I mean, yes, we concede twice in most games, because teams are overrunning us and completely dominating play. But why not think of it another way - we've only conceded three once this season, and that was in the 94th minute with Sarr up front hunting an equaliser. Meanwhile, other teams cop thrashings all the time. Why hasn't that happened to us?
Agree with this. We had a warning just before. A fit Cullen would have probably prevented it IMO. And I think we will be amazed at the transformation in the defence when we start playing a competitive midfield.
I mean, yes, we concede twice in most games, because teams are overrunning us and completely dominating play. But why not think of it another way - we've only conceded three once this season, and that was in the 94th minute with Sarr up front hunting an equaliser. Meanwhile, other teams cop thrashings all the time. Why hasn't that happened to us?
I think the reason we are conceding 2 a game is not the fault of the defence but more because we have so many injuries that we can't control the midfield. We sit too deep and in the end if you're defending constantly then eventually something will give. We need more control of possession but with our current midfield that doesn't seem possible. Also when one of the defenders has the ball nobody in midfield is showing for it or moving to create space. Cullen is a massive miss as he always shows for the ball when defenders have it and dictates the tempo of our play, as well as switching play from left to right.
TL;DR we need more balance in midfield and up front so we can actually keep and use the ball.
I mean, yes, we concede twice in most games, because teams are overrunning us and completely dominating play. But why not think of it another way - we've only conceded three once this season, and that was in the 94th minute with Sarr up front hunting an equaliser. Meanwhile, other teams cop thrashings all the time. Why hasn't that happened to us?
Because of the belief Bowyer, JJ and Gallen have built around this young team.
You've got other teams around us with no or minor injury list, they have full strength squads and are conceding 3+ goals constantly. They have no belief and that will get you relegated.
The fact we have only conceded three on one occasion, despite our injury list, is one of the reasons I remain optimistic. Other teams below us are not showing the same fortitude.
This is what happened yesterday. Preston set up with three at the back but they wanted to start offensively, probably having done their homework on us. This meant they were a bit open at the back and with Sarr we have a player who can find a killer ball when a player is in space and they probably didn't expect that and Doughty was showing what a good player he is going to be on the left. So we grabbed a goal.
Then they saw where we were threatening and tried to plug it up. But also they found their initial tactic was still the right one. On the left we were dangerous but not anywhere else. So they could push up and we defended. What was apparent is that one of their players could sit down on the ball on our side of the pitch if they wanted too. They were able to build attacks. And when we attacked we couldn't keep possession in their half for more than five seconds. So it was a matter of time.
When they got the second, they sat a bit deeper and this allowed us to at least threaten them, but the quality of our delivery was very poor and when we broke quickly, there were not enough bodies rushing into the box. I think they were about 3 seconds behind where they should be in that respect.
Having said all that, absolutely nothing Bowyer could have done about it. I think Gallagher would have made a big difference as would another striker.
I mean, yes, we concede twice in most games, because teams are overrunning us and completely dominating play. But why not think of it another way - we've only conceded three once this season, and that was in the 94th minute with Sarr up front hunting an equaliser. Meanwhile, other teams cop thrashings all the time. Why hasn't that happened to us?
Agree with this. We had a warning just before. A fit Cullen would have probably prevented it IMO. And I think we will be amazed at the transformation in the defence when we start playing a competitive midfield.
Agree with both above. Training and medical have also been mentioned & are fair comments which IMO are have been raised since at least Oct. Leuth is right to complain about professional footballers not doing the basics right - this lays at door of Bowyer et al.
I would't lay the door at Bowyer's end. I genuinely believe the injury issues have been largely due to bad luck. Maybe one or two we could be critical of, but you also have to factor in the desperation of the situation that will have forced Bowyer's hand.
Disagree with Bowyer on his comment about scoring 1 today but letting in 2. If you score more than your opponent then you will win, so the emphasis is on scoring, not not letting any in. If we had scored a 2nd & gone 2-0 I bet we would have won. How many games this season have we gone 2 goals clear & then lost...? None. And only once have we drawn (Home to Cardiff). Not many games do you score 2 & lose. And you win a bloody lot more.
Sign some strikers. We wont win many games with Davison & Hemed.
Your view on the game of football is absolutely fascinating. But not in a good way.
