Attention: Please take a moment to consider our terms and conditions before posting.

Grand National 2018 Thread

1679111222

Comments

  • edited April 2018

    Following 7 N/Rs there are 99 runners in total at Fairyhouse today:

    Willie Mullins & Gordon Elliott - 51 runners
    The other 37 trainers - 48 runners

    And the Irish wonder why so many trainers are going to the wall.

    I'll gladly settle for 2nd again for BTW if neither Elliott nor Mullins break their duck........ well, maybe not :wink:

    F**k it. I'll stick a few bob on Mall Dini and, hopefully, enjoy him scuppering the pair of 'em.
  • Following 7 N/Rs there are 99 runners in total at Fairyhouse today:

    Willie Mullins & Gordon Elliott - 51 runners
    The other 37 trainers - 48 runners

    And the Irish wonder why so many trainers are going to the wall.

    Something has to be done - and it's of course the owners, not the trainers that are the problem - and one in particular of course.

    Limiting the number of runners in a race in the same ownership, and/or coupling, although the latter would likely ruin races as betting events. It is absolutely in the interests of the various turf authorities to have a thriving industry and a competitive product and if it means the likes of O'Leary reduce their participation (or leave the industry completely) then that would be an added bonus.
  • Dear oh dear, poor old Folsom Blue. Nothing was going to get past him until Bellshill took him out.
    What a waste to run BTW. Oh well, Gordon's got his win at last.
  • Dear oh dear, poor old Folsom Blue. Nothing was going to get past him until Bellshill took him out.
    What a waste to run BTW. Oh well, Gordon's got his win at last.

    Certainly a very unlucky loser
  • bobmunro said:

    Following 7 N/Rs there are 99 runners in total at Fairyhouse today:

    Willie Mullins & Gordon Elliott - 51 runners
    The other 37 trainers - 48 runners

    And the Irish wonder why so many trainers are going to the wall.

    Something has to be done - and it's of course the owners, not the trainers that are the problem - and one in particular of course.

    Limiting the number of runners in a race in the same ownership, and/or coupling, although the latter would likely ruin races as betting events. It is absolutely in the interests of the various turf authorities to have a thriving industry and a competitive product and if it means the likes of O'Leary reduce their participation (or leave the industry completely) then that would be an added bonus.
    If they have that many horses how can ‘they’ train them?
  • edited April 2018
    ……continued

