I said Karoy, Kanu, and TC weren't ready. Thought they all played their part, would like to see them play more consistently, but TC especially, was fantastic. Was causing Birmingham some issues, Kanu was tenacious and never gave up, Karoy, relentless.
I said Karoy, Kanu, and TC weren't ready. Thought they all played their part, would like to see them play more consistently, but TC especially, was fantastic. Was causing Birmingham some issues, Kanu was tenacious and never gave up, Karoy, relentless.
Well done lads.
They're all capable of impacting a game. The question is can they do it regularly enough.
Finally, my notes. A lot has already been added by other lifers who were there.
NB These are my notes from the night, I'm not saying I agree or disagree with the questions or answers. (my own views in italics)
Part 1,
Q: You (CM) said that any fool could reduce losses to £2m or even break even but we're still making big losses. We're the owners mis-sold?
CM Losses are £8 to £9m. average loss in this division is £4.5m. The EFL provide us with all the other teams budgets in October so we'll know for sure than but based on previous figures we're 4th in first team budget and 5th in wages. We need to outperform, not underperform on our budget, we need efficiency not just spend.
Revenue is up £2m and non-football spend down £2m EG selling twice as much beer, retail £600k to £1.2k, commercial profiled to go from £1.05 to £2.3m.
Fewer U21 players as were carrying too many who weren't going to make it but paying those that remain more so more likely to keep them, saving money but better spent. One of many "boring tricks" on how to cut costs and increase income learnt at Oxford and Sunderland. There is no one silver bullet rather 100 different small things.
Need to increase fanbase 1.2m people have us as their nearest club but for many reasons aren't coming. Core fanbase will be up and down linked to performance, new fans not so linked to performance, coming to see a game.
In Premier League era Charlton constantly outperformed their budget, "That's where we need to get to". "Didn't say we could get down to losing £2m but we have to become more sustainable and well run like Brighton and Brentford.
Gavin Carter (GC) The owners, other than maybe Charlie, can afford to lose (money), incredibly sophisticated and shrewd investors
CM: Was approached by a headhunter to broker a deal with some US billionaires but wanted me to put my own money in so would have "skin in the game".
Gabriel Brener (one of the three big, 23% owners) said that they wanted a club with a good academy, in or near London and with Potential to which CM said "That's Charlton". Said they want to build something, to add value.
When deal first feel thru in Feb 2023 CM said "well, you hired me to find you an English club and there are two others to look at but Brener said "No, it's Charlton, this deal will come back around".
Owners have fallen in love, can feel it and sense it. Ian Wallis told the meeting that when Warren Rosenfeld (another 23%er) had visited the museum he'd told him that "I started out as an investor, now I'm a fan". (Rosenfeld, his wife and friends were over for the Birmingham game)
CM said taking over was like "catching a falling knife, knew it would be a tough first season. We as a board now need to deliver.
CM knows the Valley is a special place and as an Oxford fan knows the problems of losing your ground to an asset stripper and playing in a three sided ground.
"It's a question of terms, never going to play away from the Valley"
Greenwich council are saying "over our dead body" will anyone be able to use the Valley for anything else so RD has to realise the ground is worthless other than as a football ground.
On the lease "We've got time, long term, reasonable lease but to start investing heavily in the valley we need to know where we are going to be. (negotiations) have started "It's ongoing but we're not in total control, it's a conversation".
The owners would love to own the Valley. It's an ongoing commercial discussion but it's not come to the sharp end yet. Not discussed a price. Negotitions will be handled by the owners are they are very used to making big capital investment deals, big hitters which shows the importance they see in the deal. (my view was they'd be happy with a longer lease or a purchase)
Q: Talked to RD? CM, yes, building a relationship with the landlord, spoken to Leiven de Turk (RD's pointman).
GC I'm optimistic on it, as a fan I get it.
We're building up relations with the council that were neglected. Paul Elliot crucial to this, working overtime as if he was a executive director with the council building relationship.
