I’m confident that we will hit bottom three hopefully before a return to form and safety. We really are skating on thin ice. No guarantee returning players will hit the ground running or not relapse. No certainty that new players won’t take time to settle and perform. This season is very squeaky bum time. Relegation would be an absolute disaster.
Martin Samuelsen from West Ham is someone we're interested in signing, according to my mate who supports West Ham, but he has come out with some Bullshit before! regarding transfers, so wouldn't be so sure.
So if Maddison is not one of the "Deals Pending" tweeted by Southall, then who is?
Have to be honest, the idea of a CM who was a target for us not to agree on an extra 1K a week in the position as is in, is bizarre.
I'm not a doom and gloomer but, we seriously need to pull our finger out and get some bodies in. Refusing to stump up an extra 52K pa or negotiating that, is not going to keep us up.
We can not keep saying after the next game we will get bodies in, we need liven up now.
So if we assembled say a 25 man squad all doing the same that extra 1k a week becomes 25k extra a week and £1.3m a year.
Frustrating I know as we need bodies in urgently but we do also have bodies coming back like Williams and JFC.
Agreed though we do need fresh bodies now but I get not overpaying for them too.
I get that but you can't work on that model. We are not trying to sign 25 players. We need ideally 3/4 players in. So say if all four wanted an extra 1k a week. That's 208k a year for 4 players?
Is it really that unsustainable?
Yes, because you don't know what those players are asking in wages. Give Maddison say £18k a week like we have Taylor, a 3 year deal say, that's £2.8m a year each, plus Jonny Williams then says, my deal is up at the end of the season, I saw you offered Taylor £18k, I'm on about £5k, I want what you're paying them. Granted he's got a bit of an injury record, but you get the picture, floodgates are opened for all other new prospects.
Martin Samuelsen from West Ham is someone we're interested in signing, according to my mate who supports West Ham, but he has come out with some Bullshit before! regarding transfers, so wouldn't be so sure.
With Maddison it has to be more than just the money. We need players who want to be here ultimately and he clearly doesn't. Good player but there are other good players. If he changes his mind and it isn't too late, maybe something can be done!
This is bollocks... They need to start pulling their finger out or we are nailed on for relegation
I'm as frustrated as the next person but we have no idea what Maddison was asking for, and how that would effect our overall wage structure etc.
I think before putting in a bid you'd pretty much know what wage he was currently on & what he'd be looking for. All sounds a bit amateurish to me.
How's that, Golfie?
You may have an idea of what he's currently on but until you sit down and start negotiating you would not have the slightest idea what he wants.
The player's agent is only interested in two people - his client and himself (I'm not sure of the order!). Take Maddison as an example - we have made the bid and that bid was accepted - whether or not we met the release clause has little relevance - clearly Posh are happy with the bid so it must be reasonably substantial. Now Maddison's agent knows we want him - a position of strength for him. In response to a question from us along the lines of 'How much does your client want?' the response is likely to be 'How much are you prepared to pay?'. And so it plays out. 'How much?' screams the agent - 'That's not even in the ball park' - the negotiation continues and may or may not reach a conclusion if either the gap is too wide or the player doesn't really want to come to us - unless our offer was surprising and significantly more than he was expecting.
The fact that Matt Southall is an ex-agent has no relevance whatsoever - he isn't one of Maddison's agent's concerns.
Agree with all of this until the last paragraph. If you are a poacher turned gamekeeper you should've a better understanding of the rules of engagement.
Martin Samuelsen from West Ham is someone we're interested in signing, according to my mate who supports West Ham, but he has come out with some Bullshit before! regarding transfers, so wouldn't be so sure.
He impressed in the friendly at the Valley in 2015 as a teenager but not much progress since.
This is bollocks... They need to start pulling their finger out or we are nailed on for relegation
I'm as frustrated as the next person but we have no idea what Maddison was asking for, and how that would effect our overall wage structure etc.
I think before putting in a bid you'd pretty much know what wage he was currently on & what he'd be looking for. All sounds a bit amateurish to me.
How's that, Golfie?
You may have an idea of what he's currently on but until you sit down and start negotiating you would not have the slightest idea what he wants.
