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Sorry but Jackson has to go.

1235722

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  • I am concerned with the obsession with 352. It leaves far too much space, as the first 2 goals today illustrated. Because he never changes it, teams can prepare how to break us down, which is fairly easy with the space down the flanks in the final third the 352 provides. I can’t see, even having specialists in the 3 at this level will make us a promotion side next season.
  • Croydon said:
    NabySarr said:
    Table since JJ took over has us 11th, is the squad really any better than that? So I think he’s done average so far results wise, but 6 games without a decent striker doesn’t help his record. 

    3-5-2 will be fine once we get 3 good CBs and some wing backs in the summer. The top 7 in league 1 all play it so the formation clearly works at this level 
    Nail on head. He's playing a back 5, when you are effectively saying we need 5 new players to play successfully with a back 5. Madness.
    How is that a defence of Jackson? If anything that's a damning statement of how ludicrously stubborn he is
    It's not a defence from me, quite the opposite.
    It's ridiculous, once it stopped working.
    It's a bit like saying let's play 4-2-4 when you don't have a decent forward.
    Yeah sorry didn't mean your comment, meant the one you were replying to! 
  • Something i've picked up on in several games under Jacko is that we've had games, including today where we've been on fire for the first 20 minutes of a match, dominated, not scored and then the opposition get a grip on the game and start to dominate instead.

    I remember it happening in particular away at Cheltenham too and I certainly remember listening to commentary a couple more times it being mentioned.

    So why can we absolutely boss a game for 20 minutes and then look woeful for the remainder of the first half, is it the players running out of steam early on? Has Jacko got a brilliant Plan A but no Plan B to turn to once the opposition make a tactical change on 20 minutes? What's Skiverton doing to help Jackson with this? Surely someone else must see the same issue we run into a lot of times mid first half.

    I think Jacko needs to be allowed to build a team in how he wants to play, it wouldn't be fair to get rid of him if he can't play the way he wants to play with the players available to do so.

    What i'm more concerned with is how our transfer recruitment has gone to pot. This is more concerning than whether Jackson is capable of a promotion push.

    But on the other hand, when Karl Robinson left we all thought it was season over yet Bowyer was able to galvanise the same group of players who were languishing in mid table into a play off place so it does ask the question how Bowyer was able to consistently churn results out of a failed Karl Robinson side yet Jacko hasn't been able to do the same of a failed Nigel Adkins side. Had Jacko's initial run carried on we could have contended for a play off place but it hasn't and his persistence of a 3-5-2 without the players to play it is concerning.

    I think Jacko needs to be given the summer and at least a run of 10-12 league games. If that fails then a full clean sweep is needed including Gallen, Euell, Skiverton, the lot.
  • Think the intention of appointing someone else would obviously be for them to do well. Using the logic that a new manager might not make a difference, suggests that we never change anything because whatever it is might not be successful. 
  • Gribbo said:
    Think the intention of appointing someone else would obviously be for them to do well. Using the logic that a new manager might not make a difference, suggests that we never change anything because whatever it is might not be successful. 
    Of course, I'm not naïve enough to suggest that we should never make a change because it might out work - But there equally needs to be accountability, it never feels as though anyone ever thinks that a change could make things a lot worse, and that warning should always be made aware.
  • I try and strip out my emotive side, and that I’m someone that is always wanting to give a chance not the sack.  

    But trying to look at it objectively I just cannot understand the tactic / formation inflexibility that we never seen to learn from, never seem to change much, and makes it easy for teams to prepare against us. It has seen us concede goals every game as teams capitalise in that unknown area between the back three and wing backs. We never seem to bust a gut anywhere near the period we did in the few games after Adkins left, nor has the quality of football played been as high. On the football side we are too soft as a club and far too predictable to play against. 


    This is the crux of the issue. The players might as a group be less gifted than we’d hope but Christ there is little evidence of good management and coaching to get the best out of them. I accept they’re not world beaters and they say a good team is greater than the sum of its parts but I think we’re less than the sum of our parts.
  • So much understandable sentimentality surrounding Jackson; it's the Modus Operandi of the Charlton fan.

