One interesting stat from that chart above is that Accrington have played a lot stronger opposition than us in their pre-season friendlies.
Leaving aside Palace, they have played against Blackburn, Stoke, Preston, Wigan and Sunderland. I wonder if that makes them a bit more battle hardened compared to us after our games mostly against teams in lower leagues?
I notice that most teams have played stronger opposition than we have - many have played Premiership teams. I'm sure we've been tested strongly by Dartford & Welling though 🙄
We’re not really going to be able to implement a new style of play against premier league opponents. You need weaker opposition to be able to do that.
Only one way to find out who got it right though. We’ll have to find out next weekend. 👍
Yes we will. But none of our players have scored in the 180 minutes we have played against league sides in friendlies. Not very promising. Garner attacking fans who want us to go forward rather than backwards when we are losing is not a very smart way to start as manager. If we lose 2 or 3 games at the start he will find himself under big pressure very quickly.
One interesting stat from that chart above is that Accrington have played a lot stronger opposition than us in their pre-season friendlies.
Leaving aside Palace, they have played against Blackburn, Stoke, Preston, Wigan and Sunderland. I wonder if that makes them a bit more battle hardened compared to us after our games mostly against teams in lower leagues?
I notice that most teams have played stronger opposition than we have - many have played Premiership teams. I'm sure we've been tested strongly by Dartford & Welling though 🙄
If you want to give your defence a good work out just the job. Do you think that is what we needed to concentrate on this pre season?
One interesting stat from that chart above is that Accrington have played a lot stronger opposition than us in their pre-season friendlies.
Leaving aside Palace, they have played against Blackburn, Stoke, Preston, Wigan and Sunderland. I wonder if that makes them a bit more battle hardened compared to us after our games mostly against teams in lower leagues?
I notice that most teams have played stronger opposition than we have - many have played Premiership teams. I'm sure we've been tested strongly by Dartford & Welling though 🙄
If you want to give your defence a good work out just the job. Do you think that is what we needed to concentrate on this pre season?
It is relevant though, and not just the defence. It's not helpful having midfielders looking like world beating creative players against non league opposition, if they then struggle to break down better drilled and more talented EFL defences
One interesting stat from that chart above is that Accrington have played a lot stronger opposition than us in their pre-season friendlies.
Leaving aside Palace, they have played against Blackburn, Stoke, Preston, Wigan and Sunderland. I wonder if that makes them a bit more battle hardened compared to us after our games mostly against teams in lower leagues?
I notice that most teams have played stronger opposition than we have - many have played Premiership teams. I'm sure we've been tested strongly by Dartford & Welling though 🙄
If you want to give your defence a good work out just the job. Do you think that is what we needed to concentrate on this pre season?
It is relevant though, and not just the defence. It's not helpful having midfielders looking like world beating creative players against non league opposition, if they then struggle to break down better drilled and more talented EFL defences
There is no right or wrong way to do pre-season, else everyone would do it the same way.
Garner needs to be very, very careful with those sorts of comments, they will come back to haunt him if the results go badly.
Like it or not, English fans, especially at League One level, like to see their teams going forward and being aggressive in attack, they don’t really want to see aimless passing of the ball at the back.
We have seen this before with Karl Robinson, plenty of passing but mediocre results and very little penetration up front and sloppy goals conceded.
If we think back to the success under Bowyer it came when the team became more direct and looked for second balls off Taylor in the final third or hit Grant in the channels, we didn’t play possession football at all.
It was the same deal in the Powell promotion team, hit Yann and then play off him, we had a very physical team that basically bullied most of our opponents, the likes of Taylor, Morrison, Cort and Kermorgant were absolute battering rams in the final third.
Garner needs to be very, very careful with those sorts of comments, they will come back to haunt him if the results go badly.
Like it or not, English fans, especially at League One level, like to see their teams going forward and being aggressive in attack, they don’t really want to see aimless passing of the ball at the back.
We have seen this before with Karl Robinson, plenty of passing but mediocre results and very little penetration up front and sloppy goals conceded.
If we think back to the success under Bowyer it came when the team became more direct and looked for second balls off Taylor in the final third or hit Grant in the channels, we didn’t play possession football at all.
It was the same deal in the Powell promotion team, hit Yann and then play off him, we had a very physical team that basically bullied most of our opponents, the likes of Taylor, Morrison, Cort and Kermorgant were absolute battering rams in the final third.
