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Rumours Rumours - Summer 2021 edition (Deadline Day from p814)
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And Adkins clearly didn't hold it against Morgan, seeing that he's played every minute in the league, and it was Dobson who was dropped instead, with Morgan moving back.orpingtonRED said:
I mean it was a bit unfair on Morgan to say he didn't deliver.cafcfan1990 said:
I don’t think signing Lee is unfair on Morgan because we clearly lacked an AM. Arter is the weird one because we signed Clare and Dobson on top of Morgan and Watson (with Vennings and Dempsey too).orpingtonRED said:
Cheers, makes sense I guess however a bit unfair on Albie. It's not his position and never has been so was a gamble.Cafc43v3r said:
No, no name, but Lee was signed because Morgan didn't deliver and Gilbey's sickness. As I understand it and happened within about 24 hours of the post match debrief.orpingtonRED said:
Interesting that Lee was chosen over a LB.Cafc43v3r said:We were always going to get a left back on loan, we didn't because we got Lee instead. The reason we only have 4 loans is so we can get an emergency loan keeper, if we need one.
I have been told we had a premier league left back loan lined up but it depended on Ater signing or not.
No idea what the free transfer market is like for center mids but I think we went the right way?
Im assuming if you know you would say, but any idea who we were in for mate?
The Arter deal was first approached in early August apparently. Which goes against my thoughts that they didn't budget to replace JFC.
It's obviously not his best position to play but the choice was made to try him and then the idea was ditched after a few games. That's the managers fault not Albie's in my opinion.
The signing of Lee was needed as the position needed addressing and I'm pleased it was.
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For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
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Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.16 -
Agreed, fairly sure he came onto the scene a day or two before deadline day, hence why I don’t believe we pulled out of a loan deal for a LB to sign Arter. As you say, so much going on and can see why Gallen is always shattered afterwards.Henry Irving said:What we don't know was when Souare first came in the scene?
He may well have been seen as a serious option before the window closed so allowing us to focus on other positions.
We also don't know when Purrington will be fit.
As Gallen said, he had 150 phone conversations on deadline day so I imagine there were others players we know about, like Kerr, and others we know nothing about.
It's an ever changing set of plates that need to be spun.I wasn’t the most optimistic a couple of weeks ago but think they’ve balanced it pretty well and done a good job.3 -
I think this is true but it’s not just about giving games to 20 year olds, it’s about lowering the age of the squad. Amos, Oshilija, Pratley and Shinnie were all replaced by younger permanent players plus you have Kirk and CBT. Davison has been become a part of the squad too.killerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a gameAll well and good giving youth a chance but the quality has to be there. Elerewe has been played but Lavelle was a must given the concern over Inniss. Claydon and Roddy have played but if we want to go up, Leko and Souare give us the extra depth required.2 -
The likes of Deji and Clayden won't get many opportunities, now we've completed our squad. Harness may be our sub keeper, but if MacG gets injured, we'll bring someone in. How many games will the likes of Vennings, Dempsey and Ghandour get, players aged 20 or 21?Henry Irving said:
Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.
Those other players you mentioned aren't our academy players
“One, there has got to be a pathway for the youngsters in the academy,” he said. “At every football club I’ve been at that has been a big priority and that will be the same here. We have got talented players and sometimes that pathway can be blocked.
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/charlton-boss-nigel-adkins-ill-give-great-references-to-all-of-the-players-we-let-go/
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Agreed, I do put some blame on the management. It seemed obvious to most people Morgan wasn’t capable of playing that role and yes they probably got it wrong. At least they had the balls to admit that early and bring in Lee. Also, it’s not like they put the blame on Morgan as against Crewe they put in Washington but it wasn’t Albie that was dropped, he just changed role.orpingtonRED said:
I mean it was a bit unfair on Morgan to say he didn't deliver.cafcfan1990 said:
I don’t think signing Lee is unfair on Morgan because we clearly lacked an AM. Arter is the weird one because we signed Clare and Dobson on top of Morgan and Watson (with Vennings and Dempsey too).orpingtonRED said:
Cheers, makes sense I guess however a bit unfair on Albie. It's not his position and never has been so was a gamble.Cafc43v3r said:
No, no name, but Lee was signed because Morgan didn't deliver and Gilbey's sickness. As I understand it and happened within about 24 hours of the post match debrief.orpingtonRED said:
Interesting that Lee was chosen over a LB.Cafc43v3r said:We were always going to get a left back on loan, we didn't because we got Lee instead. The reason we only have 4 loans is so we can get an emergency loan keeper, if we need one.