    Jackson will, alas, end up like Chris Powell. A really nice chap who, sadly, is not cut out for football 'management'. Part of the coaching team, yes, but actually managing and handling all that is associated with such, no.

    Ok, we all measure success differently, but, in my opinion, Jackson, like Powell, will never be cut out to be a successful manager. He has a touch of the Cowleys or Robinsons about him, a lower league merry-go-round manager. Nothing more than journeyman material.

    But then again, are we any better than journeyman material?
    I’ll take 101 points in L1 and ninth in the Championship. How about you?

    Being a Powell fan, this was over two seasons.  What has he done since?
    Not much really, been part of an England coaching set up that had been to the semis of the World Cup and the final of the Euros.
    To be fair, it’s not a valid comparison, getting a tune out of possibly the best group of young English talent for a long time. And what he did for us. I’m pretty sure he’d fail with this current group. Powell hasn’t been successful in league football since being with us.(as a manager).
  • If we're going to settle for a manager and ride the wave for the next couple of years, I'd prefer it was a young up-and-coming manager with forward thinking and tactical knowledge. Perhaps even some good experience with coaching and praise within that role. Michael Beale would have been ideal but even now we probably wouldn't be able to pry him from Villa. 

    Jackson just doesn't come across as someone that really knows what he is doing. He had zero backroom praise while he was a coach, other than being 'one of the Charlton lads'. During interviews there's nothing really there other than wanting passion and energy. 

    The football is dire long-ball nonsense, along with zero attacking strategy other than hoping for the best from a knock down, or giving it to CBT and letting him do whatever. The defense look like they don't even train and learn nothing from the previous goals they've conceded. 
    This is the big one for me... it feels like they just turn up each week. When the fans are calling out training points like ... err the keeper coming out for crosses, weeks before it actually happens... even the most basic players can be trained to do stuff. I've said it for ages, wtf is happening in training?
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  • paulfox said:
    So much understandable sentimentality surrounding Jackson; it's the Modus Operandi of the Charlton fan.

    Jackson will, alas, end up like Chris Powell. A really nice chap who, sadly, is not cut out for football 'management'. Part of the coaching team, yes, but actually managing and handling all that is associated with such, no.

    Ok, we all measure success differently, but, in my opinion, Jackson, like Powell, will never be cut out to be a successful manager. He has a touch of the Cowleys or Robinsons about him, a lower league merry-go-round manager. Nothing more than journeyman material.

    But then again, are we any better than journeyman material?
    I’ll take 101 points in L1 and ninth in the Championship. How about you?

    Being a Powell fan, this was over two seasons.  What has he done since?
    Not much really, been part of an England coaching set up that had been to the semis of the World Cup and the final of the Euros.
    To be fair, it’s not a valid comparison, getting a tune out of possibly the best group of young English talent for a long time. And what he did for us. I’m pretty sure he’d fail with this current group. Powell hasn’t been successful in league football since being with us.(as a manager).
    Well yes and no. Apart from Huddersfield he's not really been particularly involved in league football since us so that's not a very good point of discussion. 
  • edited April 2022
    He gets until October from me. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but I think we have to ask what the hell the January transfer window was about. I’m on record defending Chuks’ return and we’ll have to see how many games he plays next season and how many goals he gets, but the rest of it? My other concern is that I would have no confidence in a selection process to replace Jackson.
    Most definitely this !
  • thenewbie said:
    paulfox said:
    So much understandable sentimentality surrounding Jackson; it's the Modus Operandi of the Charlton fan.

    Jackson will, alas, end up like Chris Powell. A really nice chap who, sadly, is not cut out for football 'management'. Part of the coaching team, yes, but actually managing and handling all that is associated with such, no.

    Ok, we all measure success differently, but, in my opinion, Jackson, like Powell, will never be cut out to be a successful manager. He has a touch of the Cowleys or Robinsons about him, a lower league merry-go-round manager. Nothing more than journeyman material.

    But then again, are we any better than journeyman material?
    I’ll take 101 points in L1 and ninth in the Championship. How about you?