I agree. We were direct with very talented players under Bowyer. We played good football, but I felt we swept forward and played with momentum. Garner’s approach may work, but you need bloody good footballers to pull it off.
Worst thing that happened to Bow was having to give an immediate reaction to Minto TV when he hadn't chance to tell his players when we played the behind closed doors games, think we all know he could be a tad volatile. If Garner has been a bit rude at his first game at The Valley then needs taking in hand by a competent and non egotistical CEO. Desperately need a behind closed doors game in the week with the intended starting 11 playing together, even if it's someone's U23s. McGrandles, Payne and O'Connell look like the best that have come in, though also think Lavelle is more likely to stay fit than Innis (rocket science) and has a bit of leadership about him, as does O'Connell.. Stockley alas doesn't.
Garner needs to be very, very careful with those sorts of comments, they will come back to haunt him if the results go badly.
Like it or not, English fans, especially at League One level, like to see their teams going forward and being aggressive in attack, they don’t really want to see aimless passing of the ball at the back.
We have seen this before with Karl Robinson, plenty of passing but mediocre results and very little penetration up front and sloppy goals conceded.
If we think back to the success under Bowyer it came when the team became more direct and looked for second balls off Taylor in the final third or hit Grant in the channels, we didn’t play possession football at all.
It was the same deal in the Powell promotion team, hit Yann and then play off him, we had a very physical team that basically bullied most of our opponents, the likes of Taylor, Morrison, Cort and Kermorgant were absolute battering rams in the final third.
I’m backing him all the way, as should the rest of the fanbase. We have a clear plan, a style we want to play. Either the club commits to it fully or we end up chasing individual results without a clear focus on the underlying strategy.
Playing more direct happened to work for us in one off seasons in 11/12 and 18/19, but guess what? We went up a level, struggled and got relegated back into the third tier again. Because there wasn’t a long term game plan.
We’re trying to be better than that.
Lastly I’ll repost this rebuttal of the typical, English “get it forward” / “plan B” type comments. Funnily enough, coming out of the mouth of Saturday’s opposition manager, Russell Martin.
Garner needs to be very, very careful with those sorts of comments, they will come back to haunt him if the results go badly.
Like it or not, English fans, especially at League One level, like to see their teams going forward and being aggressive in attack, they don’t really want to see aimless passing of the ball at the back.
We have seen this before with Karl Robinson, plenty of passing but mediocre results and very little penetration up front and sloppy goals conceded.
If we think back to the success under Bowyer it came when the team became more direct and looked for second balls off Taylor in the final third or hit Grant in the channels, we didn’t play possession football at all.
It was the same deal in the Powell promotion team, hit Yann and then play off him, we had a very physical team that basically bullied most of our opponents, the likes of Taylor, Morrison, Cort and Kermorgant were absolute battering rams in the final third.
I’m backing him all the way, as should the rest of the fanbase. We have a clear plan, a style we want to play. Either the club commits to it fully or we end up chasing individual results without a clear focus on the underlying strategy.
Playing more direct happened to work for us in one off seasons in 11/12 and 18/19, but guess what? We went up a level, struggled and got relegated back into the third tier again. Because there wasn’t a long term game plan.
We’re trying to be better than that.
Lastly I’ll repost this rebuttal of the typical, English “get it forward” / “plan B” type comments. Funnily enough, coming out of the mouth of Saturday’s opposition manager, Russell Martin.
It was lack of investment rather than playing style that stopped us staying at championship level. We did very well playing that way in 2012/13 but then the money ran out after that. 2018/19 I wouldn’t call us a direct team anyway but playing style was probably quite far down the list of reasons we went straight back down the year after. I’m not sure this style equates to more success in the championship, teams like Millwall prove that. It’s more about having a clear style and identity and recruiting towards that which it is good that we now have.
I am looking forward to watching hopefully better football this year and like the joined up approach to our recruitment now. Just a shame we didn’t start this earlier as it feels like we’ve wasted 2 years and now have players signed under 4 different managers with different styles in the squad meaning it will probably take at least another year to get all the right players in for us to be properly challenging for promotion
Thinking of starting a sweepstake in relation to how many goals we give away this season by faffing about at the back. Almost gifted Swansea three yesterday.
Quote from Swansea message board match thread. "Charlton playing really good possession stuff. They make the pitch wide with a winger and fullback on each touchline, really nice to watch and they create chances from it. If their centre forward wasn't tripping over his own feet they'd be in business."
