Attention: Please take a moment to consider our terms and conditions before posting.
POST-MATCH THREAD: Charlton Athletic vs Derby County | Saturday 6th August 2022 @ 3pm
Comments
-
Well I enjoyed the game£150 on 2 kits in the shop, £60 on 3 prime tickets for me and the kids and a streaky 1-0 win
I do get certain peoples agendas but really who cares whether there were 10k, 14k or 17k the crowd in the second half were fantastic and got us the points
Way way too much negativity23 -
seth plum said:I don't boo anyway, but at half time I felt relief more than annoyance, holding onto hope that it would get better.
I don't know what anyone might've been booing at, the game wasn't lost at half time was it?
I booed the Mrs at half-time the other day. It had the desired effect as second half she really put in a shift and I was much happier with her peformamce.
Afterwards I asked if she'd like to do the tunnel jump and she politely declined. She asked if I'd like to have a go and I sheepishly turned the lights out.5 -
Wholly agree. In fact it would be good for booing to be saved exclusively as a post-match thing this season if used at all. If the team are playing badly we have a great opportunity to improve the game with our support (there is a clue in the word "supporter"!) Inniss made this point very clear in his interview on CTV on Saturdays pre-match show. I fully believe Garner when he says his team is going to give everything to win every match at the valley this season. We as supporters should be 100% doing the same. If not ~ stay at home.FishCostaFortune said:Second game of the season. New manager. New players. Completely new ethos and style of play. Playing a strong side who have come down from the championship who have clearly have a larger budget than us.
And some fans are booing at the first opportunity they get.I personally just don’t understand why you would have that reaction.
I don’t want the valley to turn into a place where if our players have an off day, or are outplayed for a half (which will happen) they get boo’d.1 -
I thought Derby played the football we are trying to. We got back into it when we mixed it up more. I was told our XG was higher than theirs.0
-
Fair comment I'd agree. They were having relentless success with long balls out to either winger though. Even when we got to the long ball first we were heading it off the pitch so they had a throw in our territory.MuttleyCAFC said:I thought Derby played the football we are trying to. We got back into it when we mixed it up more. I was told our XG was higher than theirs.2 -
Some people booing because we a have a small number of fans who are over entitled pricks.1
-
Interesting about the xG stats. Perhaps I was over analysing due to the idea of 'Garnerball' but first half I felt we were playing the percentage ball but with poor execution and it was all too predictable. Until the enforced change we were far too powder puff in midfield.
Second half we showed much more bite in midfield and mixed up the play better. More energy went into the press too which was effective. It was pretty hot on Saturday but in normal conditions and with fitness work, I hope that energy level can be maintained for the full 90 plus minutes as it will put teams on the back foot.
0 -
If there is such a thing as Garnerball, there seems less room for Dobson in it. Seeing as he is our best player, we do need something in between as we can't afford not to play our best player IMO. I think he made a massive difference on Saturday. He is an annoying little bastard when he plays against you which is terrific and what we need.2
-
I was in CE Upper, and there was loads of booing at half time. Impossible to miss. Wasn't happy about it at all. Talk about fans showing patience and the new system and new players bed in! Lol.DOUCHER said:i didn't hear any booing at half time - don't get me wrong, the first half was really bad but the crowd was good and the atmosphere was very good all second half
Overall I thought it was a match that'll live in the memory. Had we not turned around the performance at half time (and yes, there were signs of improvement six or seven minutes before HT), I think we'd be in meltdown here, post match. Instead we're looking at a solid four points from our first two games, something you'd have taken with both hands when the fixtures were published.
Wallacott was excellent, but it would have taken a poor keeper to have allowed us to go in 3-0 down at half time, as some suggested we should have done. Match stats say Derby only had two shots on target all match, although they should have at least tested Jojo with the free header in the second half, and Collins should have scored when he hit the post in the first.
In the first half hour Derby looked head and shoulders above us, both in terms of ability and tactics. We were unable to get hang on to the ball with our entire midfield seemingly going missing, with the wide men barely got a touch. My mate and I were saying how much we needed the Dobson of last season, and much as you don't want to see a player injured it was good to see Dobson joining the fray in the 31st minute. He gradually started to get involved, breaking up play, and moving the ball effectively. And what a relief it was to see him back to something like his form of last season after underperforming slightly in the pre season friendlies.