    HOUBLON DES OBEAUX – currently 125/1 (100/1 NRNB)
    Ground preference: genuine GS or softer
    • Obviously a triple-digit price comes with associated risk but this fellow has the stat-profile to provide a massive shock on 14 April if he gets his ground.
    • Formerly competitive in high-class company. Was close 2nd (3.25L) to Many Clouds (lumping top-weight and giving the future GN winner 6lbs) in the 2014 Hennessy. Then beaten by (giving 1lb to) Coneygree by 7L, a month before Coneygree took the 2015 GC so impressively.
    • He’s no longer that horse and has come way down the handicap from OR162 then to the current OR144 but, as a result, he’ll carry just 10.06 (he’s never carried less than 10.12 over fences).
    • That handicap descent doesn’t mean he hasn’t run creditably in defeat in a number of big staying handicaps – 3 times last season:
    o 3rd (17L behind future GC winner Native River), lumping 11.07 in the 2016 Welsh GN on Soft, staying on one-paced (OR153)
    o 4th (20L), again staying-on, in 2017 Warwick National over 29f on Soft (won by One For Arthur, in receipt of 12 lbs from HDO – his next race being his GN win off 11lb higher mark)
    o 4th (9.25L) with topweight of 11.12 (OR144) in the 2017 Midlands National over 33.5f on Soft, once again staying-on one-paced, giving 14lbs to winner Chase The Spud (receives 5lbs from The Spud at Aintree)
    His Welsh GN 3rd is a strong GN stat (a meaningful stamina endorser). Since 1988, 8 GN winners and 10 others making the first 4 home, having won or been placed in the WN. Only 1 (The Thinker) had carried more weight than HDO in the WN and none of those 18 making the GN frame ran with as big a drop in absolute weight (-15lbs) than HDO will (Final Nudge will match him, if he gets in).
    • Ran in last year’s GN on ground too quick for him. Carried 10.12, held up in rear, negotiated fences and fallers nicely enough before staying on past 10 others in the last ½ mile to finish 42L 10th.
    • A busy but lower-profile campaign this season. As usual, he went well and won first time out but the most notable run may be 3 races ago, when lumping 12.04 in a 25f chase and coming home a strong-finishing 3rd (0.75L) behind Regal Flow (giving him 20lbs). Regal Flow has just won by 10L the Midlands National on heavy ground off a 9lb higher mark, following which RF’s gone up another 10lbs to OR145.
    • Ran poorly on desperate ground in the Eider in February (PU) but much better in his final prep last weekend in first-time blinkers, tapped for toe but staying on well to be 5.5L 3rd in a 3m veterans chase.
    • An 11 year-old (3 of the last 6 GN winners were 11 y-o)
    • 38 chases in his career (making the frame in 50%). That’s certainly high mileage for a recent-times’ GN winner (though 12 y-o Amberleigh House had run in 37 chases prior to his 2004 GN win and Montys Pass in 41 prior to his in 2003). Despite this, HDO’s form this season suggests he remains game and competitive off his lower mark (will be interesting to see if he’s declared to run again with blinkers).
    • 6 runs in the season (1 win, 2 places), the last 20 days prior – ticks the boxes.

    HDO used to go best when fresh but, barring the occasional poor run, there’s been more consistency to his performances with age. He could disappoint (2nd-time blinkers may spook him rather than help on this occasion) but, if the ground is soft enough to enable him to stay reasonably handy, we might just witness the most extraordinary case of deja vu.

    Because, heralding from the same yard, Mon Mome won the 2009 GN at 100/1 and:

    • He too had previously been placed (2nd) in a Welsh National
    • He too had finished 10th (58L) on ground too quick for him in the GN the year prior to winning it on rain-softened ground.
    • Mon Mome’s season’s record prior to his GN win? 6 runs (1 win, 2 places), the last 21 days prior.

    Spooky or what?.........Hold on to your seats folks!


    MILANSBAR – currently 50/1 NRNB
    Ground preference: genuine GS or softer
    Though he needs a few to come out, Milansbar should make the cut and, if history isn’t to be made by a novice winning a GN for the first time in 60 years or by “Venetia déjà vu”, providing he gets his ground, Milansbar has a serious chance to do so with the first winning female jockey on board.
    • 11 years old, set to carry just 10.05 (OR143)
    • 16 chases, all 3m+. After a promising start to his chase career (close 2nd in the 2016 Midlands National on Soft as topweight with 11.12 (OR145) in just his 5th start over fences and ran creditably when outpaced in the Scottish National), he lost his way somewhat last season.
    • Started this season more promisingly but, after another poorish show in the Welsh GN, came an apparent watershed moment with the application of blinkers for the Warwick National in January - made all with 11.02 on Soft to win with Bryony Frost on board for the first time (OR134). She got a really good tune out of him that day and it’s a big plus to have her on board at Aintree.
    • Blinkers and prominent tactics seem to have galvanised Milansbar but he was ridden far too aggressively (Jamie Moore) next time on desperate ground in the Eider, attempting to make all again with 11.06 but not getting home (plugged on to be 5th). A more measured ride saw him repeat his 2nd in the Midlands National on Heavy (OR142) last time out, beaten by 10L by the impressive Regal Flow.
    • Will be facing the GN fences for the first time. He can make mistakes but his only UR in 16 chases was when hampered in the last WN.
    • 6 runs in the season (1 win, 2 places), the last 28 days prior – ticks the boxes.
    Don’t be fooled by his not getting home under a clumsy ride at Newcastle. Stamina is his forte and the softer the ground the better his chance (by Milan, sire of One For Arthur). Like HDO, he’d want it no quicker than proper GS to get into a rhythm with his jumping, remain handy and minimise traffic-problems.