    Being a Powell fan, this was over two seasons.  What has he done since?
    Not much really, been part of an England coaching set up that had been to the semis of the World Cup and the final of the Euros.
    To be fair, it’s not a valid comparison, getting a tune out of possibly the best group of young English talent for a long time. And what he did for us. I’m pretty sure he’d fail with this current group. Powell hasn’t been successful in league football since being with us.(as a manager).
    Well yes and no. Apart from Huddersfield he's not really been particularly involved in league football since us so that's not a very good point of discussion. 
    Southend ? 
  • edited April 2022
    thenewbie said:
    paulfox said:
    So much understandable sentimentality surrounding Jackson; it's the Modus Operandi of the Charlton fan.

    Jackson will, alas, end up like Chris Powell. A really nice chap who, sadly, is not cut out for football 'management'. Part of the coaching team, yes, but actually managing and handling all that is associated with such, no.

    Ok, we all measure success differently, but, in my opinion, Jackson, like Powell, will never be cut out to be a successful manager. He has a touch of the Cowleys or Robinsons about him, a lower league merry-go-round manager. Nothing more than journeyman material.

    But then again, are we any better than journeyman material?
    I’ll take 101 points in L1 and ninth in the Championship. How about you?

    Being a Powell fan, this was over two seasons.  What has he done since?
    Not much really, been part of an England coaching set up that had been to the semis of the World Cup and the final of the Euros.
    To be fair, it’s not a valid comparison, getting a tune out of possibly the best group of young English talent for a long time. And what he did for us. I’m pretty sure he’d fail with this current group. Powell hasn’t been successful in league football since being with us.(as a manager).
    Well yes and no. Apart from Huddersfield he's not really been particularly involved in league football since us so that's not a very good point of discussion. 
    Kind of is, being a good coach for England doesn’t make him a good manager, obviously Powell is loved by all of us for what he did as player and manager and rightly so.However in his involvement as you say for huddersfield,he got sacked and wasn’t picked up by anyone else, did he have a little spell as interim at Derby?.

    also Southend?? 
  • thenewbie said:
    paulfox said:
    So much understandable sentimentality surrounding Jackson; it's the Modus Operandi of the Charlton fan.

    Jackson will, alas, end up like Chris Powell. A really nice chap who, sadly, is not cut out for football 'management'. Part of the coaching team, yes, but actually managing and handling all that is associated with such, no.

    Ok, we all measure success differently, but, in my opinion, Jackson, like Powell, will never be cut out to be a successful manager. He has a touch of the Cowleys or Robinsons about him, a lower league merry-go-round manager. Nothing more than journeyman material.

    But then again, are we any better than journeyman material?
    I’ll take 101 points in L1 and ninth in the Championship. How about you?

    Being a Powell fan, this was over two seasons.  What has he done since?
    Not much really, been part of an England coaching set up that had been to the semis of the World Cup and the final of the Euros.
    To be fair, it’s not a valid comparison, getting a tune out of possibly the best group of young English talent for a long time. And what he did for us. I’m pretty sure he’d fail with this current group. Powell hasn’t been successful in league football since being with us.(as a manager).
    Well yes and no. Apart from Huddersfield he's not really been particularly involved in league football since us so that's not a very good point of discussion. 
    Southend ? 
    Fair point and I'd forgotten that so that's on me. Perhaps it's fairer then to say that Powell appears to be a good coach but not perhaps an excellent manager.

    Sadly on current evidence Jackson does not appear to be very good at either role. 
  • Just for balance, What’s Jackson’s win percentage compared to previous? These aren’t his players either.
  • edited April 2022
    Ultimately it comes down to the top supporting the manager with financial backing, getting the players they want and staying out of the footballing side of the club. Until that happens then it doesn’t really matter who’s manager.
    This is true. And also the problem I think. Jackson probably is doing as well as anyone can do with the set up and players he's got. That is still not actually the same as actually doing well.

    The thing is I don't think there's anyone who is good enough to do any better in the current set up who's likely to be stupid enough to try. Adkins was an experienced coach who came in with no baggage... And failed. Jackson has the passion for the club and knows the players personally... And failed.

