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Dinosaurs and the bible
Comments
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What?cafcdave123 said:
I told the kids’ mum that pigs are Jewish and that pork scratchings were pig foreskins from their circumcision , and that’s why Jews don’t eat pork as pigs are also JewishHenry Irving said:As my Jewish uncle told me, it's OK to eat a pork chop as long as the pig was circumcised.1 -
It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.
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I love a pork chop. It’s no skin off my nose.Henry Irving said:As my Jewish uncle told me, it's OK to eat a pork chop as long as the pig was circumcised.0 -
Not only that. There are people who are extremely clever that believe. I worked for years with a physicist who was as you can imagine no slouch upstairs yet was a very active Christian. Always baffled me.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.
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Sorry, I am going slightly off piste. A few years back I got a call from my plastic surgeon. He said he'd had a late cancellation and had a free slot for my skin cancer operation on Christmas Eve, if I wanted it done a bit earlier than scheduled. I asked how come there was a cancellation and he said some people don't want an operation just before the Christian Festival. I said, well, it's no skin off my nose. Never one to be quick on the uptake regarding my sense of humour, he sounded confused and replied well, it is though isn't it?SuedeAdidas said:
I love a pork chop. It’s no skin off my nose.Henry Irving said:As my Jewish uncle told me, it's OK to eat a pork chop as long as the pig was circumcised.8 -
Nearly an accurate spelling of Vladimir Putincantersaddick said:Fear based cult2 -
Have recently had to undergo some empathy training because a colleague consumed a Big Mac meal while another colleague was fasting for some religious reason.3
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I'm an atheist too, however I find your opinions rather patronising. To suggest that a person cannot be both intelligent whilst also having a faith is nothing but ignorant.ShootersHillGuru said:
Not only that. There are people who are extremely clever that believe. I worked for years with a physicist who was as you can imagine no slouch upstairs yet was a very active Christian. Always baffled me.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.5 -
How is it ignorant? With all the evidence out there, it’s hard to believe that you could be intelligent yet still believe in any of that nonsense.4
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Not really. If someone is genuinely of the opinion that evolution, gravity, other scientific theories etc are accurate and valid then it truly doesn't matter whether they then also believe in any "higher being".JaShea99 said:How is it ignorant? With all the evidence out there, it’s hard to believe that you could be intelligent yet still believe in any of that nonsense.
To use the example of dinosaurs, and their extinction - some people would say asteroid hitting the planet was God's Will, some that it was pure chance. But both agree that it did happen, so are following the scientific evidence.
I personally can't thread that needle, but I wouldn't automatically assume those who can are ignorant - unlike the fundamentalist, creationist lunatic fringe, who very much are ignorant.1 - Sponsored links:
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Intelligence and common sense are two very different things.PopIcon said:
I'm an atheist too, however I find your opinions rather patronising. To suggest that a person cannot be both intelligent whilst also having a faith is nothing but ignorant.ShootersHillGuru said:
Not only that. There are people who are extremely clever that believe. I worked for years with a physicist who was as you can imagine no slouch upstairs yet was a very active Christian. Always baffled me.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.0 -
It's ignorant to pass judgment on someone's intelligence based on their faith. Those two things aren't mutually exclusive.JaShea99 said:How is it ignorant? With all the evidence out there, it’s hard to believe that you could be intelligent yet still believe in any of that nonsense.
I'm not going to waste a single more second on this. There is nothing to debate.
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And start war's over it.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.3 -
Who said it matters? As others have said, it just makes it hard to fathom. Just like someone highly intelligent believing in the tooth fairy. It’s a contradiction.thenewbie said:
Not really. If someone is genuinely of the opinion that evolution, gravity, other scientific theories etc are accurate and valid then it truly doesn't matter whether they then also believe in any "higher being".JaShea99 said:How is it ignorant? With all the evidence out there, it’s hard to believe that you could be intelligent yet still believe in any of that nonsense.
To use the example of dinosaurs, and their extinction - some people would say asteroid hitting the planet was God's Will, some that it was pure chance. But both agree that it did happen, so are following the scientific evidence.
I personally can't thread that needle, but I wouldn't automatically assume those who can are ignorant - unlike the fundamentalist, creationist lunatic fringe, who very much are ignorant.2 -
Oh ok, my mistake, you must be right then.PopIcon said:
It's ignorant to pass judgment on someone's intelligence based on their faith. Those two things aren't mutually exclusive.JaShea99 said:How is it ignorant? With all the evidence out there, it’s hard to believe that you could be intelligent yet still believe in any of that nonsense.
