Gilbey? What about Gilbey? I would tell those interested parties they could have Gilkirk at a reduced fee, buy one get one free as it were. But not Jake Forster Caskey. There are others more deserving than him who should be ahead of JFC at the departure gate.
DJ has his limitations but he's skilful, tenacious and gets involved. Twice on Saturday he won the ball high up the pitch and went on a threatening run. He won at least two yellow-card fouls. He got an assist and got in a good scoring position. He almost set up Stockley at the end of a flowing move - he got the pass wrong but he was in a position to make it. He's not perfect at all, or as quick as you might hope, but he contributes. Kirk thus far for us has been nothing but a weak, graft-shy showpony with about two signature moves, neither effective. I literally cannot believe that numerous people are saying he's preferable to DJ, let alone saying he should START for us. DJ can come out of the starting XI when we sign a wing-forward, as we're clearly trying to do. There's just no place for Kirk.
DJ can only play well for a half. Was the same last season but thought that was just due to him having to do more running playing at wing back. When he starts a game he always looks knackered in the second half and doesn’t affect it at all, was the same on Saturday. He’s also had a lot more chances than Kirk has, only got given a brief go under Adkins in what was a terrible team. Look at his past for Crewe and he has a higher ceiling than DJ if we can get the best out of him, he even played in the championship last year and has interest now again from that level showing he is rated higher
I guess the thing we learned from the Accrington game is that Kirk isn't in competition with DJ, he's in competition with CBT. Garner evidently wants his left-sided wingers cutting in on their right, and CBT currently holds the shirt with his pace. It's a shame in a way as I think I'd like to see pace on one wing and craft on the other, but that's not how we're playing it. DJ currently doesn't have any competition on his side unless Garner decides he wants to start Leaburn as more of an inside forward and less of an out and out winger. CBT will get his injuries and we will need Kirk to come in and offer something different. I'd really like to keep him, especially as there will be games where an intelligent winger will be needed to unlock defences rather than someone with explosive pace. What we need to do is complete on getting a right winger who is a goal threat, then DJ can be the backup on that side.
I think ideally we would have both DJ and Kirk, they are very different players. Kirk is a lot calmer on the ball than DJ he can get round a player and put a well thought out ball into the box or score from distance. Last season no-one was making intelligent runs into the box it was 'run like hell down the wing and just hope that a cross reaches Stockley'. Hopefully if our passing game continues to improve there will be many more well timed assists leading to goals and Kirk would have a part in this.
If we’re moving anyone on, the choices for me are Gilbey & JFC.
It might not be about choices though. Supply and demand. Are there any takers for those two at the moment? Perhaps we need to move sharpish to secure the striker we want and Kirk has the most interest of the saleable players. 🤷🏻♂️
Yep agree Id like to Mckirdy and the Palace lad coming in to replace DJ and Kirk as our wingers if we have any serious asperations of promotion
Both reportedly have Championship interest so will be pretty tough to get either.
I would rather we get, and are more likely to get JRS than McKirdy.
I would expect our salary restrictions against our turnover to mean we could probably afford to take on one rather than both and I bet the wage demands for McKirdy would be out of our budget when we're competing with other Championship clubs - McKirdy also seems like the type to go to the highest bidder primarily.
Whereas I think JRS (or whatever his codename is) will go where Palace think he has the best chance of progressing, in a system they want him to play in, where he's going to get maximum game-time, under a manager they know and have a relationship with. I think we tick those boxes well.
I guess the thing we learned from the Accrington game is that Kirk isn't in competition with DJ, he's in competition with CBT. Garner evidently wants his left-sided wingers cutting in on their right, and CBT currently holds the shirt with his pace. It's a shame in a way as I think I'd like to see pace on one wing and craft on the other, but that's not how we're playing it. DJ currently doesn't have any competition on his side unless Garner decides he wants to start Leaburn as more of an inside forward and less of an out and out winger. CBT will get his injuries and we will need Kirk to come in and offer something different. I'd really like to keep him, especially as there will be games where an intelligent winger will be needed to unlock defences rather than someone with explosive pace. What we need to do is complete on getting a right winger who is a goal threat, then DJ can be the backup on that side.