I have been told we had a premier league left back loan lined up but it depended on Ater signing or not.
No idea what the free transfer market is like for center mids but I think we went the right way?
Im assuming if you know you would say, but any idea who we were in for mate?
The Arter deal was first approached in early August apparently. Which goes against my thoughts that they didn't budget to replace JFC.
It's obviously not his best position to play but the choice was made to try him and then the idea was ditched after a few games. That's the managers fault not Albie's in my opinion.
The signing of Lee was needed as the position needed addressing and I'm pleased it was.0 -
Kind of make you right about Harness, he is No2 to make better use of the budget and we'll bring in an emergency loan if necessary. But, in fairness, if we signed someone like Fielding to be No2 then Harness wouldn't be getting matchday experience on a regular basis and gametime in the cup games so we are still developing him.killerandflash said:
The likes of Deji and Clayden won't get many opportunities, now we've completed our squad. Harness may be our sub keeper, but if MacG gets injured, we'll bring someone in. How many games will the likes of Vennings, Dempsey and Ghandour get, players aged 20 or 21?Henry Irving said:
Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.
Those other players you mentioned aren't our academy players
“One, there has got to be a pathway for the youngsters in the academy,” he said. “At every football club I’ve been at that has been a big priority and that will be the same here. We have got talented players and sometimes that pathway can be blocked.
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/charlton-boss-nigel-adkins-ill-give-great-references-to-all-of-the-players-we-let-go/
It's ok to reference Vennings, Dempsey and Ghandour but are they good enough and/or ready? Admittedly if you take the comment literally I agree the stance has changed slightly but over the longer term I think Adkins and Sandgaard will look to the academy, but it has to be when the players are capable of stepping up, not to fill the squad because we're scrimping on the budget.3 -
With the exception of Deji and perhaps Clayden I don’t think any of them have shown enough quality yet to be in the matchday 18, let alone the first 11, so ultimately we’ve looked to sign better in an effort to win promotion. I hope and expect that we’ll see a few faces head to non League clubs shortly and for some such loans will be vital towards how they progress. I fully believe that if the younger players show they’re good enough they’ll get a chance, as Deji has when he played before Pearce off the bench.killerandflash said:
The likes of Deji and Clayden won't get many opportunities, now we've completed our squad. Harness may be our sub keeper, but if MacG gets injured, we'll bring someone in. How many games will the likes of Vennings, Dempsey and Ghandour get, players aged 20 or 21?Henry Irving said:
Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.
Those other players you mentioned aren't our academy players
“One, there has got to be a pathway for the youngsters in the academy,” he said. “At every football club I’ve been at that has been a big priority and that will be the same here. We have got talented players and sometimes that pathway can be blocked.
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/charlton-boss-nigel-adkins-ill-give-great-references-to-all-of-the-players-we-let-go/7 -
So that’s one free agent. That may be the last of our business until January but let’s assume we’re after another based on Cawley’s tweet…
It has to be a striker or a keeper doesn’t it? I’m focusing in on the former, given what Adkins said about the emergency loan system for goalkeepers.
Realistic options…
Connor Wickham (?)
Kazaiah Sterling
Nicky Ajose
Jerome Sinclair
Kieran Agard
Calvin Andrew
David Nugent
Steve Davies
Ishmael Miller
Simon Cox
Anthony Stokes
Yaya Sanogo
Oumar Niasse
Maxime Biamou1 - Sponsored links:
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I'm not sure if we find out the squad but it will be intriguing. Dempsey and JFC missing out seems obvious and leaves us with a full squad. If we are after another outfield player (agree it would be a striker) then it surely means Schwartz is the third and final player not to be named which would be very interesting. Personally I do think he'll be included and we won't be signing another outfield player.Callumcafc said:So that’s one free agent. That may be the last of our business until January but let’s assume we’re after another based on Cawley’s tweet…
It has to be a striker or a keeper doesn’t it? I’m focusing in on the former, given what Adkins said about the emergency loan system for goalkeepers.