The player's agent is only interested in two people - his client and himself (I'm not sure of the order!). Take Maddison as an example - we have made the bid and that bid was accepted - whether or not we met the release clause has little relevance - clearly Posh are happy with the bid so it must be reasonably substantial. Now Maddison's agent knows we want him - a position of strength for him. In response to a question from us along the lines of 'How much does your client want?' the response is likely to be 'How much are you prepared to pay?'. And so it plays out. 'How much?' screams the agent - 'That's not even in the ball park' - the negotiation continues and may or may not reach a conclusion if either the gap is too wide or the player doesn't really want to come to us - unless our offer was surprising and significantly more than he was expecting.
The fact that Matt Southall is an ex-agent has no relevance whatsoever - he isn't one of Maddison's agent's concerns.
Agree with all of this until the last paragraph. If you are a poacher turned greenkeeper you should've a better understanding of the rules of engagement.
I’d prefer mowett from Barnsley over Maddison be good to get both but I think £2.5 for Maddison and demanding higher wages is a bit much with 6 months on contract don’t blame us for looking else where.
Sounds to me that Maddison just doesn't want to move to us.
Spoke to a Posh mate, he seems to think Maddison is using as leverage. He is very confident he wants to go to Hull, but will only happen if Jarrod Bowen moves.
A player who is very keen on going to Hull is almost *exactly* the type of player it would be good not to have sign for Charlton.
He has a young family in the north east and wants to be closer to them (of course money talks) He also has a good relationship with their manager, McCann having previously been at Posh.
Also bare in mind Hull have spent more time recently in the Premier League and can almost definitely pay better wages.
If ESI are serious about having a plan to get Charlton into the Premier League then we are going to have to be competing with clubs bigger and richer than Hull for the players we will need. Of course I can see that slow progression is key and busting a wage structure might not be ideal but remember that this is a wage structure put in place by Duchatelet which was the lowest in the league. We signed players on that structure and if we want to sign better players then the wage bill will have to reflect that.
At this point any plan to progress the club to the Premier League is by far and away overshadowed by the need to stay in the current league and unless things change quite quickly that is looking unlikely to me.
I imagine they have their own plans for a wage structure.
This is bollocks... They need to start pulling their finger out or we are nailed on for relegation
I'm as frustrated as the next person but we have no idea what Maddison was asking for, and how that would effect our overall wage structure etc.
I think before putting in a bid you'd pretty much know what wage he was currently on & what he'd be looking for. All sounds a bit amateurish to me.
How's that, Golfie?
You may have an idea of what he's currently on but until you sit down and start negotiating you would not have the slightest idea what he wants.
The player's agent is only interested in two people - his client and himself (I'm not sure of the order!). Take Maddison as an example - we have made the bid and that bid was accepted - whether or not we met the release clause has little relevance - clearly Posh are happy with the bid so it must be reasonably substantial. Now Maddison's agent knows we want him - a position of strength for him. In response to a question from us along the lines of 'How much does your client want?' the response is likely to be 'How much are you prepared to pay?'. And so it plays out. 'How much?' screams the agent - 'That's not even in the ball park' - the negotiation continues and may or may not reach a conclusion if either the gap is too wide or the player doesn't really want to come to us - unless our offer was surprising and significantly more than he was expecting.
The fact that Matt Southall is an ex-agent has no relevance whatsoever - he isn't one of Maddison's agent's concerns.
Agree with all of this until the last paragraph. If you are a poacher turned greenkeeper you should've a better understanding of the rules of engagement.
Interesting career path.
Cheers U-boat, now corrected but what I meant was Matt Southall should've more wedge and not be handicapped by just having Green. I wood love it if we can iron out the issues and move on from the rough days of Duchatelet, Unfortunately we still have a fairway to go and on CL we should bring back the flags.
I will get my green jacket as I don't think I made the cut.
I’d prefer mowett from Barnsley over Maddison be good to get both but I think £2.5 for Maddison and demanding higher wages is a bit much with 6 months on contract don’t blame us for looking else where.
I really liked Mowatt at Leeds but he's not that player anymore. Shouldn't have left Leeds when he did.
