So I think there are some overreactions here. We were poor tonight, but we had worse games last season, let alone under Parky, let alone under Slade. Our midfield was overrun by a very good passing side. Our fullbacks were found wanting playing against wingbacks. As a result, our CBs got dragged out of position. And we switched off from a set piece. It was bad, but it wasn't outside of the realms of what I'd put under "Things that happen in football."
That being said, things were bad. And to make so many avoidable mistakes in one match is a problem. I've worried about Dobson's positioning since pre-season. He looks like he wants to charge about and win the ball/break up play, akin to Pratley, not sit and dictate, akin to Watson (regardless of what you think of the quality of the two older players, just using their style as an example). Adkins requires so much running from his other two "shuttling" midfielders (Clare and Morgan) that that number 6 (or 4) has to be there to provide cover, and has to be very good. I'm not convinced Dobson is suited to the role. In possession, he struggles to influence the game. Has a decent range of passing, but doesn't keep things ticking over.
I thought Clare looked alright in stretches, but apart from run, I'm not entirely clear on what he's good at. Put a couple of half decent crosses in, but nothing spectacular. And given our very direct style of football, if all you do is run, you're going to run yourself out of the game because we bypass the midfield far too much at the moment.
Gunter is just...not very good anymore. Didn't think he was good last year. Don't think he's looked good at LB this year. Thought Matthews had one of his poorer games on the right, but overall he's a solid if unspectacular fullback. That said, we need an attacking fullback, namely at LB, as Kirk likes to cut in on his right and as Robinson pointed out on Saturday, that leaves a lot of space for a LB to attack. I could see that player coming in the form of a loan from a Prem side. I don't care how we get it, we just need to get a LB over the line as Purrington is not that player.
Onto the system. Adkins is obviously a systems manager. I like systems managers. I think they win out in the long term. But right now we're like someone caught between two bus stops. We neither press high up the pitch, nor sit deep and look to counter. We look to play a sort of mid range press, then lump it long, and it ends up being disjointed with players out of position half the time because they're either pressing or chasing balls into the channel. This has to fall on Adkins. And he needs to sort it out, and quickly. I'm not sure if we're fit enough to play a high pressing game, but I'd certainly try it against Wigan given that the alternative hasn't worked.
We're three games in. We have Gilbey and Schwartz to come back. The window is open for another two weeks and the fact of the matter is that a lot of loan deals both 1) provide a spark of talent otherwise unaccessible to a club at our level, and 2) happen late in the window. So I'm not going to panic yet. But things must improve. And we must start to get players in.
There were some nice moments in that, but sadly once again, my favourite bits of the evening have been the pre and post match stuff, rather than the match itself. But I have other things to be getting on with rather than post-mortems tonight.
"The song" playing before the start of the programme got on my tits. Addicks to victory indeed.
How can Adkin's assessment of what was needed to launch a critical new season have been to pitifully wrong? I fear the horse has already bolted. Just 4 games in and I couldn't care less already!
There were some nice moments in that, but sadly once again, my favourite bits of the evening have been the pre and post match stuff, rather than the match itself. But I have other things to be getting on with rather than post-mortems tonight.
"The song" playing before the start of the programme got on my tits. Addicks no victory indeed.
I am not proud to say that I have been calling this for weeks & weeks. Got pelters on the Transfer Rumours thread back in early July when I questioned our lack of transfers.....got told not to panic & the transfer window doesn't close until end of August.
Even got told by a poster that they wanted to rip my head off & piss down my neck for daring to suggest that TS's transfer policy was no different to Duchatalet. I said at least under RD we brought players in.
Seems like TS is happy to rely on the U23's. That's ok if you have a Shelvey, a Gomez or a Parker. Not so good if you have Claydon, Roddy or Vennings.
Think it might be too late anyway. Most of the good players have joined new clubs and any other players we are interested in the selling clubs will know we are desperate & will be upping their prices as I type.
Just too fucking late. Time to strengthen was back in June & July.
Could be in the bottom 4 come 5pm Saturday. And I dare anyone to call me a bedwetter.