Garner won't want to play with 2 wingers, as on at least one side he'll want a goal scoring forward like McKirdy. Or indeed Leaburn, as 2 wingers and a target man centre forward wouldn't deliver enough goals.
And I'm not sure he really wants his left winger to be right footed and cut in, as otherwise why sign a right footed left back as well? Ideally you want a left footed FB behind a right footed winger or vice versa, so you can attack both ways. After all he inherited DJ, CBT and Kirk, he didn't sign them.
I know it’s just warm ups but Kirks control is outstanding, he makes football look so easy. He looked good imo when he came on for his cameo and I think we would be foolish to let him go, especially if it’s just to get a player on loan.
His close ball control is excellent, his vision is excellent and he has good awareness. Just needs a bit more tenacity about him and energy
be quite peeved if he goes, would much rather see the likes of Gilbey or JFC be moved on where we have more cover
I know it’s just warm ups but Kirks control is outstanding, he makes football look so easy. He looked good imo when he came on for his cameo and I think we would be foolish to let him go, especially if it’s just to get a player on loan.
His close ball control is excellent, his vision is excellent and he has good awareness. Just needs a bit more tenacity about him and energy
be quite peeved if he goes, would much rather see the likes of Gilbey or JFC be moved on where we have more cover
In the warm up he can look good. But he didn't create the chance for the goal and he lost his man for their second goal. Football is not played in the warm up, it is played in real time, when you have to track your man last minute when you've just taken a 2-1 lead....
In a perfect world I would have neither DJ nor Kirk in the starting 11.
I do wonder how much of Saturday's team was picked for balance (those unavailable or not yet signed) not necessarily the 11 Garner thinks is closest to his best team.
Often when you look back at seasons you have a memory of what the team was, despite that team probably only playing a handful of times together. I think (hope?) That that was at least 3 or 4 players short.
Seeing as he is right footed, there is no reason CBT can't play on the right.
If people wnat to tell me he is more effective on the left I say oh! He beats players for pace which he can do from either flank and then when he gets in a promising position he doesn't capitalise so not sure where the more effective bit comes in.
I know it’s just warm ups but Kirks control is outstanding, he makes football look so easy. He looked good imo when he came on for his cameo and I think we would be foolish to let him go, especially if it’s just to get a player on loan.
His close ball control is excellent, his vision is excellent and he has good awareness. Just needs a bit more tenacity about him and energy
be quite peeved if he goes, would much rather see the likes of Gilbey or JFC be moved on where we have more cover
Yeah I mean you're not wrong, but he really, really doesn't fancy the physical battle, he is almost the definition of a luxury player. If there was an intra-squad five a side tournament he'd be close to first pick, but this is War you see. And before you give me all that 'didn't you like Ben Reeves'...Reeves was up for a scrap, he really relished being fouled
See I think Kirk should be starting over DJ based on what I saw pre season, and if we sign another player in that position, then again I'd probably let DJ leave over Kirk. However if Kirk is the one garnering interest, especially from championship clubs, then I think we cut our losses and sell him
Agreed, was very shocked to see DJ starting over Kirk at the weekend but he may have been a bit lightweight for any game
See I think Kirk should be starting over DJ based on what I saw pre season, and if we sign another player in that position, then again I'd probably let DJ leave over Kirk. However if Kirk is the one garnering interest, especially from championship clubs, then I think we cut our losses and sell him
Agreed, was very shocked to see DJ starting over Kirk at the weekend but he may have been a bit lightweight for any game
Fixed it for you
Away from home you can understand DJ starting but if you want to create and score goals Kirk as to start at home ( unless the Palace kid signs in time )
DJ has his limitations but he's skilful, tenacious and gets involved. Twice on Saturday he won the ball high up the pitch and went on a threatening run. He won at least two yellow-card fouls. He got an assist and got in a good scoring position. He almost set up Stockley at the end of a flowing move - he got the pass wrong but he was in a position to make it. He's not perfect at all, or as quick as you might hope, but he contributes. Kirk thus far for us has been nothing but a weak, graft-shy showpony with about two signature moves, neither effective. I literally cannot believe that numerous people are saying he's preferable to DJ, let alone saying he should START for us. DJ can come out of the starting XI when we sign a wing-forward, as we're clearly trying to do. There's just no place for Kirk.