Really....?? Can you tell me why as all I said is that you need to score at least one goal to win a football match. Generally if you get 2 you dont usually lose.......3 and you're pretty certain to win.
I'll break it down even further for you. If you never score you'll never win. The best you'll ever do is a 0-0 draw. 46 of those will give you 46 points. Might stay up but more likely to go down.
It's a bit like the old "rules of the game of cricket as described to a stranger" that you find on tea towels. The aim of football is to win........and to do that you first need to score. It is not rocket science.
I get what you're saying Golfie but it was Curbs that always went "Back To Basics" following a bad run, and it usually worked for him.
That didn't involve going totally defensive but it was a case of every player doing his job properly and keeping things simple. Tightening up defensively doesn't mean playing for 0-0 draws.
The problem is do we have the players to do this right now?
There is nothing wrong with going back to basics but your final question explains why there is little point in doing that. We have to be honest and say that with the injuries we have and have had, the performances overall have been amazing. We have been in most games for sure and credit for that goes to Bowyer.
But the reason it has been amazing is we are just too weak with the players out or coming back in some cases not 100%. So you cast an eye away from gutsy performances and look at the stats. I see one win in 16. That win was when we were able to field a front two of Taylor (even though he wasn't fully fit) and Bonne. It did tell me that with the closeness of games we didn't need a great deal extra to bring in a few more points. But in this window we are weaker now that it started. I think we would have got something out of yesterday's game against a poor Preston side with Gallagher.
Now moving on to ESI. I am highly critical but am not writing them off. I am just critical of what I have seen so far. I seriously can't imagine why anybody can be positive. There are some people who think they understand how it all works and lecture the rest of us on how hard it is to do business in January. The thing is, we know that but the situation, which has been and is, a genuine crisis, needed addressing. You have to factor in the cost of relegation against paying an extra 50 odd grand a year for a player.
I am also worried, but open for re-assurances. Only I am at the point where the re-assurances I am seeking are what I see and not what I am told. Why? Because we have been told a few things, call them promises or whatever you want, but we have been told things that haven't happened regarding players and Bowyer and we learn the deal was rushed through so Roland has lost the part of the club he didn't want and has kept the part worth money. This would be less worrying if ESI were having the window that they rushed the buying of the club to have - or so they told us in the West Brom Programme.
I do appreciate that there isn't much we can do. But we can see it and call it as it is unless we are ostriches. What Golf Addick has said is perfectly reasonable and he is being attacked for it. I am not writing ESI off and am merely demanding they stop pissing about and start to do something as the situation required they do something on January 1st. Bowyer is not in such an easy position. You can see he is a bit suspicious, but he is in the process of signing a contract that keeps him at the club for 5 years. I would imagine he wants to suss the owners out before he puts pen to paper. But he isn't going to slag them off. It is more a case of hoping it is still as good as it looked when it happened.
We all have to hope, but those that are saying, it is hard, be nice to them etc... are not paying attention. I was delighted when ESI took over and when they do ONE thing, yes ONE thing they have said they will do or have promised, I will be more comfortable which for anybody with their eyes open is an uncomfortable situation.
Muttley, I agree with the vast majority of this, because tomorrow is the 20th January.
My disagreement with you was the fact that you, or if it wasn't you it was certainly others, were saying similar when ESI had been in charge for 2 working days and I didn't think it was realistic.
But yes Bowyer must sign his contract this week and we really need to get some players in because we are 3 players worse off than we were a few days ago. (Gallagher, Cullen and JFC).
Anybody else think the subs were a bit too soon, all three that is. The first two were followed swiftly by the third with ages to go. Only minutes later Pratley took a knock or overstretched and I initially thought it was his groin, but he successfully ran it off. At the time we were all at sea and I just thought the third sub should have been kept back in case of an injury (not like we don't get many).
Oztumer for Williams was clearly pre-planned as part of their recovery. Williams 60 minutes, Oztumer 30. I think that one would have happened whatever the game position.
I would't lay the door at Bowyer's end. I genuinely believe the injury issues have been largely due to bad luck. Maybe one or two we could be critical of, but you also have to factor in the desperation of the situation that will have forced Bowyer's hand.