I'm not going to waste a single more second on this. There is nothing to debate.3 -
@ValleyOfTears throws a bone in and then runs. Troll or what? Chill everyone.3
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Well, it’s used as justification at least. Usually more to do with resource and territory.Redvaliant said:
And start war's over it.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.0 -
Other people's beliefs should be respected unless they hurt others. I don't like beliefs or even non beliefs imposed on or being used to oppress people. Jones' religion shouldn't matter to us one iota. And I'm sure it doesn't as what we are interested in is his managerial abilities.6
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Why? If a grown adult stated that they believed in Father Christmas and the Tooth Fairy, they would be ridiculed. Why should religious beliefs be sheltered from any form of scrutiny or scorn?MuttleyCAFC said:Other people's beliefs should be respected unless they hurt others. I don't like beliefs or even non beliefs imposed on or being used to oppress people. Jones' religion shouldn't matter to us one iota. And I'm sure it doesn't as what we are interested in is his managerial abilities.8 -
A lot of people believe in the existence or reality of love, but it only manifests in the observances of 'love'. Proof of the factual existence of love would be very hard, and disputed.0
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Why should we respect others beliefs? I agree it's usually best to respect other people, but why conflate people with their beliefs? I also think it's important that we should respect others rights to have their own beliefs, but if those beliefs aren't strong enough to stand up to examination or even ridicule, then those beliefs might not actually be as good as they are cracked up to be. I can think of no area of life other than religion where there's some sort of expectation that we should give people a free pass to believe any old nonsense* without at least having a discussion with them.MuttleyCAFC said:Other people's beliefs should be respected unless they hurt others. I don't like beliefs or even non beliefs imposed on or being used to oppress people. Jones' religion shouldn't matter to us one iota. And I'm sure it doesn't as what we are interested in is his managerial abilities.
*As long as that old nonsense comes from one of a handful of socially sanctioned religious cults.7 -
Also, the “it doesn’t affect anyone else” argument is almost always rubbish, because most of the time there are children involved who are then brainwashed and never get a chance to question the indoctrination they’ve been subjected to until it’s too late.5
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Did you read that in a pop up book?Redvaliant said:
And start war's over it.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.
Wars aren't fought by faiths, they are the indulgence of men. Faith isn't the issue, greed and power are.
WWII
Civil Wars - China's, Russian
WWI
Sino-Japanese Wars
Spanish Conquests of the Americas
More recently the war in the Ukraine.
The fighting in Israel is a land conflict.
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PopIcon said:
Did you read that in a pop up book?Redvaliant said:
And start war's over it.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.
Wars aren't fought by faiths, they are the indulgence of men. Faith isn't the issue, greed and power are.
WWII
Civil Wars - China's, Russian
WWI
Sino-Japanese Wars
Spanish Conquests of the Americas
More recently the war in the Ukraine.
The fighting in Israel is a land conflict.Crusades (11th-13th centuries): A series of religious wars initiated by Western European Christians to regain control of the Holy Land from Muslims.Thirty Years' War (1618-1648): Initially a conflict between Protestant and Catholic states in the Holy Roman Empire, it later evolved into a broader European war involving political and territorial disputes.French Wars of Religion (1562-1598): A series of conflicts between Catholics and Protestants in France, marked by massacres, assassinations, and sieges.Islamic conquests (7th-8th centuries): Military campaigns led by Islamic caliphs to spread Islam and conquer territories across the Middle East, North Africa, and parts of Europe.Reconquista (8th-15th centuries): A long period of military campaigns by Christian kingdoms in the Iberian Peninsula to reconquer territory from Muslim rule.Jewish-Roman Wars (1st and 2nd centuries): Revolts by Jewish communities against Roman rule, motivated partly by religious beliefs and resistance to Roman religious and cultural practices.Wars of the Reformation (16th century): Conflicts across Europe sparked by the Protestant Reformation, pitting Catholic and Protestant states against each other.Irish Confederate Wars (1641-1653): Conflicts in Ireland between Catholic Confederates and Protestant English and Scottish settlers, fueled by religious, political, and ethnic tensions.Bosnian War (1992-1995): Although primarily driven by ethnic and political factors, religious identity played a significant role in the conflict between Bosnian Muslims, Serbs, and Croats.Northern Crusades (12th-16th centuries): Military campaigns by Christian kingdoms and orders to conquer and convert pagan Baltic tribes in the Baltic region.3 -
And you haven't even mentioned the big one, The Taiping Rebellion, which caused 20 million deaths, was started by a bloke who claimed to be the brother of Jesus Christ and whose aim was to convert people to his particular brand of Christianity.Chizz said:PopIcon said:
Did you read that in a pop up book?Redvaliant said:
And start war's over it.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.