IW: Warren Rosenfeld was really interested in the Valley story, why we left etc. Museum gave him copy of Rick Everitt's "Battle for the Valley" to read.
GC: There is a three phase plan for developing the Valley. Currently only in stage one, safe standing, fan zone (LED floodlights to come I've also heard)
CM: This also applies to Sparrows Lane. The Valley is significant and the owners know that.
Q: Reports in Belgian press that ACA Football Academy are in trouble and not paying the bills of their Belgian club
CM I've read the same articles. One of the benefits of multiple ownership is that the risk is spread and if someone drops out there are others around. (he didn't really say much directly to the point on this)
Q: Does Nathan Jones still have the confidence of the board?
Not going to give him a vote of confidence as that usually happens before you sack someone but NJ understands the club, certain managers suit certain clubs and NJ fits Charlton. Totally behind him.
Q: 8 - 8 - 8, it is still a thing?
SCMP (what was called financial fair play) limits spending on the first team to 60% of revenues.
Currently this can be added to by injected cash as equity but that is going to be capped at £500k (presumably a season)
But SCMP only applies to players over 21, We currently have 9 academy players so the SCMP spend is spread over 16 rather than 24 players which means higher wages and fees on fewer players.
If you have 24 experienced, older players you have to spread your 60% of revenue more thinly.
Q: So do we have 8 elite players?
GC: It's not 8 at the moment but it's not a single window strategy
CM: Focus on the academy is a fundamental part of our squad building strategy which has been "spotty" over many years. Not going to say we've got recruitment right, we've not.
We spend double on our academy (£2m v £1m) compared to other league 1 clubs.
We're not aiming for more and more journeymen who cost more.
Q: Was watching Wrexham v Birmingham and Wrexham have Delta Airlines as a sponsor. Do we need that sort of sponsor.
CM Ryan Reynolds and Tom Brady have given their "brand" a resonance beyond the fan base, they have made them "interesting" to a wider audience in the North America. They have done league 1 a favour as it has given us a profile. Ryan Reynolds has said they bought Wrexham after watching Sunderland till I die" so they should thank me!. "Brand" isn't something to fear"
We're looking at something to make us more "interesting"
The cost controls coming in will be harsh; the two big factors in overcoming them will be income and your academy.
Birmingham's revenue is £28m, the crowd but also big commercial deals
Us, we hope to get to £13m
Q: Selling May, CBT and Dobbo
CBT: Agent said he's going now (January) or in the summer so they sold him.
May: Three things - Family wanted to move, clubs were offering him a lot more money, it was a football decision by Jones not by central management. Rather spend the £750k on others than pay more to May. Board do ask questions as to why on all transfer, what are the reasons, why do you need another centre half (example given was A Mitchel would cost us £250k a year so £3/4m over three years so they ask questions but don't make decision on which player other than is it in budget.
Jones asked if the £750k fee would go into his transfer budget and was told it was. We spent £1.3m in the summer. Ramsey cost £150k, Dixon £100k. (CM slipped these number in over the evening, I first I though maybe it as a mistake but by the third time I figured out it was deliberate).
Dobbo. Was big mates with him from Sunderland as two southerners up north, great guy, loves him. Story is already out there, we offered him an improved deal but he wanted more so he signed in Hungary but that fell through and he went to Wrexham
Football side (Scott and Jones) make football decisions but no transfer in or out happens without agreement from Jones. He has "absolute final say". Charlton fans saying that we want football people making football decisions, unlike previous regimes, and CM agrees and that is what is happening.
We currently have 27 first teamers which is too many, too many to actually get them all on the training pitch at the same time.
Partly this is because they are all fit for a change with no soft tissue/hamstring injuries - GC "Don't jinx it"
This is due partly to £400k spent on new training pitches and better medical care lead by Will Abbott. A doctor may not seem like an exciting signing but it might be one of the best.
Will look for some to go out in January to free up space for "targeted additions" (Potts and Hylton weren't mentioned but aren't both on short deals?)