Fair point & I also agree with your earlier, longer post that Covered End picked up. There is a lot of promise in this squad & it maybe a few well chosen bodies who fit in & want to play will make all the difference. Let's hope next week more positive.
Disagree with Bowyer on his comment about scoring 1 today but letting in 2. If you score more than your opponent then you will win, so the emphasis is on scoring, not not letting any in. If we had scored a 2nd & gone 2-0 I bet we would have won. How many games this season have we gone 2 goals clear & then lost...? None. And only once have we drawn (Home to Cardiff). Not many games do you score 2 & lose. And you win a bloody lot more.
Sign some strikers. We wont win many games with Davison & Hemed.
Your view on the game of football is absolutely fascinating. But not in a good way.
Really....?? Can you tell me why as all I said is that you need to score at least one goal to win a football match. Generally if you get 2 you dont usually lose.......3 and you're pretty certain to win.
I'll break it down even further for you. If you never score you'll never win. The best you'll ever do is a 0-0 draw. 46 of those will give you 46 points. Might stay up but more likely to go down.
It's a bit like the old "rules of the game of cricket as described to a stranger" that you find on tea towels. The aim of football is to win........and to do that you first need to score. It is not rocket science.
‘The emphasis is on scoring, not not letting any in’ is what you said. With all due respect, that’s like something my physics teacher come out with when he was forced to take us to a year 9 football match, cos the other PE teachers couldn’t be bothered.
You're playing away against a team close to the playoffs, we are conceding on average 2 goals a game for the last god knows how many weeks, your priority is to keep it tight. We do not struggle to score goals in the grand scheme of things (we’ve scored more than Swansea, Forest and Millwall). We do however, struggle with conceding crap goals at an alarming rate.
For someone claiming it’s not rocket science, you’ve not taken much notice of the evidence available.
Hey guys , I don’t know the whole situation , but why don’t you change the coach? i know the takeover was in November , but i don’t see any new transfers although your situation is pretty bad. What are they waiting for? *my english is shit , sorry for that
Hey guys , I don’t know the whole situation , but why don’t you change the coach? i know the takeover was in November , but i don’t see any new transfers although your situation is pretty bad. What are they waiting for? *my english is shit , sorry for that
Because he is one of the best young coaches in the game.
Well your position had some legs on the second day. Our position seems to have been proven correct on the 19th day!
I think we need to wait until the 1st February to see whether or not ESI have had a successful first month.
Either way, I don't think it was right for some of our fans to be slating them after 2 days.
(I don't know whether you were or not. I don't think you were. I seem to recall you were very positive about ESI and gave them about 10 days before you starting laying in
We have a weird situation here. I couldn’t see to many owners rushing to sign up a Manager who has led a team to one victory in 16 games.... ! I honestly think we could see the first booing the team off after the home defeat to Fulham. Any indication that the fans are dissatisfied with LB, could see no new contract.
Hey guys , I don’t know the whole situation , but why don’t you change the coach? i know the takeover was in November , but i don’t see any new transfers although your situation is pretty bad. What are they waiting for? *my english is shit , sorry for that
A few reasons:
Primarily because of the many contributing factors to our situation, most of them, and certainly the biggest ones, are outside of the coach’s control.
Also because he appears to be a very bright young coach. Unexpected promotion last year is one example of his achievements. Without him, I expect we would have even fewer points.
Lastly, and least importantly, he is ‘one of us’. A former player and someone who speaks as a fan would and understands the club and fans. This affords him a bit more patience than other managers would have been given, but as I said above any manager would struggle with the restrictions he has been working under. If anything, he’s been the one person stopping the club imploding completely.
Hey guys , I don’t know the whole situation , but why don’t you change the coach? i know the takeover was in November , but i don’t see any new transfers although your situation is pretty bad. What are they waiting for? *my english is shit , sorry for that
A few reasons:
Primarily because of the many contributing factors to our situation, most of them, and certainly the biggest ones, are outside of the coach’s control.
Also because he appears to be a very bright young coach. Unexpected promotion last year is one example of his achievements. Without him, I expect we would have even fewer points.
Lastly, and least importantly, he is ‘one of us’. A former player and someone who speaks as a fan would and understands the club and fans. This affords him a bit more patience than other managers would have been given, but as I said above any manager would struggle with the restrictions he has been working under. If anything, he’s been the one person stopping the club imploding completely.