The thing is mate you "call it out" when we are 3-0 up, that we should go for the 4th, if we signed someone who scored 20 goals the previous season you would want someone that scored 25.
If we signed Messi you would moan we didn't get Ronaldo as well.
If we won the league with 99 points you would moan we didn't get 100.
If you predict the apocalypse on an hourly basis your be right eventually.
If we signed somebody who can score 20, signing somebody who can score 25 improves us. Why would you not want that. We have lost about 25 goals with Aneke, JFC and Gilbey and not brought any in to compensate. We haven't signed Messi or Ronaldo and we have absolutely no chance of getting near 99 points as it stands.
Out of interest, am I the only one that thinks the new keeper is rubbish?
Certainly seems a big downgrade on Amos. Doesn't come for crosses, positioning and kicking suspect, at fault for 2 goals. Maynard-Brewer couldn't have done any worse.
8 points behind the pack after only three games wake up a smell the Roses Adkins 👎👎
Just my opinion but I feel sorry for Adkins. Can hardly expect him to work miracles with the mediocrity he’s been given to work with. I can’t think of any manager that could do better with a substandard first eleven and a bench made up of raw kids.
Yes it’s an opinion and only an opinion managers manage and get owners to spend so let’s give him 10 more games before we feel to sorry for him 😂😂
Not sure I feel that sorry for Adkins. Sheff wed game and first half tonight shows there is better there than smashing it long and installing no confidence in our players. Manager bounce last season and now watching some of the most predictable turgid football we’ve seen, jury is well and truly out.
Feel it's harsh to give Adkins much of the blame at all for this. He's picking the best he has available, we did start better tonight and that was down to the press and playing to feet, they then resort to pumping it long when there are no options available. I'm certain he isn't intent on a long ball game.
The lack of left back is a huge hole at the moment, I'd argue it's the single biggest problem. It makes us too one dimensional in attack our only attacking moves came down the right and even when Kirk came on he hardly had a sniff.
The only questions I would have about Adkins are around Morgan but again I'm not sure how much he'd be starting if Gilbey was fit and I'd imagine it's an area they have/should be looking at to recruit. Also playing Inniss again tonight was surely asking for trouble given his lack of fitness.
Was the point that Golfie has been on the money with his criticisms? If so apologies. I agree he has. If it is true it can't be criticised for being negative. It is what it is.
Like I said in the match thread, we could have brought on Neymar when Washington got injured and it wouldn't have made a difference. The only play we have is lump it to Stockley and pray.
The midfield 3 are no better than when we had Foley and Crofts in midfield, it's completely devoid of guile, drive and technical proficiency.
Morgan lovers cling on to one or two passes every game that he manages to pull off, but the other 95% of his play is not good enough, he also got booked for a petulant challenge after getting frustrated at himself, not what we need.
Dobson is a non entity, a destroyer who can't break play up very well
Clare is an athlete, and that's it, may as well be a cross country runner.
DJ is a waste of space, I'd sooner play a left back on loan at right wing than him, and that's saying something
WTF are you talking about. Did you watch the first half when he was excellent. In the second half he still skinned the full back but the team were so poor second half he had no chance.
Are you talking about the Oxford game when he didn't get a kick ?
So what's going wrong at Ipswich? Before the season no one would grumble at the quality of player they have bought in, as well as the experience of the manager - but currently they find themselves in the exact same situation as us.
You have to feel they have more chance of turning it around then us, but I guess we always have more leeway to improve our squad more so (if we start to being in quality players).
So what's going wrong at Ipswich? Before the season no one would grumble at the quality of player they have bought in, as well as the experience of the manager - but currently they find themselves in the exact same situation as us.
You have to feel they have more chance of turning it around then us, but I guess we always have more leeway to improve our squad more so (if we start to being in quality players).
Ipswich have signed too many players and Cook is still clearly working out what his best team is. It's a much better problem than we have but with the same results at the moment. You'd have to fancy them to get it right at some point though.
In last two games even when losing we had nothing in the tank to try and chase it and create chances.