I was wondering if Derby might start getting nervous after failing to turn their early dominance in to goals, and when Kirk and CBT started to get involved there were the first signs that it might not all be one way traffic. Stockley will be kicking himself for missing what looked like a straight forward chance, but replays showed it was a flying header, not quite as simple a chance as it first appeared, and Wildsmith pulled off the save of the match to keep it out. Even so, we couldn't have complained had we gone in behind at half time.
The second half was an entirely different matter, with a hugely improved performance both from the team and the fans. It was great to hear 'The reds are going up' sung at full volume again!
The entire team played on a much higher level in the second half, and showed much more self belief. Inniss won everything in the air as Derby started to throw in long balls to the front men because we were pressing them well (despite the heat). Even O'Connell improved after a very poor first half. His weak header back to Wallacott that was intercepted by Collins reminded me of two that Pearcy did in previous seasons, both of which led to goals - when the ball is heading away from you it's very hard to get any meaningful contact on it with your head, particularly when you're nowhere near the keeper! [Edit: Just noticed that (ironically) ITV mis-identified O'Connell as Jason Pearce!]
Clare, although he made a few mistakes, was imperious at times. He can be a great player for us. CBT looked a real threat and put in another great cross, which Stockley headed straight at the keeper, albeit under pressure from a defender.
Kirk is beginning to show why we bought him. Sessegnon is a class act and Morgan had a very good second half, showing the sort of form we always hoped he might, but seldom does. More of the same and he'll have maybe cemented his place in the starting line up.
Fraser was slightly disappointing, showing a tendency to get caught in possession, but perhaps that will improve with games. However, having seen a bit more of Payne I can see the latter starting in Fraser's place. What a player he looks like. Absolute nightmare to play against, a real in yer face pocket rocket. Haven't we been crying out for a player like that for years? I can see him starting, and being a massive player for us (despite his diminutive size).
Dobson was excellent, and needs to start, no matter who we are playing. He's not just a ball winner. He can play a bit too!
Garner's use of subs was spot on. Lots of fresh legs were required due to the heat - I hadn't realised how hot it was until walking to the station after the game!
Overall I loved that match in the way that it was such a roller coaster ride. Initial hope and expectation overtaken by despair at the poor start, glimpses of hope, the thrill of a much closer contest, the pride as we began to dominate, and the joy at the goal - followed by relief at the final whistle.
Up the Addicks!
11 -
I think too many people are making too much of GarnerBall. We aren't going to suddenly try and play like Spain did. We will pass the ball more than 5 yards and over head hight at times, believe it or not. We will even cross it in the air 🤪MuttleyCAFC said:If there is such a thing as Garnerball, there seems less room for Dobson in it. Seeing as he is our best player, we do need something in between as we can't afford not to play our best player IMO. I think he made a massive difference on Saturday. He is an annoying little bastard when he plays against you which is terrific and what we need.1 - Sponsored links:
-
I like that Dobson could be dropped, even if it turned out to be the wrong decision. He played poorly at Accrington, lost his place to another midfielder, and then was able to come on and be determined to prove his point to the manager. That's the beauty of competition, something we haven't had in years.23
-
I like the fact that each of our midfielders has a slightly different style and capability. I think choosing the right combination to start / come off the bench against different types of opposition will be key this season.
If he's fit, I'd be tempted to start Payne against Wednesday and just put him on Bannan.2 -
Man City had Fernandinho in their best sides. Steel is essential and , as I have said before , it’s not like Dobson can’t pass at all. We are not that good that we don’t need a holding playerMuttleyCAFC said:If there is such a thing as Garnerball, there seems less room for Dobson in it. Seeing as he is our best player, we do need something in between as we can't afford not to play our best player IMO. I think he made a massive difference on Saturday. He is an annoying little bastard when he plays against you which is terrific and what we need.3 -
Dobson is a decent passer, but his true ability is in reading play, tackling and breaking the oppositions attacks down. He also transforms our 4-3-3 into a 5-2-3 when defending which can be both a positive and a negative.0
-
2 -
3 points by any means you take every day of the week and long may it continue but a side with better finishing in front of goal will punish that defence and you won’t be able to get your keeper to have a blinder every game.