We have invested in data science (sorry, he didn't say what package) and recruitment generally.
Some debate with a lifer about was it a "fact" that T Campbell, Anderson and Kanu aren't good enough which CM said was an opinion, not fact. Jones is the manager and a football person and if he thinks they are good enough that's good enough for him.
CM said young players have to play otherwise they will never develop and repeated that it is football people making football decisions as fans wanted (not Martin Sandgaard or Thomas Driesen)
CM said he'd been told similar about three young players (he named them but I've never heard of them) at Sunderland who fans said shouldn't be picked but all three are now playing at the top of the Championship. (slightly a moot point after the Birmingham game IMHO)
Q: Was watching Wrexham v Birmingham and Wrexham have Delta Airlines as a sponsor. Do we need that sort of sponsor.
CM Ryan Reynolds and Tom Brady have given their "brand" a resonance beyond the fan base, they have made them "interesting" to a wider audience in the North America. They have done league 1 a favour as it has given us a profile. Ryan Reynolds has said they bought Wrexham after watching Sunderland till I die" so they should thank me!. "Brand" isn't something to fear"
We're looking at something to make us more "interesting"
The cost controls coming in will be harsh; the two big factors in overcoming them will be income and your academy.
Birmingham's revenue is £28m, the crowd but also big commercial deals
Us, we hope to get to £13m
Q: Selling May, CBT and Dobbo
CBT: Agent said he's going now (January) or in the summer so they sold him.
May: Three things - Family wanted to move, clubs were offering him a lot more money, it was a football decision by Jones not by central management. Rather spend the £750k on others than pay more to May. Board do ask questions as to why on all transfer, what are the reasons, why do you need another centre half (example given was A Mitchel would cost us £250k a year so £3/4m over three years so they ask questions but don't make decision on which player other than is it in budget.
Jones asked if the £750k fee would go into his transfer budget and was told it was. We spent £1.3m in the summer. Ramsey cost £150k, Dixon £100k. (CM slipped these number in over the evening, I first I though maybe it as a mistake but by the third time I figured out it was deliberate).
Dobbo. Was big mates with him from Sunderland as two southerners up north, great guy, loves hom. Story is already out there, we offered him an improved deal but he wanted more so he signed in Hungary but that fell through and he went to Wrexham
Football side (Scott and Jones) make football decisions but no transfer in or out happens without agreement from Jones. He has "absolute final say". Charlton fans saying that we want football people making football decisions, unlike previous regimes, and CM agrees and that is what is happening.
We currently have 27 first teamer which is too many, too many to actually get them all on the training pitch at the same time.
Partly this is because they are all fit for a change with no soft tissue/hamstring injuries - GC "Don't jinx it"
This is due to £400k spent on new training pitches and better medical care lead by Will Abbott. A doctor may not seem like an exciting signing but it might be one of the best.
Will look for some to go out in January to free up space for "targeted additions" (Potts and Hylton weren't mentioned but aren't both on short deals?)
We have invested in data science (sorry, he didn't say what package and recruitment generally.
Some debate with a lifer about was a "fact" that T Campbell, Anderson and Kanu aren't good enough which CM said was an opinion, not fact. Jones is the manager and a football person and if he thinks they are good enough that's good enough for him.
CM said young players have to play otherwise they will never develop and repeated that it is football people making football decisions as fans wanted (not Martin Sandgaard or Thomas Driesen)
CM said he'd been told similar about three young players (he named them but I've never heard of them) at Sunderland who fans said shouldn't be picked but all three are now playing at the top of the Championship. (slightly a moot point after the Birmingham game IMHO)
Which to my point on another thread why the nonsense of ‘undisclosed ’ fees when all transfers seem to be a relatively open secret ?
There have been discussions but very notional "if we, WASPS, got into a league that warranted a big ground would you, Charlton, consider it?"
A long shot, unlikely in the short term. Long term if it helped secure our future it could be good but less likely.
Q: How important is going for Cat 1 status?
