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Has Bowyer lost it?

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    Blackpool (14th in league one) are favourites to win at the valley.  That is fuckin depressing.
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    Lee mate. Chose your preferred system. Pick your best players to fit that and give it a fair crack. Allow the players a chance to gel into that system instead of asking them to do different things every match. No wonder they’re not gelling. Once players are comfortable with that you can tweak even during the game but third tier players need a shape to hang their hats on and fall back on when it’s tough. Keep it simple and choose your best players. 
    Absolutely bang on, and precisely what he hasn’t done!!.
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    thenewbie said:
    While the decision about Bowyer's future remains Sandgaard's prerogative (and rightly so), if/when a decision has been made I would hope that some sort of statement would be made.

    Unfortunately we are now in the position of where many fans seem to expect Bowyer to leave at some point but with a question of when. A bit of clarity and direction would certainly not go amiss, even if it's just a generic "we still haven't decided but conversations are ongoing."
    I agree. If TS is backing Bowyer to reshape the squad in the summer whatever happens this season then there is no harm in saying so is there? If radio silence resumes I can only assume that Bowyer's future is up in the air. 
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    Why is Ged Roddy the messiah sorry?
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    esseffect said:
    Why is Ged Roddy the messiah sorry?
    He's neither the messiah or a very naughty boy imo.

    Too early to judge in any way. 
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    There have been a couple of reports, not 100% verified, that he doesn't rate Bowyer. One appeared on the other site we don't mention, and another on here where a poster reported Roddy told an ex colleague (who he knew) this.
    According to Jim White on Talkshite Bowyer has Sandgaards full backing so his opinion on Lee may not matter?
    Everything Jim White says is utter bollox. 
    Probably means by by Bowyer 
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    I’m actually quite comforted that on the face of it, Sandgaard doesn’t appear to be a trigger happy lunatic 
    Any employer worth their salt would be putting a support plan in place to get their employee through a sticky period. If TS has given Bowyer his support he must surely be bringing someone in with experience to help him ... just a thought. 
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    Dannoo_86 said:
    Whatever happened to supporting your team through thick and thin? Some of the posts on here are quite simply embarrassing.

    As for the disrespect being shown to Bowyer when things ain’t going our way just remember when our club was desperately on its knees Bowyer stood by us and kept our club alive. He has earn’t through his loyalty to us a summer with no distractions, no shit owners, no transfer embargo and no wage cap.
    Yeah bang of fella.

    Let's carry on out of loyalty losing matches with players playing with no desire and seemingly without any tactics.

    Have you not been witnessing what's been going on all season? I really wanted it to work out but he hasn't got a clue what style of football we should be playing, what formation is best, what players to pick. The players do not know what to do!!!

    But you're right out of loyalty lets keep going.
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    Lee mate. Chose your preferred system. Pick your best players to fit that and give it a fair crack. Allow the players a chance to gel into that system instead of asking them to do different things every match. No wonder they’re not gelling. Once players are comfortable with that you can tweak even during the game but third tier players need a shape to hang their hats on and fall back on when it’s tough. Keep it simple and choose your best players. 
    The back 6 on Tuesday were all here last season (Matthews even trained with us over the summer).  I bet that's the first time they have all played in those positions together.

    It's also probably the 1st time Oshilaja has played as an "over lapping" left sided center half in a 3?
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    edited February 2021
    esseffect said:
    Why is Ged Roddy the messiah sorry?
    Not remotely the Messiah nor the enemy either (as it stands.) But the belief seems to be that he has been appointed as TS' expert/advisor on English football in general and Charlton specifically, and how to make the football side a success as TS can handle the business/commercial aspects already.
    If this is true, it's again a fair assumption that Roddy's opinion of Bowyer is very likely to greatly influence Sandgaard's.
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    Cafc43v3r said:
    Lee mate. Chose your preferred system. Pick your best players to fit that and give it a fair crack. Allow the players a chance to gel into that system instead of asking them to do different things every match. No wonder they’re not gelling. Once players are comfortable with that you can tweak even during the game but third tier players need a shape to hang their hats on and fall back on when it’s tough. Keep it simple and choose your best players. 
    The back 6 on Tuesday were all here last season (Matthews even trained with us over the summer).  I bet that's the first time they have all played in those positions together.