    The evidence to me suggests that the manager (any manager) is only a small part of a very much bigger problem at the club. 
  • edited April 2022
    Just for balance, What’s Jackson’s win percentage compared to previous? These aren’t his players either.
    But he had coached them all, if he had come in fresh then the they aren’t his players would be a good go to excuse. I think his win percentage is ok, however I get the feeling the style of play, stubbornness with formation even if he truly  believes in it is grating on people. It seems a bit unfair like Adkins being called out JJ is really being let down by the players. But he needs to somehow change that to prove he can be a success.
  • edited April 2022
    Just for balance, What’s Jackson’s win percentage compared to previous? These aren’t his players either.
    Jackson 45.9%
    Adkins 34.6%
    Bowyer 41.6% (49.5% in League One)
    Robinson 36.5%
    Slade 28.6%
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  • This has to be the most inconsistent bunch of players I think we've ever had since I've been going.
    One week they look sort of alright then the next they are absolute dog sh*t. To a man.

    Not sure if that's down to the manager or if we've managed to assemble  such a weak willed group by accident?
    I'll agree that Jackson really hasn't looked at the races which is a big concern.
  • edited April 2022
    My first game for at while today. Until Morecombe realised we were toothless we looked ok. Then once they decided to go on the front foot we looked as if it didn’t really matter. No snap, no effort and no hurt when they went ahead. 
    I don’t know how much this is down to the manager but I didn’t see Jackson make any changes to respond to the changes in the game.
    He doesn’t look able for this, he should go or  be replaced. 
  • So much understandable sentimentality surrounding Jackson; it's the Modus Operandi of the Charlton fan.

    Jackson will, alas, end up like Chris Powell. A really nice chap who, sadly, is not cut out for football 'management'. Part of the coaching team, yes, but actually managing and handling all that is associated with such, no.

    Ok, we all measure success differently, but, in my opinion, Jackson, like Powell, will never be cut out to be a successful manager. He has a touch of the Cowleys or Robinsons about him, a lower league merry-go-round manager. Nothing more than journeyman material.

    But then again, are we any better than journeyman material?
    I’ll take 101 points in L1 and ninth in the Championship. How about you?

    Being a Powell fan, this was over two seasons.  What has he done since?
    Coach to the England squad which came a close second in the Euros is one little thing. 
  • edited April 2022
    Ahh been waiting for this thread since the "give it to Jacko and Euell" one. Has anyone been called not proper Charlton yet? 

    A pointless arguement that'll go round and round and round and round and round with the same old Powell and Bowyer lines, a lot of revisionism - plenty of people called this s top 6 squad, hence why Adkins had to go, and, the results under caretaker Jacko proved they were SO good!/ Powell did worse with better players like promotion quality Miguel fucking llera - and lots of stats comparing to previous managers with worse squads and very little context.

    Forget it, he's here anyway regardless, s wingback and a fit JFC will probably keep us in the top half next season, baby steps, building something, etc.  

    Concentrate on getting the recruitment right, I'm  sure Jackson will be able to get better players higher up the table, probably, maybe. 

    Meh 
  • edited April 2022
    If we stick with Jackson we are accepting mediocrity. The ‘’not his squad’’ comments would not be chucked about if this was not a ‘Charlton man’. He shows zero enthusiasm on the pitch, sounds like he’s bored when talking about the team, doesn’t seem to have the respect as a coach of the team and is completely stubborn in his ways. 

    He hasn’t tried any youngsters, any new formations, tried playing players in their actual preferred positions and other than individual moments of brilliance, we rarely look like scoring. 

    What he reminds me of is when you’re in a shit job when you’re younger and it’s the chummy managers turn on the rota and you all know you’re in for an easy shift so you take the piss a little and just do the bare minimum to get your pay. Now I understand football is a lot more complicated from a managers perspective compared to your average job, but as always, you can’t sack all of the staff, it’s up to the man at the top to find solutions and the boss mate approach is well and truly out of the window. When you have a player like Gilbey, who makes a decision so bad that it could cost you your job, in a results business and you still give him a nickname and insist on playing him, you don’t have what it takes to be a leader. That bloke shouldn’t be anywhere near our match day bench let alone our starting XI, ship him out next season. 

    New manager, get rid of every player who’s contract is up, not one is worth keeping and actually show some intent in the next window. I am genuinely fed up of going every game and not reacting or giving a shit when either us or the opposition score & leaving on the 80th minute mark to catch an earlier train. 