Wars aren't fought by faiths, they are the indulgence of men. Faith isn't the issue, greed and power are.
WWII
Civil Wars - China's, Russian
WWI
Sino-Japanese Wars
Spanish Conquests of the Americas
More recently the war in the Ukraine.
The fighting in Israel is a land conflict.Crusades (11th-13th centuries): A series of religious wars initiated by Western European Christians to regain control of the Holy Land from Muslims.Thirty Years' War (1618-1648): Initially a conflict between Protestant and Catholic states in the Holy Roman Empire, it later evolved into a broader European war involving political and territorial disputes.French Wars of Religion (1562-1598): A series of conflicts between Catholics and Protestants in France, marked by massacres, assassinations, and sieges.Islamic conquests (7th-8th centuries): Military campaigns led by Islamic caliphs to spread Islam and conquer territories across the Middle East, North Africa, and parts of Europe.Reconquista (8th-15th centuries): A long period of military campaigns by Christian kingdoms in the Iberian Peninsula to reconquer territory from Muslim rule.Jewish-Roman Wars (1st and 2nd centuries): Revolts by Jewish communities against Roman rule, motivated partly by religious beliefs and resistance to Roman religious and cultural practices.Wars of the Reformation (16th century): Conflicts across Europe sparked by the Protestant Reformation, pitting Catholic and Protestant states against each other.Irish Confederate Wars (1641-1653): Conflicts in Ireland between Catholic Confederates and Protestant English and Scottish settlers, fueled by religious, political, and ethnic tensions.Bosnian War (1992-1995): Although primarily driven by ethnic and political factors, religious identity played a significant role in the conflict between Bosnian Muslims, Serbs, and Croats.Northern Crusades (12th-16th centuries): Military campaigns by Christian kingdoms and orders to conquer and convert pagan Baltic tribes in the Baltic region.1 -
Whohh, hold on there pal.Rizzo said:
Why? If a grown adult stated that they believed in Father Christmas and the Tooth Fairy, they would be ridiculed.MuttleyCAFC said:Other people's beliefs should be respected unless they hurt others. I don't like beliefs or even non beliefs imposed on or being used to oppress people. Jones' religion shouldn't matter to us one iota. And I'm sure it doesn't as what we are interested in is his managerial abilities.11 -
…read that back to yourself. Largely land and territory.Chizz said:PopIcon said:
Did you read that in a pop up book?Redvaliant said:
And start war's over it.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.
Wars aren't fought by faiths, they are the indulgence of men. Faith isn't the issue, greed and power are.
WWII
Civil Wars - China's, Russian
WWI
Sino-Japanese Wars
Spanish Conquests of the Americas
More recently the war in the Ukraine.
The fighting in Israel is a land conflict.Crusades (11th-13th centuries): A series of religious wars initiated by Western European Christians to regain control of the Holy Land from Muslims.Thirty Years' War (1618-1648): Initially a conflict between Protestant and Catholic states in the Holy Roman Empire, it later evolved into a broader European war involving political and territorial disputes.French Wars of Religion (1562-1598): A series of conflicts between Catholics and Protestants in France, marked by massacres, assassinations, and sieges.Islamic conquests (7th-8th centuries): Military campaigns led by Islamic caliphs to spread Islam and conquer territories across the Middle East, North Africa, and parts of Europe.Reconquista (8th-15th centuries): A long period of military campaigns by Christian kingdoms in the Iberian Peninsula to reconquer territory from Muslim rule.Jewish-Roman Wars (1st and 2nd centuries): Revolts by Jewish communities against Roman rule, motivated partly by religious beliefs and resistance to Roman religious and cultural practices.Wars of the Reformation (16th century): Conflicts across Europe sparked by the Protestant Reformation, pitting Catholic and Protestant states against each other.Irish Confederate Wars (1641-1653): Conflicts in Ireland between Catholic Confederates and Protestant English and Scottish settlers, fueled by religious, political, and ethnic tensions.Bosnian War (1992-1995): Although primarily driven by ethnic and political factors, religious identity played a significant role in the conflict between Bosnian Muslims, Serbs, and Croats.Northern Crusades (12th-16th centuries): Military campaigns by Christian kingdoms and orders to conquer and convert pagan Baltic tribes in the Baltic region.3 -
It's widely accepted that Hong Xiuquan was mentally ill, having suffered from a nervous breakdown in his 20s.Stig said:
And you haven't even mentioned the big one, The Taiping Rebellion, which caused 20 million deaths, was started by a bloke who claimed to be the brother of Jesus Christ and whose aim was to convert people to his particular brand of Christianity.Chizz said:PopIcon said:
Did you read that in a pop up book?Redvaliant said:
And start war's over it.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.
