Hodgson is a decent manager on one level, but he is also a complete loon! He ought to refund you and other England fans for his folly. I think getting to the semi might be harder now, but we do now avoid the best team in the competition (Spain), until the final. If we get that far of course. We can beat all the teams on our side of the draw with a fair wind! I'm hoping the old motto apllies to Woy - If you can't be good, be lucky! There is definitely enough talent in the squad to compensate for his silly moments.
Yeah, good point. England supporters have paid a lot of money to be at the match tonight. The Trade Descriptions Act 1968 is an Act of the Parliament of the United Kingdom which prevents manufacturers, retailers or service industry providers from misleading consumers as to what they are spending their money on. Hodgsons selection means the FA have mislead. Six changes? Mind you, 1968 was pre-Thatcher, but two years before, England had won the World Cup. In those days, we had real footballers.
Stat from MOTD: we had 29 shots during the game (13 blocked), the most in a Euro game since 1980.
well that is baffling because the distinctly dodgy Viktoria Plzen keeper will have had more fraught evenings at Pribram in front of 2,000 cynical farm- workers.
That was dire. Players who cannot trap the ball with one touch, players who cannot lift a corner kick above the first defender, players who cannot make a simple pass that doesn't make their team-mate backtrack to collect it.
But then I think, hang on, Wales must have been doing all these things Ok tonight.
So what is it? Maybe when you strip away the foreign stars in our FAPL clubs, our players are shown to be lacking in technical skills? or, they just can't be arsed, it's only England?
I don't know. What I do know is, that was utter shite. I was embarassed to be an England supporter in a Czech pub tonight.
Only reading through the thread now, baffled by the Henderson criticism. Created our best chances (Vardy, Clyne, Kane) and was our one midfielder so far who has got into dangerous positions in the box and moved the ball a bit quicker. Made himself undroppable for me especially as Alli was wank again.
Stat from MOTD: we had 29 shots during the game (13 blocked), the most in a Euro game since 1980.
Unfortunately I dont take that as a positive. To have more shots than any other team in 36 years, and walk away at 0-0? Thats dire.
I watched most of the match, albeit drinking, but the best bit of the night was chasing tail in the smoking area of the pub after full time... Poor match as far as I'm concerned.
Second to Wales? 1-1 to a Russia that Wales destroyed tonight? Not good enough, I don't care about squad rotation either: you play your best 11 in every match, tournaments included.
Stat from MOTD: we had 29 shots during the game (13 blocked), the most in a Euro game since 1980.
well that is baffling because the distinctly dodgy Viktoria Plzen keeper will have had more fraught evenings at Pribram in front of 2,000 cynical farm- workers.
That was dire. Players who cannot trap the ball with one touch, players who cannot lift a corner kick above the first defender, players who cannot make a simple pass that doesn't make their team-mate backtrack to collect it.
But then I think, hang on, Wales must have been doing all these things Ok tonight.
So what is it? Maybe when you strip away the foreign stars in our FAPL clubs, our players are shown to be lacking in technical skills? or, they just can't be arsed, it's only England?
I don't know. What I do know is, that was utter shite. I was embarassed to be an England supporter in a Czech pub tonight.
Leave off!
That's been our excuse for the last 15 years. We've moved on from that.
You could argue so far so good. Not perfect, but OK. With 16 out of 24 qualifying, the groups tend to make the good sides win one and make sure they don't lose whilst the bad sides try to nick a win and also make sure they don't lose.
Now, it changes. And clinging on for 120 mins is tougher than 90 mins as fatigue creeps in. We've played three dull teams and will probably play another dull team next Monday. Then, we get to play some proper teams, which will stretch our moderate defence but allow our more talented players to play.
I don't think we will win this tournament but there's not a lot in it and with a change in goalmouth luck, we could do OK.
You could argue so far so good. Not perfect, but OK. With 16 out of 24 qualifying, the groups tend to make the good sides win one and make sure they don't lose whilst the bad sides try to nick a win and also make sure they don't lose.