3 -
In the first half we played a lot of straight low balls from defence intended to be received by a player with their back to goal.
The Derby players frequently went round the intended recipients and got to the ball first. Hence an advanced turnover.
I thought the players supposed to be receiving those passes were a bit slack and casual.
I also think this is an area of play well within our compass to improve on.0 -
We won’t play as poorly as we did in the first half every week.shirty5 said:3 points by any means you take every day of the week and long may it continue but a side with better finishing in front of goal will punish that defence and you won’t be able to get your keeper to have a blinder every game.2 -
Every week, don’t be daft. But we will get done sooner rather than later. Look at the sitter in the second half from Knight?Scoham said:
We won’t play as poorly as we did in the first half every week.shirty5 said:3 points by any means you take every day of the week and long may it continue but a side with better finishing in front of goal will punish that defence and you won’t be able to get your keeper to have a blinder every game.
Not been a goal down yet. What will the reaction be to that?1 -
Maybe, it’s also possible we improve defensively. We need to find our best midfield three and I’m expecting a centre back to sign as we only have three seniors players in that position.shirty5 said:
Every week, don’t be daft. But we will get done sooner rather than later. Look at the sitter in the second half from Knight?Scoham said:
We won’t play as poorly as we did in the first half every week.shirty5 said:3 points by any means you take every day of the week and long may it continue but a side with better finishing in front of goal will punish that defence and you won’t be able to get your keeper to have a blinder every game.
Not been a goal down yet. What will the reaction be to that?
We’ll have to wait and see. We’ve scored three well worked goals, I don’t think goalscoring will be as big an issue as some fear.
0 - Sponsored links:
-
We won’t play many sides like Derby who play the same style of game like us. Be more up the jumper from many teams and it’s how we deal with that. That point at Accrington as the season goes on could be looked us a good one.Scoham said:
Maybe, it’s also possible we improve defensively. We need to find our best midfield three and I’m expecting a centre back to sign as we only have three seniors players in that position.shirty5 said:
Every week, don’t be daft. But we will get done sooner rather than later. Look at the sitter in the second half from Knight?Scoham said:
We won’t play as poorly as we did in the first half every week.shirty5 said:3 points by any means you take every day of the week and long may it continue but a side with better finishing in front of goal will punish that defence and you won’t be able to get your keeper to have a blinder every game.
Not been a goal down yet. What will the reaction be to that?
We’ll have to wait and see. We’ve scored three well worked goals, I don’t think goalscoring will be as big an issue as some fear.0 -
Wollacott: excellent, but for him it was all over after 25 minutes - he deserves a bonus equal to the wages due back from the wasters and shirkers below
Clare: decent overall
Inniss: useful aerially in both boxes, terrifying with the ball at his feet, couple of decent intervention/tackles, jarred his back/hip after a jump for a routine header, if he plays Tuesday I'll be astonished, lining up for a spell with the physio already
O'Connell: made Inniss look like Bobby Moore, no pace, no distribution, doesn't read the game, doesn't seem to recognise his colleagues wear the same colour kit as himself, If Garner prefers this donkey over Lavelle and Deji, he's inept or they're seriously injured
Sessegnon: Coped well with the utter crud surrounding him, good job too cos Mendez-Laing looked useful, first half at least - Steve's clearly not a left back but we've Hobson's choice atm
Morgan: All energy, commitment and wastefulness first half a very very Albie performance, much better 2nd half, aided in no small part by the dismal McG replaced by Dobbo
McGrandles: terrible, weak, inept, careless - Liam Rosenior needs to be all over McG's "concussion" replacement cos he played like he'd just done 5 rounds with Tyson Fury, if Garner chooses him over Dobbo again, either Dobbo is screwing Mrs G and pissing on G's cornflakes OR Garner's a moron
Fraser: a few nice faints, swerves and a couple of useful looking passes but he's slow and when the going gets a bit grown up Fraser goes missing, looks like a luxury we're nowhere near able to afford, needs to man up big time and put in something like a shift
Blackett-Taylor: no service first half but his simple combination of pace and forward movement was too much for Derby 2nd half, should be useful against most of the dross in this division, hopefully he was just knackered Saturday and a few more games will up his fitness
Stockley: barely any service at all, useful aerially in both boxes, he's clearly making the effort to fit in to Garnerballs which ain't really his bag, is it?