DJ has his limitations but he's skilful, tenacious and gets involved. Twice on Saturday he won the ball high up the pitch and went on a threatening run. He won at least two yellow-card fouls. He got an assist and got in a good scoring position. He almost set up Stockley at the end of a flowing move - he got the pass wrong but he was in a position to make it. He's not perfect at all, or as quick as you might hope, but he contributes. Kirk thus far for us has been nothing but a weak, graft-shy showpony with about two signature moves, neither effective. I literally cannot believe that numerous people are saying he's preferable to DJ, let alone saying he should START for us. DJ can come out of the starting XI when we sign a wing-forward, as we're clearly trying to do. There's just no place for Kirk.
DJ will be out of the team very quickly and play no meaningful part in this season at all. If I’m wrong I will donate £50 to the Upbeats. Thing is, I would love to lose this and pay the £50. Would love him to become a footballer. Unfortunately I don’t think he ever will .
I guess my question is do really need to sell either of them given how thin we are at the position. If financial fair play (or whatever acronym league one uses for salary limits) or a budgetary limit set by TS requires us to sell one to get one in, then it is a fair debate. I get nervous when we only have three wide players in a 433 and CBT has historically had some hamstring issues.
DJ has his limitations but he's skilful, tenacious and gets involved. Twice on Saturday he won the ball high up the pitch and went on a threatening run. He won at least two yellow-card fouls. He got an assist and got in a good scoring position. He almost set up Stockley at the end of a flowing move - he got the pass wrong but he was in a position to make it. He's not perfect at all, or as quick as you might hope, but he contributes. Kirk thus far for us has been nothing but a weak, graft-shy showpony with about two signature moves, neither effective. I literally cannot believe that numerous people are saying he's preferable to DJ, let alone saying he should START for us. DJ can come out of the starting XI when we sign a wing-forward, as we're clearly trying to do. There's just no place for Kirk.
Maybe I am easily pleased but I would have DJ in the team ahead of Kirk any day of the week as things stand. DJ gets way too much stick on here and I certainly don't understand the 'lazy' jibe that comes his way. He can be erratic and inconsistent but that's why he is a L1 winger. Would I like to see DJ add a few more goals and assists? Of course but if he was banging them in he wouldn't be slumming it with us in the third tier!
Kirk has done nothing yet for Charlton so can only assume people are basing the opinion on what he did at Crewe (haven't seen enough Crewe games to pass judgement). Appeciate he's a young lad who lost his father and moved down south so given some time he may yet come good. We can only hope.
I guess my question is do really need to sell either of them given how thin we are at the position. If financial fair play (or whatever acronym league one uses for salary limits) or a budgetary limit set by TS requires us to sell one to get one in, then it is a fair debate. I get nervous when we only have three wide players in a 433 and CBT has historically had some hamstring issues.
Yes, ideally we’d have the 3 we have now plus a new signing. But if we do lose Kirk we still have Leaburn, Kanu and Clayden. Plus Payne could be another option on the right which will help us fitting all our midfielders in the team. And Egbo can play further forward as well so we still have plenty of options
I guess my question is do really need to sell either of them given how thin we are at the position. If financial fair play (or whatever acronym league one uses for salary limits) or a budgetary limit set by TS requires us to sell one to get one in, then it is a fair debate. I get nervous when we only have three wide players in a 433 and CBT has historically had some hamstring issues.
Yes, ideally we’d have the 3 we have now plus a new signing. But if we do lose Kirk we still have Leaburn, Kanu and Clayden. Plus Payne could be another option on the right which will help us fitting all our midfielders in the team. And Egbo can play further forward as well so we still have plenty of options
And if CBT was injured/rested it could be an idea to play a diamond midfield again. With our many central midfielders and Stockley being better in a front 2 it could be an option if CBT was unavailable
I guess my question is do really need to sell either of them given how thin we are at the position. If financial fair play (or whatever acronym league one uses for salary limits) or a budgetary limit set by TS requires us to sell one to get one in, then it is a fair debate. I get nervous when we only have three wide players in a 433 and CBT has historically had some hamstring issues.