    To be continued......
  • edited April 2018
    ....continued

    RAZ DE MAREE – currently 50/1 (40/1 NRNB)
    Ground preference: the softer the better
    Don’t fancy any of those possible history-makers? How about the first 13 y-o winner for 95 years?
    • Forget an upper age limit if the ground at Aintree is Soft - Vics Canvas came mighty close to winning it as a 13 y-o in 2016 on Soft. It’s true that Vic had low mileage for his age but, in his last run in January, RDM made history as the oldest ever winner of the (70 year-old) Welsh GN (with 10.10 on Heavy, OR140). If it’s Soft ground on 14 April, the stats suggest he’d be in with a big shout of repeating Corbiere’s (1982/83) and Earth Summit’s (1997/98) feat of same-season Welsh and Aintree GN wins.
    • He earned a career-high RPR156 for that Chepstow win but it was no fluke. The year prior, he’d finished like a train and almost caught Native River (2nd 1.75L) on Soft. On paper, on that WN form, he’s about level with HDO at the GN weights.
    • Twice winner of the 3.5m Cork National (2012 on Soft and 2016 on “Good”, but really GS) and staying on 2nd (9L) in the 2015 Midlands National over 33.5f on Soft, RDM may only have one gear but he excels in a test of stamina, providing the ground’s not to quick that he’s cast adrift, as happened a month later when PU in the 2015 Scottish National on quick ground.
    • 26 chases - similar to Mon Mome (24) and Auroras Encore (23) but well short of the chase starts by Amberleigh House (37) and Montys Pass (41) before their GN wins.
    • Due to carry 10.08 (OR145), 1lb less than when UR in last year’s quick-ground GN, ducking left to dodge a faller at Bechers.
    • Ran in the 2014 GN, outpaced on ground too quick but staying-on typically strongly at the death to finish 8th (38L). Handled the occasion and, though sticky at times on the 1st circuit, the fences well enough.
    • 4 runs in the season (1 win, 2 places), the last his WN victory, 98 days prior – a bit of a break by GN winning standards but One For Arthur hadn’t run since his Warwick National win 84 days prior.
    Despite his limited cruising speed, which could expose him to traffic problems again at Aintree, depending on the ground, RDM showed an amazing turn of foot at the end of both WN runs - seemed he could have gone round again both times. Even if he’s 20L adrift at the last, don’t count him out.

    EDIT - Robbie Power (GN winner on Silver Birch in 2007 and 2017 GC and Irish GN winning jockey) booked to ride RDM. Trainer reported to be doing a rain dance.


    I JUST KNOW – currently 33/1 NRNB
    Ground preference: proper GS or softer but handles decent ground
    A win for I Just Know would make Sue Smith only the second woman to train 2 GN winners after Jenny Pitman (though Mrs P would no doubt claim Esha Ness as the tie-breaker) and he’s been heavily backed down from 150/1 by shrewd punters on to him early, though he has to handle a sizeable step up in company and handicap mark.
    • An 8 year-old. 8 y-os doing much better in post 2012 GNs – 2 of last 3 winners, including One For Arthur, of whose profile IJK’s is reminiscent.
    • Due to carry a winnable-with 10.07 (OR145), though his mark represents a 14lb rise after winning last chase start. One For Arthur won after an 11lb rise and, like him, IJK appears sufficiently progressive potentially to defy the rise.
    • That last chase win (by 15L) was impressive, making-all with 11.10 on Soft in the 30f North Yorkshire GN at Catterick in January, ticking the stamina box (stamina also evident in pedigree)
    • 10 chases to date (9 at 3m+), like Arthur, but IJK has a better win (and near-miss) strike rate of 56% at 3m+ and a much superior rate for making the frame (80% vs 50%).
    • 4 runs in the season (yes you’ve guessed it, 1 win and 2 places), the last being a pleasing spin over hurdles 31 days prior – in the sweet spot stats-wise.
    I Just Know would be at his best on proper GS or softer for his stamina to come into play, but he showed at Ayr last April in a Class 2 novice handicap that he can travel and jump comfortably on genuine good ground. He was ahead of Final Nudge that day (also travelled well) but, on that run and if he gets in, Final Nudge would have a “pull” at their respective GN weights.