Now, it changes. And clinging on for 120 mins is tougher than 90 mins as fatigue creeps in. We've played three dull teams and will probably play another dull team next Monday. Then, we get to play some proper teams, which will stretch our moderate defence but allow our more talented players to play.
I don't think we will win this tournament but there's not a lot in it and with a change in goalmouth luck, we could do OK.
This. The three we've played have absolutely shut up shop. Been camped in the opposition's half for the last two. A team that comes at us will be an interesting proposition.
Stat from MOTD: we had 29 shots during the game (13 blocked), the most in a Euro game since 1980.
Unfortunately I dont take that as a positive. To have more shots than any other team in 36 years, and walk away at 0-0? Thats dire.
I watched most of the match, albeit drinking, but the best bit of the night was chasing tail in the smoking area of the pub after full time... Poor match as far as I'm concerned.
Second to Wales? 1-1 to a Russia that Wales destroyed tonight? Not good enough, I don't care about squad rotation either: you play your best 11 in every match, tournaments included.
What is our best 11? Part of the problem is that nobody knows what it is, and what our best system is. We don't even have settled dead ball takers
Against a team who were so defensive and deep in the second half, it was always going to be hard, and to be fair to the Slovaks they defended very well in a Tony Pulis style manner, throwing their bodies on the line, and winning everything in the air. I can see the Slovaks parking the bus in the last 16 and maybe nicking a result.
Stat from MOTD: we had 29 shots during the game (13 blocked), the most in a Euro game since 1980.
Unfortunately I dont take that as a positive. To have more shots than any other team in 36 years, and walk away at 0-0? Thats dire.
I watched most of the match, albeit drinking, but the best bit of the night was chasing tail in the smoking area of the pub after full time... Poor match as far as I'm concerned.
Second to Wales? 1-1 to a Russia that Wales destroyed tonight? Not good enough, I don't care about squad rotation either: you play your best 11 in every match, tournaments included.
What is our best 11? Part of the problem is that nobody knows what it is, and what our best system is. We don't even have settled dead ball takers
Against a team who were so defensive and deep in the second half, it was always going to be hard, and to be fair to the Slovaks they defended very well in a Tony Pulis style manner, throwing their bodies on the line, and winning everything in the air. I can see the Slovaks parking the bus in the last 16 and maybe nicking a result.
I haven't got a clue about our best 11, but I'm not the manager!
Jokes aside; you bring up a very good point - we were a bigger team in this group and that means teams will bring a certain mentality: go for a draw, or aim for a goal before shutting up shop.
Breaking down the teams who will settle for one point is probably a good skill to have though.
Versus Russia - Just about above average against very poor opposition Versus Wales - poor 45 followed by a reasonable 45 against average opposition Versus Slovakia - Poor performance against poor opposition
Not too sure where optimism comes from, other than we are unbeaten. Once we play decent opposition let's hope the 'real' England (the one we think might be there) turns up
We might have a squad that is more suited to play against teams that want to score against you. Bilic suggested that Roy may have brought a joker - somebody like Carrol to give a different option against the packed defence. I subscribe to this- I would take a couple of players who could give me something different - whether they were in the best 23 on merit or not.
I have said from the beginning that the one thing this England team is lacking is goals - in the past we had Scholes, Lampard and Beckham and centre halves that got their fair share. That takes pressure off of the strikers. It is a shame as players like Henderson, Wilshire (not fully fit for me) and Lallana are terrific, but they don't get enough, simple as that. It is an issue Klopp will need to address at Liverpool. One solution is to put players in around them who are better than average in this respect. Drinkwater is a great player, but doesn't bring goals either to be fair to Roy. Chaimberlain who has scored 5 in 25 England internationals may have been a good call if he was fit.
We might have a squad that is more suited to play against teams that want to score against you. Bilic suggested that Roy may have brought a joker - somebody like Carrol to give a different option against the packed defence. I subscribe to this- I would take a couple of players who could give me something different - whether they were in the best 23 on merit or not.