I like Ben and think he will do well here,but I am surprised he called out a supporter for shouting his opinion.Having thousands of people watching and shouting abuse,advice or generally venting frustration is part of being a pro footballer, and if you start reacting(Roger Johnson ) you will be turned on if things go badly. The idea of playing around at the back is fine,as long as at some stage the ball is moved forward and an attack is formed,yesterday we did ok,but 2-3 times we slipped up and could easily have lost by 4 or 5 goals,you only have to start letting the odd goal in (ours came from a very good press)and things could turn ugly in the crowd.
I can't really recall any periods of play where we were just knocking it around without looking to go forward. If anything we made Swansea look ponderous in possession in the first half because we were pressing really effectively.
McGrandles was excellent and a big part of why we controlled a lot of the play in the first half I thought. Got stuck in when needed, good with the ball at his feet too. The most Cullen-like player we’ve had since, well, Cullen.
It’s only 45 minutes of football but if he continues like that, he’s in “first name on the team sheet” territory for me.
I likened him to Cullen when we signed him, he’s my early prediction for POTY.
One of those players that may not have as much technical ability but makes up for it with his work rate and good positioning.
"Charlton playing really good possession stuff. They make the pitch wide with a winger and fullback on each touchline, really nice to watch and they create chances from it. If their centre forward wasn't tripping over his own feet they'd be in business."
He must be wrong, we’re not pumping long and direct to Stockley all the time. That’s football isn’t it?
I can't really recall any periods of play where we were just knocking it around without looking to go forward. If anything we made Swansea look ponderous in possession in the first half because we were pressing really effectively.
Agree. We all want to see the ball moving forward…BUT sometimes there isn’t an opening or the player in possession is being closed down. Far better to pass back or sideways and retain possession to build again than give the ball away cheaply or play a hoof it forward risky shot.
I like Ben and think he will do well here,but I am surprised he called out a supporter for shouting his opinion.Having thousands of people watching and shouting abuse,advice or generally venting frustration is part of being a pro footballer, and if you start reacting(Roger Johnson ) you will be turned on if things go badly. The idea of playing around at the back is fine,as long as at some stage the ball is moved forward and an attack is formed,yesterday we did ok,but 2-3 times we slipped up and could easily have lost by 4 or 5 goals,you only have to start letting the odd goal in (ours came from a very good press)and things could turn ugly in the crowd.
If yesterday’s performance is repeated on a (competitive) matchday throughout the season then I suspect the occasional numpty shouting out something Isn’t going to matter or get noticed because the Valley will be rocking.
The RJ incident was completely different, there was a fraction of the effort and attitude we saw yesterday on display that day at Bury. RJ should have been giving his teammates some of that, not the Charlton fans.
I like Ben and think he will do well here,but I am surprised he called out a supporter for shouting his opinion.Having thousands of people watching and shouting abuse,advice or generally venting frustration is part of being a pro footballer, and if you start reacting(Roger Johnson ) you will be turned on if things go badly. The idea of playing around at the back is fine,as long as at some stage the ball is moved forward and an attack is formed,yesterday we did ok,but 2-3 times we slipped up and could easily have lost by 4 or 5 goals,you only have to start letting the odd goal in (ours came from a very good press)and things could turn ugly in the crowd.
It doesn’t have to be a part of football though. This was a pre-season friendly and some moron was getting upset and shouting about how he doesn’t understand football. Why shouldn’t that be commented on for what it is? Garner wasn’t abusive or impolite like Johnson was, he just told the bloke he was in for a long season. Personally I think that if you’re getting upset about what you’re seeing in a summer friendly match and can’t control yourself so much that you’re shouting at the manager then you’re fair game for absolutely everyone. I hope idiots like that who make it almost impossible to enjoy a game because there’s a constant shrill, negative whine next to your ear hate Garner enough to boycott to be honest
If we have the ball then the other team ain’t gonna score against us. To me that’s great, and it becomes greater provided we score against them and win the points.
Garner needs to be very, very careful with those sorts of comments, they will come back to haunt him if the results go badly.
Like it or not, English fans, especially at League One level, like to see their teams going forward and being aggressive in attack, they don’t really want to see aimless passing of the ball at the back.
We have seen this before with Karl Robinson, plenty of passing but mediocre results and very little penetration up front and sloppy goals conceded.