CM That's the best question of the night"
They are currently 26 Cat 1 academies and the EPL want fewer and are putting pressure on some EG Reading, to drop their Cat 1 status.
Charlton's academy is an outlier. Always 8th to 10th in the productivity rankings despite being Cat 2 so above 16 to 18 Cat 1 and above all the Cat 2 academies.
It has an impact on retaining young players. Compensation for a 15 year old goes from about £300k to £600k and that makes a difference to whether they poach the player or not.
They don't want more Cat 1 clubs. Would we benefit? Yes. Would we be admitted currently? No.
In the Championship the pressure on the EPL would he high to admit us. We aspire to Cat 1 and we want to embarrass them by getting in the top five in the rankings.
We're doubling down on our academy, investing more in it and projects like Mount Pleasant.
Q: Has the news of the Cardiff job had an impact on Jones and the players?
CM: NJ is honest and transparent, very hard working, never seen anything like it. Hasn't impacted on the players.
-------------
There was more, stuff I missed or have forgotten but that was what I felt were the key points in summary. We spoke about the Ex-Players Association and how that was about reconnecting with what we were as a club. They want to see other fans groups like Bromley Addicks (I'd say like but not as good but I don't want to be accused or tribalism) in other parts of Kent, CM mentioned Dartford and Folkstone as two areas. Dartford population wise as big as many towns with league clubs.
Both GC and CM enjoyed it and GC said to me that they got a lot out of it and felt it was good that the questions we're about strategic stuff and that obviously the people asking them knew their stuff.
As Afka has said, CM's body language doesn't hide when he thinks a question is badly worded or rambling and he seemed happy talking about the football industry in general where perhaps he can be less guarded than when focused on purely Charlton matters.
He was very positive and admitted to this being a long term project etc when IMHO I think he and his team have made errors and while I agree that things can't be expected to change overnight it has been 15 months.
I wonder how the mood might have been different, especially around recruitment and player sales if we'd had the meeting this week so after the Birmingham win.
Thanks to everyone who came along, about 85 of you.
Next meeting is 5 December with Dean Kiely and Steve Brown.
There have been discussions but very notional "if we, WASPS, got into a league that warranted a big ground would you, Charlton, consider it?"
A long shot, unlikely in the short term. Long term if it helped secure our future it could be good but less likely.
Q: How important is going for Cat 1 status?
CM That's the best question of the night"
They are currently 26 Cat 1 academies and the EPL want fewer and are putting pressure on some EG Reading, to drop their Cat 1 status.
Charlton's academy is an outlier. Always 8th to 10th in the productivity rankings despite being Cat 2 so above 16 to 18 Cat 1 and above all the Cat 2 academies.
It has an impact on retaining young players. Compensation for a 15 year old goes from about £300k to £600k and that makes a difference to whether they poach the player or not.
They don't want more Cat 1 clubs. Would we benefit? Yes. Would we be admitted currently? No.
In the Championship the pressure on the EPL would he high to admit us. We aspire to Cat 1 and we want to embarrass them by getting in the top five in the rankings.
We're doubling down on our academy, investing more in it and projects like Mount Pleasant.
Q: Has the news of the Cardiff job had an impact on Jones and the players?
CM: NJ is honest and transparent, very hard working, never seen anything like it. Hasn't impacted on the players.
-------------
There was more, stuff I missed or have forgotten but that was what I felt were the key points in summary. We spoke about the Ex-Players Association and how that was about reconnecting with what we were as a club. They want to see other fans groups like Bromley Addicks (I'd say like but not as good but I don't want to be accused or tribalism) in other parts of Kent, CM mentioned Dartford and Folkstone as two areas. Dartford population wise as big as many towns with league clubs.
Both GC and CM enjoyed it and GC said to me that they got a lot out of it and felt it was good that the questions we're about strategic stuff and that obviously the people asking them knew their stuff.