    It's also probably the 1st time Oshilaja has played as an "over lapping" left sided center half in a 3?
    Do many centre halves in a three over lap? 

    It was awful to see how open we left ourselves with the wingers, the wing backs and the side CB's too far forward.
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    Dazzler21 said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    Lee mate. Chose your preferred system. Pick your best players to fit that and give it a fair crack. Allow the players a chance to gel into that system instead of asking them to do different things every match. No wonder they’re not gelling. Once players are comfortable with that you can tweak even during the game but third tier players need a shape to hang their hats on and fall back on when it’s tough. Keep it simple and choose your best players. 
    The back 6 on Tuesday were all here last season (Matthews even trained with us over the summer).  I bet that's the first time they have all played in those positions together.

    It's also probably the 1st time Oshilaja has played as an "over lapping" left sided center half in a 3?
    Do many centre halves in a three over lap? 

    It was awful to see how open we left ourselves with the wingers, the wing backs and the side CB's too far forward.
    https://castirontactics.medium.com/sheffield-uniteds-3-5-2-the-art-of-the-overlapping-centre-back-aed8c1110fe0
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    edited February 2021
    I do wonder if Bowyer is managing his players too forensically. Maybe if he gave them fewer instructions and played a standard 4-4-2 with just basics on the opposition something might change. I think I am saying, manage a bit less and back their individual abilities/qualities compared to opponents. 

    What he seems to do is search for a complex tactic that might be asking too much of them. I'm not saying Bowyer is not intelligent, but he might not be as intelligent as he thinks he is. Managing League One players is different from managing Premier League players. 

    It is what Curbs did when we were on a bad run. Go back to basics. 
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    I do wonder if Bowyer is managing his players too forensically. Maybe if he gave them fewer instructions and played a standard 4-4-2 with just basics on the opposition something might change. I think I am saying, manage a bit less and back their individual abilities/qualities compared to opponents. 

    What he seems to do is search for a complex tactic that might be asking too much of them. I'm not saying Bowyer is not intelligent, but he might not be as intelligent as he thinks he is. Managing League One players is different from managing Premier League players. 

    It is what Curbs did when we were on a bad run. Go back to basics. 
    I don't think it's a question of intelligence, but I do agree that potentially it's an issue of over-management at the root. There's a bit of tunnel vision in the idea that if we just get The One Decision right then it will fix everything.

    When actually just getting a very basic plan and letting them just play a bit might just be more likely to work.
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    Cafc43v3r said:
    Dazzler21 said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    Lee mate. Chose your preferred system. Pick your best players to fit that and give it a fair crack. Allow the players a chance to gel into that system instead of asking them to do different things every match. No wonder they’re not gelling. Once players are comfortable with that you can tweak even during the game but third tier players need a shape to hang their hats on and fall back on when it’s tough. Keep it simple and choose your best players. 
    The back 6 on Tuesday were all here last season (Matthews even trained with us over the summer).  I bet that's the first time they have all played in those positions together.

    It's also probably the 1st time Oshilaja has played as an "over lapping" left sided center half in a 3?
    Do many centre halves in a three over lap? 

    It was awful to see how open we left ourselves with the wingers, the wing backs and the side CB's too far forward.
    https://castirontactics.medium.com/sheffield-uniteds-3-5-2-the-art-of-the-overlapping-centre-back-aed8c1110fe0
    So one other side have done it with better players than ours.
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    thenewbie said:
    I do wonder if Bowyer is managing his players too forensically. Maybe if he gave them fewer instructions and played a standard 4-4-2 with just basics on the opposition something might change. I think I am saying, manage a bit less and back their individual abilities/qualities compared to opponents. 

    What he seems to do is search for a complex tactic that might be asking too much of them. I'm not saying Bowyer is not intelligent, but he might not be as intelligent as he thinks he is. Managing League One players is different from managing Premier League players. 

    It is what Curbs did when we were on a bad run. Go back to basics. 
    I don't think it's a question of intelligence, but I do agree that potentially it's an issue of over-management at the root. There's a bit of tunnel vision in the idea that if we just get The One Decision right then it will fix everything.