Realistic options…
Connor Wickham (?)
Kazaiah Sterling
Nicky Ajose
Jerome Sinclair
Kieran Agard
Calvin Andrew
David Nugent
Steve Davies
Ishmael Miller
Simon Cox
Anthony Stokes
Yaya Sanogo
Oumar Niasse
Maxime Biamou
Wickham and Biamou are probably about the only two from that list I'd consider. Would possibly have considered Agard had we not signed Leko but his career does seem to be on the decline.0 -
Agreed, unless it's an under 21. I've said this before, but I do feel that our transfer business has left us a bit tied by the squad number rules, seeing that everyone we've brought in is over 21. Ronnie hasn't gone anywhere, surely we should try and get him fit in the next few months, seeing that we are paying himcafcfan1990 said:
I'm not sure if we find out the squad but it will be intriguing. Dempsey and JFC missing out seems obvious and leaves us with a full squad. If we are after another outfield player (agree it would be a striker) then it surely means Schwartz is the third and final player not to be named which would be very interesting. Personally I do think he'll be included and we won't be signing another outfield player.Callumcafc said:So that’s one free agent. That may be the last of our business until January but let’s assume we’re after another based on Cawley’s tweet…
It has to be a striker or a keeper doesn’t it? I’m focusing in on the former, given what Adkins said about the emergency loan system for goalkeepers.
Realistic options…
Connor Wickham (?)
Kazaiah Sterling
Nicky Ajose
Jerome Sinclair
Kieran Agard
Calvin Andrew
David Nugent
Steve Davies
Ishmael Miller
Simon Cox
Anthony Stokes
Yaya Sanogo
Oumar Niasse
Maxime Biamou
And I'm intrigued what happens when JFC is fit. If we include him from January, then someone will have to come out.1 -
I'm surprised we didn't sign someone aged 20/21 who didn't count towards the cap. Of course those players generally come at a premium and it's quite possible we tried.killerandflash said:
Agreed, unless it's an under 21. I've said this before, but I do feel that our transfer business has left us a bit tied by the squad number rules, seeing that everyone we've brought in is over 21. Ronnie hasn't gone anywhere, surely we should try and get him fit in the next few months, seeing that we are paying himcafcfan1990 said:
I'm not sure if we find out the squad but it will be intriguing. Dempsey and JFC missing out seems obvious and leaves us with a full squad. If we are after another outfield player (agree it would be a striker) then it surely means Schwartz is the third and final player not to be named which would be very interesting. Personally I do think he'll be included and we won't be signing another outfield player.Callumcafc said:So that’s one free agent. That may be the last of our business until January but let’s assume we’re after another based on Cawley’s tweet…
It has to be a striker or a keeper doesn’t it? I’m focusing in on the former, given what Adkins said about the emergency loan system for goalkeepers.
Realistic options…
Connor Wickham (?)
Kazaiah Sterling
Nicky Ajose
Jerome Sinclair
Kieran Agard
Calvin Andrew
David Nugent
Steve Davies
Ishmael Miller
Simon Cox
Anthony Stokes
Yaya Sanogo
Oumar Niasse
Maxime Biamou
And I'm intrigued what happens when JFC is fit. If we include him from January, then someone will have to come out.
I still think we'll be ok though. If you presume JFC and Dempsey miss out, we have:
MacGillivray/Harness - emergency loan if needed
Matthews/Gunter/Purrington/Souare
Inniss/Famewo/Lavelle/Pearce
Dobson/Watson/Arter/Clare/Morgan/Gilbey/Lee
Kirk/DJ/CBT/Leko
Stockley/Washington/Davison/Schwartz
We have reached the limit and with JFC hopefully returning in January, as you say someone will have to drop out. You'd expect it will be like for like with a CM dropping out otherwise we're overloaded in that position. But you also have Schwartz who could go and CBT is out of contract as it stands.
I think the balance is decent, even if not perfect. Players have to prove their worth and then it will be another balancing act, albeit on a smaller scale, come January.3 -
A few more options…Callumcafc said:So that’s one free agent. That may be the last of our business until January but let’s assume we’re after another based on Cawley’s tweet…
It has to be a striker or a keeper doesn’t it? I’m focusing in on the former, given what Adkins said about the emergency loan system for goalkeepers.
