan we probably wouldn't be in League One now.
Please pass on our best wishes @madadd
I admit I object to the view any professional player is shit and the endless extrapolation they will never have a career. Play at any level of the pyramid and you will know the difference between the professional, semi professional and amateur. The comparison in the speed of movement and thought, of natural technique, of the physicality, in the competiveness, in the drive and determination is all too easy to see.
Most young professionals put in a lot of graft, work hard on their game to pursue becoming the best they can be. Pursuing their own version of the "The Hunger Games" the odds are "are never in their favour" and any weakness will be found out. Yet a few will get there by sheer will power and continue to learn and grow through their career. I respect that.
Derek Hales dumped out of a couple of clubs gained traction with Luton, found a place with us and developed into a very effective player before he went to Derby and West Ham where he effectively failed. However the player who came back was 3 times the footballer who had left a few years earlier. He had grafted and developed his game and became a legend.
I remember playing with one guy once on Chelsea's books, badly injured his pro chance had gone. He spent a few seasons as a professional/ semi pro in Australia. He actually played with a slight limp and struggled for pace, but had great technical ability. He was near impossible to mark, one of my few talents as a defender. Glance away and he would be gone in a split second time after time after time. It was instinctive he was a natural. He was an argumentative and stroppy bastard but you could but respect a talent like that.
Another lad had played for Spennymoor, had been on Sunderlands' books. He was a great striker of the ball and told of extra training sessions with a young pro by the name of Sharkey. They spent an extra hour after every training session on shooting practice volleying shots from the edge of the box. Sharkey could on demand in quick time hit either stanchion with an unerring accuracy each and every time. It was instinctive. He described it as almost mesmeric.
So I have a basic respect for players who play and have played at a level I could only dream of.
Many will inevitably fall by the wayside. The profession is unforgiving but if a guy puts it on the line week in week out, and even though he struggles to perform is still the guy put in the team then it says he has something about him. He has my respect. Can anyone over the past 3 years suggest any player who has performed consistently well for the club over even half a season? Maybe Magennis, Berg Gudmundsson, Cousins, Ben Haim, Bulot out of 70 plus senior professionals?
At that point forgive me for looking for answers as to why Fox is struggling rather than a simplistic he must be shit or he is stealing a living. I suggest the young man, judged by his peers at least, is anything but.....however to each their own.
Edited for Leuth
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Sharkey
EDIT: Oh cheers! You are the omnipotent one
What is not right is players are disrespected/insulted. Fox deserves better than that. But you may think he is a championship player, I may think he is league one. It is right to look for answers and it may be as simple as the way we play doesn't suit him. It may be he is lacking in certain areas that will always hold him back. We may get some more clues soon enough. I do wish him well.
Good luck son.
I hope Fox finds his feet at SW, at the very least he deserves a break from the moronic abuse he received at the Valley.
Never understood why the fans have given him such a hard time.
GoodLuck CAFC on returning to a level the club deserves.
Can you also pass on my thanks for his efforts?
Can you answer me one thing tho... you know when you won that place at the sponsor's dinner on here... did he tell you that you couldn't go?
Good luck young fella.....a new start for you, let's hope you make the most of it.