    When actually just getting a very basic plan and letting them just play a bit might just be more likely to work.
    What I am trying to say is that he has the intelligence to apply advanced tactics but maybe not the emotional intelligence to see that his players are not able to take to those tactics. I say this because he seems to have kept flogging the horse long after it has died.
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    Dazzler21 said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    Dazzler21 said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    Lee mate. Chose your preferred system. Pick your best players to fit that and give it a fair crack. Allow the players a chance to gel into that system instead of asking them to do different things every match. No wonder they’re not gelling. Once players are comfortable with that you can tweak even during the game but third tier players need a shape to hang their hats on and fall back on when it’s tough. Keep it simple and choose your best players. 
    The back 6 on Tuesday were all here last season (Matthews even trained with us over the summer).  I bet that's the first time they have all played in those positions together.

    It's also probably the 1st time Oshilaja has played as an "over lapping" left sided center half in a 3?
    Do many centre halves in a three over lap? 

    It was awful to see how open we left ourselves with the wingers, the wing backs and the side CB's too far forward.
    https://castirontactics.medium.com/sheffield-uniteds-3-5-2-the-art-of-the-overlapping-centre-back-aed8c1110fe0
    So one other side have done it with better players than ours.
    My original point was why even try it, on a Tuesday after a weekend game, when you have had those players for a long time and never tried it before. 
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    Cafc43v3r said:
    Dazzler21 said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    Dazzler21 said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    Lee mate. Chose your preferred system. Pick your best players to fit that and give it a fair crack. Allow the players a chance to gel into that system instead of asking them to do different things every match. No wonder they’re not gelling. Once players are comfortable with that you can tweak even during the game but third tier players need a shape to hang their hats on and fall back on when it’s tough. Keep it simple and choose your best players. 
    The back 6 on Tuesday were all here last season (Matthews even trained with us over the summer).  I bet that's the first time they have all played in those positions together.

    It's also probably the 1st time Oshilaja has played as an "over lapping" left sided center half in a 3?
    Do many centre halves in a three over lap? 

    It was awful to see how open we left ourselves with the wingers, the wing backs and the side CB's too far forward.
    https://castirontactics.medium.com/sheffield-uniteds-3-5-2-the-art-of-the-overlapping-centre-back-aed8c1110fe0
    So one other side have done it with better players than ours.
    My original point was why even try it, on a Tuesday after a weekend game, when you have had those players for a long time and never tried it before. 
    Ah fair enough! Wasn't clear. 
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    I am sure he is trying it to find the magic tactic that works for us. But it brings us back to the question whether he should do that or might be better served simplifying.

    When we had our run, I think Innis was a key part. He was winning everything in the air in our area, our opponent's area and even towards the middle of the park. It wasn't pretty or a tactical masterclass but it was effective. 

    Of course that player is injured, but there seems to be a simple tactic that is showing some promise of playing Aneke and Stockley as a front two. I was surprised Bowyer didn't set up with a side adopting this approach on Tuesday.

    Rather than trying to be too clever, we need to look at the simple things that might make a difference.  
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    edited February 2021
    Well I think we can take the Jim White/Bowyer chat as one thing Bowyer hasn't yet lost is Sandgaard's patience. 
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    edited February 2021
    If Sandgaard has given Bowyer this season, he is hardly going to undermine him before it is over. Jim White says Sandgaard is backing him but why hasn't Sandgaard? He hasn't been shy to send direct messages to fans before.
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    MrOneLung said:
    SCT1980 said:

    I just can not get on board with this take that LB has just lost it. Reality is he and Gallen had us overperforming in the past few seasons, getting us up and almost keeping us up in championship to the point were unlucky to go down, we were only in the bottom three for about 3 weeks all season last year.

     

    To start this year the ownership situation was untenable, transfer embargo, contracts of key players were allowed to lapse and in the midst of it you had the salary cap to handcuff him and Gallen. To sack him off the back of raising expectations due to achieving to me is wrong.