If we think back to the success under Bowyer it came when the team became more direct and looked for second balls off Taylor in the final third or hit Grant in the channels, we didn’t play possession football at all.
It was the same deal in the Powell promotion team, hit Yann and then play off him, we had a very physical team that basically bullied most of our opponents, the likes of Taylor, Morrison, Cort and Kermorgant were absolute battering rams in the final third.
I’m backing him all the way, as should the rest of the fanbase. We have a clear plan, a style we want to play. Either the club commits to it fully or we end up chasing individual results without a clear focus on the underlying strategy.
Playing more direct happened to work for us in one off seasons in 11/12 and 18/19, but guess what? We went up a level, struggled and got relegated back into the third tier again. Because there wasn’t a long term game plan.
We’re trying to be better than that.
Lastly I’ll repost this rebuttal of the typical, English “get it forward” / “plan B” type comments. Funnily enough, coming out of the mouth of Saturday’s opposition manager, Russell Martin.
Thinking of starting a sweepstake in relation to how many goals we give away this season by faffing about at the back. Almost gifted Swansea three yesterday.
It wasnt playing around at the back that lost us the game yesterday. It was the lack of a striker who can fit in with the way we play. You wouldn't play Jermaine Defoe up front on his own when your plan A is to launch it 6ft in the air just because he is at your club. You'd either change the way you play or change the player. We've changed the way we play but kept the same player. Madness.
Btw. If we had the right forward line (I'll include Leaburn in with Stockley for this) then we could have been 2 or 3 up by half time. We didnt & we werent. Yesterday was just same old same old. Dominate a team but dont score enough to put them out of sight. Saw it so many times last season.
Enjoyed the game and thought we played quite well and against a good opponent who improved after HT, need a bit more experience but hopefully that will come, good effort by the young lads.
Comments
I don’t know how we’ll do this season, but if you can be excited for it, what’s the point?
2 in 1 out I reckon (JFC) maybe Dobson let's see although I hope not.
If Dobson goes I suspect it will only be for a profit after last season.
Do you think that is what we needed to concentrate on this pre season?
Like it or not, English fans, especially at League One level, like to see their teams going forward and being aggressive in attack, they don’t really want to see aimless passing of the ball at the back.
We have seen this before with Karl Robinson, plenty of passing but mediocre results and very little penetration up front and sloppy goals conceded.
If we think back to the success under Bowyer it came when the team became more direct and looked for second balls off Taylor in the final third or hit Grant in the channels, we didn’t play possession football at all.
It was the same deal in the Powell promotion team, hit Yann and then play off him, we had a very physical team that basically bullied most of our opponents, the likes of Taylor, Morrison, Cort and Kermorgant were absolute battering rams in the final third.
I’m backing him all the way, as should the rest of the fanbase. We have a clear plan, a style we want to play. Either the club commits to it fully or we end up chasing individual results without a clear focus on the underlying strategy.
Playing more direct happened to work for us in one off seasons in 11/12 and 18/19, but guess what? We went up a level, struggled and got relegated back into the third tier again. Because there wasn’t a long term game plan.
We’re trying to be better than that.
Lastly
I’ll repost this rebuttal of the typical, English “get it forward” / “plan B” type comments. Funnily enough, coming out of the mouth of Saturday’s opposition manager, Russell Martin.
"Charlton playing really good possession stuff. They make the pitch wide with a winger and fullback on each touchline, really nice to watch and they create chances from it. If their centre forward wasn't tripping over his own feet they'd be in business."
The idea of playing around at the back is fine,as long as at some stage the ball is moved forward and an attack is formed,yesterday we did ok,but 2-3 times we slipped up and could easily have lost by 4 or 5 goals,you only have to start letting the odd goal in (ours came from a very good press)and things could turn ugly in the crowd.
Side note, found Russell Martin quite annoying yesterday. He went on about a corner they felt they should have had for about 10 minutes.
Wollacott
Clare
Inniss
O’Connell
Sessengon
McGrandles
Dobson
Fraser
CBT
Stockley
Kirk
To me that’s great, and it becomes greater provided we score against them and win the points.
Btw. If we had the right forward line (I'll include Leaburn in with Stockley for this) then we could have been 2 or 3 up by half time. We didnt & we werent. Yesterday was just same old same old. Dominate a team but dont score enough to put them out of sight. Saw it so many times last season.