Realistic options…
Connor Wickham (?)
Kazaiah Sterling
Nicky Ajose
Jerome Sinclair
Kieran Agard
Calvin Andrew
David Nugent
Steve Davies
Ishmael Miller
Simon Cox
Anthony Stokes
Yaya Sanogo
Oumar Niasse
Maxime Biamou
Josh Parker
Mikael Ndjoli
Guy Melamed
Collin Quaner0 -
Also available is Nadir Ciftci…0
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Good blog on our window and a bit on what other clubs in the league have done. Although it’s already out of date with the signing of Souare.3
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Four undisclosed fees puts us joint second alongside Wigan and Lincoln… looks like the bulk of everyone else’s business was done through free transfers and loans.2
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The other possibility is that Charlton expect the PFA to win their dispute with the EFL and have the squad cap either increased or removed completely.
Bit of a gamble if so.3 -
I could see one of Dobson or Clare going on loan in January if they’re not getting game time and JFCs recovery is on track.2
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It might be later than we (and probably NA) wanted but the squad looks a lot better at least on paper now. I think the international break came in at a good time for us. Ever the optimist and there are a shed load of matches still to be played.2
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Because they had to. They probably won't play that much now unless we get injuries.Henry Irving said:
Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.1 -
I think Morgan will, he’s ahead of Clare and Dobson, and Arter will play ahead of Watson. Lee will play higher up. Main question is whether Adkins play Lee and Gilbey together once the latter is available.Chris_from_Sidcup said:
Because they had to. They probably won't play that much now unless we get injuries.Henry Irving said:
Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.2 -
That's a big question, I put the rivival of Gilbey down to a change of position/system last season. It would be intresting how he goes as one of the 6s.Scoham said:
I think Morgan will, he’s ahead of Clare and Dobson, and Arter will play ahead of Watson. Lee will play higher up. Main question is whether Adkins play Lee and Gilbey together once the latter is available.Chris_from_Sidcup said:
Because they had to. They probably won't play that much now unless we get injuries.Henry Irving said:
Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.1 -
Why Dobson done more then enough to be a first team choice and Clare can play number of rolesScoham said:I could see one of Dobson or Clare going on loan in January if they’re not getting game time and JFCs recovery is on track.3 -
Morgan would be the one to go out on loan after his early season formRonnieMoore said:
Why Dobson done more then enough to be a first team choice and Clare can play number of rolesScoham said:I could see one of Dobson or Clare going on loan in January if they’re not getting game time and JFCs recovery is on track.1 -
Are you having a conversation with yourself?RonnieMoore said:
Morgan would be the one to go out on loan after his early season formRonnieMoore said:
Why Dobson done more then enough to be a first team choice and Clare can play number of rolesScoham said:I could see one of Dobson or Clare going on loan in January if they’re not getting game time and JFCs recovery is on track.15 -
Morgan is already an established member of the first team squad - he's played 78 games for us, which in the absence of JFC and Pearce is the most in the squad! - which is why I don't count him when talking about "bringing through" academy players anyway.Scoham said:
I think Morgan will, he’s ahead of Clare and Dobson, and Arter will play ahead of Watson. Lee will play higher up. Main question is whether Adkins play Lee and Gilbey together once the latter is available.Chris_from_Sidcup said:
Because they had to. They probably won't play that much now unless we get injuries.Henry Irving said:
Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.
It would be slightly bizarre to lose a winger or striker just to fit in another midfielder, when we already seem to have too many!cafcfan1990 said:
I'm surprised we didn't sign someone aged 20/21 who didn't count towards the cap. Of course those players generally come at a premium and it's quite possible we tried.killerandflash said:
Agreed, unless it's an under 21. I've said this before, but I do feel that our transfer business has left us a bit tied by the squad number rules, seeing that everyone we've brought in is over 21. Ronnie hasn't gone anywhere, surely we should try and get him fit in the next few months, seeing that we are paying himcafcfan1990 said:
I'm not sure if we find out the squad but it will be intriguing. Dempsey and JFC missing out seems obvious and leaves us with a full squad. If we are after another outfield player (agree it would be a striker) then it surely means Schwartz is the third and final player not to be named which would be very interesting. Personally I do think he'll be included and we won't be signing another outfield player.Callumcafc said:So that’s one free agent. That may be the last of our business until January but let’s assume we’re after another based on Cawley’s tweet…
It has to be a striker or a keeper doesn’t it? I’m focusing in on the former, given what Adkins said about the emergency loan system for goalkeepers.