As Afka has said, CM's body language doesn't hide when he thinks a question is badly worded or rambling and he seemed happy talking about the football industry in general where perhaps he can be less guarded than when focused on purely Charlton matters.
He was very positive and admitted to this being a long term project etc when IMHO I think he and his team have made errors and while I agree that things can't be expected to change overnight it has been 15 months.
I wonder how the mood might have been different, especially around recruitment and player sales if we'd had the meeting this week so after the Birmingham win.
Thanks to everyone who came along, about 85 of you.
Next meeting is 5 December with Dean Kiely and Steve Brown.
Thanks for taking the time to post your notes, all very interesting.
We spent £1.3m in the summer. Ramsey cost £150k, Dixon £100k. (CM slipped these number in over the evening, I first I though maybe it as a mistake but by the third time I figured out it was deliberate).
Which to my point on another thread why the nonsense of ‘undisclosed ’ fees when all transfers seem to be a relatively open secret ?
One thing having it on the official site, another thing saying it to an "eccentric" fan group where it can be later denied
Comments
Let him contaminate one of his home town (Sheffield) clubs, or Chelsea.
Detestable man in my opinion.
Kelvin MacKenzie?
(A joke! Before anybody jumps down my throat! Even Jim Davidson has more credibility than MacKenzie!)
I said Karoy, Kanu, and TC weren't ready. Thought they all played their part, would like to see them play more consistently, but TC especially, was fantastic. Was causing Birmingham some issues, Kanu was tenacious and never gave up, Karoy, relentless.
Well done lads.
Ladies and Gentlemen I give you Karl Howman.
NB These are my notes from the night, I'm not saying I agree or disagree with the questions or answers. (my own views in italics)
Part 1,
Q: You (CM) said that any fool could reduce losses to £2m or even break even but we're still making big losses. We're the owners mis-sold?
CM Losses are £8 to £9m. average loss in this division is £4.5m. The EFL provide us with all the other teams budgets in October so we'll know for sure than but based on previous figures we're 4th in first team budget and 5th in wages. We need to outperform, not underperform on our budget, we need efficiency not just spend.
Revenue is up £2m and non-football spend down £2m EG selling twice as much beer, retail £600k to £1.2k, commercial profiled to go from £1.05 to £2.3m.
Fewer U21 players as were carrying too many who weren't going to make it but paying those that remain more so more likely to keep them, saving money but better spent. One of many "boring tricks" on how to cut costs and increase income learnt at Oxford and Sunderland. There is no one silver bullet rather 100 different small things.
Need to increase fanbase 1.2m people have us as their nearest club but for many reasons aren't coming. Core fanbase will be up and down linked to performance, new fans not so linked to performance, coming to see a game.
In Premier League era Charlton constantly outperformed their budget, "That's where we need to get to". "Didn't say we could get down to losing £2m but we have to become more sustainable and well run like Brighton and Brentford.
Gavin Carter (GC) The owners, other than maybe Charlie, can afford to lose (money), incredibly sophisticated and shrewd investors
Owners and why Charlton?
CM: Was approached by a headhunter to broker a deal with some US billionaires but wanted me to put my own money in so would have "skin in the game".
Gabriel Brener (one of the three big, 23% owners) said that they wanted a club with a good academy, in or near London and with Potential to which CM said "That's Charlton". Said they want to build something, to add value.
When deal first feel thru in Feb 2023 CM said "well, you hired me to find you an English club and there are two others to look at but Brener said "No, it's Charlton, this deal will come back around".
Owners have fallen in love, can feel it and sense it. Ian Wallis told the meeting that when Warren Rosenfeld (another 23%er) had visited the museum he'd told him that "I started out as an investor, now I'm a fan". (Rosenfeld, his wife and friends were over for the Birmingham game)
CM said taking over was like "catching a falling knife, knew it would be a tough first season. We as a board now need to deliver.
CM knows the Valley is a special place and as an Oxford fan knows the problems of losing your ground to an asset stripper and playing in a three sided ground.