This is bollocks... They need to start pulling their finger out or we are nailed on for relegation
I'm as frustrated as the next person but we have no idea what Maddison was asking for, and how that would effect our overall wage structure etc.
I think before putting in a bid you'd pretty much know what wage he was currently on & what he'd be looking for. All sounds a bit amateurish to me.
How's that, Golfie?
You may have an idea of what he's currently on but until you sit down and start negotiating you would not have the slightest idea what he wants.
The player's agent is only interested in two people - his client and himself (I'm not sure of the order!). Take Maddison as an example - we have made the bid and that bid was accepted - whether or not we met the release clause has little relevance - clearly Posh are happy with the bid so it must be reasonably substantial. Now Maddison's agent knows we want him - a position of strength for him. In response to a question from us along the lines of 'How much does your client want?' the response is likely to be 'How much are you prepared to pay?'. And so it plays out. 'How much?' screams the agent - 'That's not even in the ball park' - the negotiation continues and may or may not reach a conclusion if either the gap is too wide or the player doesn't really want to come to us - unless our offer was surprising and significantly more than he was expecting.
The fact that Matt Southall is an ex-agent has no relevance whatsoever - he isn't one of Maddison's agent's concerns.
Agree with all of this until the last paragraph. If you are a poacher turned gamekeeper you should've a better understanding of the rules of engagement.
Agree with that - my point was more about Maddison's agent in some way changing his approach or being more conciliatory because Southall used to be one of their own.
If I was Maddison I wouldn’t move until the summer, leave on a free and get paid a bigger salary/signing on fee.
It would be a bad deal for Peterborough because not only would I be depriving them of a transfer fee but I would also spend the rest of the season avoiding any situation that could lead to me being injured (including any sort of tackling) and ruining my pay day, but that’s the sort of guy I am.
Yep, so we ask Posh to reduce their transfer fee, in order to pay Maddison more. If they don't they will get nothing.
As it stands I've heard nothing to say any other club have met the break clause, so it's still only us allowed to talk to him.
I doubt we’ve met the break clause either (which I understand to be £2.5M), we’ve just bid an amount that Peterborough are happy with rather than getting nothing in a few months.
If I’m Maddison then I’m thinking that every pound spent whatsoever by a team on a fee for me in January is a pound less in my pocket if I wait until the summer.
As I said, and unless his salary is going to double/triple, then I didn’t really know why Maddison would want to move now and miss the chance to be a free agent at a time when my stock is high, which is pretty much the ideal scenario from the perspective of a professional footballers earning potential.
Reece we have given him permission to speak to 2 championship clubs. It's up to them and player to agree terms or not. Thanks pal.
Wouldnt be surprised with this news we go back in with another contract offer and find out what the other club is offering. Also gives Maddison a better idea of what other clubs think he's worth.
With Maddison it has to be more than just the money. We need players who want to be here ultimately and he clearly doesn't. Good player but there are other good players. If he changes his mind and it isn't too late, maybe something can be done!
How can you possibly say Maddison clearly doesn't want to sign for CAFC ? You haven't got the first clue what is happening in these negotiations. You may be right, but it's possible he does want to sign but is trying to get himself the best possible deal. Sorry, but you're making big assumptions on most things Charlton.
So if Maddison is not one of the "Deals Pending" tweeted by Southall, then who is?
Have to be honest, the idea of a CM who was a target for us not to agree on an extra 1K a week in the position as is in, is bizarre.
I'm not a doom and gloomer but, we seriously need to pull our finger out and get some bodies in. Refusing to stump up an extra 52K pa or negotiating that, is not going to keep us up.
We can not keep saying after the next game we will get bodies in, we need liven up now.
So if we assembled say a 25 man squad all doing the same that extra 1k a week becomes 25k extra a week and £1.3m a year.
Frustrating I know as we need bodies in urgently but we do also have bodies coming back like Williams and JFC.
Agreed though we do need fresh bodies now but I get not overpaying for them too.
I get that but you can't work on that model. We are not trying to sign 25 players. We need ideally 3/4 players in. So say if all four wanted an extra 1k a week. That's 208k a year for 4 players?
Is it really that unsustainable?