I mean, yes, we concede twice in most games, because teams are overrunning us and completely dominating play. But why not think of it another way - we've only conceded three once this season, and that was in the 94th minute with Sarr up front hunting an equaliser. Meanwhile, other teams cop thrashings all the time. Why hasn't that happened to us?
Hey guys , I don’t know the whole situation , but why don’t you change the coach? i know the takeover was in November , but i don’t see any new transfers although your situation is pretty bad. What are they waiting for? *my english is shit , sorry for that
A few reasons:
Primarily because of the many contributing factors to our situation, most of them, and certainly the biggest ones, are outside of the coach’s control.
Also because he appears to be a very bright young coach. Unexpected promotion last year is one example of his achievements. Without him, I expect we would have even fewer points.
Lastly, and least importantly, he is ‘one of us’. A former player and someone who speaks as a fan would and understands the club and fans. This affords him a bit more patience than other managers would have been given, but as I said above any manager would struggle with the restrictions he has been working under. If anything, he’s been the one person stopping the club imploding completely.
Spot on
Ok , now i undserstand why , i didn’t have enough information. I saw that he did a very good job last season . Then the problem is the squad , he needs some quality players ASAP. The new owners must take immediate actions. Thank you for your answer ,@Exiled_Addick
Well your position had some legs on the second day. Our position seems to have been proven correct on the 19th day!
I think we need to wait until the 1st February to see whether or not ESI have had a successful first month.
Either way, I don't think it was right for some of our fans to be slating them after 2 days.
(I don't know whether you were or not. I don't think you were. I seem to recall you were very positive about ESI and gave them about 10 days before you starting laying in
I think the slating has been more recent but highlighting something that you don't think is right is not slating, it is raising a concern or concerns. I have had my ghast well and truely flabbered by some people who think they understand football thinking not getting players in with absolute urgency in our situation is ok. You made a particularly nasty observation inferring I must think Bowyer and Gallen are cretins.
I certainly do not, I think Bowyer is a great manager and wise trying to suss this mob out before he commits. I know he appreciated the need to bring players in urgently because that is a basic that even somebody like me knows, so he is going to know it. But given the situation, he can't throw his rattle out of the pram.
We like house buying anaolgies on here and here is a true one. A couple of years ago, my disabled mother had to move out of her current property to a new one which was adapted to her needs. We had a timescale to get this done by and we were on course when the sellers of the house she was buying let us down late in the day. We were than in an emergency situation as we had to give time to complete and adapt the house as the deadline hadn't changed. We found a property and to meet the deadline we offered to pay them the full asking price if they could vacate two weeks after completion. This is not how you do it unless you are desperate. By doing this we were able to get it all done on time. You have to deal with the situation you are in and sacrificing points in January was not acceptable in my book.
Can I just say firstly, that game was there for the taking, Preston were poor and I can see why they havent been winning but we were equally as poor. Secondly how annoyingly well Baeur played, even ignoring his goal every cross rifled across the box he was in the right place and broke up the play. Real loss.
Yep they were there as you explained. Probably the soberist I have entered a away ground as by the time my mate got in from his delayed train we just went straight to make sure they were there. Not even cans of john smiths rapidly downed could blur the gathering frustration as the game progressed. Brum is our next outing. Thanks for the advice.
We like house buying anaolgies on here and here is a true one. A couple of years ago, my disabled mother had to move out of her current property to a new one which was adapted to her needs. We had a timescale to get this done by and we were on course when the sellers of the house she was buying let us down late in the day. We were than in an emergency situation as we had to give time to complete and adapt the house as the deadline hadn't changed. We found a property and to meet the deadline we offered to pay them the full asking price if they could vacate two weeks after completion. This is not how you do it unless you are desperate. By doing this we were able to get it all done on time. You have to deal with the situation you are in and sacrificing points in January was not acceptable in my book.