We look leggy and unfit in my eyes
I don’t think it’s fitness (bar Inniss).
it’s mental.
We look an 11 that hasn’t settled, found it’s groove and playing naturally. It’s forced and it’s short of confidence.
Had we not conceded straight after scoring this may well have been the settling performance, as it started really brightly and the goal was a just reward.
but immediately we turned a positive into a negative and passed the momentum back over to them.
So what's going wrong at Ipswich? Before the season no one would grumble at the quality of player they have bought in, as well as the experience of the manager - but currently they find themselves in the exact same situation as us.
You have to feel they have more chance of turning it around then us, but I guess we always have more leeway to improve our squad more so (if we start to being in quality players).
Ipswich have signed too many players and Cook is still clearly working out what his best team is. It's a much better problem than we have but with the same results at the moment. You'd have to fancy them to get it right at some point though.
Yep. I'd say us and Ipswich lack a lot of confidence. I don’t believe these players are this bad.
A range of thoughts, not all bad and not all consistent..
Defence was supposed to be the strength of the team. Not convinced by that at all, even putting to one side Gunter at left back which is an adequate patch at best. Innis and Famewo are not what they are cracked up to be. Space between the centre halves was ridiculous at times although I thought Famewo did ok individually.
I'm equally not convinced Morgan should be written off. He showed flashes, delivered well for the goal, and needs time, confidence and better support around him and more options ahead of him.
DJ is clearly a threat and a talent, even if he won't deliver every game.
Though Washington put a shift in.
Unconvinced by the keeper. A good comment made earlier on by someone who said he looks like an outfield player in goal. I'd take Amos back in a flash, especially the ability to command his box and deal with crosses.
We miss JFC hugely. Some were saying last year we could do better. I thought to myself at the time 'how' and I've not changed my mind one bit. We desperately missed the control and tempo he offers.
At least he may come back, unlike Aneke. If Stockley gets injured were are totally f*cked, and we are still f*cked even if he plays every game and we have no alternative options up top.
All of that said, at times we looked good, especially when the energy was high, but you can't sustain that all game nevermind all season and with such a thin squad.
Important not to read too much into things too early and for all of us to be patient and not catastophise. Team, and midfield especially, needs time to bed in.
Nevertheless, and perversely, glad these first few games have not provided false comfort. Just like the rest of us TS must see Adkins needs more resources to work with and options to change a game. Doesn't mean TS will deliver. But if not you have to wonder why he bothered to get into all of this.
So what's going wrong at Ipswich? Before the season no one would grumble at the quality of player they have bought in, as well as the experience of the manager - but currently they find themselves in the exact same situation as us.
You have to feel they have more chance of turning it around then us, but I guess we always have more leeway to improve our squad more so (if we start to being in quality players).
Ipswich have signed too many players and Cook is still clearly working out what his best team is. It's a much better problem than we have but with the same results at the moment. You'd have to fancy them to get it right at some point though.
Yep. I'd say us and Ipswich lack a lot of confidence. I don’t believe these players are this bad.
You mean Dobson and Clare our starting midfield that couldn’t get into their league one first teams last season, can’t be that bad?
Thankfully I was out tonight so didn't see the game. Can't comment on how good, bad or indifferent we were. But one point from 9 and two goals scored in 270 minutes, one of which was a penalty, is woeful.
As it stands there's 4 teams worse than us, but for how long. 2 weeks to get in players, or it's going to be along and difficult season. Our current squad is worse than any of the past 4 seasons, by some margin.
In last two games even when losing we had nothing in the tank to try and chase it and create chances.
We look leggy and unfit in my eyes
We just played two teams who are excellent at holding the ball and passing around the opposition. We chased shadows in both games and wore ourselves out doing it. If we continue playing kick and rush footy and then spending the entire game chasing to get it back when we have cheaply given it away we will look leggy even if super fit.
Out of interest, am I the only one that thinks the new keeper is rubbish?
Certainly seems a big downgrade on Amos. Doesn't come for crosses, positioning and kicking suspect, at fault for 2 goals. Maynard-Brewer couldn't have done any worse.