I have said from the beginning that the one thing this England team is lacking is goals - in the past we had Scholes, Lampard and Beckham and centre halves that got their fair share. That takes pressure off of the strikers. It is a shame as players like Henderson, Wilshire (not fully fit for me) and Lallana are terrific, but they don't get enough, simple as that. It is an issue Klopp will need to address at Liverpool. One solution is to put players in around them who are better than average in this respect. Drinkwater is a great player, but doesn't bring goals either to be fair to Roy. Chaimberlain who has scored 5 in 25 England internationals may have been a good call if he was fit.
I agree, we may look better against teams that want to come out and play, giving us a better chance to use our pace in the forwards. However, this brings another challenge, because the teams that can do this can REALLY play, all over the park.
Prague Addick has it for me. The players couldn't trap the ball properly, and had to chase it, giving the defenders an extra yard. A lot of times we lost momentum as a simple pass was misplaced. forcing the player to backtrack to find the ball, and allowing the Slovaks to regroup. A number of times we failed to see a good opportunity to open the Slovak defence up because we wanted to play a nothing safety pass to a player in a safe position in midfield. Especially on the left, we almost never had a player running wide to open their defence up, allowing their defence to group in the middle where the ball inevitably went. Sterling got crucified for not making himself available for the ball in this respect, but last night, the second half was a rerun of the first half against Wales. Sorry Roy, you are paid to spot that stuff and correct it. Poor performance. Deservedly second to Wales-
Stat from MOTD: we had 29 shots during the game (13 blocked), the most in a Euro game since 1980.
Maybe so but how many decent saves did the keeper make. One from Vardy but it was hit straight at him, one from Lallana, hit straight at him and one from Clyne, hit straight at him. He was hardly heroic despite our 29 shots. Laughed when the commentator said something like England have an embarrassment of riches upfront when Kame came on, despite us having scored no goals and a sum total of 3 against 3 bang average sides.
Stat from MOTD: we had 29 shots during the game (13 blocked), the most in a Euro game since 1980.
Maybe so but how many decent saves did the keeper make. One from Vardy but it was hit straight at him, one from Lallana, hit straight at him and one from Clyne, hit straight at him. He was hardly heroic despite our 29 shots. Laughed when the commentator said something like England have an embarrassment of riches upfront when Kame came on, despite us having scored no goals and a sum total of 3 against 3 bang average sides.
You've also got to take into effect the blocked shots though...
i.e. Alli's shot wasnt stopped by the Goalkeeper but last ditch by the Defender
I'll judge England when we come up against a team that want to have a match, rather than getting 10 men behind the ball and hardly want to venture out of their own half.
The third place thing is what made that a rubbish game. Slovakia's best hope was a single point, they weren't interested in having the ball.
Wales played a Russia team that HAD to win (while against us a point looked fine). So while last night made us look bad, I've not abandoned all hope. Especially as we might even get a better draw than Wales.
If Roy goes with the team that beat Wales in the second half of that game, against a team that has to open up a bit, I think we've got a good chance of scoring goals.
But, personally, I don't want to see Henderson again in this tournament. He plays the odds, hits balls into areas rather than picking people out, and is more than happy to win a corner. Maybe that would be good if we are the underdogs though.
People embarrassed to be an England fan because of that performance last night????
Dear me, you'd think you would be slightly thicker skinned supporting the utter shite that is Charlton Athletic for years.
I agree. It's farcical how people overreact.
Nobody is disputing that the points and goals return is acceptable , but some of the doom mongergerers need to get a grip.
But for late goals against Albania, France would have ended up with a similar record to us, yet people are pulling themselves to pieces over them.
We're now entering the business end of the tournament, knock out football where teams can't just sit back and soak up pressure. The group stages are about getting out of. We've not lost a game, not looked like losing a game, got through without any injuries, nobody suspended and all but 2 outfield players have had game time.