"It's a question of terms, never going to play away from the Valley"
Greenwich council are saying "over our dead body" will anyone be able to use the Valley for anything else so RD has to realise the ground is worthless other than as a football ground.
On the lease "We've got time, long term, reasonable lease but to start investing heavily in the valley we need to know where we are going to be. (negotiations) have started "It's ongoing but we're not in total control, it's a conversation".
The owners would love to own the Valley. It's an ongoing commercial discussion but it's not come to the sharp end yet. Not discussed a price. Negotitions will be handled by the owners are they are very used to making big capital investment deals, big hitters which shows the importance they see in the deal.
(my view was they'd be happy with a longer lease or a purchase)
Q: Talked to RD? CM, yes, building a relationship with the landlord, spoken to Leiven de Turk (RD's pointman).
GC I'm optimistic on it, as a fan I get it.
We're building up relations with the council that were neglected. Paul Elliot crucial to this, working overtime as if he was a executive director with the council building relationship.
IW: Warren Rosenfeld was really interested in the Valley story, why we left etc. Museum gave him copy of Rick Everitt's "Battle for the Valley" to read.
GC: There is a three phase plan for developing the Valley. Currently only in stage one, safe standing, fan zone (LED floodlights to come I've also heard)
CM: This also applies to Sparrows Lane. The Valley is significant and the owners know that.
Q: Reports in Belgian press that ACA Football Academy are in trouble and not paying the bills of their Belgian club
CM I've read the same articles. One of the benefits of multiple ownership is that the risk is spread and if someone drops out there are others around. (he didn't really say much directly to the point on this)
Q: Does Nathan Jones still have the confidence of the board?
Not going to give him a vote of confidence as that usually happens before you sack someone but NJ understands the club, certain managers suit certain clubs and NJ fits Charlton. Totally behind him.
Q: 8 - 8 - 8, it is still a thing?
SCMP (what was called financial fair play) limits spending on the first team to 60% of revenues.
Currently this can be added to by injected cash as equity but that is going to be capped at £500k (presumably a season)
But SCMP only applies to players over 21, We currently have 9 academy players so the SCMP spend is spread over 16 rather than 24 players which means higher wages and fees on fewer players.
If you have 24 experienced, older players you have to spread your 60% of revenue more thinly.
Q: So do we have 8 elite players?
GC: It's not 8 at the moment but it's not a single window strategy
CM: Focus on the academy is a fundamental part of our squad building strategy which has been "spotty" over many years. Not going to say we've got recruitment right, we've not.
We spend double on our academy (£2m v £1m) compared to other league 1 clubs.
We're not aiming for more and more journeymen who cost more.
Q: Was watching Wrexham v Birmingham and Wrexham have Delta Airlines as a sponsor. Do we need that sort of sponsor.
CM Ryan Reynolds and Tom Brady have given their "brand" a resonance beyond the fan base, they have made them "interesting" to a wider audience in the North America. They have done league 1 a favour as it has given us a profile. Ryan Reynolds has said they bought Wrexham after watching Sunderland till I die" so they should thank me!. "Brand" isn't something to fear"
We're looking at something to make us more "interesting"
The cost controls coming in will be harsh; the two big factors in overcoming them will be income and your academy.
Birmingham's revenue is £28m, the crowd but also big commercial deals
Us, we hope to get to £13m
Q: Selling May, CBT and Dobbo
CBT: Agent said he's going now (January) or in the summer so they sold him.
May: Three things - Family wanted to move, clubs were offering him a lot more money, it was a football decision by Jones not by central management. Rather spend the £750k on others than pay more to May. Board do ask questions as to why on all transfer, what are the reasons, why do you need another centre half (example given was A Mitchel would cost us £250k a year so £3/4m over three years so they ask questions but don't make decision on which player other than is it in budget.
Jones asked if the £750k fee would go into his transfer budget and was told it was. We spent £1.3m in the summer. Ramsey cost £150k, Dixon £100k. (CM slipped these number in over the evening, I first I though maybe it as a mistake but by the third time I figured out it was deliberate).