    So there we go folks.
    All the best to you, whichever horses you back. As always, let’s hope this is a GN that makes the right sort of headlines and, from purely a personal point of view, another one with 100/1 winner in large type would be particularly pleasing :smiley:
  • Agree about Houblon Des Obeaux....the only negative I have is him being too exposed. But perhaps that is offset by the fact he's come down a chunk in the weights?! Certainly don't need too much persuading to get involved at triple digit prices anyway!!!
  • Any recommendations for the online bookies offering e/w 5 places.

    My William Hill account only paying first 4.

    Cheers
  • Sponsored links:


  • edited April 2018

    Any recommendations for the online bookies offering e/w 5 places.

    My William Hill account only paying first 4.

    Cheers

    If you want 5 places 1/4 the odds and Non Runner No Bet, you want Bet365 or SkyBet (also best odds guaranteed if SP's bigger)
    Paddy Power 6 places but 1/5 odds and not NRNB or BOG
  • Any recommendations for the online bookies offering e/w 5 places.

    My William Hill account only paying first 4.

    Cheers

    If you want 5 places 1/4 the odds and Non Runner No Bet, you want Bet365 or SkyBet (also best odds guaranteed if SP's bigger)
    Cheers Peanuts, I've heard good things about Bet365 so I'll open an account with them.
  • I see Bob's been making some price adjustments this morning, among others trimming Houblon Des Obeaux to 66s.
    Bob.jpg 98.4K
  • Any recommendations for the online bookies offering e/w 5 places.

    My William Hill account only paying first 4.

    Cheers

    If you want 5 places 1/4 the odds and Non Runner No Bet, you want Bet365 or SkyBet (also best odds guaranteed if SP's bigger)
    Cheers Peanuts, I've heard good things about Bet365 so I'll open an account with them.
    Bet365 have the best offers but if you take them they will gub you just the same as all the others. Bookmakers are basically scumbags.
  • edited April 2018
    Now Vic's trimmed HDO to 50s and they're still 5 places.
    Skybet still 100/1 NRNB and Ladbrokes 125/1 (both 5 places 1/4 odds) if he appeals to you.
  • edited April 2018
    Mullins confirms very likely that Total Recall, Pleasant Company and Childrens List will be his only GN runners.
    Bellshill, Rathvinden and Acapella Bourgeois likely to be scratched.
    With Cause Of Causes out, that would guarantee Lord Windermere, Captain Redbeard, Houblon Des Obeaux and (assuming Bless The Wings stays at home) Milansbar a run.
    If it's not good ground, seems likely that Vicente will head to Ayr, which would get Final Nudge in.
    There are a few also entered for the Topham so softish ground could see one or more go over the shorter trip.

    EDIT Seems like Elliott's intending to run Bless The Wings.
  • Looks like Elliot has confirmed Bless the Wings for Aintree peanuts, Hughes pulled him up early (18th) as he wasn't going on the ground.

    From the RP
  • edited April 2018
    Big_Bob said:

    Looks like Elliot has confirmed Bless the Wings for Aintree peanuts, Hughes pulled him up early (18th) as he wasn't going on the ground.