    He needs to go if we want to climb the leagues, would love to be wrong but I don’t see it 
  • If he stays, the summer recruitment will be all around getting players in to suit 3-5-2. A formation which time and time again this season has been shown to have fundamental flaws.

    As a manager he appears to have no Plan B and isn't even reactive in a game. We turn up week after week and go through the same mundane nonsense. Run around for 15 mins and then gradually fall to pieces.

    Some of the performances under Jackson have been up there as the worst I have seen in 40+ years of support.

    We are a defensive mess, we are pedestrian across the park, we are utterly one dimensional in attack and more recently we have seen a total lack of discipline within the squad.

    I look at those players and there is no unity or team spirit. Listening to Matthews interviewed before the game it was clear he will be looking elsewhere before considering any offer we make. Staying seemed to be an after thought. Not that I want to keep him.

    Bradley Allen summed it up when he said we need a spine, leaders and to decide how we are going to play. At the moment we have none of these and the play is so disjointed that you can only assume the manager isn't getting his message across.

    All of this adds up to one thing. Jackson's contract does not get renewed. We then sweep away the entire coaching staff and probably Gallen as well.

    Ultimately I have no interest in watching that formation this or any season. I am bored watching the same mistakes and the same vulnerability being exploited by players and teams who on paper are far weaker than ours.

    We are easy to play against, easy to score against and are powder puff up front. The buck stops with the manager and he has shown nothing to suggest he can change things round.
    Formation will look a lot better if we got some actual wing backs and half decent centre backs to play it. Nothing wrong with 3-5-2, most of the top teams in this league play it (all of the top7) so it clearly works at this level if we can get the right players 
  • NabySarr said:
    If he stays, the summer recruitment will be all around getting players in to suit 3-5-2. A formation which time and time again this season has been shown to have fundamental flaws.

    As a manager he appears to have no Plan B and isn't even reactive in a game. We turn up week after week and go through the same mundane nonsense. Run around for 15 mins and then gradually fall to pieces.

    Some of the performances under Jackson have been up there as the worst I have seen in 40+ years of support.

    We are a defensive mess, we are pedestrian across the park, we are utterly one dimensional in attack and more recently we have seen a total lack of discipline within the squad.

    I look at those players and there is no unity or team spirit. Listening to Matthews interviewed before the game it was clear he will be looking elsewhere before considering any offer we make. Staying seemed to be an after thought. Not that I want to keep him.

    Bradley Allen summed it up when he said we need a spine, leaders and to decide how we are going to play. At the moment we have none of these and the play is so disjointed that you can only assume the manager isn't getting his message across.

    All of this adds up to one thing. Jackson's contract does not get renewed. We then sweep away the entire coaching staff and probably Gallen as well.

    Ultimately I have no interest in watching that formation this or any season. I am bored watching the same mistakes and the same vulnerability being exploited by players and teams who on paper are far weaker than ours.

    We are easy to play against, easy to score against and are powder puff up front. The buck stops with the manager and he has shown nothing to suggest he can change things round.
    Formation will look a lot better if we got some actual wing backs and half decent centre backs to play it. Nothing wrong with 3-5-2, most of the top teams in this league play it (all of the top7) so it clearly works at this level if we can get the right players 
    Or indeed the right coaching.

    If Jackson was in charge of any of the top 6 teams I feel like they wouldn't be top 6 teams, other than maybe Sheffield Wednesday as they have ridiculous players for this level.
  • This has to be the most inconsistent bunch of players I think we've ever had since I've been going.
    One week they look sort of alright then the next they are absolute dog sh*t. To a man.

    Not sure if that's down to the manager or if we've managed to assemble  such a weak willed group by accident?
    I'll agree that Jackson really hasn't looked at the races which is a big concern.
    Absolutely, the players have to take a lot of the responsibility as well. Play really well and win at Rotherham then lose at home to Morecambe. They turn up when they want to.

    This season we've lost to Crewe, Lincoln twice, Accrington twice, Cheltenham, Morecambe, these are sides with a budget a fraction of ours and we didn't turn up. And i've still not forgotten that pathetic display at Hartlepool in the pizza cup.

    But then we've beaten Sunderland, Ipswich, Plymouth, Rotherham so we can clearly put in a performance when we feel like it.
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