Wars aren't fought by faiths, they are the indulgence of men. Faith isn't the issue, greed and power are.
WWII
Civil Wars - China's, Russian
WWI
Sino-Japanese Wars
Spanish Conquests of the Americas
More recently the war in the Ukraine.
The fighting in Israel is a land conflict.Crusades (11th-13th centuries): A series of religious wars initiated by Western European Christians to regain control of the Holy Land from Muslims.Thirty Years' War (1618-1648): Initially a conflict between Protestant and Catholic states in the Holy Roman Empire, it later evolved into a broader European war involving political and territorial disputes.French Wars of Religion (1562-1598): A series of conflicts between Catholics and Protestants in France, marked by massacres, assassinations, and sieges.Islamic conquests (7th-8th centuries): Military campaigns led by Islamic caliphs to spread Islam and conquer territories across the Middle East, North Africa, and parts of Europe.Reconquista (8th-15th centuries): A long period of military campaigns by Christian kingdoms in the Iberian Peninsula to reconquer territory from Muslim rule.Jewish-Roman Wars (1st and 2nd centuries): Revolts by Jewish communities against Roman rule, motivated partly by religious beliefs and resistance to Roman religious and cultural practices.Wars of the Reformation (16th century): Conflicts across Europe sparked by the Protestant Reformation, pitting Catholic and Protestant states against each other.Irish Confederate Wars (1641-1653): Conflicts in Ireland between Catholic Confederates and Protestant English and Scottish settlers, fueled by religious, political, and ethnic tensions.Bosnian War (1992-1995): Although primarily driven by ethnic and political factors, religious identity played a significant role in the conflict between Bosnian Muslims, Serbs, and Croats.Northern Crusades (12th-16th centuries): Military campaigns by Christian kingdoms and orders to conquer and convert pagan Baltic tribes in the Baltic region.
Some scholars have suggested this episode led to schizophrenia, his cult like uprising and ultimately his own death.
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Maybe I should have been clearer, people have a right to have their beliefs as long as they don't hurt others because of them. Of course history has shown that religions have caused much suffering. I do appreciate there is indocrination or you wouldn't find most muslim children becoming muslims in muslim countries and most christian children becoming christians in christian countries etc... But parents indoctrinate kids, it is unavoidable. I also think it is fine to challenge people's beliefs but not to attack or belittle them for them.
I always tried with my son to let him make up his own mind without influence. I told him that he has to work it out for himself and he decided he did not believe. But maybe the fact that he knew I didn't and that we are not a religious family in any way, may have influenced him. I was proud of him because I thought his common sense led him there. I am against religious indoctrination in schools.
I would probably describe myself as agnostic but am not one for labels. I believe there is a very small chance of a creator, but that creator, if he or she exists, is just as likely to be Roland Rat as the one described in the bible. We have to appreciate that there will always be things beyond our comprehension and despite us knowing so much more due to science, there will always be much more we don't know. We should always question and strive to know more but understand there is ultimately a limit to what we can know and not try to fill in the gaps.
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I have some sympathy for your point, but trying to make out the Israel-Palestine situation has nothing to do with religion is a stretch and a half.PopIcon said:
Did you read that in a pop up book?Redvaliant said:
And start war's over it.The Red Robin said:It will never not blow my mind that grown adults believe in any god or religion.
Wars aren't fought by faiths, they are the indulgence of men. Faith isn't the issue, greed and power are.
WWII
Civil Wars - China's, Russian
WWI
Sino-Japanese Wars
Spanish Conquests of the Americas
More recently the war in the Ukraine.
The fighting in Israel is a land conflict.5