Yes, because you don't know what those players are asking in wages. Give Maddison say £18k a week like we have Taylor, a 3 year deal say, that's £2.8m a year each, plus Jonny Williams then says, my deal is up at the end of the season, I saw you offered Taylor £18k, I'm on about £5k, I want what you're paying them. Granted he's got a bit of an injury record, but you get the picture, floodgates are opened for all other new prospects.
Oh
Sorry Chizz, didn't type that correctly, £2.8m each over the lifetime of their deals (if 3 year deals as an example). Just highlighting that I think there are lot of well meaning comments about getting bodies in in the short term, which I agree we need, but I'm not sure how many people are thinking about what that means in the long term
Reece we have given him permission to speak to 2 championship clubs. It's up to them and player to agree terms or not. Thanks pal.
That's that then, no doubt in my mind if it's one of the 4 clubs that were linked with him recently (Forest, Boro, Derby and Hull) all 4 of them will pay what he wants.
Absolutely forget about him I would say, once again messing about only this time over a player with 128 goal contributions in 211 games. Highly doubt we will find better
With Maddison it has to be more than just the money. We need players who want to be here ultimately and he clearly doesn't. Good player but there are other good players. If he changes his mind and it isn't too late, maybe something can be done!
We don’t just want players who want to be here, we also need players who are up to the challenge. We could go and sign a team of players from the Conference tomorrow who would all love to be here, however those players probably wouldn’t be good enough. We release a team of 18 year olds every year who would love to be here.
What we want are players that are good enough and want to be here. The first part is essential and players that are good enough for this level come with a price tag, if we can’t pay it then they won’t come and I don’t blame them for that.
With Maddison it has to be more than just the money. We need players who want to be here ultimately and he clearly doesn't. Good player but there are other good players. If he changes his mind and it isn't too late, maybe something can be done!
How can you possibly say Maddison clearly doesn't want to sign for CAFC ? You haven't got the first clue what is happening in these negotiations. You may be right, but it's possible he does want to sign but is trying to get himself the best possible deal. Sorry, but you're making big assumptions on most things Charlton.
Ok, lets assume he does want to sign then. We are all making assumptions based on what we see surely.
If I was Maddison I wouldn’t move until the summer, leave on a free and get paid a bigger salary/signing on fee.
It would be a bad deal for Peterborough because not only would I be depriving them of a transfer fee but I would also spend the rest of the season avoiding any situation that could lead to me being injured (including any sort of tackling) and ruining my pay day, but that’s the sort of guy I am.
Yep, so we ask Posh to reduce their transfer fee, in order to pay Maddison more. If they don't they will get nothing.
As it stands I've heard nothing to say any other club have met the break clause, so it's still only us allowed to talk to him.
I doubt we’ve met the break clause either (which I understand to be £2.5M), we’ve just bid an amount that Peterborough are happy with rather than getting nothing in a few months.
If I’m Maddison then I’m thinking that every pound spent whatsoever by a team on a fee for me in January is a pound less in my pocket if I wait until the summer.
As I said, and unless his salary is going to double/triple, then I didn’t really know why Maddison would want to move now and miss the chance to be a free agent at a time when my stock is high, which is pretty much the ideal scenario from the perspective of a professional footballers earning potential.
Think this is spot on. Unless its a take it or leave it from a club he really wants to join .........
Comments
“There’s a serious party at the table, just finalising personal terms and should be done in next few days”.
We're fecking rich,we're fecking rich------we're fecking skint,we're fecking skint_------------------- same old bollox
I will get my green jacket as I don't think I made the cut.
If I’m Maddison then I’m thinking that every pound spent whatsoever by a team on a fee for me in January is a pound less in my pocket if I wait until the summer.
You haven't got the first clue what is happening in these negotiations.
You may be right, but it's possible he does want to sign but is trying to get himself the best possible deal.
Sorry, but you're making big assumptions on most things Charlton.
Absolutely forget about him I would say, once again messing about only this time over a player with 128 goal contributions in 211 games. Highly doubt we will find better
What we want are players that are good enough and want to be here. The first part is essential and players that are good enough for this level come with a price tag, if we can’t pay it then they won’t come and I don’t blame them for that.
Think this is spot on. Unless its a take it or leave it from a club he really wants to join .........