You'd have been better off if they had vacated on completion like everyone else does :-)
We like house buying anaolgies on here and here is a true one. A couple of years ago, my disabled mother had to move out of her current property to a new one which was adapted to her needs. We had a timescale to get this done by and we were on course when the sellers of the house she was buying let us down late in the day. We were than in an emergency situation as we had to give time to complete and adapt the house as the deadline hadn't changed. We found a property and to meet the deadline we offered to pay them the full asking price if they could vacate two weeks after completion. This is not how you do it unless you are desperate. By doing this we were able to get it all done on time. You have to deal with the situation you are in and sacrificing points in January was not acceptable in my book.
You'd have been better off if they had vacated on completion like everyone else does :-)
One thing we do have to remember is that even with all of our players fit and ready we really struggled against teams who we should have been looking to go out and beat. The likes of Wigan, Birmingham and Barnsley looked like teams we should have had control over, but we've never been set up in this division to do well against teams who let us have the ball and force us to play on the front foot. That's an issue that won't be solved by players coming back, it needs to be solved by thinking about how we play and ideally bringing in the kind of players who are more proactive on the pitch and less reactive. That's hard to do in January, but we're at a point now where we can't afford to be looking at the table and thinking we could get something off Leeds and Fulham and then allow that we'll probably trip up against Barnsley and Luton again. I have so much sympathy for Bowyer's predicament, but I would like to never see us play three at the back again. It just doesn't work with our set-up and we always play better with a flat back four, regardless of the fact most of our renaming fit first teamers are defenders. Let's hop we bring in the kind of players soon who can help us get the results we need against the teams around us because there's a lot of six pointers coming up
Comments
TL;DR we need more balance in midfield and up front so we can actually keep and use the ball.
Then they saw where we were threatening and tried to plug it up. But also they found their initial tactic was still the right one. On the left we were dangerous but not anywhere else. So they could push up and we defended. What was apparent is that one of their players could sit down on the ball on our side of the pitch if they wanted too. They were able to build attacks. And when we attacked we couldn't keep possession in their half for more than five seconds. So it was a matter of time.
When they got the second, they sat a bit deeper and this allowed us to at least threaten them, but the quality of our delivery was very poor and when we broke quickly, there were not enough bodies rushing into the box. I think they were about 3 seconds behind where they should be in that respect.
Having said all that, absolutely nothing Bowyer could have done about it. I think Gallagher would have made a big difference as would another striker.
My disagreement with you was the fact that you, or if it wasn't you it was certainly others, were saying similar when ESI had been in charge for 2 working days and I didn't think it was realistic.
But yes Bowyer must sign his contract this week and we really need to get some players in because we are 3 players worse off than we were a few days ago. (Gallagher, Cullen and JFC).
You're playing away against a team close to the playoffs, we are conceding on average 2 goals a game for the last god knows how many weeks, your priority is to keep it tight. We do not struggle to score goals in the grand scheme of things (we’ve scored more than Swansea, Forest and Millwall). We do however, struggle with conceding crap goals at an alarming rate.
i know the takeover was in November , but i don’t see any new transfers although your situation is pretty bad.
What are they waiting for? *my english is shit , sorry for that
Either way, I don't think it was right for some of our fans to be slating them after 2 days.
(I don't know whether you were or not. I don't think you were.
I seem to recall you were very positive about ESI and gave them about 10 days before you starting laying in
Primarily because of the many contributing factors to our situation, most of them, and certainly the biggest ones, are outside of the coach’s control.
Bauer is the one player Bowyer and Jackson should have known how to counter on corners.
Then the problem is the squad , he needs some quality players ASAP. The new owners must take immediate actions.
Thank you for your answer ,@Exiled_Addick
I certainly do not, I think Bowyer is a great manager and wise trying to suss this mob out before he commits. I know he appreciated the need to bring players in urgently because that is a basic that even somebody like me knows, so he is going to know it. But given the situation, he can't throw his rattle out of the pram.
We like house buying anaolgies on here and here is a true one. A couple of years ago, my disabled mother had to move out of her current property to a new one which was adapted to her needs. We had a timescale to get this done by and we were on course when the sellers of the house she was buying let us down late in the day. We were than in an emergency situation as we had to give time to complete and adapt the house as the deadline hadn't changed. We found a property and to meet the deadline we offered to pay them the full asking price if they could vacate two weeks after completion. This is not how you do it unless you are desperate. By doing this we were able to get it all done on time. You have to deal with the situation you are in and sacrificing points in January was not acceptable in my book.