     

    So I am firmly in the camp of give Bowyer time, and by that I mean a stable off season with stable ownership, which ever league we are in next season, I am not saying he’s beyond criticism or he’s got things right tactically at time, its been grim to watch recently, but the circumstances he’s worked under have not been normal to judge him on this year, and I think we just have to face the fact we don’t have enough talent particularly in the midfield due to having to rebuild under those circumstances, but I think it’d be a mistake to say that changing Bowyer will fix that and suddenly send us on a run to promotion.

    Instead we just lose a promising manager with a connection to the club, particularly when I can’t see who we’d bring in who would be a notable upgrade.

     

    Don’t let your highs get you too high and lows get you too low.


    That squad did not over-perform in getting promoted. That was easily one of the top 3 squads in the division. 

    Likewise we were not unlucky to go down last season. We went down with a whimper 
    Overperformed in building a competitive team in the circumstances under Roland where many had failed, the quality of loan signings and progress of players like Taylor who was not seen as a Championship level striker when we signed him, were as a result of Bowyer, and we had the lowest budget in the championship last year so reject the comment about going down with a whimper particularly with COVID and your top goals scorer sitting it out, we went down in the last minute of the last game of the season in the end of course that's unlucky.    
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    edited February 2021
    I do wonder if Bowyer is managing his players too forensically. Maybe if he gave them fewer instructions and played a standard 4-4-2 with just basics on the opposition something might change. I think I am saying, manage a bit less and back their individual abilities/qualities compared to opponents. 

    What he seems to do is search for a complex tactic that might be asking too much of them. I'm not saying Bowyer is not intelligent, but he might not be as intelligent as he thinks he is. Managing League One players is different from managing Premier League players. 

    It is what Curbs did when we were on a bad run. Go back to basics. 
    Thought he didnt discuss tactics with the players though?
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    Who ever is in charge of signings this summer please do not sign injury prone players. Innis was just a liability waiting to happen. As good as he is how can you plan a team around players with his injury record.  The same with the likes of Chucks, Williams etc....... 
    Need a young fit vibrant team going forward, no Watson or Pratley next season!  
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    I think the message is clear that TS is backing him for now and I think it will be in everyone’s best interests if the general heat got dialled down now. Sandgaard’s decision making (at this stage) just simply needs acceptance from fans.

    Even if a change was made today there is no guarantee at all that our fortunes this season would improve enough to put us in the Championship. so ultimately negative campaigning against the owner, manager, club etc won’t serve any real purpose other than making things more unharmonious. 

    Aren’t we all exhausted of campaigning against Charlton things? I know I am. If the end of season peters off or the poor form is making you depressed,  just detach yourself from it and don’t buy the streams. 

    Proper football won’t really start for us again now to August. We need to start that new era strong as a club and enthused as a fanbase. 
    Agree. TS seems an honourable man and I’m glad he’s giving Bow more time, particularly after his post Burton interview when he talked about needing a lift. 
    The bloke deserves some support, imo.
    Forget what he’s done in the past, just as a human being. 
    I think a bit of loyalty will go a long way. 
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    I think the message is clear that TS is backing him for now and I think it will be in everyone’s best interests if the general heat got dialled down now. Sandgaard’s decision making (at this stage) just simply needs acceptance from fans.

    Even if a change was made today there is no guarantee at all that our fortunes this season would improve enough to put us in the Championship. so ultimately negative campaigning against the owner, manager, club etc won’t serve any real purpose other than making things more unharmonious. 

    Aren’t we all exhausted of campaigning against Charlton things? I know I am. If the end of season peters off or the poor form is making you depressed,  just detach yourself from it and don’t buy the streams. 

    Proper football won’t really start for us again now to August. We need to start that new era strong as a club and enthused as a fanbase. 

    Someone also posted the other day how nice it is to be pissing and moaning and depressed about the football rather than off the field shenanigans. 

     A very good point that I am using to console myself and gain perspective after nights like Tuesday (well pretty much every Tuesday and Saturday)

    The football may improve but can improve a lot easier than the off the pitch headaches and misery we had for the past 10 years.  Of course we want both to be great but so long as we are not threatened with relegation which even on current form looks very unlikely then it is something to console ourseleves with.

    Looks like Lee is here for the foreseeable and therefore should get 100% support and hope he can refind the form that made him a great manager for us not so long ago.
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