Realistic options…
Connor Wickham (?)
Kazaiah Sterling
Nicky Ajose
Jerome Sinclair
Kieran Agard
Calvin Andrew
David Nugent
Steve Davies
Ishmael Miller
Simon Cox
Anthony Stokes
Yaya Sanogo
Oumar Niasse
Maxime Biamou
And I'm intrigued what happens when JFC is fit. If we include him from January, then someone will have to come out.
I still think we'll be ok though. If you presume JFC and Dempsey miss out, we have:
MacGillivray/Harness - emergency loan if needed
Matthews/Gunter/Purrington/Souare
Inniss/Famewo/Lavelle/Pearce
Dobson/Watson/Arter/Clare/Morgan/Gilbey/Lee
Kirk/DJ/CBT/Leko
Stockley/Washington/Davison/Schwartz
We have reached the limit and with JFC hopefully returning in January, as you say someone will have to drop out. You'd expect it will be like for like with a CM dropping out otherwise we're overloaded in that position. But you also have Schwartz who could go and CBT is out of contract as it stands.
I think the balance is decent, even if not perfect. Players have to prove their worth and then it will be another balancing act, albeit on a smaller scale, come January.
The rules do affect how you think. It amused me when people said that Morgan should be loaned out when he's the one player we don't want to loan out this season, because he counts as an under 21 AND a home produced player, thus ticking 2 EFL boxes1 -
Morgan is the only one of those three not to have been dropped this seasonRonnieMoore said:
Morgan would be the one to go out on loan after his early season formRonnieMoore said:
Why Dobson done more then enough to be a first team choice and Clare can play number of rolesScoham said:I could see one of Dobson or Clare going on loan in January if they’re not getting game time and JFCs recovery is on track.2 -
Because we’ve since signed Arter and Lee meaning unless we have a few injuries some CMs will get limited game time.RonnieMoore said:
Why Dobson done more then enough to be a first team choice and Clare can play number of rolesScoham said:I could see one of Dobson or Clare going on loan in January if they’re not getting game time and JFCs recovery is on track.
My prediction is it’ll be those two who miss out more than Morgan - so far he’s has kept his place and improved playing in a deeper role which he’s better suited to. As already said he also counts as an u21 player, the other two don’t.
Very early though and I’m not ruling anyone out from improving and becoming a regular starter. I just think Clare and Dobson will most likely be squad players, it’s unlikely a top L1 player was hidden away as back up at Sunderland or as a right back at Oxford. Of course I’d be happy for them to prove me wrong.3 -
I think what you’re missing here is that he said he wanted a pathway, not necessarily a stepping stone. With the exception of Elerewe, I’m not sure I’ve seen anything to suggest that others are ready yet. That may change as the season goes on but you can’t say that Adkins hasn’t talked up Morgan & Davison particularly and given them chances. I don’t think either have so far grasped those chances, but perhaps Josh will get confidence from the Crawley game.killerandflash said:
The likes of Deji and Clayden won't get many opportunities, now we've completed our squad. Harness may be our sub keeper, but if MacG gets injured, we'll bring someone in. How many games will the likes of Vennings, Dempsey and Ghandour get, players aged 20 or 21?Henry Irving said:
Harshkillerandflash said:For all the talk of Adkins wanting to give youth a chance, we've ended up with a pretty full squad, with too many over 21s to register then all, and few opportunities for young players to get a game
Morgan has played, Deji has played, Harness on the bench and we have other young players on the fringes. Davison and did well in the pizza cup if not in the league cup.
We need the experienced players to guide what is still a young squad. Famewo is 22, DJ not much more, Kirk is 23 or 24. Clare and Dobson aren't ancient either.
Those other players you mentioned aren't our academy players
“One, there has got to be a pathway for the youngsters in the academy,” he said. “At every football club I’ve been at that has been a big priority and that will be the same here. We have got talented players and sometimes that pathway can be blocked.
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/charlton-boss-nigel-adkins-ill-give-great-references-to-all-of-the-players-we-let-go/6
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