Dobbo. Was big mates with him from Sunderland as two southerners up north, great guy, loves him. Story is already out there, we offered him an improved deal but he wanted more so he signed in Hungary but that fell through and he went to Wrexham
Football side (Scott and Jones) make football decisions but no transfer in or out happens without agreement from Jones. He has "absolute final say". Charlton fans saying that we want football people making football decisions, unlike previous regimes, and CM agrees and that is what is happening.
We currently have 27 first teamers which is too many, too many to actually get them all on the training pitch at the same time.
Partly this is because they are all fit for a change with no soft tissue/hamstring injuries - GC "Don't jinx it"
This is due partly to £400k spent on new training pitches and better medical care lead by Will Abbott. A doctor may not seem like an exciting signing but it might be one of the best.
Will look for some to go out in January to free up space for "targeted additions"
(Potts and Hylton weren't mentioned but aren't both on short deals?)
We have invested in data science (sorry, he didn't say what package) and recruitment generally.
Some debate with a lifer about was it a "fact" that T Campbell, Anderson and Kanu aren't good enough which CM said was an opinion, not fact. Jones is the manager and a football person and if he thinks they are good enough that's good enough for him.
CM said young players have to play otherwise they will never develop and repeated that it is football people making football decisions as fans wanted (not Martin Sandgaard or Thomas Driesen)
CM said he'd been told similar about three young players (he named them but I've never heard of them) at Sunderland who fans said shouldn't be picked but all three are now playing at the top of the Championship. (slightly a moot point after the Birmingham game IMHO)
Q: WASPS at the Valley?
There have been discussions but very notional "if we, WASPS, got into a league that warranted a big ground would you, Charlton, consider it?"
A long shot, unlikely in the short term. Long term if it helped secure our future it could be good but less likely.
Q: How important is going for Cat 1 status?
CM That's the best question of the night"
They are currently 26 Cat 1 academies and the EPL want fewer and are putting pressure on some EG Reading, to drop their Cat 1 status.
Charlton's academy is an outlier. Always 8th to 10th in the productivity rankings despite being Cat 2 so above 16 to 18 Cat 1 and above all the Cat 2 academies.
It has an impact on retaining young players. Compensation for a 15 year old goes from about £300k to £600k and that makes a difference to whether they poach the player or not.
They don't want more Cat 1 clubs. Would we benefit? Yes. Would we be admitted currently? No.
In the Championship the pressure on the EPL would he high to admit us. We aspire to Cat 1 and we want to embarrass them by getting in the top five in the rankings.
We're doubling down on our academy, investing more in it and projects like Mount Pleasant.
Q: Has the news of the Cardiff job had an impact on Jones and the players?
CM: NJ is honest and transparent, very hard working, never seen anything like it. Hasn't impacted on the players.
-------------
There was more, stuff I missed or have forgotten but that was what I felt were the key points in summary. We spoke about the Ex-Players Association and how that was about reconnecting with what we were as a club. They want to see other fans groups like Bromley Addicks (I'd say like but not as good but I don't want to be accused or tribalism) in other parts of Kent, CM mentioned Dartford and Folkstone as two areas. Dartford population wise as big as many towns with league clubs.
Both GC and CM enjoyed it and GC said to me that they got a lot out of it and felt it was good that the questions we're about strategic stuff and that obviously the people asking them knew their stuff.
As Afka has said, CM's body language doesn't hide when he thinks a question is badly worded or rambling and he seemed happy talking about the football industry in general where perhaps he can be less guarded than when focused on purely Charlton matters.
He was very positive and admitted to this being a long term project etc when IMHO I think he and his team have made errors and while I agree that things can't be expected to change overnight it has been 15 months.
I wonder how the mood might have been different, especially around recruitment and player sales if we'd had the meeting this week so after the Birmingham win.
Thanks to everyone who came along, about 85 of you.
Next meeting is 5 December with Dean Kiely and Steve Brown.