Yes, ideally we’d have the 3 we have now plus a new signing. But if we do lose Kirk we still have Leaburn, Kanu and Clayden. Plus Payne could be another option on the right which will help us fitting all our midfielders in the team. And Egbo can play further forward as well so we still have plenty of options
And if CBT was injured/rested it could be an idea to play a diamond midfield again. With our many central midfielders and Stockley being better in a front 2 it could be an option if CBT was unavailable
Who partners him? I would actually like to see a diamond with CBT and A&Enke up top but I get why we can't.
I guess my question is do really need to sell either of them given how thin we are at the position. If financial fair play (or whatever acronym league one uses for salary limits) or a budgetary limit set by TS requires us to sell one to get one in, then it is a fair debate. I get nervous when we only have three wide players in a 433 and CBT has historically had some hamstring issues.
Yes, ideally we’d have the 3 we have now plus a new signing. But if we do lose Kirk we still have Leaburn, Kanu and Clayden. Plus Payne could be another option on the right which will help us fitting all our midfielders in the team. And Egbo can play further forward as well so we still have plenty of options
And if CBT was injured/rested it could be an idea to play a diamond midfield again. With our many central midfielders and Stockley being better in a front 2 it could be an option if CBT was unavailable
Who partners him? I would actually like to see a diamond with CBT and A&Enke up top but I get why we can't.
Yeah I’m not sure we have the partner in the squad at the moment so it would have to be the new striker we will hopefully sign or Leaburn. I like the idea of CBT up top but I think his finishing would let him down. Aneke is our best striker imo so hopefully we can get him back to 2019/20 fitness levels where he was doing 60mins one game and then 30 the next so starting him is then an option
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I would tell those interested parties they could have Gilkirk at a reduced fee, buy one get one free as it were.
But not Jake Forster Caskey. There are others more deserving than him who should be ahead of JFC at the departure gate.
We also have Clayden along with the option of Leaburn and Payne who aren't wingers but can playing in the front three
But we need depth amongst the squad
Its easy to talk about the squad that won us promotion in 2018/19 - But the likes of George Lapslie still played nearly 30-games
I would expect our salary restrictions against our turnover to mean we could probably afford to take on one rather than both and I bet the wage demands for McKirdy would be out of our budget when we're competing with other Championship clubs - McKirdy also seems like the type to go to the highest bidder primarily.
Whereas I think JRS (or whatever his codename is) will go where Palace think he has the best chance of progressing, in a system they want him to play in, where he's going to get maximum game-time, under a manager they know and have a relationship with. I think we tick those boxes well.
And I'm not sure he really wants his left winger to be right footed and cut in, as otherwise why sign a right footed left back as well? Ideally you want a left footed FB behind a right footed winger or vice versa, so you can attack both ways. After all he inherited DJ, CBT and Kirk, he didn't sign them.
be quite peeved if he goes, would much rather see the likes of Gilbey or JFC be moved on where we have more cover
I do wonder how much of Saturday's team was picked for balance (those unavailable or not yet signed) not necessarily the 11 Garner thinks is closest to his best team.
Often when you look back at seasons you have a memory of what the team was, despite that team probably only playing a handful of times together. I think (hope?) That that was at least 3 or 4 players short.
If people wnat to tell me he is more effective on the left I say oh! He beats players for pace which he can do from either flank and then when he gets in a promising position he doesn't capitalise so not sure where the more effective bit comes in.
meaningful part in this season at all. If I’m wrong I will donate £50 to the Upbeats. Thing is, I would love to lose this and pay the £50. Would love him to become a footballer. Unfortunately I don’t think he ever will .
Kirk has done nothing yet for Charlton so can only assume people are basing the opinion on what he did at Crewe (haven't seen enough Crewe games to pass judgement). Appeciate he's a young lad who lost his father and moved down south so given some time he may yet come good. We can only hope.