    From the RP

    Cheers Bob. Just seen it.
    Personally, I don't buy the bullshit from Elliott that Hughes was saving him. 18th (6 from home) ain't early - he'd just clattered one and was looking pretty legless, comfortably behind.
    Nonetheless he's clearly likely to line up but I'll stick with my stat-system which suggests now, after Monday, that he could put in a decent show but won't be winning it....famous last words!
  • I never understand why trainers want to miss the National to run somewhere else. If a horse wins a National he is written into the history books forever. Most other races are forgotten the next day.
  • Sponsored links:


  • Giving the latest Aintree going report on Tuesday, clerk of the course Andrew Tulloch said: "On the Grand National course we're mainly soft with a couple of heavy places around the Canal Turn and Valentine's Brook. The Mildmay course would be good to soft.

    "Sunday and yesterday were pretty horrible, with 22mm of rain yesterday, but the course has taken it well. Although it looks as though we're going to be between 12C and 14C over the coming days, it would be helpful if we could be warmer than that to encourage the grass to start growing.

    "We could have showers this week, a few of them heavy, but at this stage it's too far out to be making any predictions about the ground we'll have from next Thursday."
  • HDO still 100/1 with Coral, put £2.50EW on it, paying 5 places. Thanks in advance Peanuts for the tip.
  • Saw that and was a bit taken aback by the good to soft on the mildmay!
  • HDO still 100/1 with Coral, put £2.50EW on it, paying 5 places. Thanks in advance Peanuts for the tip.

    125s with Ladbrokes. Not sure if that includes in shop though, haven't got round to it yet
  • edited April 2018

    HDO still 100/1 with Coral, put £2.50EW on it, paying 5 places. Thanks in advance Peanuts for the tip.

    I really appreciate the vote of confidence @johnnybev1987
    He's one that the media "experts" will easily write-off, naturally, but not only is he grossly over-priced given the likely ground but, according to my GN stats-system (ignoring the deja vu), has a genuinely serious chance if it stays soft enough and he can avoid misfortune.
    Fingers crossed.
  • HDO still 100/1 with Coral, put £2.50EW on it, paying 5 places. Thanks in advance Peanuts for the tip.

    I really appreciate the vote of confidence @johnnybev1987
    He's one that the media "experts" will easily write-off, naturally, but not only is he grossly over-priced given the likely ground but, according to my GN stats-system (ignoring the deja vu), has a genuinely serious chance if it stays soft enough and he can avoid misfortune.
    Fingers crossed.
    2 reasons , one as i know with GN you know your stuff. secondly 100/1, will be rude not to at those odds.
  • If HDO comes through I'm taking peanuts out for as much lobster and wagyu steak he can eat!

  • edited April 2018
    Carter said:

    If HDO comes through I'm taking peanuts out for as much lobster and wagyu steak he can eat!

    Lucky for me you've never met me @Carter
    PM.png 358.7K
  • As De Mee on to cross off the list. Ruled out by Nicholls
  • Right. My likely final team of five, which I'm posting as reference/so it's on the record, rather than to go against Peanuts (cos who in their right mind would do that lol):

    - Baie Des Iles @ 50/1 NRNB (absolutely praying praying praying she gets the ground she needs - only 7 but Katie Walsh specifically went for her I believe out of quite a few options)

    - Final Nudge @ 50/1 NRNB (All faith in PM)

    - Bless The Wings @ 50/1 NRNB (not actually that concerned about his last two runs. One was bad luck, the other was the ground - apparently - and let's face it, price is price for a reason)

    - Houblon des Obeaux @ 100/1 NRNB (Peanuts makes a very good case - also let's face it, who doesn't love triple digit prices!)

    - Milansbar @ 33/1 NRNB (With Bryony Frost on board, who guided him to a very attractive win in first-time blinkers [I think, or some other apparel] at Warwick in Jan, and hoping very much for the cut - plus, of course, Peanuts and Killer Kish have mentioned!)

    ------------------------

    Depending on any NRs or unexpected windfalls, I will also have a look at Rathvinden and/or Vieux Lion Rouge.

    *gets prayer mat out, faces Mecca*
Sign In or Register to comment.

Roland Out Forever!