I think people just want to have a moan up because it's England.
The only real positive is that we kept a clean sheet and that our draw against 2nd place of group F should be relatively simple.
First thing the team needs to learn is that goals have corners, maybe we should aim for those rather than straight down the middle at the keeper. Happened too often against Russia and Slovakia.
People embarrassed to be an England fan because of that performance last night????
Dear me, you'd think you would be slightly thicker skinned supporting the utter shite that is Charlton Athletic for years.
They're the Man Utd / Chelsea / Arsenal fans though...
They moan when they dont win every League game so its no different when it comes to England because they're not able to just support the best team out there... Fans of your everyday club are probably more understanding of the result because they've more patience and because of the Football they usually see
The only real positive is that we kept a clean sheet and that our draw against 2nd place of group F should be relatively simple.
First thing the team needs to learn is that goals have corners, maybe we should aim for those rather than straight down the middle at the keeper. Happened too often against Russia and Slovakia.
Stat from MOTD: we had 29 shots during the game (13 blocked), the most in a Euro game since 1980.
well that is baffling because the distinctly dodgy Viktoria Plzen keeper will have had more fraught evenings at Pribram in front of 2,000 cynical farm- workers.
That was dire. Players who cannot trap the ball with one touch, players who cannot lift a corner kick above the first defender, players who cannot make a simple pass that doesn't make their team-mate backtrack to collect it.
But then I think, hang on, Wales must have been doing all these things Ok tonight.
So what is it? Maybe when you strip away the foreign stars in our FAPL clubs, our players are shown to be lacking in technical skills? or, they just can't be arsed, it's only England?
I don't know. What I do know is, that was utter shite. I was embarassed to be an England supporter in a Czech pub tonight.
To be fair, you must be embarrassed by lots of things you are or do all the time mate.
If Portugal beat Hungary - and I think they will. It would have worked our well for us. I will be watching that game with great interest. The thing is that teams have to win matches now to progress. Portugal - despite being awful - can beat England to the extent of a match up being pretty much 50-50 - I honestly think Hungary don't have enough to beat us and would be more 5-95.
Then we would almost certainly have to get past a France team that haven't impressed me at all. But they have dangerous players and are at home. I'd say that is 45-55 in their favour, but we have a real chance. You ought to expect to play a decent side in the quarter finals and it is winnable, Then a well organised Italy or disapointing Germany side in the semis, I'd have both of these as 50-50s with the toughest game against Spain in the final - 30-70 in their favour. That is the best time to play your toughest game.
So whilst we will have to get through a couple of tough matches - three if Portugal come second - we have increased our cahnces of making the final IMO by coming second. Is Roy a genius? I doubt it. I hope he stops messing about now and just puts out sides that have sufficient threat and let's see what happens!
Comments
That was dire. Players who cannot trap the ball with one touch, players who cannot lift a corner kick above the first defender, players who cannot make a simple pass that doesn't make their team-mate backtrack to collect it.
But then I think, hang on, Wales must have been doing all these things Ok tonight.
So what is it? Maybe when you strip away the foreign stars in our FAPL clubs, our players are shown to be lacking in technical skills? or, they just can't be arsed, it's only England?
I don't know. What I do know is, that was utter shite. I was embarassed to be an England supporter in a Czech pub tonight.
I watched most of the match, albeit drinking, but the best bit of the night was chasing tail in the smoking area of the pub after full time... Poor match as far as I'm concerned.
Second to Wales? 1-1 to a Russia that Wales destroyed tonight? Not good enough, I don't care about squad rotation either: you play your best 11 in every match, tournaments included.
That's been our excuse for the last 15 years.
We've moved on from that.
Now, it changes. And clinging on for 120 mins is tougher than 90 mins as fatigue creeps in. We've played three dull teams and will probably play another dull team next Monday. Then, we get to play some proper teams, which will stretch our moderate defence but allow our more talented players to play.
I don't think we will win this tournament but there's not a lot in it and with a change in goalmouth luck, we could do OK.