Kirk: 1st half was the most shameful shirking I've witnessed in 35+ years of watching professional football, this prick knows he's in the shop window and does that on Saturday, his agent or someone must have had a word at HT cos he looked halfway to giving a toss, for 20 minutes or so and with some useful output too. He was soon looking to come off tho when it got a bit warm and Derby's frustrations began to show
Dobson: does Garner hate him? is Garner a cretin? has Dobbo done something terrible to Garner? 1st name on the teamsheet by a distance that.is.all
Referee: bang average 3rd division tosser, woefully inconsistent, fortunately to no major detriment for either side
Leaburn: coping well so far with the ludicrous expectations on a 17 year old, looks to have plenty of ability
Payne: lively and intelligent enough for what we needed for those 5 or 6 minutes
DJ: better than Kirk 🙄
Realistically if any Derby player had brought his shooting boots, it was all over inside 25 minutes, Collins their worst offender. If Wollacott had been 5% off his game it would've been just as bad. The gulf in class and attitude was like our 2nd half at Dartford in the friendly when the Darts had half a team of teenage triallists and we had Chuks in the mood, and sort of fit FFS but enough about his fragility.
I hope, not believe, that was an aberration by manager and players alike. We'll see.
This "high press" is a myth, the back 4 jog up and start with a high line but no other bugger went looking to press the rams before we had gone ahead.
Pissing around with it at the back with donkeys like Inniss and O'Connell is some twisted sort of self-harm
Many thanks to Derby for showing up and so casually wasting the best chance they'll have all season to wrap up a game in 35 minutes. Their resources must be pretty thin with only using half the subs at their disposal.6 -
Miles is 18 and will be 19 in November.0
-
I'd hazard a guess you were one of those booing at half time!Billy_Mix said:Wollacott: excellent, but for him it was all over after 25 minutes - he deserves a bonus equal to the wages due back from the wasters and shirkers below
Clare: decent overall
Inniss: useful aerially in both boxes, terrifying with the ball at his feet, couple of decent intervention/tackles, jarred his back/hip after a jump for a routine header, if he plays Tuesday I'll be astonished, lining up for a spell with the physio already
O'Connell: made Inniss look like Bobby Moore, no pace, no distribution, doesn't read the game, doesn't seem to recognise his colleagues wear the same colour kit as himself, If Garner prefers this donkey over Lavelle and Deji, he's inept or they're seriously injured
Sessegnon: Coped well with the utter crud surrounding him, good job too cos Mendez-Laing looked useful, first half at least - Steve's clearly not a left back but we've Hobson's choice atm
Morgan: All energy, commitment and wastefulness first half a very very Albie performance, much better 2nd half, aided in no small part by the dismal McG replaced by Dobbo
McGrandles: terrible, weak, inept, careless - Liam Rosenior needs to be all over McG's "concussion" replacement cos he played like he'd just done 5 rounds with Tyson Fury, if Garner chooses him over Dobbo again, either Dobbo is screwing Mrs G and pissing on G's cornflakes OR Garner's a moron
Fraser: a few nice faints, swerves and a couple of useful looking passes but he's slow and when the going gets a bit grown up Fraser goes missing, looks like a luxury we're nowhere near able to afford, needs to man up big time and put in something like a shift
Blackett-Taylor: no service first half but his simple combination of pace and forward movement was too much for Derby 2nd half, should be useful against most of the dross in this division, hopefully he was just knackered Saturday and a few more games will up his fitness
Stockley: barely any service at all, useful aerially in both boxes, he's clearly making the effort to fit in to Garnerballs which ain't really his bag, is it?