A range of thoughts, not all bad and not all consistent..
Defence was supposed to be the strength of the team. Not convinced by that at all, even putting to one side Gunter at right back which is an adequate patch at best. Innis and Famewo are not what they are cracked up to be. Space between the centre halves was ridiculous at times although I thought Famewo did ok individually.
I'm equally not convinced Morgan should be written off. He showed flashes, delivered well for the goal, and needs time, confidence and better support around him and more options ahead of him.
DJ is clearly a threat and a talent, even if he won't deliver every game.
Though Washington put a shift in.
Unconvinced by the keeper. A good comment made earlier on by someone who said he looks like an outfield player in goal. I'd take Amos back in a flash, especially the ability to command his box and deal with crosses.
We miss JFC hugely. Some were saying last year we could do better. I thought to myself at the time 'how' and I've not changed my mind one bit. We desperately missed the control and tempo he offers.
At least he may come back, unlike Aneke. If Stockley gets injured were are totally f*cked, and we are still f*cked even if he plays every game and we have no alternative options up top.
All of that said, at times we looked good, especially when the energy was high, but you can't sustain that all game nevermind all season and with such a thin squad.
Important not to read too much into things too early and for all of us to be patient and not catastophise. Team, and midfield especially, needs time to bed in.
Nevertheless, and perversely, glad these first few games have not provided false comfort. Just like the rest of us TS must see Adkins needs more resources to work with and options to change a game. Doesn't mean TS will deliver. But if not you have to wonder why he bothered to get into all of this.
On Inniss and Famewo last season, worth remembering they had Pratley shielding them as a defensive midfielder who often dropped into the gzp between them when we were under pressure, Dobson is not a patch on Pratley in that role.
1) I maintain what I have said from the start - signing two rejects from Oxford and Sunderland screamed out from the start our big rebuild was gonna be a damp shitty squib.
‘Be patient’ we were told. There are now two weeks left and we need 6-7 quality players. Not Tranmere rejects or whoever was linked today. It’s not gonna happen.
None of this is good enough. We are as big as anyone in this league. We have bigger crowds than most. We generate more revenue. And on the face we have (by league one standards) a wealthy owner.
2) We keep getting told ‘we have a club’… ‘be grateful we exist’….. ‘we are stabilising in this league’.
Well for all that was wrong with RD he paid the bills. We had a club. For many years we existed in the championship.
So how come Thomas strums a guitar, drops his ‘booms’ and gets away with this shite? And we are told to be simply happy to ‘have a club?’
Yet we weren’t happy to simply ‘have a club’ for the last few years? Even when we had better players by a long stretch?
Roland may have been a twat but this is in danger of plunging to depths we didn’t even reach with Tommy D and co. To think we used to go mental over getting players from standard liege - Jesus Christ what I would do for players like Bulot, Buyens and Texeira now.
Comments
That being said, things were bad. And to make so many avoidable mistakes in one match is a problem. I've worried about Dobson's positioning since pre-season. He looks like he wants to charge about and win the ball/break up play, akin to Pratley, not sit and dictate, akin to Watson (regardless of what you think of the quality of the two older players, just using their style as an example). Adkins requires so much running from his other two "shuttling" midfielders (Clare and Morgan) that that number 6 (or 4) has to be there to provide cover, and has to be very good. I'm not convinced Dobson is suited to the role. In possession, he struggles to influence the game. Has a decent range of passing, but doesn't keep things ticking over.
I thought Clare looked alright in stretches, but apart from run, I'm not entirely clear on what he's good at. Put a couple of half decent crosses in, but nothing spectacular. And given our very direct style of football, if all you do is run, you're going to run yourself out of the game because we bypass the midfield far too much at the moment.
Gunter is just...not very good anymore. Didn't think he was good last year. Don't think he's looked good at LB this year. Thought Matthews had one of his poorer games on the right, but overall he's a solid if unspectacular fullback. That said, we need an attacking fullback, namely at LB, as Kirk likes to cut in on his right and as Robinson pointed out on Saturday, that leaves a lot of space for a LB to attack. I could see that player coming in the form of a loan from a Prem side. I don't care how we get it, we just need to get a LB over the line as Purrington is not that player.