Been camped in the opposition's half for the last two.
A team that comes at us will be an interesting proposition.
Against a team who were so defensive and deep in the second half, it was always going to be hard, and to be fair to the Slovaks they defended very well in a Tony Pulis style manner, throwing their bodies on the line, and winning everything in the air. I can see the Slovaks parking the bus in the last 16 and maybe nicking a result.
Jokes aside; you bring up a very good point - we were a bigger team in this group and that means teams will bring a certain mentality: go for a draw, or aim for a goal before shutting up shop.
Breaking down the teams who will settle for one point is probably a good skill to have though.
Versus Wales - poor 45 followed by a reasonable 45 against average opposition
Versus Slovakia - Poor performance against poor opposition
Not too sure where optimism comes from, other than we are unbeaten. Once we play decent opposition let's hope the 'real' England (the one we think might be there) turns up
I have said from the beginning that the one thing this England team is lacking is goals - in the past we had Scholes, Lampard and Beckham and centre halves that got their fair share. That takes pressure off of the strikers. It is a shame as players like Henderson, Wilshire (not fully fit for me) and Lallana are terrific, but they don't get enough, simple as that. It is an issue Klopp will need to address at Liverpool. One solution is to put players in around them who are better than average in this respect. Drinkwater is a great player, but doesn't bring goals either to be fair to Roy. Chaimberlain who has scored 5 in 25 England internationals may have been a good call if he was fit.
Poor performance. Deservedly second to Wales-
i.e. Alli's shot wasnt stopped by the Goalkeeper but last ditch by the Defender
Dear me, you'd think you would be slightly thicker skinned supporting the utter shite that is Charlton Athletic for years.
Wales played a Russia team that HAD to win (while against us a point looked fine). So while last night made us look bad, I've not abandoned all hope. Especially as we might even get a better draw than Wales.
If Roy goes with the team that beat Wales in the second half of that game, against a team that has to open up a bit, I think we've got a good chance of scoring goals.
But, personally, I don't want to see Henderson again in this tournament. He plays the odds, hits balls into areas rather than picking people out, and is more than happy to win a corner. Maybe that would be good if we are the underdogs though.
Nobody is disputing that the points and goals return is acceptable , but some of the doom mongergerers need to get a grip.
But for late goals against Albania, France would have ended up with a similar record to us, yet people are pulling themselves to pieces over them.
We're now entering the business end of the tournament, knock out football where teams can't just sit back and soak up pressure. The group stages are about getting out of. We've not lost a game, not looked like losing a game, got through without any injuries, nobody suspended and all but 2 outfield players have had game time.
I think people just want to have a moan up because it's England.
First thing the team needs to learn is that goals have corners, maybe we should aim for those rather than straight down the middle at the keeper. Happened too often against Russia and Slovakia.
They moan when they dont win every League game so its no different when it comes to England because they're not able to just support the best team out there... Fans of your everyday club are probably more understanding of the result because they've more patience and because of the Football they usually see
To be honest, I didn't realise that so many people - at least judging from this thread - had such high expectations from us in the first place.
Did people expect us to be winning all our games by two or three goals or something? If so, why?
Before it started I thought we'd win one and draw two of our group games, I just got the order wrong.
;-)
Wake me up when someone wants a game.
Then we would almost certainly have to get past a France team that haven't impressed me at all. But they have dangerous players and are at home. I'd say that is 45-55 in their favour, but we have a real chance. You ought to expect to play a decent side in the quarter finals and it is winnable, Then a well organised Italy or disapointing Germany side in the semis, I'd have both of these as 50-50s with the toughest game against Spain in the final - 30-70 in their favour. That is the best time to play your toughest game.
So whilst we will have to get through a couple of tough matches - three if Portugal come second - we have increased our cahnces of making the final IMO by coming second. Is Roy a genius? I doubt it. I hope he stops messing about now and just puts out sides that have sufficient threat and let's see what happens!