Kirk: 1st half was the most shameful shirking I've witnessed in 35+ years of watching professional football, this prick knows he's in the shop window and does that on Saturday, his agent or someone must have had a word at HT cos he looked halfway to giving a toss, for 20 minutes or so and with some useful output too. He was soon looking to come off tho when it got a bit warm and Derby's frustrations began to show
Dobson: does Garner hate him? is Garner a cretin? has Dobbo done something terrible to Garner? 1st name on the teamsheet by a distance that.is.all
Referee: bang average 3rd division tosser, woefully inconsistent, fortunately to no major detriment for either side
Leaburn: coping well so far with the ludicrous expectations on a 17 year old, looks to have plenty of ability
Payne: lively and intelligent enough for what we needed for those 5 or 6 minutes
DJ: better than Kirk 🙄
Realistically if any Derby player had brought his shooting boots, it was all over inside 25 minutes, Collins their worst offender. If Wollacott had been 5% off his game it would've been just as bad. The gulf in class and attitude was like our 2nd half at Dartford in the friendly when the Darts had half a team of teenage triallists and we had Chuks in the mood, and sort of fit FFS but enough about his fragility.
I hope, not believe, that was an aberration by manager and players alike. We'll see.
This "high press" is a myth, the back 4 jog up and start with a high line but no other bugger went looking to press the rams before we had gone ahead.
Pissing around with it at the back with donkeys like Inniss and O'Connell is some twisted sort of self-harm
Many thanks to Derby for showing up and so casually wasting the best chance they'll have all season to wrap up a game in 35 minutes. Their resources must be pretty thin with only using half the subs at their disposal.6 -
Scoham said:
Maybe, it’s also possible we improve defensively. We need to find our best midfield three and I’m expecting a centre back to sign as we only have three seniors players in that position.shirty5 said:
Every week, don’t be daft. But we will get done sooner rather than later. Look at the sitter in the second half from Knight?Scoham said:
We won’t play as poorly as we did in the first half every week.shirty5 said:3 points by any means you take every day of the week and long may it continue but a side with better finishing in front of goal will punish that defence and you won’t be able to get your keeper to have a blinder every game.
Not been a goal down yet. What will the reaction be to that?
We’ll have to wait and see. We’ve scored three well worked goals, I don’t think goalscoring will be as big an issue as some fear.
Keeping the goals out is my worry as we have rode our luck in both games and have the worst xg against stat in the league by some margin after 2 games with 3.8. Second on that list is Peterborough with 3.1 followed by Burton on 2.9.
0 -
My son's wedding went very well. Thank you for asking.
Managed to sneak into The Tankard in Walworth High street for a pint of Guinness and to catch up on the match thread during the endless bloody photo shoot but unfortunately was spotted by guests walking to the reception.
5 -
I don't hate the XG stat but how on earth do Derby have a xg of 1.4?Chunes said:
Absolute sitter in the second half, along with 2/3 in the first!0 -
It also begs the question of when the xG for a chance is measured. The Albie shot would have had a moderate xG, but the rebound then became a high xG open goal!cafcsinger said:
I don't hate the XG stat but how on earth do Derby have a xg of 1.4?Chunes said:
Absolute sitter in the second half, along with 2/3 in the first!1 -
The 'absolute sitter' looks to have been assigned 0.15 - 0.2 xG, a bit more than Jayden's header that was from a similar distance late in the first half (Jayden received 0.1-0.15 xG). I suspect that's probably because it was a headed opportunity, which historically is a lower quality chance compared to other shots. If the Derby player had taken a shot with his foot from the same position, I'm guessing it'd be closer to 0.4.cafcsinger said:
I don't hate the XG stat but how on earth do Derby have a xg of 1.4?Chunes said:
Absolute sitter in the second half, along with 2/3 in the first!
The two standout chances in the first half are both shots from the boot of James Collins. His first shot was assigned around 0.3 - 0.35 xG and the second shot right on half time was given around 0.4 xG. There was another impressive reflex save made by Wollacott but it didn't come from a shot so isn't included in the shots stats, or the xG stats. (Derby had only two shots on target, in the 8th minute and the 19th minute. But Wollacott made three "saves" including the reflex palm away.)
According to this model, CBT had the best chance of the entire match. Near enough 0.5 xG with an open goal. This perhaps shows the limitation of making xG work with limited data in League One because I'd suggest that that was a better than 50/50 chance.2 -
I don't know how this guy calculates his xG to be honest.3