Onto the system. Adkins is obviously a systems manager. I like systems managers. I think they win out in the long term. But right now we're like someone caught between two bus stops. We neither press high up the pitch, nor sit deep and look to counter. We look to play a sort of mid range press, then lump it long, and it ends up being disjointed with players out of position half the time because they're either pressing or chasing balls into the channel. This has to fall on Adkins. And he needs to sort it out, and quickly. I'm not sure if we're fit enough to play a high pressing game, but I'd certainly try it against Wigan given that the alternative hasn't worked.
We're three games in. We have Gilbey and Schwartz to come back. The window is open for another two weeks and the fact of the matter is that a lot of loan deals both 1) provide a spark of talent otherwise unaccessible to a club at our level, and 2) happen late in the window. So I'm not going to panic yet. But things must improve. And we must start to get players in.
managers manage and get owners to spend
so let’s give him 10 more games before we feel to sorry for him 😂😂
The lack of left back is a huge hole at the moment, I'd argue it's the single biggest problem. It makes us too one dimensional in attack our only attacking moves came down the right and even when Kirk came on he hardly had a sniff.
The only questions I would have about Adkins are around Morgan but again I'm not sure how much he'd be starting if Gilbey was fit and I'd imagine it's an area they have/should be looking at to recruit. Also playing Inniss again tonight was surely asking for trouble given his lack of fitness.
WTF are you talking about. Did you watch the first half when he was excellent. In the second half he still skinned the full back but the team were so poor second half he had no chance.
Are you talking about the Oxford game when he didn't get a kick ?
You have to feel they have more chance of turning it around then us, but I guess we always have more leeway to improve our squad more so (if we start to being in quality players).
it’s mental.
but immediately we turned a positive into a negative and passed the momentum back over to them.
A range of thoughts, not all bad and not all consistent..
Defence was supposed to be the strength of the team. Not convinced by that at all, even putting to one side Gunter at left back which is an adequate patch at best. Innis and Famewo are not what they are cracked up to be. Space between the centre halves was ridiculous at times although I thought Famewo did ok individually.
I'm equally not convinced Morgan should be written off. He showed flashes, delivered well for the goal, and needs time, confidence and better support around him and more options ahead of him.
DJ is clearly a threat and a talent, even if he won't deliver every game.
Though Washington put a shift in.
Unconvinced by the keeper. A good comment made earlier on by someone who said he looks like an outfield player in goal. I'd take Amos back in a flash, especially the ability to command his box and deal with crosses.
We miss JFC hugely. Some were saying last year we could do better. I thought to myself at the time 'how' and I've not changed my mind one bit. We desperately missed the control and tempo he offers.
At least he may come back, unlike Aneke. If Stockley gets injured were are totally f*cked, and we are still f*cked even if he plays every game and we have no alternative options up top.
All of that said, at times we looked good, especially when the energy was high, but you can't sustain that all game nevermind all season and with such a thin squad.
Important not to read too much into things too early and for all of us to be patient and not catastophise. Team, and midfield especially, needs time to bed in.
Nevertheless, and perversely, glad these first few games have not provided false comfort. Just like the rest of us TS must see Adkins needs more resources to work with and options to change a game. Doesn't mean TS will deliver. But if not you have to wonder why he bothered to get into all of this.
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/nigel-adkins-reacts-to-second-defeat-in-four-days-as-charlton-are-beaten-at-milton-keynes/
As it stands there's 4 teams worse than us, but for how long. 2 weeks to get in players, or it's going to be along and difficult season. Our current squad is worse than any of the past 4 seasons, by some margin.
Well for all that was wrong with RD he paid the bills. We had a club. For many years we existed in the championship.
So how come Thomas strums a guitar, drops his ‘booms’ and gets away with this shite? And we are told to be simply happy to ‘have a club?’
Yet we weren’t happy to simply ‘have a club’ for the last few years? Even when we had better players by a long stretch?